What is the astrological reason I do what I do?

astrop86

Well-known member
I find this thread a bit interesting, as I have no planets in my 8th or 10th houses, yet my 10th house is Gemini, ruled by Mercury, which is in my 11th house. This Mercury is also trined with Saturn, yet squared with Pluto. I find this mixup a bit intriguing, as I'm very good in science (am currently working on a paper to be published for scientific research), as well investigations and seeking the knowledge beneath the surface (which would normally seem to be a Mercury trine or sextile Pluto).

Could someone try to explain this apparent mixup to me?

[person posted in the middle of someone else's thread and gave no astrological interpretation so moved to Greenhorns Lounge - Moderator]
 
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waybread

Well-known member
It is hard to say without seeing the rest of your chart. Aquarius is often described as the sign of the scientist or inventor. Mercury trine Saturn sounds good for careful, analytical thinking. Virgo has a knack for this, also.
 

R4VEN

Well-known member
astrop86, waybread is right in saying that we can only surmise about the information you have given, since career choices involve so many influences which can only be examined if we see your chart.

Just using the information you've given, the two aspects to Mercury - i.e. trine Saturn and square Pluto - are in no way inconsistent.

Mercury trine Saturn is really good for any kind of mental activity which involves precision and details, and attention to detail. This would be good in any kind of mathematical or scientific activity.

And the Mercury square Pluto gives quite an obsessive and intense edge to the research - the need to know!!! - accompanied by the need to share with others what it is you have discovered.

My brother did mathematical research before he retired, and he has Mercury in quintile to Pluto - perhaps not as much a deep drive as a square, but it's still a drive. Towards retirement he joined a men's choral group. Someone asked him why it was that the musical scale in Western music was made up of musical distances which were unequal. He could have answered that satisfactorily in a couple of sentences, but no, he went home and wrote a 10-page paper on it, then handed out copies to the other members of the choral group. Typical Plutonian overkill!!!!
 

astrop86

Well-known member
Yeah, a mod must have split this thread off, as I remember putting this in another thread. Here is the natal chart:

Astro_NPT.gif
 

katydid

Well-known member
Your Mercury is in the 11th and aspects all of the outer planets. That could represent a fascination with the outer world and feeling a need to personally unlock it's mysteries. Mercury @ Zero degrees Leo is interesting in that Zero degrees is the purest essence of that sign.
So your curiousity could be aimed at the essence of Leo ;
Health, vitality, the heart, circulation, the body as a whole, the cell.

Mercury trine Jupiter and trine Saturn are a really good balance for a scientific mind. Jupiter gives one enthusiasm and a knack for hunches and lucky guesses, but the Saturn would force one to back it up with facts and data, and not be sloppy like Jupiter can sometimes be.
 

astrop86

Well-known member
Ah, I thought a square had always meant a challenging or difficult aspect, and had interpreted the Pluto square Mercury as having a difficult time communicating (which is sometimes true) and having a difficult time thinking and investigating (very untrue).

So explain to me how a square can actually be beneficial, as it supposedly is in this sense?
 
mercury.gif
square.gif
opposition.gif
pluto2.gif

Mercury square or opposition Pluto

[deleted overly-long quote of copyrighted text - Moderator]

Courtesy of http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/mercuryplutoaspects.html

When we look at squares we also look at the houses Scorpio rules ie;4th and Mercury rules Asc and MC. So from 11th house of large orgnisations, groups, friendships etc is square to Pluto in 3rd causing tension and poss too forceful speech on occasions that also affects the Asc & MC ie; the way you communicate and present yourself professionally. Sometimes we are not always aware of how 'we come over to others' and this square is capable of 'verbal lacerations' but you would/should know and use this sparingly...
 
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katydid

Well-known member
astrop86 said:
Ah, I thought a square had always meant a challenging or difficult aspect, and had interpreted the Pluto square Mercury as having a difficult time communicating (which is sometimes true) and having a difficult time thinking and investigating (very untrue).

So explain to me how a square can actually be beneficial, as it supposedly is in this sense?


It is beneficial because it is a 'challenge.' In other words, the square gives the mercury the incentive by challenging it to a duel so to speak. The friction involved in a square or opposition is more conducive to action than the trine which sometimes produces laziness or lack of concern.

