Any Chance for Future Relationship?

Firstly, thank you in advance to those helping my noob's curiosity some enlightenment. I've just begun learning astrology about a couple of months ago, and interested in Horary about a week ago. So, I thought I am gonna give myself a try, using my own case as the example.

Background story: I've met someone 2 years back and instantly felt a strong spiritual connection. There was familiarity somehow. We bonded right away as good friends. However, I confessed my feeling within a week after our friendship had just started (ready for rejection - knowing there are a lot of obstacles to make it work) but what I didn't expect that she suddenly ghosted me. No communication from her up till today. And now we both had been separated in different countries.

Q: I wonder though, is there any chance of a romantic relationship for us, in the future?

So I've created the below chart:

Here is so far my compilation (plus a bit newbie interpretation of it):

Querent (Significator-1): Lord of Scorpio = Mars (peregrine in Aquarius)
Quesited (Significator-2): Lord of Taurus = Venus (detriment in Scorpio)
Co-significator Querent: Moon detriment in Capricorn, however joyous in House 3.

Interpret:
Venus and Moon in detriment showing the inability to start the connection?
However Moon as the Planet of Joy showing the positive expectation?
Position of Venus in the Significator-1 domicile = more willing for connection and well-received?
Mars being in peregrine is confuse or unaware or can it also showed that Mars is a foreigner to Venus?
Both Venus and Mars in Angular house showing the strong desire to establish a relationship?

Aspects& Interpret:
Venus (retrograde) making square aspect with Mars (separating) => past issue?
Moon sextile Venus: possible future positive outcome?

Conclusion so far: is it true if there is a possibility for future relationship, however, hindered by certain obstacles? (What are the obstacles could be seen from the chart?)

additional questions:
Is there any significant meaning for part of fortune conjunct Mars? Mars opposition MC? What is the role of Mercury there?

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I am sorry if I am still scattered on this. I am still far from being able to interpret horary. Hope someone can help shed some light here. Thx.

Here I also give the 'twin' chart from Astro.com:

Can you post a horary chart from Astrodienst in the normal way?

Hi waybread, thank you for the response.
I hope I am doing it correctly now.

So this girl ghosted you for two years ? Venus rx has her a$$ whooped right about now. After reaching back out after two years, what did she msg you ?

Returning under the rulership of a retrograde planet, i wouldn't trust it working out and turning into a full blown relationship with this girl, i dnt think she even knows what she wants with you moon/neptune, and she'll most likely be changing her mind again when venus goes back direct.

Just don't put too many eggs in one basket with this one.

Looks to me like she just left mercury and now decides after two years she wants you.

Wao Chrysalis, thank you.

But I was more looking for description of what aspects/planets causing what event, for learning purpose. But I have to say, the way you interpret the subject just blow my mind. But you did answer regarding mercury involvement, though, thanks. So I could also involve neptune in the picture, I see.

Amadeus99 said:

Wao Chrysalis, thank you.

But I was more looking for description of what aspects/planets causing what event, for learning purpose. But I have to say, the way you interpret the subject just blow my mind. But you did answer regarding mercury involvement, though, thanks. So I could also involve neptune in the picture, I see.

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For learning purposes:

Shes L7 venus, shes recently gone retrograde hence the reappearance from her. Moons just recently left a sextile with venus which was her reaching back out to you, moons now in a sextile with neptune delusion/confusion on the matter, venus has just separated from mercury which is venus's L5/romance/fling which is why i said shes most likely recently finished something with someone and has now come running back to you.

Whats moon doing next ? squaring with your 2nd significator sun, which perfects at 23 degrees in capricorn, moons already in detriment in capricorn and when reaches 23 degrees will be in what you call a pitted degree, so has had another kick to the knees, which is why this square is in bad shape to produce anything good at all.

Whats next...well jupiters eagerly awaiting her sextile from moon, will this help ? Jupiter is your L5/romance, moon perfects the sextile at 25 degrees capricorn, .....BUT even this is no success either, as jupiters in moons fall

Then if you want to include chiron, chirons next up, so along comes the disappointment from things not working out, then moon changes signs and its all over.

