Overlapping Sign-Blending

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
It's just a metaphor, like colors blending.
I understand the difference.
Convention has it that Sign-qualities stay entirely contained
within their own separate compartments, so no blending can occur.
That just doesn't work for me, personally.
Interesting - an illustrative chart of your theory would be helpful :smile:
 

IleneK

Premium Member
You're a Facilitator according to my version of Astrology. You find satisfaction in helping others along their life-paths, which is a blessing.
I live in an astrological world. It's how I relate to the reality you take for granted. I appreciate your concern, but the challenge/response dynamic is actually helpful to me. Thank you, though!

Okay, thank you for explaining.
 

AppLeo

Well-known member
Here's the real zodiac wheel

375px-RGB_color_wheel_360.svg.png
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
I was astounded to learn that in both Trad and Mod opinion, the Signs have definitive cut-offs ("walls") at the boundary points. For the Houses, I agree, but not for the Signs. I use a 5 degree orb, with slight blending of Sign-qualities at the first and last 5 degree points, gradually increasing to half-and-half at the boundaries themselves. The Sign the indicator is actually in, is dominant, but it shares some qualities with the previous and next Sign in the very early and late degrees.
I'm pretty sure a lot of us are of this opinion, which seems rather apparent to me, personally. Aries on the verge of Taurus, and Taurus within that 5 degree range of Aries, for example, aren't the same in effect as pure Aries and Taurus by themselves [IMO].
Any comments?
Because of experience. With a Piscean Asc and Sun, I feel the difference regarding the Solar transits, and see the difference in those born at the beginning and ending of Sun-sign placements. As for the Houses, those are areas of life, and Houses do have "walls". But the Signs are a continuum of qualities, and I see no reason WHATSOEVER for totally walling them apart.
Let's see if anyone else is blending Signs at the boundary-cusps, not realizing how unconventional it really is. Remember, I'm talking about Modern here. Trads will do whatever was done before. That's their job!
Zodiac Sign Cusps: What Does It Mean to Be Born on a Cusp?
there's an in-depth discussion
about the use of zodiac sign cusps in astrology,
and what it means when a person is born on a cusp.
Cusps have recently become a topic of conversation in the astrological community
because some pop astrology sites are treating them almost like a third sign :smile:
that blends the qualities of two neighboring signs.
This has elicited some push-back in the astrological community
with some saying that cusps are not a thing and have no intrinsic meaning
aside from being boundaries.
In episode 177 of The Astrology Podcast astrologers Chris Brennan and Austin Coppock
set out to explore this issue, and we discuss the pros and cons
of both sides of the cusp debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6iX9OcsP9M&t=316s
 

david starling

Well-known member
Zodiac Sign Cusps: What Does It Mean to Be Born on a Cusp?
there's an in-depth discussion
about the use of zodiac sign cusps in astrology,
and what it means when a person is born on a cusp.
Cusps have recently become a topic of conversation in the astrological community
because some pop astrology sites are treating them almost like a third sign :smile:
that blends the qualities of two neighboring signs.
This has elicited some push-back in the astrological community
with some saying that cusps are not a thing and have no intrinsic meaning
aside from being boundaries.
In episode 177 of The Astrology Podcast astrologers Chris Brennan and Austin Coppock
set out to explore this issue, and we discuss the pros and cons
of both sides of the cusp debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6iX9OcsP9M&t=316s

As an alternative to actual Sign-blending, where one Sign is beginning its transformation into the next (my viewpoint), they have another explanation: The Signs are "activated" by the indicator--Sun, Moon, Planet, or Ascendant, etc. These have Orbs, meaning an area of influence that extends beyond its "needle-point", precise position. And, the Orb-influence begins to activate both Signs at once at the cusps, causing the mix of Sign qualities exhibited by the indicator.
 

Ekonomist13

Well-known member
I completely agree.

