Arabic parts

(This thread belongs to isis.It was posted on the wrong board)

how significant are arabic parts in natal astrology? because mine say REALLY bad things and have me a bit nervous, please anyone that can enlighten me, I am a very nervous person and things like this can really effect my wellbeing. Id appreciate any help, thanks.

Cheers,
Lilly

In my opinion (and it goes back at least to Dorotheus of Sidon 100 years before Ptolemy) the Lots ("Arabic Parts") are very significant in natal astrology; however, one must know what one is doing to delineate them accurately, one must also take into account the house-position of the Lot, the degree its in, the potential modification of its meaning by its dodekatemorion ramification, the planetary indicator (dispositor) of the Lot, the condition of that Lot dispositor, and aspects to the both the Lot and to its indicator (dispositor) planet-delineation of Lots is an art in itself.
Unless the delineations of the Lots in your chart have been subject to this degree of analysis I wouldn't set much store by the allegedly "really bad" things supposedly indicated...

they don't exist

dr. farr said:

In my opinion (and it goes back at least to Dorotheus of Sidon 100 years before Ptolemy)


the Lots ("Arabic Parts")


are very significant in natal astrology;



however, one must know what one is doing to delineate them accurately, one must also take into account the house-position of the Lot, the degree its in, the potential modification of its meaning by its dodekatemorion ramification, the planetary indicator (dispositor) of the Lot, the condition of that Lot dispositor, and aspects to the both the Lot and to its indicator (dispositor) planet-delineation of Lots is an art in itself.
Unless the delineations of the Lots in your chart have been subject to this degree of analysis I wouldn't set much store by the allegedly "really bad" things supposedly indicated...

Click to expand...

https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47124


02-22-2012, 03:25 PM
Omnisphericus
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 277


Lots = Pillars of Fate
I'm opening this thread




in order to practically put in use
certain (so called) arabic (or Greek)


lots by analyzing certain charts of the celebrities.
I will try to use AA ratings of charts of celebrities given on the site Astro-Databank, and convert these charts in to whole sign house system because it was a house system used by Hellenistic astrologers who used these lots in great deal.

In general my examination will be concentrated on particular lots like the Lot of Fortune (LOF), Lot of Spirit (LOS), Lot of Basis (LOB), Pars Hyleg (PH), Part of Exaltation (short: Exaltation).
I will add some other lots sporadically.

I welcome all of you who are interested in this lots and their practical use to participate in this discussion and we may learn through it.

I will start with a great introduction by the great authority on the subject Curtis Manwaring:
Quote:
Greek lots (also known as arabic parts) are sensitive points in a birth chart based upon the positions of the planets at birth, and the ascendant (with a few exceptions). The theory is that the planets in the heavens signify the more general circumstances that exist in the world at any given moment in time. What makes these planetary relationships unique to the individual is the way the individual exists in them, in relation to their ascending degree and sign. In essence, the lots are a tool that help the cosmic soul see how a relationship formed in the heavens applys to an individual through the use of analogy. For example, the cosmic soul says, for instance (lot of father), I know what the relationship of fatherhood is in the heavens; it is like the relationship between Saturn and the Sun. The distance between them is the implied relationship. So if the native is like the Sun, place the Sun on the ascendant and the distance between the Sun/Asc to where Saturn falls out in relation to the Sun is like the relationship the native has to his father. Another way of stating this is: "As Saturn is to the Sun, so too is the father to the native". The same principle extends to the other lots.
LOF is called the Lunar Horoscope (ancients called the ascendant - horoscope). The Moon in traditional astrology is representative of the Body in general (the ascendant as well), so LOF as Lunar Horoscope is a representative of the general health of the native, a source of wealth and well being (and this is not money and worldly success only, a good health condition is also Fortuna!).
Paulus from Alexandria says:
Quote:
"And fortune signifies everything that concerns the body, and what one does through the course of life. It becomes indicative of possessions, reputation and privilege.
Many of the ancients were calculating charts with the Fortuna as Ascendant, and therefore if the ruler of the Fortuna is 10 Signs from the Fortuna is said to be very fortunate.

