when will lou w die?

rubyelixir

Well-known member
I see this chart is fit to be judged.The querent is not malicious in the intent and it is her father who is 93 and increasingly senile.
It is very difficult on the family and has been a burning question for a few years now.She has asked this question before but not knowing of astrology or horary and was asked in slightly different wording so as t6o not feel morally corrupt.Here is the question now point blank.
I am not sure if I use the ruler of the first (mars) as her or her father.Or do I look at the sun as representing the father? if so pluto is conjunct the sun now. The moon is 9 degrees away from the sun so I'm not sure if its considered combust. My initial take is that he will be robust until the end And although we all know death is inevitable for everyone, I do not know how I should read the timing on this.


Any help is appreciated
 

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tsmall

Premium Member
I see this chart is fit to be judged.

The question may be fit, but the chart is not radical. Note, I do not mean not readable, just not radical. Jupiter is the hour ruler and is in Virgo. Mars is the ascendant ruler and in Scorpio, as is the ASC. Those don't agree. Is there something else going on with the querent?

The querent is not malicious in the intent and it is her father who is 93 and increasingly senile. It is very difficult on the family and has been a burning question for a few years now.

Is the father in a nursing home? Or is he being cared for at home by the family?

I am not sure if I use the ruler of the first (mars) as her or her father.Or do I look at the sun as representing the father?

If you are not sure what to use as the significator of the father, why did you pull the chart?

Her father is the ruler of the 4th, Saturn.

if so pluto is conjunct the sun now.
That is irrelevant for the purposes of this chart.

The moon is 9 degrees away from the sun so I'm not sure if its considered combust.

Not yet, but it will be in one degree. For now it is under the beams.

My initial take is that he will be robust until the end And although we all know death is inevitable for everyone, I do not know how I should read the timing on this.


Any help is appreciated

Well, the timing is going to be difficult anyway because the chart isn't radical, which usually means there is something else going on other than what the question would indicate. I'd start by looking at the chart and then talking to your querent to get more information. For example, why is Venus just separating but still in partile conjunction with Saturn? What does the Moon's last aspect, the sextile to Mars, tell you about the situation as it has unfolded? What is motivating this question? Jupiter, ruler of the 2nd, is debilitated and out of sect, in applying square with that Saturn/Venus conjunction from the 2nd. Is the family hoping for an inheritance? Or is the care for the father a drain on resources?

Predicting death is not something to be taken lightly, nor out of idle "gee, dad's really getting up there in years and is a bit more dotty every day" (notice no one else here replied to this thread) and honestly unless there is a really, really compelling reason to make a chart for a question like this then I wouldn't do it. Especially if you are uncertain going into the chart what to take as the significators, or where to go from there.
 

mdinaz

Well-known member
Just my opinion but you cannot predict when someone will die. They will go when they are good and ready and when they think they've done all they can do. That can be five minutes from now or 50 years from now. We all have various check points in our life when we can "check out" and only your higher source knows which one is "the one". All of those check points are valid check out dates. Some times you can get a better sense of it by looking at the charts of those closest to them, to see if they all have common transits indicating a death in the family or some related issues. Then again, not all deal with death the same, especially for someone that old and in bad health. For some it's a relief, for some it's the end of the world.
 

tikana

Well-known member
Just my opinion but you cannot predict when someone will die. They will go when they are good and ready and when they think they've done all they can do. That can be five minutes from now or 50 years from now. We all have various check points in our life when we can "check out" and only your higher source knows which one is "the one". All of those check points are valid check out dates. Some times you can get a better sense of it by looking at the charts of those closest to them, to see if they all have common transits indicating a death in the family or some related issues. Then again, not all deal with death the same, especially for someone that old and in bad health. For some it's a relief, for some it's the end of the world.

YES you can and that has been done.. of course if you had read Christan astrology vol 2 you would have noticed that.......astrologers and people had to deal with those questions because inheritance and estate were in question.

Ruby
i am going to toss a coin on this and say possibly 9 units.. weeks or months
 

mdinaz

Well-known member
YES you can and that has been done.. of course if you had read Christan astrology vol 2 you would have noticed that.......astrologers and people had to deal with those questions because inheritance and estate were in question.

I respectfully disagree. Souls still have free will, and that includes death. I was nearly killed several times in the past and my chart very strongly indicated death. It was one of my "check out" periods. Obviously I opted not to. I know other people personally who are "walk ins" - essentially killed in an accident and another soul takes over. Their personality does not match their natal birth chart one bit - but fits their new chart (when they came out of a coma) perfectly. Every memory prior to the accident is gone. As far as I'm concerned, the natal chart is just your "default" position - if you don't evolve spiritually one bit, your life will indeed go along as your chart and transits indicate. But you can completely transcend your chart and make it irrelevant with the right ways of thinking and believing. If your life is set in stone by the chart, why bother (as seen from non-physical)?
 

tikana

Well-known member
for god sake look at this and tell me it cannot be done?.


https://books.google.com/books?id=p...CQYQ6AEIHTAA#v=onepage&q=horary death&f=false
page 21


https://books.google.com/books?id=t...CQYQ6AEINjAE#v=onepage&q=horary death&f=false
page 402

https://books.google.com/books?id=D...D4KHfo3CQYQ6AEIRzAH#v=onepage&q=death&f=false

https://books.google.com/books?id=O...D4KHfo3CQYQ6AEIUjAJ#v=onepage&q=death&f=false
Chapter 9
page 93

don't argue without supporting evidence.. your opinion unfortunately doesnt matter when there are case after case in horary and natal astrology specifically that deals with when a person dies and how it will be.

