Natal Planets conjunct house cusps

Hello,

If a planet nearing a given house cusp will influence the affairs of both houses, [more so the next house along going anti clockwise] are there other factors that might determine the nature of this influence? For example, based on my own chart, neptune influences the affairs of both the eighth and the ninth,[Not in Equal house system (mine) it's 5' and and 9th house cusp will be 19'] while saturn is more clearly active in the seventh alone.[that's due to be max 5' away from 8th] I wonder if this is connected to the fact that, in my experience (and there is material in the beginners section that mentions this, and plenty of material in other places, too), the angles "attract" an approaching planet at a wider orb than do the cusps of succedent or cadent houses; might a planet then "linger" in an angular house? Do aspects play a part? Or don't those considerations come into play? [YOUR saturn takes on more importance as it's MC ruler and very afflicted, so I'm not suprised you feel it more]

Another question I have is this: what house is a planet in when it is nearing the cusp, regardless of where it exerts its influence? To use my own chart again, is neptune located in the ninth or eighth?[8th] The question came to me when looking at planets ruling its house: the decision to place it in either saturn-ruled ninth or jupiter-ruled eighth (or both--I don't think "or neither" is a likely response(!)) has implications for further interpretations (aspects between house-rulers, etc), ditto for saturn.
[pisces/neptune rules 11th and is posited 8th. You should never agree to a joint bank account!]
I'm using the Placidus system and a predominantly "modern" approach, although of course I'm open to any and all insights. I'm interested in the general, but in case anyone wants to field the specific questions, here are the degrees in question on my own chart, which may be difficult to identify on the attached photo:
8th cusp: sag 15.17
saturn: sag 13.39
9th cusp: cap 7.00
neptune: cap 5.08

Ruler of the Eleventh House in the Eighth House
Your hopes and wishes can change completely at some point in your life. You may abandon your goals in the blink of an eye and decide to go after something totally different. Your involvement with a particular organization and your support of its aims could result in a total lifestyle change for you. Or, you could end up experiencing a complete change of attitude towards it.
http://www.skyviewzone.com/astrology/houserulerships.htm#hr11
You are really lucky that neptune was not retrograde as your hopes and wishes may never realise or be severly delayed.....

I use Equal House system (where each cusp is same as Ascendant) and am a modern astrologer. Lots of newcomers come into Astrology/forums and get a free chart from www.astro.com and the default ‘house system’ used is Placidus and think that’s just the norm and all there is……..BUT that is just the tip of the iceberg. You can change the default on astro.com in Extended Chart selection to Equal house and a few others if you wish to experiment…..

Within the mainstream here on AW of placidus/equal houses (the default on astro is placidus) only difference being some planets may move from one house to another thereby altering it's interpretation and it's 'only' with research will you find which /planets 'fit you' in which houses. So my advice, do two charts, research any planets that move houses and see which you identity with - simple


Youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAwGtMWl4z4

so your mars/jupiter conj would be 10th house conj 11th house cusp. In my view your Saggi sun conj uranus will serious alter saggi expressions to more like Aquarius/uranus. In later life this may well make you quite 'eccentric' or difficult to live with

Your moon is handle for bucket chart and you lack air element in your chart. This can tend towards sweeping statement will little thought of how it affects others. But you do have two planets in air house AND your mercury is conj saturn which shows you lack confidence in communications, espec in childhood, probably good at studying and readingt though...

Your also lack earth planets and neptune is a singleton. Lots energies in fire and water, so swinging from action and emotions :love:
 

Ben

Banned
If a planet nearing a given house cusp will influence the affairs of both houses, are there other factors that might determine the nature of this influence?
(Your post indicates you are an experienced astrologer, Noth - So, I shall attempt to focus on the principle you are raising rather than specfic details.)

My understanding is that planets nearing a house cusp indicate an urge to be involved in the activities of the higher-numbered house, yet still "anchored" by unfinished business/learning relating to the activities of the lower-numbered house - So, other factors WILL influence the strength of the "pull" from each of those houses, but (imo) what they are is likely to vary for each individual.

