Who's Who? An Astrological Exploration.

Before attempting to judge the charts, I am going to brainstorm some characteristics I believe each type of person would possess:

Serial killer:

Key Words and Ideas: aggressiveness, brutality, need to feel power over others, predator vs. prey mentality, cunning, possible issues with authority (may enjoy "leaving clues" to taunt investigators), enacting revenge, addicted to adrenaline rush, may enjoy planning murders and escape routes

Astrological influences that immediately come to mind: Afflicted Mars/Pluto

An adult movie star:

Key Words and Ideas: enjoys the spotlight, expressive, possibly craves attention and fame

Astrological influences that immediately come to mind: Leo, planets in the tenth house

A spiritualist medium:

Key Words and Ideas: attuned to higher energies, not completely grounded/focussed in the physical world

Astrological influences that immediately come to mind: Strong Pisces/Neptune emphasis, planets in the water elements, planets in the eighth house

Outstanding athlete

Key Words and Ideas: extremely disciplined, physically active and strong

Astrological influences that immediately come to mind: Aries/Mars

Mystery Person #1:

Mars tightly conjunct Virgo Ascendant

Tight Sun/Venus conjunction in Cancer in the ninth house (trines Mars and squares Saturn)

Moon conjunct Leo Midheaven (Moon square Jupiter; Saturn sextile Midheaven, Part of Fortune trine Midheaven)

South Node conjunct Pluto

All of these charts supposedly belong to a famous person, yet this one particularly indicate themes of fame and power to me, and the possible abuse of it. The North Node is located in Aquarius in the fourth house; clearly, this person has a spiritual goal to focus less upon the limelight and the outside world of fame and prestige in order to retreat into an inner world focussed more upon community than self. However, his Leo Moon conjunct the Midheaven seems to indicate an emotional need to be held in high regard and prestige and approaching a conjunction with Pluto, he may very well feel emotional security through the power of fame. The Sun and the Moon are in mutual reception, Pluto is exalted in Leo, Saturn is exalted in Libra, Mars is in the sign of its rulership in Scorpio, and although Jupiter rules Pisces and Sagittarius and is exalted in Cancer, I have often mused that the greater benefic seems pretty comfortable in Taurus. This is quite a lot of power to reckon with.

I initially guessed this chart to belong to the adult movie star, but the first house Mars in Scorpio conjunct the Ascendant is such a stereotypical serial killer aspect that I am now doubting my intuition and reasoning. Yet it does not appear to be badly aspected; indeed, Mars receives a beautiful trine from a tight Sun/Venus conjunction. As Tim would undoubtedly note, the majority of the planets are in the upper hemisphere, and I just do not see the brutality of a killer--there appears to be too much creativity. Although I suppose as one of the old astrology joke threads indicated, this person could make beautiful art out of the remains of his victims!

Seriously, I immediately thought of foreign travel with a ninth house stellium, and I think that a famous actor would have many opportunities to visit strange lands while filming on the various sets of his movies.

Mystery Person #2:

As soon as I saw the eighth house stellium of Mystery Person 2's chart, I immediately thought it belonged to the psychic. I will undoubtedly feel foolish when Draco reveals the chart belongs to the serial killer instead, yet Pluto is conjunct the Sun and Mercury to boot, and the Sun-Mercury conjunction appears to be at a critical degree! Actually, this may very well be the serial killer because the Venus/Uranus conjunction makes me think of strange sexual fetishes of a darker nature--perhaps this person, if he is not the spiritual medium, raped his victims before killing them? Mars may be in its detriment in Taurus, but I think it's a bit ominous that the planet is tightly conjunct the fifth house cusp and appears to form a loose square aspect with Uranus and an even looser square aspect with Venus. I might be thinking too much in terms of horary, but I also don't like that the Part of Fortune is conjunct the Nadir in Aries--it makes me think that he has the ability to conceal the evidence of murder. Its opposition to tenth house Jupiter makes me think that he presents himself in a jovial manner that is much different from his true inner nature. The Moon is conjunct the Ascendant from its dark side, so I question his ability to keep his emotions in check. It is located in the sign of Sagittarius, true, but I don't like Saturn in the house of its joy exerting its influence upon the Moon. If I am wrong, it will be interesting to see exactly how vivid my imagination is!