Valens says:
Quote:
"... the Lot itself will possess the power of the horoskopos, that of life; the 10th zoidion [sign] from this, the power of the midheaven, that of reputation; the 7th, the power of the descendant; the 4th, of the subterraneous zoidion, and the remaining places will possess the power of the 12 regions."
The 11th sign from the Fortuna is also very important because it is a Place of
Acquisition.
Valens:
Quote:
"We have also found the 11th place [sign] from Fortune to be an acquisitive place, a bestower of belongings and goods, and especially when benefics are upon it or are testifying [in aspect].
LOS is showing the Spirit, the Vitale inside the body (Fortuna). It is what is moving the body - the Will Power, a will to action.
Paulus says:
Quote:
"Spirit happens to be lord of soul, temper, mindfulness, and every power; and sometimes it also cooperates in the determination concerning what one does."
LOB is derived from the Fortuna and Spirit (body and soul), so it represents the basis of the individual and its placement is of great importance.

The Exaltation is not a lot (though there exist a lot with calculating particular degrees but here we will use only the sign exaltation).
The Exaltation can be found by calculating how much is the distance (by signs) from the placement of the Sun (if diurnal chart) in your chart to the natural place of exaltation of the Sun - Aries. Then you add that number counting from the Ascendant on.
For example, lets say an Ascendant in Leo, Sun in Pisces, you have one sign from Pisces to Aries. You then calculate one sign from Leo which would be Virgo. So the Place of Exaltation of this 'person' is Virgo.
If a night chart you use the Moon and Taurus (place of exaltation) instead of the Sun and Aries.

Pars Hyleg is showing the Life Purpose of the person.

So, this is in short what these particular lots are representing.

Lets try this with example.
Here's Whitney Houston's chart:
Whitney Houston.jpg

LOF = 8.02 Cancer
LOS = 8.48 Scorpio
LOB = 7.39 Scorpio
Exaltation = Scorpio
Pars Hyleg = 13.15 Taurus

First that we notice is Fortuna's ruler: Moon is in 10th Place from Fortuna with the greater Benefic Jupiter.
This is great, Jupiter is ruler of the radical 10th.
Pars Hyleg, 'the Life Purpose' is in Taurus, 11 signs from the Fortuna.
She reached the Audience. She "Acquisited" a great number of audience. That was her life purpose.
Pars Hyleg in the Venusian Taurus is showing that her purpose is to Sing (Taurus ruler the throat), to make music.

Next, look how close (partile) are the degrees of LOF, LOS and LOB.
LOS and LOB are making Partile Trine to the Fortuna.

The thing that LOB, LOS and Exaltation are in the same sign is already a great deal of significance.
But, they all share same ruler which is not so strong.
Mars is in 12th Place from them in fall in Libra. In 8th radical place. This is an idle place. The ruler of radical 8th Venus is in 6th place in combustion.
All this shows troubled life.
As it was indeed.
The Fortuna and the ruler in 10th place from it, is showing the eminence, the glory and success. But the LOB and LOS are too weak through their ruler.
Mars in 8th in fall and ruler of the Spirit can show "weak will".
That Mars is making partile square to the Fortuna, and an opposition to the Fortuna's ruler Moon.
So, all in all that Mars is creating great troubles to all the significant points in the chart.

At this moment I will refer you to this discussion here:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=46808

Here I 've calculated her chart to find the Hyleg and Alcocoden and I was able to be precise with months about the years of life showed by her Alcocoden.
I didn't make the calculations of the Lots back then, but now as I'm examining her chart through this lots I can see how the both techniques are showing the similar results. Again, Mars is the greater 'trouble maker'.
Lot of Fortuna is her Hyleg and Mars her Alcocoden.

Bjorkstrand said:

they don't exist

Click to expand...

I agree, just like many of the systems I discuss elsewhere https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=125407

JUPITERASC said:

https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47124


02-22-2012, 03:25 PM
Omnisphericus

Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 277


Lots = Pillars of Fate
I'm opening this thread




in order to practically put in use
certain (so called) arabic (or Greek)


lots by analyzing certain charts of the celebrities.
I will try to use AA ratings of charts of celebrities given on the site Astro-Databank, and convert these charts in to whole sign house system because it was a house system used by Hellenistic astrologers who used these lots in great deal.

