Virtue of being self-absorbed?
- Thread starter AppLeo
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AtomsInPlace
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
Hi AppLeo
Hehe, selflessly absorbed...That's an interesting concept. Would you like to expand on that?
I guess there is a reason and season for everything and all ways of being...
Thank you for your input
Well wishes to you.
What's wrong with being self-absorbed?
Seriously.
It's better than being selflessly-absorbed.
Hi AppLeo
Hehe, selflessly absorbed...That's an interesting concept. Would you like to expand on that?
I guess there is a reason and season for everything and all ways of being...
Thank you for your input
Well wishes to you.
AppLeo
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
If you're selfishly involved, you'll always have your back.
If you're selflessly involved, someone else will always else has your back.
In other words, if you don't trust the world, it's better to be selfish because you can count on yourself. You don't know if other people will have your back.
If you do trust the world, it's better to be selfless because you can count on other people. You don't know if you will have your back.
In the end though, we are all responsible for ourselves and what we might do. We have no idea what other people might do. It's better to be selfish because at least yourself is the most predictable person on Earth.
If you're selfishly involved, you'll always have your back.
If you're selflessly involved, someone else will always else has your back.
In other words, if you don't trust the world, it's better to be selfish because you can count on yourself. You don't know if other people will have your back.
If you do trust the world, it's better to be selfless because you can count on other people. You don't know if you will have your back.
In the end though, we are all responsible for ourselves and what we might do. We have no idea what other people might do. It's better to be selfish because at least yourself is the most predictable person on Earth.
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
AppLeo
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
Thinking of yourself first is probably the most important thing you can do.
As a 7th house sun, I know what it's like to be selfless, and it never ends well. You always come first before anyone else. That's like a law of life.
Thinking of yourself first is probably the most important thing you can do.
As a 7th house sun, I know what it's like to be selfless, and it never ends well. You always come first before anyone else. That's like a law of life.
StillOne
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
Thank you for mentioning. As most definitely it is relevant and important. My first inclination is to disagree... However, I'm now fully aware that I must certainly agree with this point. I see that most people are definitely self-absorbed and that is the norm! I also see how that is an advantage in this world and is an attitude to embrace for most. People, mostly, only care about themselves and furthering their direction. If one embraces this pathway, one has a better chance of surviving since you are focusing primarily on yourself. Why wouldn't it be the most evolutionary successful individual?
In knowing this, you have to always question the motive of the "other" person and embrace your thoughts, instincts, and knowledge as your reaction or counterpoint to their self-centeredness. So, are they aligned with you? Or, are they solely out for themselves? It's an interesting position to be in since you have to weigh how to, then, trust the other. I personally find this bothersome, but have seen it happen time and again...
What's wrong with being self-absorbed?
Seriously.
It's better than being selflessly-absorbed.
Thank you for mentioning. As most definitely it is relevant and important. My first inclination is to disagree... However, I'm now fully aware that I must certainly agree with this point. I see that most people are definitely self-absorbed and that is the norm! I also see how that is an advantage in this world and is an attitude to embrace for most. People, mostly, only care about themselves and furthering their direction. If one embraces this pathway, one has a better chance of surviving since you are focusing primarily on yourself. Why wouldn't it be the most evolutionary successful individual?
In knowing this, you have to always question the motive of the "other" person and embrace your thoughts, instincts, and knowledge as your reaction or counterpoint to their self-centeredness. So, are they aligned with you? Or, are they solely out for themselves? It's an interesting position to be in since you have to weigh how to, then, trust the other. I personally find this bothersome, but have seen it happen time and again...
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AppLeo
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
You're welcome. :3
BTW, it's not in anyone selfish interest to have immoral motives. It's literally selfless to lie, steal, cheat, murder and everything along those lines. It doesn't help you at all to do those things; it just corrupts your soul and sooner or later people will not want to associate with you.
Everyone is self-absorbed differently, meaning, everyone wants, desires, and needs different things. If one person has something you want, and you have something they want, you can help each other selfishly. And if you want something that someone else doesn't have, you don't have to waste your time on them and vice versa. I think that's way better than just being selfless and hoping that what you're doing will help the other person at your own expense.
And people can have bad motives selflessly as well. In fact, I think people would be more inclined to have evil motives if they are selfless because every action they take is either to get the person to like them or appreciate them, to "appear" moral, and to ultimately base their entire existence on the behalf of someone else and not themselves; that can only end badly.
People should not be responsible for your well-being. YOU are responsible for your well-being.
I think this is why the Sun is exalted in Aries and debilitated in Libra.
And not to get political, but being selflessly absorbed is similar to communism, socialism, or collectivism... and we all know those things never work. Humans need other people, but only if it benefits the individual; otherwise, what's the point of being in a group?
Forgot to mention, I question the motives of the people who are NOT out for themselves. Something must be wrong with them, and the people that willingly take advantage of people who are NOT out for themselves are psychopaths, narcissists, or energy vampires. The most evil people in the world would not be able to thrive if selfless people did not exist.
