Is college really that important?

CapAquaPis said:

College doesn't prepare our youth to the new economy: mostly comprised of low-wage, part-time or temping jobs...if they ever get one.

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I know that's what I'm afraid of. I'm this worthless skilless person who's afraid to fail. God it's so annoying.

CapAquaPis said:

They're often told to "stay in school" and graduate with a HS diploma, because employers don't like anyone without one. And where's community college? trade schools? or online courses? Is there cheaper alternatives...

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Unlike most people, money isn't my problem.

CapAquaPis said:

or don't they really help? Make sure your degree isn't a mismatch: gender studies and liberal arts will never help you in your job search in the corporate workplace.

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Well obviously.

waybread said:

AppLeo, you might want to take off for a "gap year" or two, and then come back, if you do, when you know why you're in college and what it will enable you to do in your career.

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That's what I was thinking. The only problem with that is that I'll be graduating at like age 26.

waybread said:

Normally first-year American college students have to take a slug of introductory courses in their intended major plus what are called liberal education or general education courses. The introductory courses in your major are planned both to expose students to the diversity of topics within their field, and to lay the foundations for the more advanced classes-- where students are expected to have retained what they learned in year one.

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Yeah, complete waste of time and money.

waybread said:

The purpose of liberal education is to expand students' minds and to expose them to different points of view. Like ones that are not your extremist, reactionary libertarian and misogynist ideologies.

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I became an extremist libertarian because I was open-minded. I've never met a closed-minded person that ever thought about libertarianism. Just saying. Most people identify with republican or democrat without really diving deep. And also, I used to be a liberal for like a month. Originally I was conservative because my parents were, so I just went with their views. But then I also knew that people should have their own rights to be gay and smoke whatever they want, so I became liberal. I also became liberal because I actually bought into the idea that welfare programs and socialism was a good thing. I was manipulated by the free-lunch and free healthcare unicorn ****. And I was also envious of rich people and thought they should give their wealth to everyone else. But then my parents said that you can't just take someone's wealth because you want to. But I didn't understand that because I just didn't get it. So then I became republican because I ultimately thought that people should keep their money, but I was unsettled because there were some liberal policies that I agreed with. And then when Donald Trump became president I decided to seriously consider my political beliefs because the republican party wasn't looking to great. I eventually stumbled upon the political compass. I saw that Authoritarian left-wingers were people like stalin and mao, and I knew that they were horrible people, so I went to the opposite of the political compass. If left-wing authoritarianism caused death and destruction then the opposite must be life and prosperity. So when I looked at right-wing libertarian, I saw Ayn Rand and the founding fathers there, and then I remembered reading Anthem by Ayn Rand a long time ago and thinking that she was interesting but never really cared much. So then I read Atlas Shrugged because I was open minded and some of her other books, and then I was hooked, and then realized what libertarianism is and that being republican or democrat or conservative or liberal is just a bunch of nonsense.

Fiscally conservative and socially liberal is the most open-minded.

I'm a fascist libertarian. I will take control and shove my beliefs down your throat only so that you can live free and independent and pursue your own happiness. Sounds ironic, but yeah. If you disagree with me, you're basically saying that you want a dictator/state to control your life with violence.

Don't tell me I need a class or that I need to expand my mind. I expanded it enough. My politics are on key.

And I'll be misogynist if I feel like it. I used to be a weak *** feminist in high school because that's just what everyone was and the public school was just liberal and stupid. But because I was open minded its the reason why IM NOT a feminist and why I'm, I wouldn't say misogynist, but just a little distrustful when it comes to women's rights. Because they completely ignore men's rights and don't appreciate men. And also, not to mention, feminism focuses exclusively on uncontrollable things like gender. The left focuses on appearance and things you can't control and they completely ignore things like character and skill. When I judge people, I prefer to judge their skill. When you judge people on gender and associate rights between gender, all you do, is polarize people and pin them against each other. Men can't be women, and women can't be men. Whites can't be black and blacks can't be white. But an unskillful person can become skillful. An evil character can become a good character.

waybread said:

If you do stay in school, or leave and come back later, many students ask around, and learn who the really good, mind-grabbing faculty are. If Professor Deadwood is the only one teaching a required course, you're sort of stuck, but oftentimes students can get into the more stimulating professors' courses.

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Yeah... I just don't like professors or teachers or authority figures in general. They just like to tell you what to do because they're so wise and all that.

waybread said:

Also, most campuses of any size have student counseling services. If you're confused about why you're in school, they may be able to help you gain some clarity on your career directions.

