Will I never have friends?

AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
When I look at my 11th house (house of friends) the ruler of that house is Mars. I have a day chart, so by sect, Mars becomes my worst planet. Mars's evil is exacerbated by its debilitation in Cancer. And to make things even WORSE, it's exactly conjunct my descendant, so it gains prominence being on an angle.

I've never really had friends or felt connected to people. I avoid large groups and communities. A solitary lifestyle seems to bring me the most peace because whenever I'm around people, it's like they make me feel bad about myself, abuse my time and energy, or I have this need to cut them out of my life.

chart.cgi
 
CapAquaPis

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
A Chiron (wound) in the 11th house (friends, community and society)...I have that in my own 11th under Taurus ruled by Venus however which is conjunct MC in the 10th. Knowing you and myself, we can be too open, come off rude or crass, opinionated, deemed inappropriate and displays improper sense of self. Your planet Mars should be more malefic than my own planet Venus which has conjunct feminine energy of other influences Pallas, Ceres and Eris but in Aries.
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
Do I really come off as crude and inappropriate to you?

But you make a good point about Chiron. I forgot about that. That seems to only solidify what I mentioned above.
 
waybread

waybread

Well-known member
AppLeo, With Mars ruling your 11th house from the 7th house of open enemies, I think you expressed that when you wrote:

whenever I'm around people, it's like they make me feel bad about myself, abuse my time and energy...
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You do seem to see other people as the enemy. It's not that you feel badly around other people: but "they" actively make you feel that way. "They" actively abuse your time and energy.

And you're the passive recipient of this, right?

Saturn square sun can confer real issues with self-esteem. The wounded lion retreats to his solitary den to lick his wounds.

Maybe it's time to take responsibility for your part of the equation. People can't just make you feel rotten without your permission.

But beyond that, maybe you're just cut out to be a loner. 8th house people tend to be very private.

The question is, what exactly do you want?
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
waybread said:
AppLeo, With Mars ruling your 11th house from the 7th house of open enemies, I think you expressed that when you wrote:



You do seem to see other people as the enemy. It's not that you feel badly around other people: but "they" actively make you feel that way. "They" actively abuse your time and energy.

And you're the passive recipient of this, right?
Yes, I often become a doormat or feel taken for granted by "friends"

waybread said:
Saturn square sun can confer real issues with self-esteem. The wounded lion retreats to his solitary den to lick his wounds.

Maybe it's time to take responsibility for your part of the equation. People can't just make you feel rotten without your permission.

But beyond that, maybe you're just cut out to be a loner. 8th house people tend to be very private.

The question is, what exactly do you want?
Click to expand...

Sun-Saturn suggests a negative and losing approach to life that stops one from trying.

The thing is, I want friends, but I wonder if the astrology says that I'm fated or doomed to loneliness. Since the people I come in contact with don't have my best interest.
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obsidianmineral

obsidianmineral

Well-known member
waybread said:
AppLeo, With Mars ruling your 11th house from the 7th house of open enemies, I think you expressed that when you wrote:



You do seem to see other people as the enemy. It's not that you feel badly around other people: but "they" actively make you feel that way. "They" actively abuse your time and energy.

And you're the passive recipient of this, right?

Saturn square sun can confer real issues with self-esteem. The wounded lion retreats to his solitary den to lick his wounds.

Maybe it's time to take responsibility for your part of the equation. People can't just make you feel rotten without your permission.

But beyond that, maybe you're just cut out to be a loner. 8th house people tend to be very private.

The question is, what exactly do you want?
Click to expand...

I agree with this, I think. There seems to be quite the spiritual ride promised in the natal chart. Sun in aspect with generationals, in the 8th with Moon in the 9th, also aspecting a generational planet.

Some people write the generationals off but I believe it's because they don't even understand them. They're the most complex. Either way, the main focus of the native seems to be to find transformation. There is light and good will in the Sun in Leo, and his mission in life is to dig deep within and find meaning in all of his trauma so he can be reborn. There is definitely capacity to make it happen (since Sun trines Pluto).