As I was studying this chart some more, I regret to say that I am yet again waffling back and forth between the psychic and the serial killer! Jupiter is loosely conjunct Neptune, two planets that tie into Pisces through traditional or modern rulership. Also, Jupiter's conjunction with the North Node looks familiar in the a chart I was studying the other day of a psychic/spiritual medium--I won't mention a name although I do not think it is the same chart, in respect for Draco's rules. I will note that out of the four charts in this thread, this one definitely looks the most psychic, but then which chart belongs to the serial killer? I suppose it is back to the drawing board...

Arian Maverick

Some very interesting comments there Mav to get the thread rolling.

You have mentioned two things that really are quite significant, but I won't yet tell you what, as it might make it too easy, but some good observations!

It will be interesting to see how this develops.

EDIT:

You've added in some even more interesting comments now Mav. I'm dying to let you know where you are right on and where you are going off track, but I don't want to prejudice the input that others may deliver, or make it too obvious who is who, and there's probably many other's that would like a go at this, so my lips are firmly sealed for now. Some nice observations though.

Mystery person 1, or 4 may be the serial killer. I'd veer more towards person 1. The Mars in Scorpio conjunct Ascendant makes me think that. And Pluto near the top in the 10th house. So maybe they would square each other? Creating conflict??

Hahaha, I have Mars/Sag in the 1st house, Pluto/Libra conjunct the MC! I can be quite forceful at times, have never harmed anyone physically though!

Neptune

Does anyone have any insight about chart #3 and #4? The twelfth house Pluto conjunct Part of Fortune grabs my attention, as does the sixth house Moon-Mercury conjunction in Aquarius and Venus' conjunction with the Descendant, but no specific picture has been painted in my mind. The most significant observation I have made about chart #4 is the mutual reception between Mars in Pisces and Jupiter in Aries, both of which are conjunct in the seventh house. I've read that Mars and Jupiter can be a dangerous combination, but I would think that a mutual reception would be beneficial. I am also baffled by the astrological paradox that of Saturn in Aries opposite Libra North Node; my father has a similar one in his chart of Capricorn North Node conjunct Capricorn Moon, and I cannot get my mind around it! Speaking of paradoxes, Neptune is also in the first house in Virgo and squares fourth house Mercury in Sagittarius, the sign of its detriment. It also just recently occurred to me that Venus and Uranus are in mutual reception using modern rulership, although I am a bit uncertain as to what this means...

Arian Maverick

Again, my lips are firmly sealed for the time being.

Hehe, this is fun.

Im a very new beginer but Id be willing to throw out a guess at number 2 as the spiritualistic medium with the nicely aspected planets in the 8H the sun there as well, part of fortune on the IC in 4h trines sun, moon, mercury.
I like how the sun moon and mercury aspects the assendent as well.
jupiter in the 10H is a good place as well in libra for a guru the oposition to the IC and part of fortune tells me he may have had some conflicting energies will his inner and outer worlds like identifying with his fame or something mabie a pride issue as far as "Im the greatest since everybody seems to agree with me" and may have taken advantage of it early on, but the sextiles to the sun, moon, and mercury may have helped cool that off easy, as well as the sextile to pluto in the 8H.
Pluto in scorpio indicates this too me as well being in the 8H. ocult sciences regeneration and such.

Then again.......with the sun siting right on top of mercury in retrograde like that I dont know..... cmbust?

I heard somewhere that retrogrades may compell the individual to further express that planet in some way though as well and being in the 8H with that uranus opposed mars I bet he felt obliged to get his message across somehow yet the restricion of being forced into this role somehow....
mabie being born into it or something like he wants to be free of it yet he doesnt. family strugles or something.....mabie a loss of Homeland?.

Saturn in the 12th may indicate a metaphsical teacher of sorts someone who can easily adapt to inner solitude, and move toward karmic completions and liberation. Probably has a good family lineage.