In general my examination will be concentrated on particular lots like the Lot of Fortune (LOF), Lot of Spirit (LOS), Lot of Basis (LOB), Pars Hyleg (PH), Part of Exaltation (short: Exaltation).
I will add some other lots sporadically.

I welcome all of you who are interested in this lots and their practical use to participate in this discussion and we may learn through it.

I will start with a great introduction by the great authority on the subject Curtis Manwaring:
Quote:
Greek lots (also known as arabic parts) are sensitive points in a birth chart based upon the positions of the planets at birth, and the ascendant (with a few exceptions). The theory is that the planets in the heavens signify the more general circumstances that exist in the world at any given moment in time. What makes these planetary relationships unique to the individual is the way the individual exists in them, in relation to their ascending degree and sign. In essence, the lots are a tool that help the cosmic soul see how a relationship formed in the heavens applys to an individual through the use of analogy. For example, the cosmic soul says, for instance (lot of father), I know what the relationship of fatherhood is in the heavens; it is like the relationship between Saturn and the Sun. The distance between them is the implied relationship. So if the native is like the Sun, place the Sun on the ascendant and the distance between the Sun/Asc to where Saturn falls out in relation to the Sun is like the relationship the native has to his father. Another way of stating this is: "As Saturn is to the Sun, so too is the father to the native". The same principle extends to the other lots.
LOF is called the Lunar Horoscope (ancients called the ascendant - horoscope). The Moon in traditional astrology is representative of the Body in general (the ascendant as well), so LOF as Lunar Horoscope is a representative of the general health of the native, a source of wealth and well being (and this is not money and worldly success only, a good health condition is also Fortuna!).
Paulus from Alexandria says:
Quote:
"And fortune signifies everything that concerns the body, and what one does through the course of life. It becomes indicative of possessions, reputation and privilege.
Many of the ancients were calculating charts with the Fortuna as Ascendant, and therefore if the ruler of the Fortuna is 10 Signs from the Fortuna is said to be very fortunate.

Valens says:
Quote:
"... the Lot itself will possess the power of the horoskopos, that of life; the 10th zoidion [sign] from this, the power of the midheaven, that of reputation; the 7th, the power of the descendant; the 4th, of the subterraneous zoidion, and the remaining places will possess the power of the 12 regions."
The 11th sign from the Fortuna is also very important because it is a Place of
Acquisition.
Valens:
Quote:
"We have also found the 11th place [sign] from Fortune to be an acquisitive place, a bestower of belongings and goods, and especially when benefics are upon it or are testifying [in aspect].
LOS is showing the Spirit, the Vitale inside the body (Fortuna). It is what is moving the body - the Will Power, a will to action.
Paulus says:
Quote:
"Spirit happens to be lord of soul, temper, mindfulness, and every power; and sometimes it also cooperates in the determination concerning what one does."
LOB is derived from the Fortuna and Spirit (body and soul), so it represents the basis of the individual and its placement is of great importance.

The Exaltation is not a lot (though there exist a lot with calculating particular degrees but here we will use only the sign exaltation).
The Exaltation can be found by calculating how much is the distance (by signs) from the placement of the Sun (if diurnal chart) in your chart to the natural place of exaltation of the Sun - Aries. Then you add that number counting from the Ascendant on.
For example, lets say an Ascendant in Leo, Sun in Pisces, you have one sign from Pisces to Aries. You then calculate one sign from Leo which would be Virgo. So the Place of Exaltation of this 'person' is Virgo.
If a night chart you use the Moon and Taurus (place of exaltation) instead of the Sun and Aries.

Pars Hyleg is showing the Life Purpose of the person.

So, this is in short what these particular lots are representing.