For a r'ship its not happening.

Chrysalis, thank you so much! Wao, I envy you, hope I can read like you one day. It is amazed me of the details you gave on the L5's from the quesited point a view (I forgot about this, but read it somewhere) - then you saw the Jupiter coming as the querent L5.

And thanks for the neptune explanation as well.

I still have queries though, if you don't mind.
1st. You barely mention the main significator of the querent (me) Mars. How to translate the aspect made with Venus? Is it regarding the 'emotional' involvement between these 2 persons?

2nd. I realized that separating and applying denote past and upcoming events. However, with a retrograde planet, does it mean the opposite? Can you please enlight me further on this?

3rd. Why Moon making an aspect with Mercury? How to translate that? (since I recalled no 3rd party involved - I mean not in my knowing).

4th. (in addition) how you calculate the timing in term of days/months for the expected future result?

You and venus are now in separating aspects. Putting the chart back we can see that venus/mars were both last in a perfection aspect by trine at 29 degrees (venus 29 degrees Libra and mars 29 degrees aquarius), it just so happened that then you both changed signs, and you also being in venus detriment in Libra...hence nothing becoming of it.

Venus then leaves you and carries on her journey through scorpio, until she slows down to go retrograde and meets back up with you again by square at 10 degrees scorpio, which just happens to be 2 degrees away from where mars/venus is now = 2 years till return.

3rd. Why Moon making an aspect with Mercury? How to translate that? (since I recalled no 3rd party involved - I mean not in my knowing).
Venus blocks moon making aspect with mercury.

Amadeus, just to add to what Chrysalis posted.

No, I think she's gone. You're symbolized by Mars. (Secondarily by Jupiter.) She's symbolized by Venus. Venus is in detriment, retrograde, turning away from Mars. The moon (your emotional stake in the matter) is also past its last aspect with Venus. Venus in the quadrant house system I would use is also in your 12th house of secrets. You may never know why she fled. The next aspect of Venus is to Saturn, which I would regard as a prohibition.

In horary, we don't generally use all of the planets in the chart, unlike in in a general natal chart reading.

Frankly, this is someone you knew for just a week. You haven't mentioned why she got in touch with you just recently. My sense, from the condition of Venus, is that she is not happy about her life now, and recalled you as a friendly face from her past. But this doesn't mean she's ready to start a new relationship, especially if you live in different countries.

I'm sorry not to have a more positive answer for you. And I'd be happy to be proven wrong if you really like her. Please let us know what happens.

Hi Chrysalis and Waybread, thank you so much for taking the time to tutor me on this. I appreciate that you both have put your expertise to translate the situation.

In many ways, I do gain new perspective based on your reading. But I would also like to add some of my own conclusion (after continuously reading about horary in the net) correlated to the actual (subjective) event (perspective).

First, I like to pinpoint the main significator's condition/situation in which I found quite revealing -from the chart:
Mars (me) being peregrine: I translated that as my state of uncertainty (whether to be committed or not). However being in the angular house did create certain 'expectation' (hence the horary reading). As also could be witnessed (i donno if this is valid though), Mars is making aspect by opposition with MC -> this is my current struggle and the main focus/attention in life. As I am trying to change job to expand my career. It also rooted in the 4th House in which I translated that as my need to concentrate in stabilizing my foundation first (career, financial, 'home') before moving on to an established relationship.

Venus (her): despite detriment, she is in her sign of triplicity and located in the ascendant house. So, I don't see this as 'black and white' malicious. But I do see it as the 'uncertainty' as well.

You see, in reality, there was mutual attraction, however, the external circumstances were far from easy to overcome. So despite, good intention to be together - however, taking the realistic consideration; a committed relationship is not coming as an easy answer (and countries differences is not really a matter, cause she is 'familiar' with my country (been here), and to travel to her (to her country) also not an issue for me (btw, we met in different country than our origin, though).