With that in mind, I agree that angular houses are likely to have a stronger attraction than succedant houses and the latter are likely to "pull" harder than cadent houses. But, I believe the nature of the planets will be another factor - with (say) conservative Saturn being less inclined to "move-on" than imaginative Neptune, and aspects to friendly/unfriendly planets encouraging/discouraging their moving-on accordingly.

What house is a planet in when it is nearing the cusp, regardless of where it exerts its influence?
I regard it as being in the lower-numbered house, but modified quickly as/when it progresses into the higher-numbered house - which might never happen with your Neptune or Saturn, but will with Venus.
 
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Planets conjunct a house cusp
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=202304&postcount=7
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=205033#post205033
Planets conj House cusp
“Ascendant at 15’ Libra and Jupiter 13’ Libra. That would place Jupiter in the 12th house, right? But many thoughtful astrologers would read this as Jupiter being conjunction with Ascendant, and end up reading it as bringing its action to bear in the first house, rather than in the 12th.
This same idea would apply for each and every house cusp. If the planet is IN THE SAME SIGN as the sign on the next house cusp, and close enough to be CONJUNCT WITH that next house cusp, the action of the planet will be directed into oncoming house”
http://www.astrology-numerology.com/inhouses.html
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14887
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=125412&postcount=4
Ptolemy says the influence of the house begins to be felt 5° before the actual cusp.
http://www.astrologycom.com/houses.html

“Astrologers have seen a body influencing the house it is about to enter, time and time again. All theorizing aside, the planet casting its shadow ahead works. I can speak from personal experience, as well as reading ancient texts. If you discover this as true, then the next question may be, "Just how close must a body be to a cusp before it begins to be felt in the neighboring house?"
I've seen some authors say 3 degrees. I've seen some that give 5 degrees. I have seen some that even give 8 degrees. And there may be other variations.”
http://astronuts.tribe.net/thread/90c9f417-5086-4ff0-b31f-c904fe99baca
 

Noth

Member
Thanks for the replies. Ast50, I hope you didn't mind posting that material on house cusps a second time! I read the earlier posts you made and they moved me along quite a bit. I see what you mean when I try the equal house, although it places neptune far from ninth; I'll have to look over long-term transits again to get the whole picture and see where I stand. . .

By the way, your quick interpretations that conclude the post are apt, nicely done, elaborating on them would fill many posts, especially with regard to all those saturn afflictions and the nature of the "handles" (I like the image, suitable for this chart, a solid cancer moon in 2nd handle that affords a strong grip, while dangling below a nasty bucket that barely contains all those seething squares and conjunctions) of bucket charts. I'll just add that I think you can expect almost anyone with sun-uranus in say, square or conjunction, to be eccentric and willful from the get-go, not just later in life, and that, in this case, given the location in eighth house and the sun .30 semisquare pluto, you've got to take into account the scorpio modifications, too, although I strongly suspect you're aware of this already. . .

Ben, thanks for the response. I'm not really an experienced astrologer, just a dedicated autodidact. You happen to bring up an idea that occurred to me and that I almost mentioned, but didn't, because I can't recall reading about it or thinking about it except in relation to my own chart: the very nature of the planets involved near house cusps when determining the area of their influence. I wonder if you have seen this effect most clearly in certain cases. . . looking forward to your next comment. . .
 

byjove

Account Closed
Hello, does anyone else know much about planets conjunct a NON-ANGLE cusp? Say the 2nd or 8th cusps etc.? I read about this a few years ago but not enough and I seem to have forgotten it.

Regarding the angles, yep, I'm testing a chart with Pluto on the 3rd cusp but retrograde, my logic would be retro - so going back into the 2nd, not the 3rd. Also, Venus within 2 degrees of the 7th from the 6th side, it's moving forward and touching one of the four critical angles, so in the 7th? Finally, Jupiter at the end of house 7, in the 7th/8th or both? I've a few ideas of my own but I'm curious about best practice and others' experience. :happy:
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Hello, does anyone else know much about planets conjunct a NON-ANGLE cusp? Say the 2nd or 8th cusps etc.? I read about this a few years ago but not enough and I seem to have forgotten it.

