Will Trump become the first US Dictator?

petosiris

Banned
Hi leomoon,

It's not a valid chart.

Under horary rules, you don't have the right to ask questions of that nature.

Read Rhetorius, Dorotheus, Cardan, Bonati, Mashallah, ibn Ezra, Sahl, Gadbury, Clavis and Lily for prohibitions on the use of horary.

Do you read Cardan in Latin? As far as I am aware none of his astrological books have been translated into English.
 

leomoon

Well-known member
A horary astrology casts a horary chart asked by a Trump supporter in 2016:
"Will we win the Election?"
http://www.courtastrologer.net/horary/will-donald-trump-win-the-election/

the querent was a Trump supporter, I took the question as “Will WE win?” The moon (1st House ruler) represents Trump, and Jupiter (10th House ruler) represents the presidency. This question was asked before anyone knew Donald Trump would win the GOP nomination, and before Hillary Clinton had won the DNC nomination. Hillary Clinton is Saturn (7th House ruler).
Ironically perhaps?

Interestingly enough, just looking at the where each candidates planets are indicates a lot about how they feel about the election. The moon (Trump) is in his 11th house. Avraham Ibn-Ezra says that “a planet in 11th house is like a person in the house of his friends.”
Sometimes, one just needs to "stretch" the rules, which I always tend to do. But then again, I recall when Brady ran a thesis for her degree asking everyone the question, "Is Astrology a Science or an Art?"


An Art, won out by the majority of astrologer, including myself.



Artists all create using their individualized mediums.



Perhaps this man did too?


For sure, the 2016 Presidential Race was a very difficult one to correctly guess, not like the Bush 2004 or Obama 2006 or Obama 2008, all "relatively" easier ones to predict using natal astrology.


and this one: (actually 2 were cast): Both she guessed correctly using Horary -

https://www.kathrynsilvestre.com/the-sun-s-joy-blog/horary-trump/


https://www.kathrynsilvestre.com/20...horaries-2016-chart-5-will-trump-take-office/


https://www.kathrynsilvestre.com/2016/11/17/us-election-horaries-2016-chart-2-will-trump-win/



The chart is set for Nov 8, 2016 at 10:42 pm in Highland Park, IL (Ascendant 14 Leo).

The querent voted for Mrs Clinton and wants her to win, so Mrs Clinton gets the first house and its ruler, the Sun. Donald Trump, Mrs Clinton’s opponent, gets the seventh house and its ruler, Saturn. As we know, the Moon is the key to judgment in election contest horaries because it represents the voters. If the Moon applies to aspect one of the key significators, that candidate wins. Here the Moon applies to square Saturn, Trump’s significator: Trump will win.

Deborah Houlding on how she approaches Horary:
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/horary_prediction.html
 
Last edited:

leomoon

Well-known member
I seem to be running out of room to post what I think can be helpful past Horary charts erected in various corners of the globe regarding the U.S. 2016 Presidential Election. Seems a lot of peoples had a stake in knowing the answer:


From Skyscript: 3rd question down:




Generally speaking, the government of your country is L10. The ruling party is L10, the opposing party is L4. The government of a foreign country is L6 (10th from the 9th). In election charts the Moon is the electorate so the planet the Moon aspects wins the election. If the querent is emotionally engaged with a candidate or party to the point of feeling "us" or "them" about the election then the significators are L1 and L7.
We read the chart just like any other horary: dignity, receptions and aspects.



https://traditionalmedicalastrology.org/presidential-election-prediction/


Alan Leo - among others:

http://www.skyscript.co.uk/horary_prediction.html
 
Last edited:

leomoon

Well-known member
From 2016: Question regarding WHICH Party would win the Election?


apparently. using a "turned chart" to read i.e. 7 from 10 = 4 for Saturn.

SIGNIFICATORS
Democrats, the incumbent party, is the Sun, L10. The opponent party/challenging party: Saturn, L4. The Moon, the electorate.
INTERPRETATION
The Moon applies to conjoin Saturn next. Translation: the electorate chooses Saturn over the Sun.
ANSWER
The new president will be Republican. Period.


https://traditionalmedicalastrology.org/presidential-election-prediction/


Seems to be a whole lot easier then what we all went through back then. Especially turning to a particularly tough years, the Obama vs McCain year of 2008. Although all the astrologers on a committee that year (5 in all) predicted Obama would win based on Sidereal for some, a combination others, and Tropical for the majority of them - they were in unison.


Yet there was a particular astrologer I had/have a lot of respect for his knowledge, and he went through a lot of work, PMs & trouble for me to try & prove J. Eshelman's Sidereal Progressed Quotidian chart which predicted a win for Mitt Romney for him. (ouch!) Sometimes, we do get so attached to a certain way and method, we miss the forest for the trees. This I think was one of those times although its a fascinating study (the Secondary Progressed Quotidian charts ) which can be erected on Solar Fire. With my Mercury and Mars in slow moving Capricorn, it takes forever for me to learn something new. It was still worth it, but not for that election even though it may have proved correct back during Bush-Gore, it didn't in 2008, its certainly a worthwhile subject:


This one worked out:
https://solunars.com/viewtopic.php?t=3829
 

ElenaJ

Well-known member
It's not "We the People" who choose to elect a President. It's actually We the States, in a holdover from the Articles of the Confederation which preceded the Constitution and was grafted in to satisfy the Slave States' imperative that they could prevent an Anti-Slavery President. Trump could lose the election by as many as 8 million votes of We the People, and still win the Presidency.