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They'll just want me to spend and waste more money. I mean hello, they've convinced the entire nation that college is important and chained these poor people to outrageous debt so that they could "find themselves."

waybread said:

Some really smart people-- Like Bill Gates-- never finished their university programs but did very well. However, few people are genius enough to pull it off. If you're in his creative ranks you may not need any academic credentials.

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Unfortunately, my intelligence is average.

Thanks Waybread for your advice. Much appreciated

AppLeo, after scanning your last post (and as a retired prof) I would suggest you withdraw now, if you can get your mother's tuition dollars refunded; or finish off this one term as best you can. Then go through the proper paperwork to take a formal leave of absence. This is just in case you wish to return, you won't have burned any bridges behind you. (Sometimes students who aren't in a good place at university simply stop showing up for class, don't take their exams, and flunk out. Then they may not be able to return, or cannot get admitted at another university with those Fs on their transcript.)

A university isn't about keeping you amused in class. The prof isn't some kind of entertainment system. It is about providing you with an e.d.u.c.a.t.i.o.n.

Since you apparently know everything you care to know already, your mother's tuition dollars would be wasted on you. And so would the experience. Students who love their college years typically make good friends, participate in extra-curricular activities, and are actually eager to do well in their courses. If none of these benefits appeal to you, why are you even enrolled? To waste your mother's money? (I didn't think so.)

I have to say that your unawareness of a university as an institution is profound. You're a first year student, who has no idea from the inside of how and why a campus operates. For one thing, if you and a counselor conclude that staying on campus isn't where you need to be, s/he will work with you to transition out of the university. It's nothing to the counselor if you stay or withdraw.

The older returning or first-time university students usually do very well. First, they've had some real life experience under their belts. Second, they know why they are in school, what degree they want, and how they think it will benefit them. They are not only chronologically more mature, but emotionally more mature than some 19-year old with no sense of purpose, who attends class merely because Mom or Dad (who typically pays for the tuition) or his high school peer group expects it of him. "Returning" or "mature" students can be anywhere in age from their late 20s to 60s, and usually they are a joy to teach, vs. some teenager with a chip on his shoulder.

Joining the world of work, or taking a gap year to travel (if Mom will pay for that) seems like a much better use of your time and brain just now.

Funny how tough you talk when you've yet to cut the umbilical chord.

AppLeo said:

I feel like dropping out because I'm learning nonsense. I feel like I could learn the things I want on my own.

But that degree is oh so important.

Could really use some advice from my astrology people because all of you are older

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i told you ... .. remember the argument/discussion a few months ago... it is a waste of time.

now you know

waybread said:

AppLeo, after scanning your last post (and as a retired prof) I would suggest you withdraw now, if you can get your mother's tuition dollars refunded; or finish off this one term as best you can. Then go through the proper paperwork to take a formal leave of absence. This is just in case you wish to return, you won't have burned any bridges behind you. (Sometimes students who aren't in a good place at university simply stop showing up for class, don't take their exams, and flunk out. Then they may not be able to return, or cannot get admitted at another university with those Fs on their transcript.)

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Okay.

waybread said:

A university isn't about keeping you amused in class. The prof isn't some kind of entertainment system. It is about providing you with an e.d.u.c.a.t.i.o.n.

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Isn't learning supposed to be interesting.

waybread said:

Since you apparently know everything you care to know already, your mother's tuition dollars would be wasted on you.

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I offered to pay her back once I get a good job, but she said I didn't need to. And she's been wasting money on me since I was born. I don't even know why she had kids. I don't even know why I'm here.

waybread said:

And so would the experience. Students who love their college years typically make good friends,

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Friends have never worked out for me. I hate being rejected and most people are just not worth my time.

waybread said:

participate in extra-curricular activities, and are actually eager to do well in their courses. If none of these benefits appeal to you, why are you even enrolled? To waste your mother's money? (I didn't think so.)

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Why would I bother with those things? Where's my paycheck. I'm only hear to make a profit. I don't care about extra-curricular activities. I hate participating in groups. I hate my courses because they're boring. I'm only eager to do good in them for money.

waybread said:

I have to say that your unawareness of a university as an institution is profound. You're a first year student, who has no idea from the inside of how and why a campus operates.

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Well it's a complicated system.

waybread said:

For one thing, if you and a counselor conclude that staying on campus isn't where you need to be, s/he will work with you to transition out of the university. It's nothing to the counselor if you stay or withdraw.

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I don't care about what the counselor has to say. She doesn't care about my problems and what's best for me.

waybread said:

The older returning or first-time university students usually do very well. First, they've had some real life experience under their belts. Second, they know why they are in school, what degree they want, and how they think it will benefit them.