Mercury: as I read, planet in the ascendant house could be taken as the querent co-significator. And I also aware that moon making a sextile aspect to mercury then it conjunct Venus (is it translation of light?). And as Mercury represent communication, I see this as also correlated - as communication part of the obstacle (but I strongly emphasized on the importance of it). And here I do agree to Waybread using different house system, that Venus is in 12th house; as Venus problem in communicating her thought coming from her reserved nature and emotionally detached type of person.

As for Sun, Pluto, Jupiter (next moon aspects), I kinda disagree to relate it as 3 parties in the querent part. Since I am not in the position to be in relationship, let alone a fling. My sole focus is in my future goal and career, at the moment.

And as for Neptune - as I am also aware of the effect of the retrogade transit and I see an aspect made with both significators, however, I didn't translate it right away as 'malice' intention based on the illusive judgement. In contrary, it is actually creating 'a wake up call' for us to be more realistic and stop wearing a rose-colored glasses (thus not a good time to be in committed/romantic relationship).

Finally,
as Venus being retrograde during this reading (as I also read, it could impede the judgment if the lord of the 7th in retrograde, the same way like finding Saturn in retrograde in the 1st: I translated this as a none conclusive event.

Meaning if to answer the question: will there be a romantic relationship in the future? Based on the actual experience (and noob interpretation of the chart) the answer provided here: Despite mutual attraction, current situation/condition are not condusive to form a commited (romantic) relationship - thus the answer is 'pending' till Venus goes direct and/or all other circumstances supported (if there will be, though).

With this interpretation, I simply don't wanna create a plain answer yes or no, or act as sound judgement while the sound circumstances are not yet supported. However, yes, 'No' is what I am taking now (but what lies in the future, who knows?)

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Thank you both (Chrysalis and Waybread), I learn a lot just by posting this initial thread in here.

Good for you, that you're teaching yourself horary. But the danger is that you're personally invested in the outcome, and can be tempted to overlook the main messages from the chart, in the hope that some minor ones will work for you. Also, please keep in mind that although a horary chart can reveal additional information, it's there specifically to answer the question that you asked.

First, I like to pinpoint the main significator's condition/situation in which I found quite revealing -from the chart:
Mars (me) being peregrine: I translated that as my state of uncertainty (whether to be committed or not). However being in the angular house did create certain 'expectation' (hence the horary reading). As also could be witnessed (i donno if this is valid though), Mars is making aspect by opposition with MC -> this is my current struggle and the main focus/attention in life. As I am trying to change job to expand my career. It also rooted in the 4th House in which I translated that as my need to concentrate in stabilizing my foundation first (career, financial, 'home') before moving on to an established relationship.

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A peregrine planet basically has little power to act. It picks up a little accidental dignity in the 4th house, but not much. Since you didn't ask a question involving anyone's career, I don't see where the MC gets you. Your significator in the 4th house possibly says something about your focus on the home. Possibly you hope to establish a home together.

Venus (her): despite detriment, she is in her sign of triplicity and located in the ascendant house. So, I don't see this as 'black and white' malicious. But I do see it as the 'uncertainty' as well.

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I wouldn't see Venus as in any way malicious. Venus in "your" house may indicate some residual affection, but I don't see this as strong enough to trigger a romantic relationship.

You see, in reality, there was mutual attraction, however, the external circumstances were far from easy to overcome. So despite, good intention to be together - however, taking the realistic consideration; a committed relationship is not coming as an easy answer (and countries differences is not really a matter, cause she is 'familiar' with my country (been here), and to travel to her (to her country) also not an issue for me (btw, we met in different country than our origin, though).

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That's fine, but the main point is that I don't see a coming together.

Mercury: as I read, planet in the ascendant house could be taken as the querent co-significator. And I also aware that moon making a sextile aspect to mercury then it conjunct Venus (is it translation of light?). And as Mercury represent communication, I see this as also correlated - as communication part of the obstacle (but I strongly emphasized on the importance of it). And here I do agree to Waybread using different house system, that Venus is in 12th house; as Venus problem in communicating her thought coming from her reserved nature and emotionally detached type of person.

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In horary, applying aspects are normally the ones that matter. We look at the faster-moving planet. A separating aspect indicates something over and done with. The exception would be if the separating planet turns retrograde and then the aspect perfects.

