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  #1  
Unread 11-08-2019, 03:54 PM
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is it a third house matter?

I`m trying to determine whether questions like these:


"is it the same person (or another one)?"

"was it person X that I saw earlier today?"



should be judged as 3rd house questions?

Whether a statement is true or false?
Or whether the querent is right or wrong about something?

Or should I consider these 7th house questions?


Last edited by dd78; 11-08-2019 at 03:55 PM. Reason: mistakes
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  #2  
Unread 11-13-2019, 12:47 AM
AJ Astrology AJ Astrology is online now
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dd78 View Post
I`m trying to determine whether questions like these:


"is it the same person (or another one)?"

"was it person X that I saw earlier today?"



should be judged as 3rd house questions?

Whether a statement is true or false?
Or whether the querent is right or wrong about something?

Or should I consider these 7th house questions?
Hi dd78,

An indispensable work is the "Book of the Nine Judges."

H3 is exclusively siblings. Any question about a sibling goes in H3, including whether a sibling is absent or missing.

H4 is for outcomes, and that would include whether a statement is right/wrong or the questioner right/wrong.

Now if the origin of the statement is a rumor or a letter, email or text, that would be H5.

For the first two questions, I doubt that's what they want to know. They may have couched it as "was it Person X I saw?" but that isn't what they really wanna know.

H7 is for partners, business partners and marital/dating partners. It's for wars, conflicts and contests, too, but mostly for partners.

H11 might be a possibility, assuming they are/were friends. You can ask will two friends come together. You can also ask if family members will come together (but not siblings). Maybe there's a rift in the family because someone died or someone dissed another.

I'd be inclined to use H9 myself. Treat it as an absent person (not necessarily the same as a missing person) and when they will return.

I'd look for any aspect between Ruler H9 and Asc or Moon including sign aspect, and if there is no aspect, then look for a collection of light or transfer of light.
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  #3  
Unread 11-13-2019, 01:18 PM
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Hi AJ,
Thank you so much for your response!

It`s very helpful



I rethought my questions and I think in ALL cases the underlying question is:

Are my impressions/observations/hypotheses etc.= thoughts concerning a person true or false ?

or:

I`m I right or wrong about somebody (who can only be signified by 7th house - the ultimate other) ?

So it rather seems to be a third house question.




Third house is about rumors, statements and verbal information , so I`m not sure if it includes the querent`s own thoughts?


Maybe I should use 7th from 3rd as questited = true or false (3rd) about somebody else (7th)?
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Unread 11-14-2019, 01:23 AM
AJ Astrology AJ Astrology is online now
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dd78 View Post
Hi AJ,
Thank you so much for your response!

It`s very helpful



I rethought my questions and I think in ALL cases the underlying question is:

Are my impressions/observations/hypotheses etc.= thoughts concerning a person true or false ?

or:

I`m I right or wrong about somebody (who can only be signified by 7th house - the ultimate other) ?

So it rather seems to be a third house question.




Third house is about rumors, statements and verbal information , so I`m not sure if it includes the querent`s own thoughts?


Maybe I should use 7th from 3rd as questited = true or false (3rd) about somebody else (7th)?

Hi dd78,

H3 is strictly siblings. If a question is not about a sibling or their status it does not belong to H3.

H5 is rumors.

H4 is about finality. It is a house of endings and completion. Use H4 to determine the truth of a matter or for the outcome of a matter that isn't already governed by another house. Supposedly you can know the hour of the outcome, but I don't know how to do that. I've seen it mentioned often in texts, but no one outlines the method to use.

Your question has a simple yes/no answer and H4 will tell you the answer.

If Asc Ruler is lighter than H4 Ruler and applying or Moon applying to H4 Ruler the answer is yes. Aspect doesn't matter. Well, I shouldn't say that, because a sextile would tell me you're ambivalent, a trine that your happy, a square that you're concerned and an opposition that you're not at all happy about it.

If no aspect, look for a collection of light (Moon cannot collect) or a transfer (Saturn cannot transfer). The planets involved in the collection/transfer of light will tell me the same thing the aspects would.

If the significantors are inconjunct, no aspect, no collection/transfer then the answer is no. If there's an aspect, make sure the planet isn't slow or on station, because that would mean it's about to go retrograde, which would be a no (and that would be telling, too, because it suggests you really wanted it to be that person but it wasn't).
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  #5  
Unread 11-14-2019, 04:59 PM
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ Astrology View Post

H4 is about finality. It is a house of endings and completion. Use H4 to determine the truth of a matter or for the outcome of a matter that isn't already governed by another house. Supposedly you can know the hour of the outcome, but I don't know how to do that. I've seen it mentioned often in texts, but no one outlines the method to use.