Regarding the angles, yep, I'm testing a chart with Pluto on the 3rd cusp but retrograde, my logic would be retro - so going back into the 2nd, not the 3rd. Also, Venus within 2 degrees of the 7th from the 6th side, it's moving forward and touching one of the four critical angles, so in the 7th? Finally, Jupiter at the end of house 7, in the 7th/8th or both? I've a few ideas of my own but I'm curious about best practice and others' experience. :happy:
Fwiw JMO byjove an interesting experiment is to create a whole sign house natal chart and (1) observe the 'cusps' aka 'sensitive points' in each house at all times and keep notes

i.e. the 'cusps' aka 'sensitive points' of each house are (a) the ASC/DESC degree AND (b) the MC/IC degree


ALSO note any events/influences when (2) a planet changes sign

just my two cents worth :smile:
 

theV

Well-known member
I don't understand I have pluto in the 4th H but it conjunct my 5th and Saturn in the 8th but conjunct the 9th does that mean it influence both houses?
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Fwiw JMO byjove an interesting experiment is to create a whole sign house natal chart and (1) observe the 'cusps' aka 'sensitive points' in each house at all times and keep notes

i.e. the 'cusps' aka 'sensitive points' of each house are (a) the ASC/DESC degree AND (b) the MC/IC degree

ALSO note any events/influences when (2) a planet changes sign

just my two cents worth :smile:
I don't understand I have pluto in the 4th H but it conjunct my 5th and Saturn in the 8th but conjunct the 9th does that mean it influence both houses?
theV there's a comprehensive explanation at http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53276:smile:
 

theV

Well-known member
I use Placidus type of chart I have pluto 3 degree away from the 5th H and saturn 2 degree away from the 9th house I have always felt myself relate to the 5th house pluto
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Can you load your natal chart? I find that the planets have to be very close to the cusps, within 1 degree for an effect and if they are connected to planets in the next house they are stronger.
I have Saturn right on 5th/6th cusp and in other house methods it is in the 6th however it works in both houses. The aspects to that cusp planet from elsewhere have to be considered. Transits will tell you if it is valid for whatever house.
 
Natally I have Jupiter 13 aries conj MC 9 aries.

Sun 28 cancer conj ASC 25 cancer

Neppy at 16 libra H4 is too far from IC 8 lira to be considered conjunct..

Interesting thread..

Looking around Forum to aquaint myself with the ...style

GG
 

theV

Well-known member
Can you load your natal chart? I find that the planets have to be very close to the cusps, within 1 degree for an effect and if they are connected to planets in the next house they are stronger.
I have Saturn right on 5th/6th cusp and in other house methods it is in the 6th however it works in both houses. The aspects to that cusp planet from elsewhere have to be considered. Transits will tell you if it is valid for whatever house.

 

byjove

Account Closed
Fwiw JMO byjove an interesting experiment is to create a whole sign house natal chart and (1) observe the 'cusps' aka 'sensitive points' in each house at all times and keep notes

i.e. the 'cusps' aka 'sensitive points' of each house are (a) the ASC/DESC degree AND (b) the MC/IC degree


ALSO note any events/influences when (2) a planet changes sign

just my two cents worth :smile:

I know this but *never* seem to remember this when actually monitoring transits! Grr! :whistling: I must remember this...
 

byjove

Account Closed
Can you load your natal chart? I find that the planets have to be very close to the cusps, within 1 degree for an effect and if they are connected to planets in the next house they are stronger.
I have Saturn right on 5th/6th cusp and in other house methods it is in the 6th however it works in both houses. The aspects to that cusp planet from elsewhere have to be considered. Transits will tell you if it is valid for whatever house.