The USA is not a democracy, it is a democratic republic. The purpose of the electoral college has nothing to do with slaves, but with the unequal representation of states with low population rates as opposed to those that are highly populated.
 

david starling

Well-known member
The USA is not a democracy, it is a democratic republic. The purpose of the electoral college has nothing to do with slaves, but with the unequal representation of states with low population rates as opposed to those that are highly populated.

The President is the President of ALL the people, as in "We the People of the UNITED States, and all elected, REPRESENTATIVE offices are by majority rule. That's what makes it a democratic republic, as opposed to a monarchy, a dictatorship, or a pure democracy.

Each State has its own elected officials, including its own Governor and ONLY two U.S. Senators REGARDLESS of population, which is how the less populated States get equal representation at the Federal level.

The ONLY elected representatives of ALL of the people in ALL of the States united into a single Nation, are the President and Vice-president. Therefore, they should be elected by the Popular vote of the entire Nation.

The Electoral College was ORIGINALLY intended to preserve Slavery in the "Slave-States", as opposed to the "Free-States". Slave-States would not have joined the Union under the Constitution without getting an unfair advantage, a type of "affirmative action", to ensure that the majority of the entire population of this nation would be denied the right to elect an anti-Slavery President, like Abraham Lincoln.

When this strategy failed, they seceded, and went back to the Articles of Confederation and Perpetual Union, which had been superseded by the Constitution, and had provided more sovereignty for the States than the Constitution.

Because of this unfair, Electoral College, method of electing EVERYONE'S President, REGARDLESS of what State one resides in, as many as 49.9 % of a State's population can be denied the right to cast a meaningful vote for the elected representative of the entire Nation. For example, in California, about a third of the votes were for Trump in 2016, but not ONE of those votes mattered--ALL of California's Electoral votes went to HRC. In Texas, it was the reverse.
 
Last edited:

david starling

Well-known member
Fun fact: When it appeared that Mitt Romney would win the Popular vote but lose the Electoral vote, none other than DJT himself declared that the Electoral College system was unfair, and should be abolished!
 

david starling

Well-known member
If the Democratic Party nominee loses the Electoral vote in the 2020 Election, as many as 8 MILLION votes for the Presidency will have been thrown in the trash! So much for "One Person One Vote"!

Since the President is the President of ALL of the People, EVERY person's vote should count.
 
Last edited:

ElenaJ

Well-known member
If the Democratic Party nominee loses the Electoral vote in the 2020 Election, as many as 8 MILLION votes for the Presidency will have been thrown in the trash! So much for "One Person One Vote"!

Since the President is the President of ALL of the People, EVERY person's vote should count.

Where is it written that there is one person one vote?
I live in a country governed strictly by majority rule, and it is caos.
So, after the 2016 elections, the Democrats accepted the elections and worked towards resolving problems and improving the country? Or have they spent the past few years trying one way or the other to overthrow the vote?
When Obama was elected twice, and the election frauds came to the surface, it wasn't considered serious.
But the republicans didn't work towards finding some excuse to overthrow the president. In 4 years, there is another election!
 

david starling

Well-known member
Where is it written that there is one person one vote?
I live in a country governed strictly by majority rule, and it is caos.
So, after the 2016 elections, the Democrats accepted the elections and worked towards resolving problems and improving the country? Or have they spent the past few years trying one way or the other to overthrow the vote?
When Obama was elected twice, and the election frauds came to the surface, it wasn't considered serious.
But the republicans didn't work towards finding some excuse to overthrow the president. In 4 years, there is another election!

The U.S. IS governed strictly by majority rule. The majority in each State elects its representatives. And, since the President is everyone's President regardless of which State one resides in, the majority of voters in the nation should elect the President.

The Republicans couldn't find anything solid enough to impeach Obama. They did try to "find some excuse to overthrow the president" in Bill Clinton's case, but having sex with an intern isn't against the rules as far as the Constitution is concerned. Unlike Trump, Clinton agreed to testify under oath, and was impeached for lying about it, not for doing it.
 

mrastro

Account Closed
Do you believe Trump will refuse to leave office after losing the Election?

I don't think Donald Trump is the type of person who accepts defeat gracefully. He said that the election was rigged and he would not accept the results during the 2016 election when he thought he was going to lose.
 

ElenaJ

Well-known member
He refused to promise to accept the results because it depended on how the election was carried out.
The Dems including Hilary promised to accept and respect the results. And we know how that ended, don't we!
 

leomoon

Well-known member
I don't think Donald Trump is the type of person who accepts defeat gracefully. He said that the election was rigged and he would not accept the results during the 2016 election when he thought he was going to lose.


I think everyone agrees with this answer, both parties who have watched the man closely. There are lots of images created of him hanging on to a pole on the portico of the WH, (a particularly funny one) but there is also something called FATE. Some Presidents even died while in office of natural causes.



The Democrats of course need to have the Majority rule in the Senate, get rid of McConnell, and then they are halfway home free. If Bernie is elected it would not surprise me if the more conservative of the group worked on negotiating with him. His age is a concern and hopefully, his VP pick (IF the ulltimate nominee that is, a big "IF" at this point; will be younger then he is.
 

ElenaJ

Well-known member
Has anyone done any charts on the upcoming election?
Or comparisons with the candidate's charts/progressions?
That would be interesting. A bit of work, though.
 
Top