Moon in the 12th another indication of liking or being liked by solitude and with Saturn in the house to help that house out and all of the moons pleasent aspects as well I would say he has alot of suport in viewing the world from a detatched sort of "dream" view. he's probably idealistic of metaphisical studies and its place in the world and has gathered alot of "stuff" ideas and such from former teachers as well. and he doesnt interact with the public that much yet likes it every once in a while.

there's other stuff as well....but overall I'd say he's the spiritual dude.
probably gets along with the ladies alright too.
then again this may be the guy that knocks on your door with an axe so I dont know.....
Im waiting to be the prime example of the guy who thinks all these trines and sextiles are just so "positive".
Im extremely interested being a beginer of sorts to see the results.
The more I look the more I cant tell one way or the other far any of them.
Great idea for a post!
----------------------------
Tsquare
I thought I was the first poster. Im slow

Arian Maverick said:

The most significant observation I have made about chart #4 is the mutual reception between Mars in Pisces and Jupiter in Aries, both of which are conjunct in the seventh house. I've read that Mars and Jupiter can be a dangerous combination, but I would think that a mutual reception would be beneficial.

Click to expand...

I too thought this would lead to some sort of expansive expression of agression, but then since Mars was in Pisces, would that expansive energy be more loving? In the 7th house of relationships/open enemies?! Are they one and the same??!

Neptune

Arian Maverick

Does anyone have any insight about chart #3 and #4?

Click to expand...

chart 4
I dont like that sun moon jupiter tsquare....although the orbs are wide.
and with mars and jupiter as close as they are conj I also dont like that
neptune mercury jupiter tsquare.
I usually dont mind neptune in the firstH but in virgo I dont like.
that grand trine between Venus, moon, and Midheaven looks odd and so does
the assendent uranus and sun grand trine.

The main thing that bothers me about chart 4 is the moon in libra in house2
square sun in in the fourth house whic is home life type stuff, and its opposition to jupiter in the seventhH.

Im sniffing out a bad childhood here I think mabie trouble with relationships later on in life also.
with that trine between venus and moon and midheaven in there houses.........
at first I m thinking actor or artist with that venus im thinkin suduction and ability to be creative since in aquarius and then trine moon and midheaven.
but Im not sure how to figure in that moon trine with venus.
then im thinking murder dude.
I dont know how to figure the retrogrades like
neptune, pluto, and uranus
I also dont know what that lilltle -d- behind the true nod means is that dignity or detriment or neither?

I think those retrogrades play a big part in this chart somehow but dont know how. something makes me cringe about this chart yet dont know what.
Mabie its just me not knowing yet.

I too thought this would lead to some sort of expansive expression of agression, but then since Mars was in Pisces, would that expansive energy be more loving? In the 7th house of relationships/open enemies?! Are they one and the same??!

Click to expand...

Neptune Rising

I dont think Pisces always means more loving. Pisces can at times be feisty and fiery more so then a cancer anyhow.
I dont see how mars and piscies would be good but I dont know.
Mars seems to be impuse outward motion Fire. then piscies as a sign seems inflow thought and emotion, like an dispersal only inward.
like where pisces seems to be more about pulling in thought and emotion like water catching leaves. it seems that mars is strait out outflow I am.

I see someone thats a little frustrated in that seventh house, and i wonder
how happy is that jupiter and mars in the seventh if they oppose neptune in the first. and what about retrograde neptune. mabie a sence of not knowing how others percieve him?

with that moon in libra I see someone who doesnt like conflict its someone who needs harmony but I dont know if he gets it here with those aspects to the 4th and 7th houses.
His part of fortune is on the nadir.
Some nice pluto aspects there in the 11thH Group Therapy?
what about pluto being retrograde also?
Im stumped

Chart 1
Mars on ascendent in scorpio so power is an issue. Mars is in sign of rulership and has nice trines so I would imagine it works in a positive manner. 9th house stellium is good for travel. I would imagine sports poepl travel more than just about anyone. Sag in 2nd may indicate income is gained through travel and foreign countries, it is also quite a physical sign I think.

Chart 2
Jupiter and Neptune in 10th naer MC with NN. Which kinda looks like some kind of fame. Neptune has a lot to do with illusions and film so I guess acting is a potential here. Moon on ascendent which would look like they can express their emotions immediately which is good for actors. Sag moon possibly means they can go different places with their emotions good for different roles. Kidman and aniston have sag moon.Uranus Venus in Leo with Pluto sun merc all in 8th could indicate a sexual provocative nature that is well liked in the film industry. Sex sells I think they say.