I do not see it as having a difficult time investigating, but perhaps having to find a balance so one is not always suspicious, and investigating everyone for lack of trust in others.
 

astrop86

Well-known member
astrologer50 said:
mercury.gif
square.gif
opposition.gif
pluto2.gif

Mercury square or opposition Pluto
You are very incisive and aggressive with your opinions. You have a tendency towards fanaticism and often want to impose your ideas on others, sometimes in a subtle manner and sometimes more imperatively. You will find yourself attracted by the occult and other mysteries but it is recommended that you avoid those subjects because they can generate certain fixations or obsessiveness. You must learn to control your impatience and impulsiveness, to think things over before speaking, and to respect the weaknesses of others.
Alternate interpretation: Never satisfied with the face value of anything, you are always probing beneath the surface for deeper reasons and hidden motives - though you rarely reveal your own. You have a very suspicious, even paranoid, side. You mind is penetrating and deep and you have an aptitude for research, investigative reporting, or private investigation. You are keenly interested in the deeper aspects of the human psyche, with a sort of "x-ray vision" regarding the inner motivations and intentions of others. You are drawn to anything secret, hidden, or mysterious, and may pursue esoteric or occult studies. You are also a forceful and convincing speaker or writer, with the ability to influence peoples' thinking by the sheer power of your conviction.

Courtesy of http://www.cafeastrology.com/natal/mercuryplutoaspects.html

When we look at squares we also look at the houses Scorpio rules ie;4th and Mercury rules Asc and MC. So from 11th house of large orgnisations, groups, friendships etc is square to Pluto in 3rd causing tension and poss too forceful speech on occasions that also affects the Asc & MC ie; the way you communicate and present yourself professionally. Sometimes we are not always aware of how 'we come over to others' and this square is capable of 'verbal lacerations' but you would/should know and use this sparingly...

Fair enough, as most of that is true. I guess I was boxed in by thinking that the squares only presented hardship without any positive aspects.
 

gaer

Well-known member
astrop86 said:
Ah, I thought a square had always meant a challenging or difficult aspect, and had interpreted the Pluto square Mercury as having a difficult time communicating (which is sometimes true) and having a difficult time thinking and investigating (very untrue).

So explain to me how a square can actually be beneficial, as it supposedly is in this sense?
The idea that squares are "beneficial" is really an idea of context. From time to time I've seen charts for people where there are almost not difficult aspects, and many easy ones. It seems to me that such people tend to coast, to be too passive. Lazy may be the wrong word, and it's too much of a generalization.

People who have almost all squares, oppositions and conjunctions and very few "easy aspects" seem to lead difficult lives. Some triumph over obstacles that would defeat most people.

It is usually accepted that a reasonable mixture of easy and hard aspects is best, because there is enough "ease" to allow people to feel safe or protected in some areas of life in order to give them the energy or power to struggle against difficult obstacles in other parts of life.

So far it is hard for me to figure out exactly what you are trying to puzzle through. :)
 

astrop86

Well-known member
Honestly I'm not sure anymore what the original question was. I've had so many of my topics moved around that I can't even find them anymore, which means there is little chance of others finding them to help me learn. I can do my own studying on astrology, but it does help to have someone else to confirm along the way that I'm not making serious mistakes or coming up with things out of the blue.
 

astrop86

Well-known member
Mod - please delete this thread, as it seems to serve no purpose and has been confusing since it was split from another thread.
 

waybread

Well-known member
astrop86 said:
Mod - please delete this thread, as it seems to serve no purpose and has been confusing since it was split from another thread.

atrop86, my recollection is that this thread began with your question about why you should be good at doing science. I think you've gotten some decent feedback that may be of interest to other readers.
 

gaer

Well-known member
Sometimes threads take on a direction of their own. It's always a bit confusing when posts are moved, but I do think we have tried to answer questions. I was trying to get to the bottom of why Mercury square Pluto would be a problem for science, research, investigating, and so on.

In fact, that particular aspect would tend to point towards a rather "sharp" means of communication. That would in no way get in the way of any of the things you mentioned earlier, but it might mean that in discussions or communication others might perceive you as being a bit harsh, critical, or edgy.

The Saturn/Mercury trine is excellent for grounding. I believe that in traditional astrology both these planets are considered important for scientists, and the trine is an excellent aspect for this.