Venus retrograde is also turning away from Mercury. The aspect doesn't perfect. The moon at 14 Capricorn (in detriment) applies to a sextile with Jupiter, but before it gets there, it hits the square with the 12th house sun. I would view that as a prohibition.

As for Sun, Pluto, Jupiter (next moon aspects), I kinda disagree to relate it as 3 parties in the querent part. Since I am not in the position to be in relationship, let alone a fling. My sole focus is in my future goal and career, at the moment.

And as for Neptune - as I am also aware of the effect of the retrogade transit and I see an aspect made with both significators, however, I didn't translate it right away as 'malice' intention based on the illusive judgement. In contrary, it is actually creating 'a wake up call' for us to be more realistic and stop wearing a rose-colored glasses (thus not a good time to be in committed/romantic relationship).

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I don't use the outer planets except as supplementary data points.

Finally,
as Venus being retrograde during this reading (as I also read, it could impede the judgment if the lord of the 7th in retrograde, the same way like finding Saturn in retrograde in the 1st: I translated this as a none conclusive event.

Meaning if to answer the question: will there be a romantic relationship in the future? Based on the actual experience (and noob interpretation of the chart) the answer provided here: Despite mutual attraction, current situation/condition are not condusive to form a commited (romantic) relationship - thus the answer is 'pending' till Venus goes direct and/or all other circumstances supported (if there will be, though).

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I think this is wishful thinking on your part. a horary chart is time-sensitive. Obviously, following a "no" answer we could all wait long enough (months, years) enough for the planets to realign.

With this interpretation, I simply don't wanna create a plain answer yes or no, or act as sound judgement while the sound circumstances are not yet supported. However, yes, 'No' is what I am taking now (but what lies in the future, who knows?)

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Well, let us know what happens.

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Thank you both (Chrysalis and Waybread), I learn a lot just by posting this initial thread in here.

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You're welcome.

Hi Waybread, I think you imposing your own perspective on the horary chart there.

Nope, I am not thinking on establishing a home with the quesited. But I let you settle with your reading since it seems to me you know more about my side of story and my life - based on this horary chart alone.

And for the outer planet, I was mere bring back the real/actual event from the Chrysalis' reading. Cause, nope, there was/is no 3rd party not from the quesited side, nor from me as the querent.

In my profession, I did encounter group of people similar like here in this forum, it may sometime stepping too much onto 'what they believe they know' while restricting the possibility that while the chart maybe make no flaw, however, the interpretation is always bounded by human's constraint.

I post the chart for the learning purpose. And I thought by giving the real story of what really happened you can then learn how to fit the chart with the actual event. However, if you like to keep your perspective on it, and its up to you.

Anyhow, take this as constructive criticism. And nope I am not trying to defend myself against the horary, I was mere giving my side of story based on the previous reading made by C and yourself. And as I mentioned, I am aware of the time-sensitive on the horary, so I took the answer as a 'no'. However, again, be mindful of the fact we are not holding any secret of destiny, or power over someone's life - I prefer to keep the future possibility open (this is my ground as a horary reader, in this case).

And as for MC, well, since my life is basically occupied with the thinking on changing job and making plan to go overseas for the career advancement; seeing how Mars making aspect with MC - I thought it is true in defining my current state of being which impact on how I perceive myself in term of the relationship.

But then again, I let you think the opposite, cause your interpretation is: I want to establish a home with the quesited. Then it is fine for me.

He said: Your significator in the 4th house possibly says something about your focus on the home. POSSIBLY you hope to establish a home together.

Not about what you are suggesting. Focus on home can be variety of others thing too.

And I don’t see waybread imposing his perspective at all but contributing his time to tell you the basics..

4th house is also about foundation, and since it resonate on my state of being (here I am telling the state of the querent - me) then that's what I was revealing. And that's how I translated the 'weaker' side of the querent in this "relationship wishful thinking'. Foundation here about security, finance, home in general term.

HeartTree said:

He said: Your significator in the 4th house possibly says something about your focus on the home. POSSIBLY you hope to establish a home together.