I think I've come to agreement with those that say, if the planet is retrograde, consider it only in the house it's in - not the next one. I wonder about the others though. Saturn is very close to my 6th cusp but since it's retrograde, I think I'll stick with it in the 5th. I've Mercury about a degree previous of the MC and about 3 degrees previous of the next sign, but I swear it has 9th house effects. Perhaps it does touch both the current and succeeding houses. Hmm.
 

byjove

Account Closed
Natally I have Jupiter 13 aries conj MC 9 aries.

Sun 28 cancer conj ASC 25 cancer

Neppy at 16 libra H4 is too far from IC 8 lira to be considered conjunct..

Interesting thread..

Looking around Forum to aquaint myself with the ...style

GG

My Jupiter is 9 degrees Aries, watch out for the Uranus conjunction! It should be fun times! Plus I've read many astrologers say TR Uranus conjuncting the MC often results in foreign travel or moving abroad; I can totally support this. Good luck, have fun! :joyful:
 

astro11

Well-known member
I have Pluto just 2 minutes past my 4th house cusp. I have found that Pluto's characteristics strongly affect both my home life and my career. I've also noted in my family, friends and client's charts that when someone has a planet conjunct a cusp, it has a much stronger influence on the affairs of that house and the house opposite it than if the planet were just in the house. Also when planets are conjunct the midpoint of a house, the effects tend to be stronger than if the planet is just in the house.

When thinking about transits, the outer planets have a wider orb of influence than the inner planets and it becomes more intense as it becomes exact. For example, Saturn is about to make a conjunction with my Pluto and 4th house cusp at 7 degrees Scorpio very soon. However, ever since Saturn came into Scorpio in early October I've been feeling the effects of this transit and it is definitely intense and challenging!
 

Caro

Well-known member
how is it affecting the chart - are you prepared to describe? the move of saturn into scorpio for me too has brought an intensity to outside events/work etc. its near my natal ascendant at 8 degrees which is just a point right?

I was going to start another thread on the positive effects or how to work with saturn in scorpio in a positive way.

Im surrounded by deadpan people who are unbelievably secretive in my work place. its unreal!!! :smile:

however I have heard that recieving therapeutic body work is good for scorpio transits.
 

astro11

Well-known member
I'm working on my Masters degree in the sciences right now and I've never worked harder at school in my life. My bachelors was a B.A and a lot of my classmates did a B.Sc so I'm constantly having to catch up and I spend an inordinate amount of time studying. Most of my classmates are simply repeating courses they had in undergraduate so they don't understand my stress and workload. The courses are very intense and I have 6 of them at the same time. I feel guilty whenever I want to have a night out or just relax. I haven't spent much time with family/ friends since early October when Saturn moved to Scorpio. At the moment it seems all I do are Astronumerology consultations or school work, no time for leisure. I even had to take a break from teaching piano because there was no time for all three things, its too bad because I really enjoyed teaching.
 
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Claire19

Well-known member
Thanks for that info, waybread.

My natal Uranus is one which is so close to the 6th house cusp, that it jumps into the 6th with Placidus, but is just in 5th with Koch. I also count it as influencing both houses, although am aware of Uranus' strong influence with my children, both very `unusual' and unique and quite rebellious in relation to The System, so I feel it stronger in the 5th. Uranus is closely conj natal Venus, but Venus stays in the 6th with both house systems, still conj 6th house cusp.

However from what I read retrogrades are just slower in expressing their energies and are karmic matters to be dealt with. Transits will tell you what is valid.
 
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Claire19

Well-known member
how is it affecting the chart - are you prepared to describe? the move of saturn into scorpio for me too has brought an intensity to outside events/work etc. its near my natal ascendant at 8 degrees which is just a point right?

I was going to start another thread on the positive effects or how to work with saturn in scorpio in a positive way.

Im surrounded by deadpan people who are unbelievably secretive in my work place. its unreal!!! :smile:

however I have heard that recieving therapeutic body work is good for scorpio transits.
Wait until it hits your ascendant within a degree or so and then watch the effects. If there is a connection natally with Saturn to the ascendant then it will be felt for sure. It depends on what else it is going on in your chart but sometimes your plumbing works and reproductive area may have to be checked.
 
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