I think planets conjunct to the angles are usually the easiest to spot because they tend to show easily observable events. With Mars in Cancer conjunct the Descendant there, it seems to me like there's a desire to actually connect with others.

I see the 7th house as the way we psychologically view ourselves when we confront others. OP might be serious with other people, considering his ruler is trining Saturn and squaring Pluto. He may view creative outlets as something that shield him from having to deal with others in general. Saturn is in the Moon's exaltation, after all.

To be honest, I'd really like to read this chart more deeply but I think it is hard as hell to understand what the cosmic charts tell us. I'm not a beginner but I'm no expert either. If we're gonna go down the generalization path then it's easy.. but once you know just how much you would need to know about astrology to be able to stop generalizing you just feel baffled and overwhelmed.
 
IleneK

IleneK

Premium Member
AppLeo said:
Do I really come off as crude and inappropriate to you?
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Often you do. Not crude; more insolent or rude. But I don't think you are intentionally doing so.
There is a real inner unease with your identity/Sun that comes from Sun's very close applying square to Saturn along with inhospitable reception from Sun to Saturn.

Lots of hard life lessons to be learned with hard contacts between Saturn and the luminaries.
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
passiflora said:
Are you super attached to the whole signs chart?
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It's more accurate so..

IleneK said:
Often you do. Not crude; more insolent or rude. But I don't think you are intentionally doing so.
There is a real inner unease with your identity/Sun that comes from Sun's very close applying square to Saturn along with inhospitable reception from Sun to Saturn.

Lots of hard life lessons to be learned with hard contacts between Saturn and the luminaries.
Click to expand...

sad times
 
IleneK

IleneK

Premium Member
AppLeo said:
sad times
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I would add that I think you are being reshaped right now, by Saturn's passage over your natal Uranus. Times are sad; they will pass when Saturn's transiting cycle completes its work on Uranus at the end of the year. You may learn a lot about yourself during this time.

And you will have a Jupiter return in the spring of 2022. Although natal Jup is largely unaspected in your chart, I think if you follow the timing of it and open yourself to the energies of that conjunction, it can shift and lighten how you are feeling in conversational exchanges with others.
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
IleneK said:
I would add that I think you are being reshaped right now, by Saturn's passage over your natal Uranus. Times are sad; they will pass when Saturn's transiting cycle completes its work on Uranus at the end of the year. You may learn a lot about yourself during this time.

And you will have a Jupiter return in the spring of 2022. Although natal Jup is largely unaspected in your chart, I think if you follow the timing of it and open yourself to the energies of that conjunction, it can shift and lighten how you are feeling in conversational exchanges with others.
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Ugh that aspect was absolutely disgusting. At the beginning of the year when Saturn-Uranus was at 7 degrees. I was feeling so much anger because I couldn't pass my programming class, and I hated my professor, I just hated it. I did all this work for absolutely nothing. Failed once more. Always behind, never getting ahead. I hate university.

And it was mandatory to have partners for every single assignment and I hate working with people. You have to socialize and make conversation and act like you care. And then when you work on the assignment, they never show up on time, it takes longer to do the work because you have to ask them if that's the code they want to use. The assignments that are already long and tedious become nearly impossible with another person. 10 hours everyday of the week coding, only to barely finish before the due date.

When Jupiter transited by 3rd house, a new relative popped into the family. An overwhelmingly positive one. I think this new person will help me in life, especially when Jupiter fully transitions into Pisces.
 
IleneK

IleneK

Premium Member
AppLeo said:
Ugh that aspect was absolutely disgusting. At the beginning of the year when Saturn-Uranus was at 7 degrees. I was feeling so much anger because I couldn't pass my programming class, and I hated my professor, I just hated it. I did all this work for absolutely nothing. Failed once more. Always behind, never getting ahead. I hate university.

