does the 7th house represent all marriages? Or only the first marriage?

Satine said:

In several places I have read 7th house rules all marriage but I have also read that the 7th house rules the first, the 9th house rules the second marriage if there is one and a third marriage would be ruled by the 11th house. Which is correct?
Thank you

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Omnisphericus said:

This is very intriguing subject isn't it?

Well, I must mention in the very beginning in explaining the methods here that they are of medieval astrology type (Bonatti, Abu Ali, Al Khayat and etc.).
To say that the method is 'Traditional' is really using very wide range of time span in which different techniques for delineating marriage were used.
For example, the Hellenistic Astrologer's (Valens, Dorotheus and etc.) have used methods on their own, methods which I'll probably (not even later) not explain on this thread, but we can open another thread for that matter.
As this section of Traditional Astrology is quite new and in its beginnings, we now trow out the techniques here and there and title them as "Traditional". I hope that in the future we can make sub sections of traditional astrology, such as: "Medieval Astrology", "Hellenistic Astrology", Renaissance Astrology" and etc..

There are certain rules in Medieval Astrology compiled
which can give quite good and workable methods for delineating marriage.
The rules one can learn for a short period of time,
but the practice is what is needed in order these rules to become second nature
of the astrologer's intuitive tool in delineating such things as Marriage in the chart.
This is what I would like to do on this thread: to practice as much charts as I/we will have the time to do it.


The Technique

The Compound Almuten is what is very practical thing in almost all methods used in medieval delineation. It seems that Bonatti and other medievals were very fond on Compound Almutens.
I will first give delineation for male charts, and in some later post will explain the delineation for female charts.

Finding the Compound Almuten for Marriage:

Find the Rulers of all 5 dignities for these places:

1. 7th house cusp

2. Lord of the 7th house

3. Planets in 7th house (if any)

4. Moon

5. Venus

6. Part of Marriage (According to Hermes) (ASC + VE - SA) for Men.

The Planet which gets most points over these places is Almuten of Marriage.

But consider also if there are impediments to these places.

If there is affliction to 7th house
(by some Malefic's square or opposition),
to the Moon
(aspect, combust, cadent, retrograde and etc.)

See if one of the individual Almutens over these places is joined to the Lord of the Ascendant or its Almuten or the Lord of the 7th or its Almuten.
If they are in trine or sextile, and if especially in reception, then the native will rejoice in living beautiful life with his wife according to his desire.

But if the aspects were without reception, or if the aspects were square or opposition, then the significations will be judged lower.

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Satine said:

Thank you Poyi! do you know if there are any aspects that would indicate a second or third marriage? Or multiple marriages in general?

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Omnisphericus said:

In Women's chart the Sun is of great importance.
According to Ptolemy we seek to find the Sun in the two Oriental Quadrants: from AC to MC, and from DC to IC, because this signifies that the woman will be married in her youth and that she will take young man in her older years, but not an older husband.
But when the Sun is in the Occidental quadrants (from AC to IC, and from DC to MC), then her marriage is delayed or in youth she will take older man.

If the Sun is from the beginning of Aries till the middle of Taurus,
or from the middle of Leo all the way to the end of Virgo,
or from the beginning of Libra all the way to the middle of Scorpio,
or from the middle of Aquarius till the end of Pisces, and the significator (In women's chart this is the Lord or Almuten of the 7th house) is Occidental, she will marry in old age or with older man.

If the significator is under the Sun's beams, it signifies that she has no marriage.

If the Sun is in fixed sign signifies that she will be married to one man only.
But if in that sign there is Oriental planet, you will judge that the man will be young or that she will marry another one after that.
If the planet is Occidental, then he will be older.

If the Sun is in mutable sign she will have two husbands.
If the Sun is in cardinal sign she will have many men.

This is the chart of Jennifer Aniston.

She was very publicly married with Brad Pit
and had numerous broken relationships after that.
Her Sun is in fixed sign, so she married once.