Lets try this with example.
Here's Whitney Houston's chart:
Whitney Houston.jpg

LOF = 8.02 Cancer
LOS = 8.48 Scorpio
LOB = 7.39 Scorpio
Exaltation = Scorpio
Pars Hyleg = 13.15 Taurus

First that we notice is Fortuna's ruler: Moon is in 10th Place from Fortuna with the greater Benefic Jupiter.
This is great, Jupiter is ruler of the radical 10th.
Pars Hyleg, 'the Life Purpose' is in Taurus, 11 signs from the Fortuna.
She reached the Audience. She "Acquisited" a great number of audience. That was her life purpose.
Pars Hyleg in the Venusian Taurus is showing that her purpose is to Sing (Taurus ruler the throat), to make music.

Next, look how close (partile) are the degrees of LOF, LOS and LOB.
LOS and LOB are making Partile Trine to the Fortuna.

The thing that LOB, LOS and Exaltation are in the same sign is already a great deal of significance.
But, they all share same ruler which is not so strong.
Mars is in 12th Place from them in fall in Libra. In 8th radical place. This is an idle place. The ruler of radical 8th Venus is in 6th place in combustion.
All this shows troubled life.
As it was indeed.
The Fortuna and the ruler in 10th place from it, is showing the eminence, the glory and success. But the LOB and LOS are too weak through their ruler.
Mars in 8th in fall and ruler of the Spirit can show "weak will".
That Mars is making partile square to the Fortuna, and an opposition to the Fortuna's ruler Moon.
So, all in all that Mars is creating great troubles to all the significant points in the chart.

At this moment I will refer you to this discussion here:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=46808

Here I 've calculated her chart to find the Hyleg and Alcocoden and I was able to be precise with months about the years of life showed by her Alcocoden.
I didn't make the calculations of the Lots back then, but now as I'm examining her chart through this lots I can see how the both techniques are showing the similar results. Again, Mars is the greater 'trouble maker'.
Lot of Fortuna is her Hyleg and Mars her Alcocoden.

​

Click to expand...

What that member wrote about the Part of Hyleg is hilarious...[absolutely clueless] It reminds me of an old joke as to "Why are fire engines red?" ...and the answer was because "Because Communists are Red and Russians are all communists and fire engines are always rushin' therefore that's why fire engines are red."

Read my thread titled "The King of Parts: The Part of Hyleg" for the real information on what the Part of Hyleg is and what it signifies...at this following link... https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=85891&highlight=Part+Hyleg

..as for the rest of what that member wrote... nearly just as clueless... and one should never change a Parts formul as to whether an individual was born during the Night or during the day... no more than you would change the recipe for a cake depending on whether you are going to bake it at night or during the day.

The Sabian Symbols are the "Key of Understanding"... without that key...you're just looking at a lot of closed doors locked tight.

Always a pleasure to be of service...

Would there be a part of autism or neurological disorders in astrology since the number of people diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder in the last 20-some years increased dramatically? 3 planets: Uranus plus Neptune minus Saturn are associated with attributes and traits of autism. Mine falls on 22-23' Aquarius right between my natal sun in 26' and moon in 20' and indeed I have a mild form of autism.

The astrological part of Cancer in my natal chart: ASC 17' 33" Cancer+Neptune 22' Sagittarius-6' Virgo = 3' Scorpio and the sabian symbol for that is "A child holds a candle in a ritual". I find 8' Scorpio an interesting one: a doctor at work. I suppose there's a connection of my part of Cancer close to the doctor degree.

dr. farr said:

In my opinion (and it goes back at least to Dorotheus of Sidon 100 years before Ptolemy) the Lots ("Arabic Parts") are very significant in natal astrology; however, one must know what one is doing to delineate them accurately, one must also take into account the house-position of the Lot, the degree its in, the potential modification of its meaning by its dodekatemorion ramification, the planetary indicator (dispositor) of the Lot, the condition of that Lot dispositor, and aspects to the both the Lot and to its indicator (dispositor) planet-delineation of Lots is an art in itself.
Unless the delineations of the Lots in your chart have been subject to this degree of analysis I wouldn't set much store by the allegedly "really bad" things supposedly indicated...

Click to expand...

Okay, another one of the old, old, threads that a moderator decided to reinvigorate, that was best left to the past... mainly for the reason that the thread initiator is long gone [I so believe. as they haven't posted anything in this forum for almost 10 years now] and will likely never read anything I have to say further about the matter.

