Major US Study Says Red Meat Unhealthy/Lethal/Can Kill!!!

Here is something I have thought about for....quite awhile.

Eskimos eat nothing but meat. In fact, they have a rather mono diet and they do not die of any of the diseases or have any of the complications that others do. They live quite long and healthy lives for the most part.

Italians, for example, also not only eat a high amount of meat but, also high cholesterol. Yet, they have a lower incidence of heart and arterial problems then other places like the USA.

So, it it really what we eat or how it is treated before we eat it?? Is it what we eat or how we are eating it or using that energy to fuel our lives? Not sure, but I can tell you that the argument is not so easily solved by simply pointing fingers at a carrot vs. a steak.

Just some thoughts....

On the contrary, authentic Eskimos eat nothing but fish since there is nothing for animals to graze on in the frozen wastes. Eskimos could get the odd seal/polar bear but subsist mostly on various varieties of fish.

Italians are famed for consuming vast quantities of pasta, macaroni, pizza and cheese

Actually, they eat quite a few land forms including include walrus, seal, caribou, polar bear, to name a few. They do not eat just the meat but, also the organs which, makes sense.

My point is, they hardly adhere to the "food pyramid" that purports to be the basis of a healthy diet and lifestyle. They consume NO vegatables and certainly no citrus fruits.

This begs a closer look at what exactly is a "healthy diet". It certainly cannot be quantified as we are often led to believe or perseverate over meat vs. no meat.

JUPITERASC said:

On the contrary, authentic Eskimos eat nothing but fish since there is nothing for animals to graze on in the frozen wastes. Eskimos could get the odd seal/polar bear but subsist mostly on various varieties of fish.

Italians are famed for consuming vast quantities of pasta, macaroni, pizza and cheese

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And the Japanese have the longest life expectancy in the entire world. They eat 90% seafood (fish, sushi, crabs, even whales, etc)... rarely, do traditional Japanese eat red meats. (The younger generation is beginning to eat more of it though, and there are also more health issues surfacing in the country since this began.)

"According to both UN and WHO estimates, Japan has the longest life expectancy of any country in the world. According to the UN, it has the third lowest infant mortality rate.[11][12]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan#Health




By the way; To the poster above who claims eating animal fat is what caused our intelligence to increase; It was fat in general.

Primitive people did not know how to process milk, cheese, eggs, nut oils, coconut oils, olive oils, etc.. so of course there was a great nutritional deficiency because we were eating nothing but plant food -- with a bit of grain thrown in.

Any healthy source of ample oil/fat would have caused the same development.

Jupiter ~ have you ever been to italy?
they eat meat every day if the can. pasta is a side dish and their cheeses are typically low fat ~ mozz, pecorino, parm, romano and the like.
threy are so precise with how cows graze, the assign regions to them.
pasta is a side dish.
your pizza joke fell flat ~ pfglgggh
but they don't have the volume of processed meat that u.s. has, nor the industrialized equip in most regions to keep food and preserve them for weeks. most regions ~ agrarian or livestock ~ (though changing and growing) still employ many old world techniques and values.
anyway ~
The issue here is bizarre.
Red Meat Kills!
Human's have survived on red meat for centuries.
Only because of profit efficiency has the u.s. seen the worst in food production and handling, which this study wants to blame on red meat alone.
Fat steer pumped with steroids and hormones to weigh more, fed but not ranged, handed over to slaughterhouses that deal with a million cows a year, packaged, frozen and maybe even ground up with dirt and garbage, turned into "burgers", "steaks" and whatever ~
eating s*hit and not moving is what kills most of us.

Anachiel said:

My point is, they (Eskimos) hardly adhere to the "food pyramid" that purports to be the basis of a healthy diet and lifestyle. They consume NO vegatables and certainly no citrus fruits.

