To be a feminist is to be evolved and enlightened

D

demetraceres

Well-known member
blackbery said:
I'm not sure. Self hatred perhaps? Ignorance perhaps of how oppressive society is to women?
Most of the religious ones who vote against abortion rights, defunding of planned parenthood in the USA justify their restriction of women's rights by saying they must follow their religious beliefs.:crying::crying::crying:
Click to expand...

Why do women support social norms, behaviour and ideas that restrict their rights? Not because of the self hatred, but because they are accepted and awarded by the society or their own group if they do so. Or - more correctly, they are punished or isolated if they don't. They put their own personal benefits before right, just or consiouss behaviour and beliefs.

In more patriarchal society they risk their life or excommunication if they go against the imposed social norms, in little more tolerant society they may not get an approval of the group they are part of.
 
B

blackbery

Well-known member
I agree that in strong patriarchal societies where a woman must rely on men (or women in their group) for their own survival, then they must adhere to those patriarchal rules.

But in the West, there are no punishments for supporting women's rights.
I've been a feminist for over two decades and never been punished for it.
I don't go around trying to convert people to my cause but I will speak up when necessary, even against the majority. Rarely do I get into women's rights issues with men because they can never fully understand anyways.
With religious women, it's like talking to a robot. All they do is spout their dogma even when it is in the detriment of women's rights and they never have an answer to that. :whistling::whistling::whistling:



demetraceres said:
Why do women support social norms, behaviour and ideas that restrict their rights? Not because of the self hatred, but because they are accepted and awarded by the society or their own group if they do so. Or - more correctly, they are punished or isolated if they don't. They put their own personal benefits before right, just or consiouss behaviour and beliefs.

In more patriarchal society they risk their life or excommunication if they go against the imposed social norms, in little more tolerant society they may not get an approval of the group they are part of.
Click to expand...
 
D

david starling

Well-known member
It's about the 3 types of world-view: Individual, Social, and Traditional. Only approximately 1/3 of a given population is "Inner-directed", and will place individual self-interest first, over the rules and regulations of Society and/or Tradition. In cultures where the social order is subservient to an entrenched, patriarchal Tradition, it's dangerous to demand women's rights.
 
CapAquaPis

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
It's good that many men now stand up for women's rights as they all have mothers, sisters, daughters, aunts, best friends. and wives, girlfriends and lovers. I never want any woman I know in my life be discriminated, restricted or harmed (i.e. sexual abuse or domestic violence). I'm a sun/moon Aquarius male who is a believer in equal rights in gender/sex, race/ethnicity, income class (the USA is sorta lacking in this field), disability and sexual orientation.

The Age of Aquarius has begun, so the process of social liberalism to change our country completely will take time. The current federal government moved to the right under a Republican majority plus president. The Democratic party is a champion of civil rights and social justice, but in the USA, like I mentioned, the middle class is in decline and low-income Americans are having it harder. Conservatives hadn't caught up in this new age's concern of income equality.
 
Y

ynnest

Well-known member
CapAquaPis said:
It's good that many men now stand up for women's rights as they all have mothers, sisters, daughters, aunts, best friends. and wives, girlfriends and lovers. I never want any woman I know in my life be discriminated, restricted or harmed (i.e. sexual abuse or domestic violence). I'm a sun/moon Aquarius male who is a believer in equal rights in gender/sex, race/ethnicity, income class (the USA is sorta lacking in this field), disability and sexual orientation.

The Age of Aquarius has begun, so the process of social liberalism to change our country completely will take time. The current federal government moved to the right under a Republican majority plus president. The Democratic party is a champion of civil rights and social justice, but in the USA, like I mentioned, the middle class is in decline and low-income Americans are having it harder. Conservatives hadn't caught up in this new age's concern of income equality.
Click to expand...


Thats why the republican party will be stripped of their power as the core of their ideology cant hold the incoming light frequencies.



Y
 
D

demetraceres

Well-known member
Feminism itself is often connected with other liberation movements. Recently deceased feminist Simone Veil has dedicated her life to struggle against antisemitism and racism. This is not surprising as we are often subjected to many types of oppression, not just one of them.

When it comes to racism, we can find similar patterns, but in the opposite way, defending oppression - racism is often intertwined with sexism, homofobia or some other forms of hatred.

I'v been thinking how the recent tragedy in Charlottesville have discloused this very pattern. The victim of the murder has been stigmatised in a very ugly manner that implies her private life, sexual life and physical appearance. Rebellious men are never stigmatised this way. In the similar way are stigmatised women (not men), who are helping refugees or defending their rights.So women who decide to fight racism or some other manifestations of hatred and injustice, will be very likely exposed to sexist attacks.

I think today's feminism has a lot of work to do with this special kind of degradation of women.
 
Last edited:
Y

ynnest

Well-known member
demetraceres said:
Feminism itself is often connected with other liberation movements. Recently deceased feminist Simone Veil has dedicated her life to struggle against antisemitism and racism. This is not surprising as we are often subjected to many types of oppression, not just one of them.