Chart 3

leo asc so a need for attention. Pluto in 12th with POF worries me. Not a nice place to live, indicating some kind of seclusion. Pluto not well aspected. Sat/Uranus conj in 10th is not an easy energy to channel. But Jupiter is there and venus rules the MC which is on 7th cusp but square that uranus/saturn. I think this has a strong implication on the life but it is difficult to tell where it went.

Chart 4

Gemini on MC, merc in sag in deteriment. Virgo on asc so not that pushy or demanding but potentially critical. Neptune in 1st house can be enlightenment or dellusion. venus in 5th with no real bad aspects good trine with moon makes it hard for me to see this person being bad. Jupiter with mars in 7th. in aries which gives a power which is maybe lacking on the MC. There is a lot of energy in 4th. I would have to gues that this is the spiritualist as gem is asc and merc in sag is often connected with publishing, Jane Austen for example. But I dont think this person had huge fame.

There is my 10 cents. The last two are tricky.


Love & Light
Flea

Hi Draco.
Pity you didn't include the aspects on the charts; makes it a little easier to see what is aspected to what if you work with that sort of technique.

I don't see Black Moon Lilith ?

It's a bit like that game Mastermind with the different pegs. Elimination through things you'd expect to find. But you're not providing the 'accurate' pegs.

What are the positions on the outer rings? Midpoints and 90* dial?

F.

Hi Fris.

When I first looked at that style chart I didn't understand it either, but once you get it, it's really very easy to read.

The reason I didn't include aspect lines is because preferances for orbs differ, some base orbs upon the aspect itself, some, like myself, base the orbs on the moiety of the planet. Some do not allow out of sign aspects. Astrodienst uses the most enormous orbs, which bug many, and if the orbs are reduced by 50%, it can remove aspects that really ought to be there. Aspect lines dictate the aspect, the Kundig style chart allows you to decide.

Now, to read that style chart, say for example that a planet, the Sun for example, is at Aries 00.00. You will see that at 00.00 of all the cardinal signs, that there is a Sun glyph accompanied by a square, showing that the Sun is in square to these points, and the glyph will be in red indicating a hard aspect. At 00.00 degrees of the fire signs, you would see a Sun glyph, this time accompanied by a triangle, and they will be in green indicating a soft aspect.

So you glance around the edge of the chart in order to determine the aspects, and have them as tight or as wide as you want, in sign only or out of sign aspects too.

If you look at Mystery Chart #1 as an example, you will see that at the MC, there is a little green line pointing to this point, and next to it is a little green glyph for Saturn and is accompanied by a sextile symbol, this shows that Saturn is closely sextile with the midheaven.

Where the Moon is, you can see that there is a little red line coming from the chart just above the Moon a degree ahead of it, with a little red glyph of Jupiter accompanied by a square, and this shows that Jupiter is in square with the Moon.

If in any doubt, you can refer to the bottom of the charts, where the degrees and minutes of arc of each planet is depicted.

There are no midpoints or 90' wheel depicted on the chart, only major aspects between the planets depicted.

Hopefully this has clarified for you.

There have been some really interesting responses guys, but I'm dropping no hints.

Fris, if the Black Moon is important to you, to save uploading again, then here I provide for you the position of her in each chart. It will be interesting to read your reflections on how you feel this point influences the charts, as I don't use it and know little about it.

I used the natural apogee rather than the oscillating.

Lillith:

#1 - 13.50 Leo.

#2 - 24.10 Aries.

#3 - 00.56 Gemini.

#4 - 15.09 Aquarius.

Thanks Draco for putting up such an interesting thread!

I didn't read any previous post in order not to influence my reading.Please bear in mind that I'm only a beginer and I will probably say lots of completly crazy things but well I'm trying to learn.

First chart:First thingthat caught my eye was the dignified Mars conjunct the Ascendnat by a very tight degree.A curious thing about this charts is that two of them have Mars in debility,and this chart is the only exception.Assuming that debilated planets are not comfortable enough to fully express their energies in the way traditionally associated with the planet,I think this chart belongs to the athlethe.Mars only has two aspects,so I think the planet is free to express it's dignity in a almost 'untouched' way.Not only,but we also see the Leo Moon tightly conjunct the MC,and Leo is a sign which typically feels comfortable being in the public eye.The9th house Cancer stellium is the only thing that puzzles me .