I find this thread a bit interesting, as I have no planets in my 8th or 10th houses, yet my 10th house is Gemini, ruled by Mercury, which is in my 11th house. This Mercury is also trined with Saturn, yet squared with Pluto. I find this mixup a bit intriguing, as I'm very good in science (am currently working on a paper to be published for scientific research), as well investigations and seeking the knowledge beneath the surface (which would normally seem to be a Mercury trine or sextile Pluto).

I believe your other point was about having no planets in the 8th or 10th houses. Were you looking (specifically) for comments about what it means to have Gemini on the MC and have the ruler of the 10th in the 11th? Are you thinking that this would in some way help or hinder you in a career?

Really, I think people have been trying to help.
 

wilsontc

Staff member
the original question, to astrop

astrop,

You asked:
astrop86 said:
Honestly I'm not sure anymore what the original question was.

This was the original question:
I have no planets in my 8th or 10th houses, yet my 10th house is Gemini, ruled by Mercury, which is in my 11th house. This Mercury is also trined with Saturn, yet squared with Pluto. I find this mixup a bit intriguing, as I'm very good in science (am currently working on a paper to be published for scientific research), as well investigations and seeking the knowledge beneath the surface (which would normally seem to be a Mercury trine or sextile Pluto). Could someone try to explain this apparent mixup to me?

I think the end result has been so far that no astrologer has thought of this as a "mixup" at all. The planets, houses, and aspects you describe and that we see in your chart fit in very well with both research and science.

Explaining the question,

Tim
 
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astrop86

Well-known member
gaer said:
I believe your other point was about having no planets in the 8th or 10th houses. Were you looking (specifically) for comments about what it means to have Gemini on the MC and have the ruler of the 10th in the 11th? Are you thinking that this would in some way help or hinder you in a career?

Really, I think people have been trying to help.

I believe I may have over-reacted a bit, I was just taken aback by having the thread moved around and then feeling like people were jumping on me for not always posting a chart.

As for the Gemini on the MC, the only "planets" I have in the 10th house is a Chiron conjunct Lilith. I realize Chiron is the wounded healer, but wouldn't Lilith cause some problems to make that worse?

Right now I am a bit worried about career, as well as finances (as so many other people are right now), as I just got accepted into graduate school, but its a big move for me (2600 miles in about 6 days of on/off driving) and its going to be a very big change for me. I guess a part of me is worried if I'll be okay, especially with the ocean always being a part of my life (Neptune in 4th), and now I'll be leaving for the mountains.

That stellium in Aquarius 6H isn't helping me much either, as I've already failed two tests in the past two weeks from all of the stress it is causing on me lately. It just feels like I can't keep up, and sadly this thing sticks around until June or so.
 

waybread

Well-known member
astrop86, the good news about graduate school is that (a) if you are not happy there, your degree program is only temporary. You will learn what you can, get your degree, and move on. (b) If you turn out to love the mountains, you may have the option to continue to live there. Failing tests suggests that it would be a great idea to talk to your prof/s or TA/s, if you have not already done so--chances are there is a mismatch between what you think is important and what they think is important.

Lilith is the "bad girl" of the zodiac. In a woman's chart, it may show where she is willing to break the rules. In a man's chart, it can show the kind of woman he most fears. But both sexes can swap these gendered identities.

And hey, as a scientist, the last thing you want to take home from astrology is a feeling of being anxious or superstitious about it. I think astrology works best as a tool for self-awareness, not as something to make us feel even more uncertain about our lives.
 

astrop86

Well-known member
waybread said:
And hey, as a scientist, the last thing you want to take home from astrology is a feeling of being anxious or superstitious about it. I think astrology works best as a tool for self-awareness, not as something to make us feel even more uncertain about our lives.

Hmm, and I felt like I was just starting to get to understand some of this and learn more about myself and others. Funny thing about dead ends. You don't know you're following one until you've reached it.
 

waybread

Well-known member
I have been studying astrology for 18 years, and very seldom have I felt that I have reached a dead end. There is always more to learn, and more questions to ask. But to paraphrase astrologer Steven Forrest, no planet is in our charts just to hurt us. I believe in a choice-centered astrology, in which people can develop empowering interpretations of their tough aspects. Every planet in my chart except Uranus is involved in an opposition or square. Thankfully, I learned astrology later in life, after most of it had actually turned out pretty well, nevertheless.
 
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