Not about what you are suggesting. Focus on home can be variety of others thing too.

And I don’t see waybread imposing his perspective at all but contributing his time to tell you the basics..

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Amadeus99 said:

Hi Waybread, I think you imposing your own perspective on the horary chart there.

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It's not "my" personal perspective. I have an extensive collection of astrology books, and the 4th as the "house of home" is the most common interpretation. Other common meanings seemed less appropriate (one's early childhood conditioning, missing item, father, mother, ancestry, land, the end of the matter.)

Nope, I am not thinking on establishing a home with the quesited. But I let you settle with your reading since it seems to me you know more about my side of story and my life - based on this horary chart alone.

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I don't know more about your life. You know more about your life. I have probably studied horary longer than you have and read more horary charts than you have, but others on this forum are more expert than I am.

What I said in my previous post was: "Your significator in the 4th house possibly says something about your focus on the home. Possibly you hope to establish a home together."

This was hardly a definitive statement.

A horary chart should show a picture of the events pertinent to your question. However, it isn't like a natal chart, which would say more about your personality and life experience.

And for the outer planet, I was mere bring back the real/actual event from the Chrysalis' reading. Cause, nope, there was/is no 3rd party not from the quesited side, nor from me as the querent.

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I did not suggest a third party.

In my profession, I did encounter group of people similar like here in this forum, it may sometime stepping too much onto 'what they believe they know' while restricting the possibility that while the chart maybe make no flaw, however, the interpretation is always bounded by human's constraint.

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Please don't compare me to your work associates. You have no idea whatsoever who I am. You asked for horary readings and I gave one. The problem is that you don't like it. You may notice that I typically (not always) qualify my judgments. In my previous post I used qualifiers like "possibly," "may," 'normally," "I would view." In my first post I said, " I'd be happy to be proven wrong if you really like her."

I post the chart for the learning purpose. And I thought by giving the real story of what really happened you can then learn how to fit the chart with the actual event. However, if you like to keep your perspective on it, and its up to you.

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Thank you. A backstory is generally helpful, but it doesn't always appear in a horary chart or alter the basic judgment.

Anyhow, take this as constructive criticism. And nope I am not trying to defend myself against the horary, I was mere giving my side of story based on the previous reading made by C and yourself. And as I mentioned, I am aware of the time-sensitive on the horary, so I took the answer as a 'no'. However, again, be mindful of the fact we are not holding any secret of destiny, or power over someone's life - I prefer to keep the future possibility open (this is my ground as a horary reader, in this case).

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If you prefer to practice your own version of horary, unlike the large body of information published on it, please do. Then let us know how it turns out.

And as for MC, well, since my life is basically occupied with the thinking on changing job and making plan to go overseas for the career advancement; seeing how Mars making aspect with MC - I thought it is true in defining my current state of being which impact on how I perceive myself in term of the relationship.

But then again, I let you think the opposite, cause your interpretation is: I want to establish a home with the quesited. Then it is fine for me.

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Again, thanks for the backstory, but I don't know how you define the word "possibly," which I used in that context.

[deleted response to possibly attacking remark - Moderator]

Amadeus99 said:

4th house is also about foundation, and since it resonate on my state of being (here I am telling the state of the querent - me) then that's what I was revealing. And that's how I translated the 'weaker' side of the querent in this "relationship wishful thinking'. Foundation here about security, finance, home in general term.

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"Foundation" means exactly what??? In a natal chart it might refer to your childhood family home, your family history, roots, and upbringing.

If you mean emotional security, that's normally the moon. However, you could include it within your home life.

Your personal finance is a second house matter. "Shared resources" like proceeds from a marriage (2nd from the 7th,) an inheritance, insurance, and investments like stocks and bonds are 8th house matters. Your father's (or parent's) money is a 5th house matter (2nd from the 4th.)

I'm not being picky here, because choosing the wrong house in horary can result in an incorrect answer.

May I ask what you're reading to learn horary astrology? There is a good traditional horary primer on the Skyscript website. A good book is J. Lee Lehman, The Martial Art of Horary Astrology.