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I'm in school because I want money. That's all I care about. I chose a computer science to get an internship to get a job to make money.

If I won the lottery I wouldn't have gone to school. I would've skipped ditched k-12 and completely avoided college.

waybread said:

They are not only chronologically more mature, but emotionally more mature than some 19-year old with no sense of purpose, who attends class merely because Mom or Dad (who typically pays for the tuition) or his high school peer group expects it of him.

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Well what are you supposed to do when everyone expects you to? My parents don't want me to be a loser and they'd disown me. And I don't want to starve to death, so college it is.

waybread said:

"Returning" or "mature" students can be anywhere in age from their late 20s to 60s, and usually they are a joy to teach, vs. some teenager with a chip on his shoulder.

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Well sorry I'm not the perfect golden student.

waybread said:

Joining the world of work, or taking a gap year to travel (if Mom will pay for that) seems like a much better use of your time and brain just now.

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My parents wouldn't be able to comprehend such a thing.

waybread said:

Funny how tough you talk when you've yet to cut the umbilical chord.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

tikana said:

i told you ... .. remember the argument/discussion a few months ago... it is a waste of time.

now you know

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OMG how could I forget

Thanks for reminding me



.......

AppLeo, I must have misread something you posted a while ago. You didn't call yourself a "whiny kid" once, did you?

Man-up, dude.

Look, go to university or don't. It is what it is. It isn't going to change just because you've got a fist-full of put-downs for it. It's your life. Make of it what you will or can. Or don't. Like I said, it's your life.

You talk up a tough line of extreme libertarianism and misogyny, but you can't run your own life due to your parents? If you were really a libertarian you'd stand on your own two feet, and rise or fall on the strength of your own will and talents. If those are wobbly, well that's nobody else's fault-- or problem, if you're a libertarian.

waybread said:

AppLeo, I must have misread something you posted a while ago. You didn't call yourself a "whiny kid" once, did you?

Man-up, dude.

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LOL

A feminist used the term "man-up" ? I thought that was damaging to our equality system.

But whatever that's totally cool.

waybread said:

Look, go to university or don't. It is what it is. It isn't going to change just because you've got a fist-full of put-downs for it. It's your life. Make of it what you will or can. Or don't. Like I said, it's your life.

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I don't know what I want to do with my life. I just feel like life is kind of pointless, ya know?

waybread said:

You talk up a tough line of extreme libertarianism and misogyny, but you can't run your own life due to your parents?

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I know, I'm a hypocrite and a fraud.

waybread said:

If you were really a libertarian you'd stand on your own two feet, and rise or fall on the strength of your own will and talents. If those are wobbly, well that's nobody else's fault-- or problem, if you're a libertarian.

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A democrat or socialist will help me out. They're selfless and care about others.

AppLeo, so many of your peers are confused about their life direction at this stage: it's par for the course. Maybe the lucky ones wake up one morning at age 8, and say, "OMG-- I want to become a plumber and unplug toilets for a living," and can actually do that. And plumbers make good money in the process.

The unlucky ones have Mom and/or Dad leaning on them to go into a potentially lucrative in-demand field like engineering, even when the student finds that sort of work to be soul-destroying. [If you've never seen the film The Dead Poets Society with Robin Williams, I highly recommend it.] My department used to get a fair number of mid-program students whom I called "refugees" from majors like engineering and business. They started in this type of field due to parental pressure, but their hearts weren't in them. Imagine spending, not just 4 years but possibly extra grad school, and then the rest of your life in a field that you disliked?

The sorta-lucky, sorta-not students don't find their One True Vocation In Life So Bright You Need Sunglasses To See It. They don't have that sense of a "calling" in life. They find a major they enjoy, they find gainful employment, work hard, and life goes along reasonably well for them. I was like that for most of my career.

I may be mistaken, AppLeo, but what I am getting from you is a lot of fear. For so many college students, that's normal and even natural, as they pivot from high school during college into adulthood. Which to many, looks kind of scary.

Where you differ, however, is that most students don't feel the need to hide that fear behind an outrageous ideology that you cannot even enact so long as you remain dependent on your parents.

Millions of other young adults leave high school and go get a job. Even if it doesn't pay well at first, bit by bit it can lead to more serious employment. If you have any physical strength, apply for a job in the Bakken oil fields. I once chatted with a young man who worked there, and was earning over $100k per year on the strength of a high school diploma and the ability to lift pipes. I'm not saying this is your cup of tea, but getting one's *** in gear may be beneficial. Some jobs require an apprenticeship or certification (like a higher grade of drivers license) but these are not insurmountable obstacles.

