AppLeo
Well-known member
You can always chat with me about the gospel.
what does it say about gay people
idolatry?
Random Thoughts, strictly Text
- Thread starter david starling
- Start date
what does it say about gay people
idolatry?
Do you mean gay people and idolaters, or the relationship between the two (Romans 1:18-32)? There wouldn't be good news for everyone if there weren't bad news, which is death for all people who have ever lived (Romans 3:9-20).
The good news (the gospel) is that Jesus of Nazareth preached repentance and becoming born again in preparation for immortality in his coming kingdom, and we are convinced of this by the fact that he was raised from death and appeared to over five hundred witnesses, many of who were persecuted or martyred for this gospel, and also by the supernatural gift of the holy spirit received on baptism that helps us to grow in this faith and to resist the adversary in times of temptation.
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AppLeo
Well-known member
I just don't see how being gay is immoral according to god
there are churches who approve of gays
There are many so-called churches who don't believe in the divine inspiration of the scriptures or are filled with idolatry itself.
God decides morals, not men (men don't agree), and there are certainly many practical, but also mystical reasons behind all his commandments.
AppLeo
Well-known member
you know many of "gods" morals are contradicting and illogical
Contradicting and illogical? Of the God of the Bible? I would like to hear which ones as I delight in reasoning and pondering over scripture.
david starling
Well-known member
Explain the Commandment, "Thou shalt not kill".
AppLeo
Well-known member
its immoral to be gay for one
The commandment actually means ''Thou shall not murder''. Hebrew, like most languages distinguishes between killing and murder <of a human being>.
The Torah prohibits unjustified willful murder, such as the murder of Abel by Cain or judicial murder (murder of an innocent). It permits killing in self-defence, killing a burglar by night (but not by day) and it commands the Israelites to exact death penalty for certain transgressions. It also has commandments regarding accidental killing to protect these people from being exacted revenge by the family members. Willful murder is established by showing the instrument that caused death (Num. 35:16-18) or by proving the enmity or hate toward the victim (Num. 35:20-21, Deut. 19:11-13).
''Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all. If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord.” To the contrary, “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals on his head.” Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.'' - Romans 12
Now Paul quoting Proverbs 25 seems to contradict the principle of an eye for an eye. But there is no contradiction between these two statements.
One is either going to be punished in this life, or he is going to be punished at the day of judgement (these are the burning coals). Of course these statements (with Matthew 5:38-44) are contradictory if you are an atheist. But God is coming to exact vengeance upon the nations.
Jesus and Paul, being righteous Jews knew that God is either going to punish the wrongdoers, or the wrongdoers will repent of their sins and start keeping the commandments of God. Indeed, it is through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ, that people from every tribe and every nation are repenting of their sins and turning towards the God of Israel, and the martyrs followed his example ''for even if you should suffer for righteousness' sake, you will be blessed''.
Thus Jesus Christ and his brother James, whose death at the hands of the Jews is recorded by the historian Josephus and by the church fathers, while they were being unjustly murdered, they were praying for their murderers, for by doing so, they were giving them a second chance while they themselves were getting a crowning reward from God.
david starling
Well-known member
Did the Judeans nail Jesus to the cross with their own hands, and pierce him with a spear? Thought it was the Romans.
The Sanhedrin couldn't execute anyone during the Roman occupation in a biblical trial. This is a well established historical fact and is also recorded in the Gospels - John 18:31. The Pharisees made it impossible to convict a murderer or an adulterer* by insisting on near impossible amount of evidence, only in order to be able to turn the criminal to the Romans, because the latter forbade it. It was the Jews who turned Jesus to the Romans though, which is why Peter in Acts 2 preached ''Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs that God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know — this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men. God raised him up, loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to be held by it.''
(*John 7:53-8:11, one of the most cherished episodes is omitted in recent translations, because it is a forgery along with Mark 16:8-20. These two passages don't appear in the earliest manuscripts we have along with a dozen other disputed verses - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...s_not_included_in_modern_English_translations.)
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david starling
Well-known member
So, not at the "hands" of the Judeans (as they were called in Latin) but those of the Romans. Btw, there were no "Jews" at the time--that's from the pejorative French word, "Giu", late 12th century.