I would like to hear from others with this placement. How it manifest's in ur life/plays out. It isn't an easy placement but once there is the understanding of it's energy I think as time goes by it becomes easier to accept. It's indeed lonely at times, hidden away, shy (not behind closed doors, ofcourse). I have this in leo so does that make venus in her fall? And how is that determined? In vedic this is a great place for venus, but vedic to me is too grimm, fatalistic so I really don't read it much.