And it was mandatory to have partners for every single assignment and I hate working with people. You have to socialize and make conversation and act like you care. And then when you work on the assignment, they never show up on time, it takes longer to do the work because you have to ask them if that's the code they want to use. The assignments that are already long and tedious become nearly impossible with another person. 10 hours everyday of the week coding, only to barely finish before the due date.

When Jupiter transited by 3rd house, a new relative popped into the family. An overwhelmingly positive one. I think this new person will help me in life, especially when Jupiter fully transitions into Pisces.
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Follow the timing of the transits from Saturn to your natal Uranus and Jup to Jup. It will be helpful.
And remember to look at your role in all of these dynamics, past and future, so you can find out what it takes to have friends, if you want them.
Wishing you the best, AppLeo.
Ilene
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
passiflora said:
I thought the point of whole signs is that angles are congruent with the beginning of the sign on the angle cusp, and not with the degrees corresponding to actual angles?
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No. There's whole sign houses, and there's the angles. The house division is not determined by the angles, but you still take the angles into account, especially when conjunct a planet.
 
K

katydid

Well-known member
=

I don’t think I have ever looked at your chart, App. It is a fascinating one. It has a rough outline, or the vestiges of a 5 pointed Star. Those are formed by interconnecting Yods— and every planet in your chart, except the Sun, is making a quincunx.

Having so many quincunxes might be adding to your impatience with friendships.
Quincunxes force us to make adjustments, make emotional bargains, and accept things we don’t want to accept in others in order to try and relate to them. >>>Or worse, in order for them to relate to us.

When having a lot of natal quincunxes, one may feel awkward or uncomfortable, trying to fit in, and it can create anxiety and depression.

The good news is that quincunxes mature as we mature. And we learn to overcome the awkward feelings and to accept whatever it is we feel uncomfortable about.

The transiting Saturn/Uranus square is sitting on your wide Saturn/Uranus square, but in reverse. So I think you are doing a lot right now to clear out those kinds of issues. I am sure it has been brutal but it helps you to understand your psyche.

The ‘empty leg’ of that T-square to Saturn falls in your 11th, on your Chiron.

So friendships will come together when you work out your own internal fears/insecurities. Chiron in the 11th says friendships come with a cost but you can have them when you prepare yourself to ante up. You have to feel solid within yourself, and not allow others to make you feel bad. THEY are not making you feel that way. You are because you bought into what you learned as a child. REJECT that stuff and be confident in your true desires.

Do a breakdown and unpack your Sun/[Uranus/Neptune] T-square to Saturn in 5th. Something to do with your father and your artistic talents and your belief in yourself and your unique calling. Find that inner strength to stand up for your wild ambitions and out of the world type of beliefs and you might quell that inner anxiety and internal struggle. [do you even want to be a programmer? ]

Friendships will fall into place after all that comes together…
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
katydid said:
=

I don’t think I have ever looked at your chart, App. It is a fascinating one. It has a rough outline, or the vestiges of a 5 pointed Star. Those are formed by interconnecting Yods— and every planet in your chart, except the Sun, is making a quincunx.

Having so many quincunxes might be adding to your impatience with friendships.
Quincunxes force us to make adjustments, make emotional bargains, and accept things we don’t want to accept in others in order to try and relate to them. >>>Or worse, in order for them to relate to us.

When having a lot of natal quincunxes, one may feel awkward or uncomfortable, trying to fit in, and it can create anxiety and depression.

The good news is that quincunxes mature as we mature. And we learn to overcome the awkward feelings and to accept whatever it is we feel uncomfortable about.
Click to expand...

That's really interesting with the quincunxes. I've completely forgot about them because hardly anyone in the astrological community talks about them. I'll have to do more research on those in relation to my chart. The idea of feeling uncomfortable or awkward certainly makes sense. Really not forward to making adjustments though :annoyed:

katydid said:
The transiting Saturn/Uranus square is sitting on your wide Saturn/Uranus square, but in reverse. So I think you are doing a lot right now to clear out those kinds of issues. I am sure it has been brutal but it helps you to understand your psyche.