Your question has a simple yes/no answer and H4 will tell you the answer.



If the significantors are inconjunct, no aspect, no collection/transfer then the answer is no. If there's an aspect, make sure the planet isn't slow or on station, because that would mean it's about to go retrograde, which would be a no (and that would be telling, too, because it suggests you really wanted it to be that person but it wasn't).
wow!
thank you so much!
Your replies clarify so much to me!!!

so, just to be sure:

let`s assume the querent thinks he/she saw A. Schwarzenegger* while shopping a few hours prior to asking question.

But the querent somehow can`t be sure about who it actually was, so asks a horary question: "was it Schwarzenegger (or not him, only someone who happens to look similar)?"


The questited in this type of question would be the ruler of the 4th radical house, instead of 7th (used for the "ultimate other"), right?

I`m aware that there should be a separating aspect (or translation etc.) between sigs, instead of an applying one, as the question refers to a past event.

I simply have hard time assigning significator of the questited.


Thank you again, AJ!


*Schwarzenegger is just an example.

Last edited by dd78; 11-14-2019 at 05:05 PM. Reason: a sidenote
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Unread 11-14-2019, 06:24 PM
eekndyn eekndyn is offline
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Re: is it a third house matter?

I wonder if that would be 10th house a public figure?
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Unread 11-18-2019, 12:54 AM
AJ Astrology AJ Astrology is online now
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dd78 View Post
The questited in this type of question would be the ruler of the 4th radical house, instead of 7th (used for the "ultimate other"), right?
Hi dd78,

Yes, H4. Your H4. If you're casting the chart for another who asked the question it's still H4.

Quote:
I`m aware that there should be a separating aspect (or translation etc.) between sigs, instead of an applying one, as the question refers to a past event.
That would not be the case here. Truth is independent of time. If something is true, it's always true. The same for rumors in H5. Whether the rumor is rooted in a past event, current event or future event makes no difference.

Quote:
I simply have hard time assigning significator of the questited.
It's H1 Ruler and Moon and then H4 Ruler.
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  #8  
Unread 11-19-2019, 03:36 PM
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Re: is it a third house matter?

WOW!
You clarified also those of my questions I didn`t even ask here!!!

much appreciated!

Thank you very much for your help, AJ!!!

Last edited by dd78; 11-19-2019 at 03:39 PM. Reason: addition
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  #9  
Unread 11-20-2019, 02:36 AM
Aquarius358 Aquarius358 is offline
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Hi - Here are my thoughts :

Quote:
Originally Posted by dd78 View Post

I rethought my questions and I think in ALL cases the underlying question is:

Are my impressions/observations/hypotheses etc.= thoughts concerning a person true or false ?

If you are asking about information and it's the information that you, as the querent has, then the truth or falsity can be judged from the 3rd House. It is not just for siblings. The rumour / thought/ gossip / communication becomes the quesited and is L3.

Deb Houlding has written (Skyscript.co.uk) has written that a badly afflicted 3rd House can indicate lies - and, in your case, this would be 'false thinking'.

There are other things to take into account - the angles, are they Fixed? Is the Moon and the Moon's dispositor in a Fixed Sign? If so - good. Solidity = Truth. But if the most of them are in mutable Signs, then you are not necessarily on the 'truth' track.
Also, Mercury is involved here as the general significator of all things to do with thought and/or impressions as you mention above. What is Mercury's condition? Retrograde? Combust? Cadent?
Keep it simple. Look at L3 and Moon and also Mercury : ask what they are doing, going towards.
I would certainly judge a chart using L3 unless it were a rumour / information coming from overseas, in which case, L9 could be used.
It seems to me that you're asking about whether you yourself are on the right track in your thinking. There is no one else involved in the truth or lie debate.


or:

I`m I right or wrong about somebody (who can only be signified by 7th house - the ultimate other) ?

So it rather seems to be a third house question. YES, IT IS.




Third house is about rumors, statements and verbal information , so I`m not sure if it includes the querent`s own thoughts? YES. THEY DO.


Maybe I should use 7th from 3rd as questited = true or false (3rd) about somebody else (7th)? NOT NECESSARY.
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  #10  
Unread 11-22-2019, 03:11 PM
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Re: is it a third house matter?

Thank you so much, Aquarius!


Your clarifications are very helpful to me!

Thank you again!

Last edited by dd78; 11-22-2019 at 03:13 PM. Reason: unnecessary sentence
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