You're welcome. :3
BTW, it's not in anyone selfish interest to have immoral motives. It's literally selfless to lie, steal, cheat, murder and everything along those lines. It doesn't help you at all to do those things; it just corrupts your soul and sooner or later people will not want to associate with you.
Everyone is self-absorbed differently, meaning, everyone wants, desires, and needs different things. If one person has something you want, and you have something they want, you can help each other selfishly. And if you want something that someone else doesn't have, you don't have to waste your time on them and vice versa. I think that's way better than just being selfless and hoping that what you're doing will help the other person at your own expense.
And people can have bad motives selflessly as well. In fact, I think people would be more inclined to have evil motives if they are selfless because every action they take is either to get the person to like them or appreciate them, to "appear" moral, and to ultimately base their entire existence on the behalf of someone else and not themselves; that can only end badly.
People should not be responsible for your well-being. YOU are responsible for your well-being.
I think this is why the Sun is exalted in Aries and debilitated in Libra.
And not to get political, but being selflessly absorbed is similar to communism, socialism, or collectivism... and we all know those things never work. Humans need other people, but only if it benefits the individual; otherwise, what's the point of being in a group?
Forgot to mention, I question the motives of the people who are NOT out for themselves. Something must be wrong with them, and the people that willingly take advantage of people who are NOT out for themselves are psychopaths, narcissists, or energy vampires. The most evil people in the world would not be able to thrive if selfless people did not exist.
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david starling
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
"If you're not for yourself, who are you? If you're only for yourself, what are you?"--{paraphrasing Rabbi Hillel}
"If you're not for yourself, who are you? If you're only for yourself, what are you?"--{paraphrasing Rabbi Hillel}
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
is often perceived as Morality in other cultures
then “immoral motive” is a cultural notion
few associate willingly with liars, cheaters, thieves, murderers
– depends on the value of what is wanted by each individual
obviously there may be others with a better trade on offer
is known as using people
and is a waste of time
is not unexpectedly more appealing to users than “just being selfless”
and is common in westernised culture
From a perspective that Immorality in one culture
is often perceived as Morality in other cultures
then “immoral motive” is a cultural notion
Siriusly intriguing notion
Not unexpectedly
few associate willingly with liars, cheaters, thieves, murderers
Obviously Individuality leads to individual preferences
IF they are willing to trade
– depends on the value of what is wanted by each individual
obviously there may be others with a better trade on offer
To associate solely with those from whom one can get something
is known as using people
and is a waste of time
Using people to get what one wants
is not unexpectedly more appealing to users than “just being selfless”
and is common in westernised culture
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
then most seek social acceptance
hence most seek to “appear” moral
and
that's basic level social interaction
is a sweeping assumption
not based on factual reality
which cultivates selfish attitudes
when we encounter someone being unselfish
all motives are suspect for one reason or another
is misperception
evil people do not ultimately thrive
also
If selfless people are content while being selfless
then that is their prerogative
Certainly motivation is key
Interesting perspective
because most value appreciation
then most seek social acceptance
hence most seek to “appear” moral
and
that's basic level social interaction
Those kinds of people have got themselves crucified in the past
To say “we all to know those things never work”
is a sweeping assumption
not based on factual reality
Humans are social animals indeed
Very suspicious indeed in our “me society”
which cultivates selfish attitudes
when we encounter someone being unselfish
It seems then
all motives are suspect for one reason or another
That "the most evil people in the world" are perceived as thriving
is misperception
evil people do not ultimately thrive
also
If selfless people are content while being selfless
then that is their prerogative
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
then most seek social acceptance
hence most seek to “appear” moral
and
that's basic level social interaction
is a sweeping assumption
not based on factual reality
which cultivates selfish attitudes
when we encounter someone being unselfish
all motives are suspect for one reason or another
is misperception
evil people do not ultimately thrive
also
If selfless people are content while being selfless
then that is their prerogative
motivation is key
Interesting perspective
because most value appreciation
then most seek social acceptance
hence most seek to “appear” moral
and
that's basic level social interaction
Those kinds of people have got themselves crucified in the past
To say “we all to know those things never work”
is a sweeping assumption
not based on factual reality
Humans are social animals indeed
Very suspicious indeed in our “me society”
which cultivates selfish attitudes
when we encounter someone being unselfish
It seems then
all motives are suspect for one reason or another
That "the most evil people in the world" are perceived as thriving
is misperception
evil people do not ultimately thrive
also
If selfless people are content while being selfless
then that is their prerogative
AtomsInPlace
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
This has turned into an interesting discussion...
Selfish vs Selfless...
The concept reminds me of the protocol in an emergency situation during flight, we are instructed to place the oxygen mask on ourselves first and then to assist any others who will need our help, such as children etc.
So one could say that it behooves us to take care of ourselves and our needs first, so that we are in a better position to be of service to others...
Also, when one thinks deeply enough about it, there really is no such thing as being totally and absolutely selfless. It oftens benefits us to act "selflessly" as it most often benefits the whole of which we are a part, so it benefits us by default and also because, for the majority of people, it simply "feels good to do good", so we're still getting something out of it.