The ‘empty leg’ of that T-square to Saturn falls in your 11th, on your Chiron.

So friendships will come together when you work out your own internal fears/insecurities. Chiron in the 11th says friendships come with a cost but you can have them when you prepare yourself to ante up. You have to feel solid within yourself, and not allow others to make you feel bad. THEY are not making you feel that way. You are because you bought into what you learned as a child. REJECT that stuff and be confident in your true desires.

Do a breakdown and unpack your Sun/[Uranus/Neptune] T-square to Saturn in 5th. Something to do with your father and your artistic talents and your belief in yourself and your unique calling. Find that inner strength to stand up for your wild ambitions and out of the world type of beliefs and you might quell that inner anxiety and internal struggle. [do you even want to be a programmer? ]

Friendships will fall into place after all that comes together…
Click to expand...

Thank you very much for your analysis.

I totally forgot about Chiron. I didn't realize that the Uranus/Saturn square was exactly aspecting Chiron. For months Uranus and Saturn were at 11-12 degrees! The Chiron is right though, I just need to suffer the pain.

(No I don't want to program. I'm kind of being forced into it by my parents. It's hard to pursue other things when you're not supported in those other things. I want to do creative things with art and youtube videos, but I doubt that is career material)

There seems to be a theme that things will get better over time. I guess with a strong Saturnian influence that would especially make sense.
 
B

blackbery

Well-known member
Maybe you just haven't met the right people or your soul tribe members?

What is it that you want from a friendship? Someone to pour your heart out to? To get some TLC that we all need (tender, loving care)? Or do you want friends to discuss deep subjects with?

Or a travelling companion?

Maybe join groups or organizations which interest you & you will meet like-minded people. Like here, you enjoy studying astrology & you have forum friends that you interact with.

But regardless of what you think your chart portrays, there is NO reason at all for you not to have friends/acquaintances if that's what you TRULY WANT.

You are a hermit by nature so being alone suits you...but if you want to make friends, then BE a good friend as what you give out in life returns to you.

Try being more humble too. Arrogance is not really a trait people admire.

:):):)





AppLeo said:
When I look at my 11th house (house of friends) the ruler of that house is Mars. I have a day chart, so by sect, Mars becomes my worst planet. Mars's evil is exacerbated by its debilitation in Cancer. And to make things even WORSE, it's exactly conjunct my descendant, so it gains prominence being on an angle.

I've never really had friends or felt connected to people. I avoid large groups and communities. A solitary lifestyle seems to bring me the most peace because whenever I'm around people, it's like they make me feel bad about myself, abuse my time and energy, or I have this need to cut them out of my life.

chart.cgi
Click to expand...
 
AppLeo

AppLeo

Well-known member
blackbery said:
Maybe you just haven't met the right people or your soul tribe members?

What is it that you want from a friendship? Someone to pour your heart out to? To get some TLC that we all need (tender, loving care)? Or do you want friends to discuss deep subjects with?

Or a travelling companion?

Maybe join groups or organizations which interest you & you will meet like-minded people. Like here, you enjoy studying astrology & you have forum friends that you interact with.

But regardless of what you think your chart portrays, there is NO reason at all for you not to have friends/acquaintances if that's what you TRULY WANT.

You are a hermit by nature so being alone suits you...but if you want to make friends, then BE a good friend as what you give out in life returns to you.

Try being more humble too. Arrogance is not really a trait people admire.

:):):)
Click to expand...

With all the questions you pose, I certainly have a lot to think about. I'm not really sure. I guess that I've been so comfortable by myself that I forget to ask what I want from others. I need to be more conscious in my relationships.

But yeah arrogance isn't exactly a good thing, unless you're correct. Arrogance is fine if you know you're right.

Thanks you, blackbery.

david starling said:
Do internet friends count?
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Kind of hoping for friends in the flesh. Don't get me started on the internet.
 
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