When it comes to racism, we can find similar patterns, but in the opposite way, defending oppression - racism is often intertwined with sexism, homofobia or some other forms of hatred.

I'v been thinking how the recent tragedy in Charlottesville have discloused this very pattern. The victim of the murder has been stigmatised in a very ugly manner that implies her private life, sexual life and physical appearance. Rebellious men are never stigmatised this way. In the similar way are stigmatised women (not men), who are helping refugees or defending their rights.So women who decide to fight racism or some other manifestations of hatred and injustice, will be very likely exposed to sexist attacks.

I think today's feminism has a lot of work to do with this special kind of degradation of women.
Click to expand...


I think your thoughts are interesting in the sense that all of these hateful paradigms and those who represents them consciously or unconsciously have from what I have seen always this sexist and women degrading component within them. It runs through them like a virus and it is often these unconscious ones who are claiming that unequality and oppression against women do not exist which of course is a ridiculous false belief.

Y
 
Dirius

Dirius

Well-known member
ynnest said:
I think your thoughts are interesting in the sense that all of these hateful paradigms and those who represents them consciously or unconsciously have from what I have seen always this sexist and women degrading component within them. It runs through them like a virus and it is often these unconscious ones who are claiming that unequality and oppression against women do not exist which of course is a ridiculous false belief.

Y
Click to expand...

Where in the western world does inequlity for women exist? :pouty:

Sure if you go to undevelop countries with religious influence such as the middle east. But by far equality exists for both sexes.

The U.S./European feminist movement is certainly miss-directed now days.
 
Y

ynnest

Well-known member
Dirius said:
Where in the western world does inequlity for women exist? :pouty:

Sure if you go to undevelop countries with religious influence such as the middle east. But by far equality exists for both sexes.

The U.S./European feminist movement is certainly miss-directed now days.
Click to expand...


Are you serious, Dirius?

Y
 
Dirius

Dirius

Well-known member
ynnest said:
Are you serious, Dirius?

Y
Click to expand...

I am.

I get that inequality for women exists in many parts of the world, specially in the 3rd world, particularly in deep`religious countries.

But where in the western world does inequality (both genders not having equal rights)exist?
 
D

david starling

Well-known member
Dirius said:
I am.

I get that inequality for women exists in many parts of the world, specially in the 3rd world, particularly in deep`religious countries.

But where in the western world does inequality (both genders not having equal rights)exist?
Click to expand...

Would you consider that the vast majority of victims of rape, domestic violence, and human trafficking are women (and yes, human trafficking is going on in the western world) to be a form of inequality?
 
Oddity

Oddity

Well-known member
david starling said:
No question that women are being victimized. Feminism is against that, first and foremost.
Click to expand...

Feminism used to be against that. These days they're playing the oppressed, offended, and utterly traumatised card. Are they trying to make us believe that women are that hysterical and feeble?

They also seem to think that the serious abuses against women in places like Saudi, where there is real oppression, are ok because it's part of their culture.

Ugh.
 
Y

ynnest

Well-known member
Dirius said:
I am.

I get that inequality for women exists in many parts of the world, specially in the 3rd world, particularly in deep`religious countries.

But where in the western world does inequality (both genders not having equal rights)exist?
Click to expand...


In terms of laws and "official standards" outwardly portrayed the western society is better yes but in reality it is not as progressive as it claims to be which creates this false perception in peoples mind of an equal society which blocks them and our society as a whole from understanding/accessing the truth as it is so that it can be transformed. Without grounding ourselves in the truth as it is without false labels/identities we cant transcend these negative patterns.

Y
 
D

david starling

Well-known member
Oddity said:
Feminism used to be against that. These days they're playing the oppressed, offended, and utterly traumatised card. Are they trying to make us believe that women are that hysterical and feeble?

They also seem to think that the serious abuses against women in places like Saudi, where there is real oppression, are ok because it's part of their culture.

Ugh.
Click to expand...

Are you feeling victimized by feminists?
 
Dirius

Dirius

Well-known member
david starling said:
Would you consider that the vast majority of victims of rape, domestic violence, and human trafficking are women (and yes, human trafficking is going on in the western world) to be a form of inequality?
Click to expand...

Neither of those are subjects of inequality among genders, they are related to criminal violence (which specifically targets women). Society does not condone any of the 3 examples you presented, neither does the law.

(again we are talking about the western world).

ynnest said:
In terms of laws and "official standards" outwardly portrayed the western society is better yes but in reality it is not as progressive as it claims to be which creates this false perception in peoples mind of an equal society which blocks them and our society as a whole from understanding/accessing the truth as it is so that it can be transformed. Without grounding ourselves in the truth as it is without false labels/identities we cant transcend these negative patterns.

Y
Click to expand...

I'm gonna have to ask for a bit more consistent argument with examples, because you didn't really answer my question, you just stated that what I said is a "false perception of reality". :pouty:
 
Last edited:
Top