This has turned into an interesting discussion...
Selfish vs Selfless...
The concept reminds me of the protocol in an emergency situation during flight, we are instructed to place the oxygen mask on ourselves first and then to assist any others who will need our help, such as children etc.
So one could say that it behooves us to take care of ourselves and our needs first, so that we are in a better position to be of service to others...
Also, when one thinks deeply enough about it, there really is no such thing as being totally and absolutely selfless. It oftens benefits us to act "selflessly" as it most often benefits the whole of which we are a part, so it benefits us by default and also because, for the majority of people, it simply "feels good to do good", so we're still getting something out of it.
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
AtomsInPlace
Well-known member
StillOne
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
Well I'm certainly going to disagree with most of this rationale. In my mind this is largely the problem we face today and why the world is in the turmoil it is in. However, I don't have the time to go into more of it now... not sure I want to anyway since it appears we are completely opposite in our viewpoints.
Well I'm certainly going to disagree with most of this rationale. In my mind this is largely the problem we face today and why the world is in the turmoil it is in. However, I don't have the time to go into more of it now... not sure I want to anyway since it appears we are completely opposite in our viewpoints.
jkxx74
Premium Member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
- glad that made sense too. Not the case usually with me. Anyway, whenever I see a cluster of many outer planet transits hitting someone it's usually a sign things are feeling really chaotic in a person's life. If the chart indicates introversion it's even more so because we are not as capable of unloading it on others to get a perspective on what's happening. So anything that can help is good.
The way this topic has progressed has piqued my interest in general though as it's so philosophical. What constitutes being selfish? Ensuring we have a job while bumping someone else off so we can provide for our own well-being? Taking advantage of someone because they seem "weak"? Seeing someone suffering on the street and ignoring it? It seems that this is not a set-in-stone distinction and is different for everyone. About the most fascinating (and if you like things balanced, disturbing) bit about this is that someone who is seemingly selfish in one way can be quite unselfish in others when something stimulates them in the opposite direction. So there isn't even an absolute frame of reference for it.
But, good food for thought
You're welcome
- glad that made sense too. Not the case usually with me. Anyway, whenever I see a cluster of many outer planet transits hitting someone it's usually a sign things are feeling really chaotic in a person's life. If the chart indicates introversion it's even more so because we are not as capable of unloading it on others to get a perspective on what's happening. So anything that can help is good.The way this topic has progressed has piqued my interest in general though as it's so philosophical. What constitutes being selfish? Ensuring we have a job while bumping someone else off so we can provide for our own well-being? Taking advantage of someone because they seem "weak"? Seeing someone suffering on the street and ignoring it? It seems that this is not a set-in-stone distinction and is different for everyone. About the most fascinating (and if you like things balanced, disturbing) bit about this is that someone who is seemingly selfish in one way can be quite unselfish in others when something stimulates them in the opposite direction. So there isn't even an absolute frame of reference for it.
But, good food for thought
AppLeo
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
It is good food for thought. Philosophy is a great thing. To just sit around and ponder things is great.
Anyway, AtomsInPlace, you should be proud of your chart and it's "selfishness"
The majority of the planets are on the left side of the chart, which is something I envy considering that all of my personal planets are on the right side of my chart. Planets on the left usually indicates someone who is a leader and is not bogged down by the people around them. People with planets on the right are usually followers who let people control them. Even the planet on the right side of your chart (moon) is in the strong and "selfish" sign of Aries!
It is good food for thought. Philosophy is a great thing. To just sit around and ponder things is great.
Anyway, AtomsInPlace, you should be proud of your chart and it's "selfishness"
The majority of the planets are on the left side of the chart, which is something I envy considering that all of my personal planets are on the right side of my chart. Planets on the left usually indicates someone who is a leader and is not bogged down by the people around them. People with planets on the right are usually followers who let people control them. Even the planet on the right side of your chart (moon) is in the strong and "selfish" sign of Aries!
AtomsInPlace
Well-known member
Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.
Aw thanks AppLeo,
I like your energy...
Funny you should mention that about leadership qualities, quite a few people have mentioned the "leader" thing to me...Perhaps I just need to get over my own reluctancy...and I must admit that if the crowd is going that way, you'll most often find me galloping off in the opposite direction hehe...
This is one of my songs where I definately use my arian moon energy more:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ7thr4F8jo
How do you use your "others" oriented energy in your own chart?
It is good food for thought. Philosophy is a great thing. To just sit around and ponder things is great.
Anyway, AtomsInPlace, you should be proud of your chart and it's "selfishness"
Aw thanks AppLeo,
I like your energy...
Funny you should mention that about leadership qualities, quite a few people have mentioned the "leader" thing to me...Perhaps I just need to get over my own reluctancy...and I must admit that if the crowd is going that way, you'll most often find me galloping off in the opposite direction hehe...
This is one of my songs where I definately use my arian moon energy more:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ7thr4F8jo
How do you use your "others" oriented energy in your own chart?