With all due respect to dr. farr, a most educated man within his profession, I've never read anything by him that seems to be particularly insightful about understanding the Astrological Parts.

He, like many that cling to the "Gilded Lily", and the "Classic" astrologers from the Middle and Dark Ages, like to use the so esoteric, and occluded terms of astrology such as dodekatemorion and dispositor and terms such as delineation.

Delineating a Part accurately? Just what is meant by that?
Do any of these astrologers ever give a example with a detailed explanation?
Do they ever show any proof as such to back up these claims?
For all my years here I've yet to see just one.

The definition of the word "delineate" is "describe or portray (something) precisely."
Look at the many examples of Parts I, and at times, member PhoenixVenus have demonstrated what some mis-labled, or mis-titled Parts genuinely are.
How did we arrive at that? By questioning the accepted, is how.
For one example see my thread on the Part of False Love, in which I both challenged that given, and accepted title, and demonstrate that it should be properly known as the Part of Ideal Love, and for what reasons.
Also, read my thread "The King of Parts, The Part of Hyleg" in which I demonstrate as to why the renowed author Robert Zoeller, whom wrote the, so called, definitive work on Arabic Parts, didn't have a clue as to understanding what the Part of Hyleg is and how to use it.

If it doesn't make any sense as to any technique, title given, or what the use of it is...then challenge it. Don't accept it until you are satisfied by proof. Either your own proof or that of someone else that demonstrates and explains it.

I don't have ALL THE ANSWERS, but then again, no one has...not yet

There may be something to the notion that a Parts' dispositor does have weight to the overall analysis. I haven't delved into that particular study as of yet. I may never get to it. It does sound plausible though. But, as most people aren't affected by all the planets, [although I do believe that everyone is affected by planetary Parts/Lots which is due to my studies of the late, 20th century, renowned clairvoyant, Edgar Cayce, and all that He had to say on the subject of astrology...in that He did infer that everyone is affected by their ascendant and all angles to the ascendant, leaving me to conclude that all Astrological Parts that utilize the ascendant as the "personal point" in the formula for that Part...and thus all House cusps that also are utilized as a "personal point" {for example, such as the Part of Destiny which use the M.C.} are of affect on a person...even though a particular planet that is not of affect on a person is a part of that particular Astrological Parts formula.] then one must be very wary of utilizing dispositors or any ephemeral activity of the planets themselves for the purpose of evaluating any particular Astrological Parts amount of effect.

As I have repeatedly demonstrated that Astrological Parts are symbolically active, when one consults the Sabian Symbol for the degree that Part is found to be in, that is what I believe is the most important thing to be aware of along with what that particular Part is oriented towards in influence.

For an example of what I mean by all of that.
if your Part of Catastrophe happens to be in the 17th degree of Capricorn, such as mine happens to be, then given that the Sabian Symbol for the 17th of Cap. is about "losing ones inhibitions", then for Pete's sake stay away from drugs, alcohol, dare devil sports, and unprotected sexual relations, affairs with a married spouse or underage minors, and anything else you should naturally be inhibited from partaking in.

It's that simple, for most people to at least know and be aware of that... that is as to how these Parts work and what danger they may be of to you.
Watch for planetary conjunctions to the Parts...they can and often do activate that particular Astrological Part. If it is a planet, or luminary, that also happens to a part of that particular Astrological Parts' formula, then take extra heed to the event. If that planet is of known effect to you, then you had best believe that it will both activate that Part and have its way with your life.

Please let sleeping dogs and old posts lie. Don't disturb them.

My part of death is 12-13' Leo, something to do with an old sea captain. I was on a cruise trip in Feb. from Florida to Key West to Cozumel, Mexico. Then in March 1st, Americans were preparing for cruise ships filled with covid19 (mine wasn't affected at all) infections. Oddly, 2-3' Leo is described as a plague. The connections of current events and sabian symbol descriptions are quite eerie. So far, nobody I personally know (family, friends, coworkers and online friends, except on AW reading posts) has covid19, but they knew a few to be infected.