Second chart: I have a feeling this belongs to the adult movie star.The MC is ruled by Venus,and Venus is in Leo(a sign which loves to be in the public eye,like I said before)very tightly conjunct Uranus(freedom,inovation,individualism,breaking barries)in the8th house(typically associated with sex).The Moon in Sagitarius is adventurous and likes to try new things.Looking at the5th(another house associated with sex),the5th is ruled by Venus,which leads agains to the8th house Venus-Uranus conjunction.The conjunction with Uranus is the only aspect Venus makes,putting more emphasis on it.

Third chart: I think this chart belongs to the medium.Neptune is in the2nd(achieving money through spiritual work-the book selling thing).The3rd house-communications-is ruled by Venus;Venus is very tightly conjunct the DC,and is disposed by Uranus;Uranus can be found in the10th(associating the book-writing with the career).Sun,Moon and Mercury are all in the6th(daily work);I'm thinking spiritual practices require a lot of daily work and dedication in order to achieve our spiritual goals.The Part of Fortune is in the12th house alongside Pluto,so money was achieve through spirituality.

Fourth chart: The serial killer.Mars is in the7th(anger turned against others).Mars is disposed by Neptune(found in the1st house),and it opposes it's own dispositor.The12th house(psychologhical problems)is ruled by the Sun,and the Sun is in the4th,the house related to the uncounscious and security matters.

I have to say I'm still very confused by all of this.I probably a lot of things that don't make sense but well we'll see.

Here are my Guesses:

Now I might have missed some aspects as I am used to reading charts with the aspect lines drawn in, so I tried my best to spot most of the aspects.

Chart number 1 - This may be the possible murderer chart, The SN on Pluto in Leo/10th an authoritative, powerful placement.

Sun in Cancer squares Saturn in the 11th house - Maybe this individual doesn't feel he fits into society in some way. Saturn is on the cusp of the 12th, which can suggest a confinement of some sort for this individual.

The Sun is very afflicted in this chart. Saturn, Uranus, semi something to Pluto.

There is a lot of 9th house activity in this chart but this could also mean dealings with the law, travel, are his morals right or wrong, that's for god to judge he has Sun/Uranus in 9th maybe he breaks the law.

There is a T.square with Mars/Jupiter/Moon involving the fixed signs, of Leo, Scorpio, and Taurus. I think fixed t.Squares focus on issues of self worth for this person. Emotions, anger, can be excessive. Venus Squares Saturn so again self-worth issues for this person. Moon conjunct Pluto secretive emotions, destructive emotions considering this person has a lot of Cancer in chart the emotions are controlled, by the powerful planets Saturn/Pluto.

The worst traits of Mars in Scorpio person - emotional and sexual addictions, , fears linked with loss, betrayal, abandonment, can create a fundamental fear of intimacy. A Mars in Scorpio, person must learn the value of emotional and sexual commitment versus following every compulsive desire.

Chart Number 2 - Adult move star - SN in Aries sex, anger, impulsive desires. Mars on the cusp of 5th and the only planet below the horizon, may suggest sexual affairs as I believe the 5th house relates to casual non committed sex. Mars squares Uranus/Venus in the 8th house I would say this person may be distanced from deep commitment, detached from the issues of the 8th house sex, intimacy, deep connections. Mars quincunx Saturn. Mars in Taurus can mean sexual violence, this person may want to confront sexual situations, where the emotions and psychological nature are brought into awareness I won't go further on the Mars in Taurus as I will make myself blush. Nearly all these charts had Mars in Taurus but this Mars was on the 5th house afflicting Uranus/Venus in 8th which makes my mind think this person would most likely to be the adult film star.

Neptune in Scorpio 10th - bring to mind sexual/images career. Conjunct Jupiter. Excessive. Neptune rules neurotic conditions. Sexual/Addictions/excess.

Chart number 3 - The sporty person - Sagittarius on the cusp of the 5th house, ruler in 10th Gemini. Enjoys sporty, activities. Sun in 6th square Mars in Taurus/9th Mars active in the travel house, Jupiter house but in Taurus I was thinking this may be a slow sign for Mars, but it adds stamina and perseverance. To the individual. Moon Squares Mars in 9th work travel/adventure provoke strong emotions. Moon Square Saturn work houses Air/Earth a mental physical perseverance. Mars/Pluto aspect amazing physical/power.