T
 

fensi88

Well-known member
I see this chart is fit to be judged.The querent is not malicious in the intent and it is her father who is 93 and increasingly senile.
It is very difficult on the family and has been a burning question for a few years now.She has asked this question before but not knowing of astrology or horary and was asked in slightly different wording so as t6o not feel morally corrupt.Here is the question now point blank.
I am not sure if I use the ruler of the first (mars) as her or her father.Or do I look at the sun as representing the father? if so pluto is conjunct the sun now. The moon is 9 degrees away from the sun so I'm not sure if its considered combust. My initial take is that he will be robust until the end And although we all know death is inevitable for everyone, I do not know how I should read the timing on this.


Any help is appreciated

I donot see he will die soon.
Her father is Saturn and ruler of the radiacl 8 house/death or turned 8 house is same Mercury and Saturn do not have applying aspect with Mercury that means he will not die soon. Next, P/DEATH-trad. is on
06 ARI 46, ruler is Mars, again Saturn donot have applying aspect with it that means he will not die soon.
 

mdinaz

Well-known member
for god sake look at this and tell me it cannot be done?.


https://books.google.com/books?id=p...CQYQ6AEIHTAA#v=onepage&q=horary death&f=false
page 21


https://books.google.com/books?id=t...CQYQ6AEINjAE#v=onepage&q=horary death&f=false
page 402

https://books.google.com/books?id=D...D4KHfo3CQYQ6AEIRzAH#v=onepage&q=death&f=false

https://books.google.com/books?id=O...D4KHfo3CQYQ6AEIUjAJ#v=onepage&q=death&f=false
Chapter 9
page 93

don't argue without supporting evidence.. your opinion unfortunately doesnt matter when there are case after case in horary and natal astrology specifically that deals with when a person dies and how it will be.

T

Judas H. Priest. I can find just as many quotes that say it cannot. I don't quote what somebody else said to support my position. Souls have free will on everything. You can predict all day long that I'm going to be married this month and just to be a butt I'll stop the wedding to prove you wrong. People are nearly killed or even die every day and brought back to life by the doctors, while others narrowly miss being killed and walk away. The chart can only predict trends and possibilities. It cannot predict absolutes, and any astrologer that says it does is dangerous to his clients. Have a nice day.
 

tsmall

Premium Member
Just to toss it out there, this is the horary forum and maybe not the right place to have a debate about whether or not horary, or astrology in general, can predict death. :whistling:
 

tikana

Well-known member
Judas H. Priest. I can find just as many quotes that say it cannot. I don't quote what somebody else said to support my position. Souls have free will on everything. You can predict all day long that I'm going to be married this month and just to be a butt I'll stop the wedding to prove you wrong. People are nearly killed or even die every day and brought back to life by the doctors, while others narrowly miss being killed and walk away. The chart can only predict trends and possibilities. It cannot predict absolutes, and any astrologer that says it does is dangerous to his clients. Have a nice day.

William Lilly is not just random guy who wrote horary book neither is Anthony Louis or Raphael... and how many cases do you have to prove that death cannot be predicted in horary?
study horary .. write a paper or something then talk.
Argument statement : death cannot be predicted in horary
Here is why
at least 20 cases on the paper as an example... then we will talk.

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/weekly-horary/when-will-pope-die.php



:devil:
 
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rubyelixir

Well-known member
Their personality does not match their natal birth chart one bit - but fits their new chart (when they came out of a coma) perfectly. Every memory prior to the accident is gone. As far as I'm concerned, the natal chart is just your "default" position - if you don't evolve spiritually one bit, your life will indeed go along as your chart and transits indicate. But you can completely transcend your chart and make it irrelevant with the right ways of thinking and believing. If your life is set in stone by the chart, why bother (as seen from non-physical)?
wow interesting perspective, i like it
 

rubyelixir

Well-known member
i agree Fensii88, this is the way I was reading it. I just could not see a date. I spoke with the querent after I had posted this because I think the phrasing of the question is not easily answered with horary. She agreed however there is very good extenuating information in the chart to give some valuable information regarding the subject.
 

rubyelixir

Well-known member
He is not in a nursing home and family has already tried to care for him but he is hostile to family. (he always has been anyway only moreso now) He is unable to walk. So he is being cared for by a friend that is paid. Yes inheritence is a major part of it as he increasingly makes irrational decisions in regards to money. He allowed an estranged son to sue him for quite a large sum, for which he hired an incompetent lawyer represent him & this brother basically apsconded with his business reputation & money. The querent was given power of attorney recently however she does not wish to disrespect her father even though his rational thinking has basically disappeared. He is a delusional yet strong willed and egocentric individual. It is difficult to deal with him. Painful & heartbreaking at the same time. He is easy prey to con artists and flatterers but remains spiteful to those who truly do care for him. And I only see it getting worse.
 

tikana

Well-known member
He is not in a nursing home and family has already tried to care for him but he is hostile to family. (he always has been anyway only moreso now) He is unable to walk. So he is being cared for by a friend that is paid. Yes inheritence is a major part of it as he increasingly makes irrational decisions in regards to money. He allowed an estranged son to sue him for quite a large sum, for which he hired an incompetent lawyer represent him & this brother basically apsconded with his business reputation & money. The querent was given power of attorney recently however she does not wish to disrespect her father even though his rational thinking has basically disappeared. He is a delusional yet strong willed and egocentric individual. It is difficult to deal with him. Painful & heartbreaking at the same time. He is easy prey to con artists and flatterers but remains spiteful to those who truly do care for him. And I only see it getting worse.


that's just sad... i hear u ...
 
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