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In contrast, the Indian diet is predominantly vegan - most Indians consume no meat at all and are healthier than many of their over-fed contemporaries in the West - death is caused by malaria or by water-borne disease such as cholera/other tropical disease

Ixaee said:

Exactly; and the Japanese have the longest life expectancy in the entire world. They eat 90% seafood (fish, sushi, crabs, even whales, etc)... rarely, do traditional Japanese eat red meats. (The younger generation is beginning to eat more of it though, and there are also more health issues surfacing in the country since this began.)

"According to both UN and WHO estimates, Japan has the longest life expectancy of any country in the world. According to the UN, it has the third lowest infant mortality rate.[11][12]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan#Health
By the way; To the poster above who claims eating animal fat is what caused our intelligence to increase; It was fat in general.

Primitive people did not know how to process milk, cheese, eggs, nut oils, coconut oils, olive oils, etc.. so of course there was a great nutritional deficiency because we were eating nothing but plant food -- with a bit of grain thrown in.

Any healthy source of ample oil/fat would have caused the same development.

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JUPITERASC said:

In contrast, the Indian diet is predominantly vegan - most Indians consume no meat at all and are healthier than many of their over-fed contemporaries in the West - death is caused by malaria or by water-borne disease such as cholera/other tropical disease

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Yes, yes...I'm not arguing for or against meat or non-meat diets. My overlooked point is that there are a variety of diets, some exclusively meat and some not so much and...in comparison to what we are traditionally told about a "healthy diet" there is something that is being overlooked. Obviously.

Anachiel said:

Actually, they (Eskimos) eat quite a few land forms including include walrus, seal, caribou, polar bear, to name a few. They do not eat just the meat but, also the organs which, makes sense.

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walrus and seal are not exclusively 'land forms' as such. walrus and seal spend much of their time in the water. I have already mentioned that Eskimos consume seal and rarely, the occasional polar bear.

Caribou are land forms but cannot survive where ice and snow prevent the growth of vegetation. Therefore, Eskimos inhabiting the frozen wastes rarely have access to caribou and those Eskimos mostly subsist on fish and seal. Some Eskimos do have rare access to land vegetables, but in any event, crucially, Eskimos do eat plenty of seaweed and other sea vegetables.

MaeMae said:

R&R ~ i refer to beef in this instance.
lots of people don't eat beef who survive. India for example.

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Anachiel said:

Yes, yes...I'm not arguing for or against meat or non-meat diets. My overlooked point is that there are a variety of diets, some exclusively meat and some not so much and...in comparison to what we are traditionally told about a "healthy diet" there is something that is being overlooked. Obviously.

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IMO Your point, far from being overlooked has been obviously answered indirectly by MaeMae

MaeMae said:

my only point really is that the meat that "Kills Us" is toxic, poorly raised and mass produced. Paying more for pure, raising your own (if you have the land) or going without should be the alternative.

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MaeMae has already drawn our attention to the fact that it is the way the meat is raised that causes the illhealth to the consumer

MaeMae said:

Fat steer pumped with steroids and hormones to weigh more, fed but not ranged, handed over to slaughterhouses that deal with a million cows a year, packaged, frozen and maybe even ground up with dirt and garbage, turned into "burgers", "steaks" and whatever ~
eating s*hit and not moving is what kills most of us.

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MaeMae said:

nonetheless ~ i'm not anti-meat but i no longer eat it.
good, healthy , lean beef, ranged and grazed and not messed with and slaughtered appropriately is not what this study is talking about.

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I vote with the sensible, sensitive, informed carnivores.

This was a long-range study involving a lot of people. It is so general that it doesn't allow for fine-tuned discrimination.

Most beef sold in the developed world is marbled. This marbling of fat throughout the muscle tissue doesn't occur in nature. Cattle were bread for marbling because the melted fat throughout the meat is what makes a cut of meat more flavourful and juicy. Most processed meats sold by large meat-packers are high in fat, salt, nitrates, sweeteners, and preservatives.