Chart number 4 - Spiritual person - Asc Virgo, Neptune - Spirituality part of this person. Self daily routine, work.

Sun Square Jupiter, Sun Square Uranus in 9th, Moon opposed Jupiter.

Mercury square Mars/Pisces around the spiritual degree. Mars/Neptune aspect, Jupiter Neptune aspect.

P.S I couldn't see the chart patterns in the chart so my T.Square I noted might be too wide. There was no degrees next to the planets to check quickly. Excuse my mistakes.

tsquare said:

Pisces can at times be feisty and fiery more so then a cancer anyhow.

Click to expand...

Oh yes, my moon in Pisces understands this, flustered and fussed too! But not enough to even kill a spider...

I'm learning all the time here.

Neptune

I remember I once read somewhere that serial killers have some sort of stressful connection between the12th and the8th house...Thinking of that,in the4th chart,the12th house is ruled by the Sun,the Sun(located in the house of inner security)is disposed by Saturn,which is in the8th and in it's fall!Not only,but the Sun(ruler of the12th)squares the8th house cusp with something like a1ºorb.

This is an excellent excersize. Thanks for it. These are my thoughts and really have been formed with the help of all the other input thus far.
#1 athelete- mars on an angle(Guaqalin studies, i'm sorry i cannot remember the correct spelling of his name). Also, moon and pluto conjunct on MC- the conjunction of these two would suggest a strong mothering influence in this athelete's life.
#2 spiritual medium-12th house moon in sagittarius, like Princess Diana and mother Teresa. I have seen Sagittarius and Virgo moons to be called the "monastic" moons. Pluto can be a very powerful healer when connected with the 8th house and conjunct the sun here would indicate a person who has a personality which is in-touch with and can offer support to the healer within. Sun is trine moon so they work together in this chart. Sun conjunct mercury helps with ability to communicate in dynamic ways. I was suprised not to see more water influence in the chart but moon in 12th house is pisces' domain and 8th is scorpio's.
#3serial killer. It was said at the beginning of this post that mars/pluto conflicts in a chart represent aggression and this chart is full of them. Mars square sun and moon and pluto square mars and oppose sun and moon from the 12th house where it cuddles up with POF. This is where I see how we come in with these certain dispositions and i feel for the folks who come in so conflicted.
#4adult movie star-Venus in Aquarius leads to the ability to distance oneself from attachment and i would see this as a necessary trait in the **** industry. Also this person has moon in the second so there will be a drive toward attaining wealth. Mars and jupiter conjunct in 7th house, benefit through relationships and mars in pisces so this person would seem a lover more than a fighter. Pluto/power in the eleventh house(friends and groups) in leo(a proud nature). Also sun square moon points to the idea that the left hand doesn't necessarily agree with what the right is doing. Pluto trine mars suggest an easy flow between this person's power and drives.
I'll be anxious to see the outcomes of this post. smile

Really interesting responses, keep them coming. I see that I will have rather a lot to respond to when I reveal the answers, and the thread is still growing, but I don't mind that. When I reveal, I will try to be thorough in highlighting where each of you have made significant observations.

Remember, if you don't want to attempt all four charts, you might want to select one or two charts to focus upon, do as you wish.

I await your observations with interest Frisiangal. The Black Moon's are listed especially.

I'm glad so many of you find this exercise interesting, I was inspired by Bob's post where he put up the nativity and asked us to observe what kind of person the chart may belong to. We ought to do this sort of thing more often.

When I selected these four charts, I thought I had chosen four very different kinds of people, but on thinking about it, an athlete, a male **** star and a killer are all under the rulership of Mars, with the exception of the medium. Please don't in anyway take this as some sort of clue, it isn't, if you take it as such it could mislead, then again, perhaps not, I'm just sharing my thoughts. Perhaps it is my own fascination with Mars that lead me to select these types.

To remind you, all the charts belong to men. Three are American and one is Canadian. Three are still living, and one is now dead. Two of them were born in the Forties, and two in the Fifties.

I wonder if alongside trying to relate career to the chart, anyone might be able to deduce which of these persons is now dead?

Bob, might you join in on this? It would be interesting to read your observations.