But, no, wait. It's easier by far to criticize everybody from the safety of your own cocoon, and let Mom waste her money on an education you hate, just because the world doesn't offer a soft landing.

I know, I'm a weak person.

I'm sorry; I just don't really know what to do.

I've been fearful of everything in my life. I wish I grew up in poverty or something because the idea of doing anything uncomfortable is just unacceptable.

AppLeo said:

I know, I'm a weak person.

I'm sorry; I just don't really know what to do.

I've been fearful of everything in my life. I wish I grew up in poverty or something because the idea of doing anything uncomfortable is just unacceptable.

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You are not a weak person. You are just young and overwhelmed by change and stress right now.

We have all been there.

Don't drop out just yet. Maybe drop one of the classes, if it is not too late.

And then meet with a counselor and reevaluate your major and your goals/ambitions.

You have to take classes in subjects that interest and inspire you. You are not really wanting to be a computer scientist, are you?

If you plan on doing your own business anyway, then study things that fascinate and motivate you now.

Woman-up, dude.
Strong, intelligent women are giving you encouragement and advice. You should take it seriously.

katydid said:

You are not a weak person. You are just young and overwhelmed by change and stress right now.

We have all been there.

Don't drop out just yet. Maybe drop one of the classes, if it is not too late.

And then meet with a counselor and reevaluate your major and your goals/ambitions.

You have to take classes in subjects that interest and inspire you. You are not really wanting to be a computer scientist, are you?

If you plan on doing your own business anyway, then study things that fascinate and motivate you now.

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Okay..

Well I'm taking computer science to learn coding. I feel like I could develop a passion for it once I get good at it. It will help with expressing creativity, I think. And making lots of money.

AppLeo said:

Okay..

Well I'm taking computer science to learn coding. I feel like I could develop a passion for it once I get good at it. It will help with expressing creativity, I think. And making lots of money.

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OK. Then why are you doubting if you should even be there?

I think coding is a good thing to learn. My son says he wishes he had learned it when he was younger because he is 28 now and feels too old to tackle it now.

But if you want to learn coding then stop whining and commit to it. Coding classes are not exciting or entertaining.


Are you afraid of failure? College is more daunting and intimidating than high school AP classes are...

katydid said:

OK. Then why are you doubting if you should even be there?

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I don't know; I have issues.

katydid said:

I think coding is a good thing to learn. My son says he wishes he had learned it when he was younger because he is 28 now and feels too old to tackle it now.

But if you want to learn coding then stop whining and commit to it. Coding classes are not exciting or entertaining.

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UGh okay okay

katydid said:

Are you afraid of failure? College is more daunting and intimidating than high school AP classes are...

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Of course I'm afraid of failure.

I just shouldn't have asked this question because all it is, is me complaining.

AppLeo said:

Okay..

Well I'm taking computer science to learn coding. I feel like I could develop a passion for it once I get good at it. It will help with expressing creativity, I think. And making lots of money.

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I think we had the career chat before and it looked like art, animation, computers were good for you. How those all combine will be up to you, of course, but animators can certainly do okay.

You're probably going through the same thing we all went through when we first went to uni, being completely overwhelmed, getting lost on campus, not knowing anyone or how things work - that will pass.

Katy's advice is good. Finish out the term at least, and if you're still sure you hate it, check polytechnic schools to see if you could learn the skills you want to learn at one of those without the other classes.

The mantra I suggested OM KLEEM OM helps to attract positive people into your life which will help with making friends and having the right people in your life to inspire you. It will take 2 weeks to work if you are to notice any effect. Going to college I needed the help of this mantra because I am shy. People who don't have issues are boring.

Om Kleem Om?? Just chant this while I meditate?

Uhh.... Well I guess I could and see what it does.

AppLeo said:

Om Kleem Om?? Just chant this while I meditate?

Uhh.... Well I guess I could and see what it does.

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You can say OM at the start and repeat the KLEEM. Such mantras are called beej (seed) mantra. It has no specific meaning but will attract a support system to you. Worth a try

Ukpoohbear said:

You can say OM at the start and repeat the KLEEM. Such mantras are called beej (seed) mantra. It has no specific meaning but will attract a support system to you. Worth a try

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Alright, I'll give it a shot.

Ukpoohbear said:

The mantra

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Ukpoohbear said:

I suggested OM KLEEM OM
helps to attract positive people into your life
which will help with making friends
and having the right people in your life
to inspire you.
It will take 2 weeks to work
if you are to notice any effect.
Going to college
I needed the help
of this mantra
because I am shy.
People who don't have
issues are boring.

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