To avoid the problems with commercial beef, look for leaner cuts (like round steak) and if you like ground beef, grind it yourself so you know exactly what's going in there. Look for a source of "natural" or organic beef in your area. You can probably find farmers within a decent radius of your home who sell this type of beef. Check, also, if you have a local farmers' market, as these growers will often sell their products there.

If you like red meat, you can also opt for lamb, goat, or farm-raised vension or bison. These animals have not been bred for marbling. If there is fat on the outside of a roast, you can trim it off.

For sure, any diet that focuses on fresh fruits and vegetables is going to be better than one heavy in saturated fats and additives. There is a big debate about whole grains (carbs) and dairy products. Obviously a little of anything in moderation is going to be just fine.

A totally vegan diet does not provide adequate bio-available iron and some of the B-vitamins. A person who is vegan out of conscience might happily pop a vitamin pill rather than consume meat. However, this does indicate that humans did not evolve with a vegan diet.

Hindus are not vegan. They consume dairy products such as yogurt and soft cheeses (chenna, paneer). Truth be known, scientists who wondered how Hindus got enough B-vitamins determined that insect infestations in rice (in a developing nation) were enough to provide some of the animal-based vitamins.

I think the best thing to do is to eat more fruit, vegetables, nuts, fish and beans. Occasionally some cheese is nice, and I think meat once a week is fine. If I spend money on meat, I opt for decent quality like organic or halal. I feel pretty healthy as a result.

The other reason people can get ill from meat is the use of meat trimmings and ammonium hydroxide (which is corrosive) to form pink slime, which is even worse than ordinary meat. But that's what happens when government agencies serve narrow economic interests instead of public health (even with the concept of externalities...).

Nuts are for weirdos. Eat meat, in abundance. Just balance it out with vegetables. Only eat fruit as often as you'd eat snacks and candy, fruit is just a snack. Don't eat bread, rice, potatoes and other tubers, don't eat dairy, and don't eat anything refined or processed.

Oh golly, I'm describing the exact diet humans ate before civilization! Human remains of those eating this diet were shown to have very few serious health problems, contrary to those found eating more modern diets, including the Japanese (generally considered the healthiest people).

Anachiel said:

Here is something I have thought about for....quite awhile.

Eskimos eat nothing but meat. In fact, they have a rather mono diet and they do not die of any of the diseases or have any of the complications that others do. They live quite long and healthy lives for the most part.

Italians, for example, also not only eat a high amount of meat but, also high cholesterol. Yet, they have a lower incidence of heart and arterial problems then other places like the USA.

So, it it really what we eat or how it is treated before we eat it?? Is it what we eat or how we are eating it or using that energy to fuel our lives? Not sure, but I can tell you that the argument is not so easily solved by simply pointing fingers at a carrot vs. a steak.

Just some thoughts....

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I don't know that we Italians are anymore tolerant to high levels than other ethnic groups overall. I did hear of an exception or two...
I believe those Italians you are referring to are an isolated group that has an extremely high level of cholesterol among them and the tolerance for it...and I can't remember where in Italy the region is. They do use a lot of Olive oil and probably exclusively.
Since 2007 I know longer allow any oil to be used in cooking in my home other than Olive but do permit occasionally peanut, almond..or any of the 'nut' oils... [don't care for the flavor of coconut other than in candy or cake, thanx u.]

I know that my mom [who sort of atypical 'Earth Mother Hippie'... though she was 38 at the onset of the 'Summer of Love'. {I was 14}] whom had read all of Adele Davis and was always up to date with all things Edgar Cayce, had a 'Cause' going for dietary oils.

She extolled Olive oil and Peanut oil as Cayce had done so.
She oft remarked that it is the oils we use that potentially are are the greatest harm to us in the 'long term picture'.
She oft reminded me that there was not much that was worse than eating something of rancid oil content.
Inferior and or unnatural oils aren't good for you. That crud that is called 'Canola oil' that was known as 'Rape seed oil' prior to the nation of Canada trying figure out how to sell a non digestible oil with an unappealing name that they happened to have so much of.
Now, Monsanto has even come out with a GM Rape seed plant....horrors!