That's why I was happy to see some astrologers divide each sign in three decanates. That way, the first decanate is reserved for people with half previous sign, half current sign, and people in 3rd decanate are half current sign and half next sign.

I do see it gradually. In fact, I was considering using colored numbers as codes for birthdates, that way a combination of colors you have would easily show you which amount of your personality belongs to the next/previous sign and which amount belongs to the current sign.

Besides, it's common sense - how can 1 day, or even 1 hour for that matter, be associated with a complete change of personality? It's not like there's a giant gear with different speeds in the milky way, downshifting and upshifting when 21st in a month comes.

Oh and might I add couple of astonishingly easy examples: I mean, just imagine the mixture of a capricorn and aquarius (20. january dob). That guy is silent, but always surrounded with people. Can't miss that combination.

Or 21. june for that matter. Philosophical with millions of interests, yet argumentative, unchangable and introverted.

In fact, that is why I prefer using Vedic astrology for people on the cusps. Because if you're on a cusp in Western astrology, in vedic you'll be purely previous sign, and most of the people find those personalities much more like them (even though that's entirely subjective at this point - reality will be, there's always a cardinal trait of the next sign involved, but people don't want complications, they just want to hear something they wanted to hear and stick to it).
 
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Bunraku

Well-known member
Since the weather changes all the time, then which body rules what time of day.

I'm thinking Sun rules the midday since it's the hottest. Maybe Saturn before the Sun rises because it's the coldest part of the day(night).
 

AppLeo

Well-known member
Since the weather changes all the time, then which body rules what time of day.

I'm thinking Sun rules the midday since it's the hottest. Maybe Saturn before the Sun rises because it's the coldest part of the day(night).

Technically the evening is hottest, specifically around 4-5pm
 

Bunraku

Well-known member
Jupiter - Morning because it brings winds from the shift in temperature from the entrance of the Sun
Venus - the Morning after sunrise because of pleasant moist, cool weather
Sun - mid day, when the rays are oppressive
Mars - post-mid day when the temperature is scorching
 

Blaze

Account Closed
I was astounded to learn that in both Trad and Mod opinion, the Signs have definitive cut-offs ("walls") at the boundary points. For the Houses, I agree, but not for the Signs. I use a 5 degree orb, with slight blending of Sign-qualities at the first and last 5 degree points, gradually increasing to half-and-half at the boundaries themselves. The Sign the indicator is actually in, is dominant, but it shares some qualities with the previous and next Sign in the very early and late degrees.
I'm pretty sure a lot of us are of this opinion, which seems rather apparent to me, personally. Aries on the verge of Taurus, and Taurus within that 5 degree range of Aries, for example, aren't the same in effect as pure Aries and Taurus by themselves [IMO].
Any comments?

Going by this....

My Gemini Venus at 1 degree is colored by Taurus in someway, yes? If so, what do you make of said Venus?
 

david starling

Well-known member
Going by this....

My Gemini Venus at 1 degree is colored by Taurus in someway, yes? If so, what do you make of said Venus?

Stronger, earthier, and more intense than later degrees of Venus in Gemini, because of the inclusion of some Taurian qualities in the mix.
 
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petosiris

Banned
Since the weather changes all the time, then which body rules what time of day.

I'm thinking Sun rules the midday since it's the hottest. Maybe Saturn before the Sun rises because it's the coldest part of the day(night).

In the northern hemisphere
Asc (eastern wind/earth) - drying and moderately cooling - Mars both by day and by night, as only Mars produces such drying and maleficent winds
Mc (southern wind/fire) - heating and moderately drying - Sun by day and Jupiter by night (when dryness diminishes)
Dsc (western wind/air) - moistening and moderately heating - Venus by day and Moon by night (when heat diminishes)
Ic (northern wind/water) - cooling and moderately moistening - Saturn by day and Mercury by night (when moisture increases)

Aries, Leo and Sagittarius are southern wind trigon of Sun by day and Jupiter by night
Taurus, Virgo and Capricorn are western wind trigon of Venus by day and Moon by night
Gemini, Libra and Aquarius are northern wind trigon of Saturn by day and Mercury by night
Cancer, Scorpio and Pisces are eastern wind trigon of Mars
Because winds always predominate an exact direction, and because there are four possible general directions of winds, the twelve places are sharply pointed in groups of three separated by four places, that is by the figure of the trigon.