The problem is that this Sun is afflicted from the Lord of the 7th
and the Sun itself is Almuten of the 7th.
This is (and other testimonies) what brought divorce.

Jennifer was 31 years old when she married Brad, so not so young.
Brad was 36, a little bit older then her.
Sun is in the Oriental Quarter,
but from the Middle of Aquarius till the End of Pisces
which testifies that the she will take older man and in her older years
(older from Medieval viewpoint).
With the Sun in the same sign there is occidental planet,
which again testifies about older man and marriage in older years.

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Satine said:

Do fixed signs usually only marry once?

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QUOTE

'....If the Sun is in fixed sign signifies that she will be married to one man only.

But if in that sign there is Oriental planet,
you will judge that the man will be young
or
that she will marry another one after that....'

JUPITERASC said:

QUOTE

'....If the Sun is in fixed sign signifies that she will be married to one man only.

But if in that sign there is Oriental planet,
you will judge that the man will be young
or
that she will marry another one after that....'

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poyi said:

Very interesting I think I read it somewhere in one of my books maybe William Lilly's.
I have Scorpio Fixed Sun sign ahahhaha with other oriental was an older husband,
yep most likely marrying another one after that.

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Lion o ness said:

The question that baffles me the most is what if 2 people are in a long term relationship but never actually marry??

I know a couple that has been together 30 years... Since they were in HS but they never married....
First it was cuz they didn't have enough money, then over the years it just became "ahh what's the point"
They are still together... And seem very happy with each other.

Would they show as h7 relationship?

Also what if a couple lives together for 10 years, never marry...
They split up..
Then get married to different people later...

Since they lived together first, would that be considered the " first marriage"
And then the actual marriage would then be h9?

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Always necessary to read the charts of the individuals mentioned in the examples given

Keep in mind that living together for ten, twenty, thirty years or more is often preferred for many reasons, often financial... and those financial reasons continue from year to year as time passes and the individuals do not in fact at any time 'legally marry'. Nevertheless for those individuals, so far as they are concerned, they are married.

Lion o ness said:

The question that baffles me the most is what if 2 people are in a long term relationship but never actually marry??

I know a couple that has been together 30 years... Since they were in HS but they never married....
First it was cuz they didn't have enough money, then over the years it just became "ahh what's the point"
They are still together... And seem very happy with each other.

Would they show as h7 relationship?

Also what if a couple lives together for 10 years, never marry...
They split up..
Then get married to different people later...

Since they lived together first, would that be considered the " first marriage"
And then the actual marriage would then be h9?

Click to expand...

JUPITERASC said:

Always necessary to read the charts of the individuals mentioned in the examples given

Keep in mind that living together for ten, twenty, thirty years or more is often preferred for many reasons, often financial... and those financial reasons continue from year to year as time passes and the individuals do not in fact at any time 'legally marry'. Nevertheless for those individuals, so far as they are concerned, they are married.

Click to expand...

Lion o ness said:

The question that baffles me the most is what if 2 people are in a long term relationship but never actually marry??

I know a couple that has been together 30 years... Since they were in HS but they never married....
First it was cuz they didn't have enough money, then over the years it just became "ahh what's the point"
They are still together... And seem very happy with each other.

Would they show as h7 relationship?

Also what if a couple lives together for 10 years, never marry...
They split up..
Then get married to different people later...

Since they lived together first, would that be considered the " first marriage"
And then the actual marriage would then be h9?

Click to expand...

poyi said:

Since most of the astrology techniques and methods were developed before modern time. We should consider and view the situation from the eyes of the past. In very strict point of views, Marriage should be through official ceremony, with witness, on paper, in front of relatives/family, to have a change of social status, change to your husband's surname etc. Living together from the old standard is not considered as marriage as you have no social status calling each other as husband and wife, even these days without such official paper, you can at most on legal right, called each other Partner only. The official 7th house will have effect on the Living/family condition your IC, your self identity AC, you social status MC.

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