..and my roommate Rick, just informed me [as he sometimes works as a chef/cook ...killla Sous' Chef !] that one can no longer use 'Lard' in commercial cooking in the state of California since 2007... I wasn't aware of that..

.. first thing comes to mind..is Monsanto is probably behind that...
even though it is a good idea... I have a sneaking suspicion...
ifyaknowhatimean...

anybody see the recent movie with Billy BoB Thorton and Tia Leoni, called, 'Smell of Success'?

if so did you 'see' any Monsanto refs. in the flick?

[the scene about the huge carrot is one of the funniest of scenes ...but then again I do have a Scorpio Asc.... ...I recommend that flick ...a most novel Noir too!]

QUOTE FROM: "Food Inc"

"The Industry doesn't want you to know the truth about what you're eating because if you did - you might not want to eat it!... the food has become much more dangerous in ways that are being deliberately hidden from us... This isn't just about what we're eating... this is about what we are allowed to say... what we are allowed to know... the companies don't want the Farmers talking - they don't want this story told" http://www.schooltube.com/video/66aa3cbb5d91038dfda3/

and sadly, most people never bother to ask...

piercethevale said:

Inferior and or unnatural oils aren't good for you. That crud that is called 'Canola oil' that was known as 'Rape seed oil' prior to the nation of Canada trying figure out how to sell a non digestible oil with an unappealing name that they happened to have so much of.
Now, Monsanto has even come out with a GM Rape seed plant....horrors!

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Good info!..thanks for that very informative. I had no idea they renamed it...

Since there is reference to Rapeseed oil and Canola oil, I'd put forward my views.

Mustard/Rapeseed oil Vs Canola oil:
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Mustard/Rapeseed oil, extensively used in India and China. Before coming to USA, I ate Mustard/Rapeseed oil almost every day. It does not hurt/harm me, it has been used for cooking and body massage since generations.

Mustard/Rapeseed oil has about 5% Erucic Acid, in excess, supposed to cause scar on organ tissues. Canada went ahead with genetic engineering and came up with Canola oil. In this process, the 5% omega 3 oil of Mustard/Rapeseed oil increased up to 12% in Canola Oil.

Of course, it was time to celebrate, omega 3 being essential oil, and its content increased, but cooking with omega 3 is poisonous (Omega 3 turns rencid). Canola oil probably became harmful oil for consumption, although it is sold.

Please note that flaxseed oil, rich in omega 3 is kept in dark bottle and inside freeze, to preserve from getting rencid (from heat and light). It is not used for cooking.
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Use of Mustard/Rapeseed oil, specially for body massage is helpful, in case, Mars is week. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mustard_oil
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For me Red Meat means Goat Meat. It helps me to strengthen Mars. In fact, this Red Meat, Red Pepper and Mustard oil helps me to improve Mars.

Astrologically, I recommend others, if their Mars is Weak or in Fall, with warnings that Red Meat influences lipid profile, Pepper can cause digestive irritation and Mustard can cause scar in internal organ. But they are sort of best to strengthen Mars.

BTW, any other suggestion (other than Indian Garam Masala) for Foods, which helps Mars?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garam_masala

Great info dhundhun.

Traditionally, from Western perspective anyway, ginger, pepper, garlic, onion, radish, mustard-seed, spinach, nettles, leeks and horehound all add to Mars.

dhundhun said:

For me Red Meat means Goat Meat. It helps me to strengthen Mars. In fact, this Red Meat, Red Pepper and Mustard oil helps me to improve Mars.

Astrologically, I recommend others, if their Mars is Weak or in Fall, with warnings that Red Meat influences lipid profile, Pepper can cause digestive irritation and Mustard can cause scar in internal organ. But they are sort of best to strengthen Mars.

BTW, any other suggestion (other than Indian Garam Masala) for Foods, which helps Mars?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garam_masala

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dhundhun - check out turmeric, basil, mint