Aries + Leo + Sagittarius = 1 Moisture + 1/2 Heat + 1 Heat + 1/2 Dryness + 1 Dryness + 1/2 Cold = 1 Heat + 1/2 Dryness (South or Fire)
Taurus + Virgo + Capricorn = 1 Moisture + 1/2 Heat + 1 Heat + 1/2 Dryness + 1 Cold + 1/2 Moisture = 1 Moisture + 1/2 Heat (West or Air)
Gemini + Libra + Aquarius = 1 Moisture + 1/2 Heat + 1 Dryness + 1/2 Cold + 1 Cold + 1/2 Moisture = 1 Cold + 1/2 Moisture (North or Water)
Cancer + Scorpio + Pisces = 1 Heat + 1/2 Dryness + 1 Dryness + 1/2 Cold + 1 Cold + 1/2 Moisture = 1 Dryness + 1/2 Cold (East or Earth)

Thus, Aries, Leo and Sagittarius are southern wind trigon of Sun by day and Jupiter by night, more moistening by night due to the moisture of the night.
Taurus, Virgo and Capricorn are western wind trigon of Venus by day and Moon by night, more cooling by night due to the cold of the night.
Gemini, Libra and Aquarius are northern wind trigon of Saturn by day and Mercury by night, more moistening by night due to the moisture of the night, this wind is predominated by Mercury by night to account for the moderate moisture, occasional fecundity and beneficence, note that half of the time by night, this wind becomes feminine and nocturnal.
Cancer, Scorpio and Pisces are eastern wind trigon of Mars both by day and by night, as only Mars produces such drying and maleficent winds. To account for the moderate cold of the winds, some of the old astrologers put Venus as cooperating lord by day, and Moon as cooperating lord by night, however this does not seem right to me, as they are moistening planets.
The winds seem point at the seasonal powers of the solid places.

Of course, for the Southern Hemisphere, the equatorial winds of Sun and Jupiter become northern, and the polar winds of Saturn and Mercury become southern, as the direction of their two angles are reversed, likewise this differentiation of winds applies only to the general winds within the fronts, and not to every single locality at all times...

Likewise, for universal and genethlialogical investigations exactly at the equator, different system of predomination is to be used, based on complete and powerful configurations having twice the power of operative and moderate configurations, and predomination based on the qualities of angles (Hour-Marker - Mars, Midheaven - Sun by day and Jupiter by night, Setting - Venus by day and Moon by night, Anti-Midheaven - Saturn by day and Mercury by night) because the predominations of houses, elevations, trigons and bounds are useless. Planets become powerful, operative and inoperative only based on their angularity and phases in case of the five planets. For investigations in between the equator and the tropics, both equatorial and temperate systems are to be used proportionally.

So for the temperate zone we should use the triplicities of the zodiac rather than the angles, but for the equator, we should use the angles rather than the triplicities of the zodiac, as their power is predominating, and of course by angles I mean the angular triads here - the pre-ascension (12th) and post-ascension (2nd) of the Asc belong to the angle of the Asc (1), and so on for the other angles.

You can very well base your judgement on diurnal lag, provided that you factor increases and decreases holistically (or one might say idealistically), since it is clear that the cusp of the 8th is not increasing temperature (in most seasons and places), and the cusp of the 12th isn't coldest. The ancients made the same holistic judgement when they decided that the elevation of the Sun should be in Aries, and the elevation of Saturn should be in Libra, which are the most hot and most cold signs qualitatively, but not quantitatively.
 
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