Towards the end of capitalism?


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Thanks for the video piercethevale.

Hmm, the snake-oil salesperson in the video reminds me of certain cell-phone agreements that people can't get out of without paying a huge wad of cash in the form of termination fees.

From what I've read about the 1950s, it sounded like a terrible time where authoritarianism and fear dominated America. And people didn't think enough about the consequences of DDT or tobacco, and holistic perspectives about daily life were lacking.

Yes, the US has a lot of cars. In fact there are too many cars, which is leading to traffic jams, the creation of too many impervious surfaces for parking lots (yes it can be permeable, but that would depend on the permeability of the soil beneath), intrusion into the spaces of other species (accidents involving deer etc.) and increasingly stringent parking laws because it's becoming more difficult to share the road between motorists (and the government wants to make money out of parking tickets). Sub-production is like being skinny, sufficient production (with reserves in the event of an emergency to ensure abundance) is like having a balanced body and overproduction is like obesity (which is what is promoted by the concept of infinite material economy requiring constant production with GDP indicators is unsound.).

Planned obsolescence is disgusting, and I think that if an update is needed to make a car perform better, pollute less, or even drive itself, people should be able to insert that update into their current car without having to buy a whole new one.

Interestingly enough, the losses of freedom suffered by the characters remind me of "communist dictatorship in the eyes of the West", but it also reminds me of the censorship and tyranny that exists in corporatism. Mike Gravel (he wasn't perfect, but he had one or two really good ideas, and this is an element of unfairness I have to mention) got excluded from some of the debates in 2008 because he challenged the profits of the military-industrial complex that fuels the revenues of the democratic party and MSNBC/General Electric. Something's very wrong when non-corporate voices are smeared or ridiculed to avoid being heard because Mike Gravel wasn't the only case. Third parties and independents who don't resort to getting conflicting campaign contributions/bribes struggle with ballot access, and it's an uphill struggle for the green party etc.

Plus too many employees think one thing, but are forced to oppose their convictions in order to keep a job.

Well, a lot of people did get conned by counter-reformationist Reaganism for the last 30 years (his name is being put on buildings and he has statues, but I think he will end up in the dustbin of history just like Stalin), and when I had the foresight to warn that Obama was no different than Bush, nobody listened to me until 2010, and even now...-_-

In some ways, Americans do have freedom, but not as much as has been claimed by the video, and the 4th amendment has been considerably eroded. Plus if people cannot speak up about problems that bump heads with corporate interests and profits without facing libel or intimidation, then the US is not a free country. Be careful of conmen, but don't push away people with genuine solutions either.

A lot of people are cynical about the way things are, but they do not trust people with real solutions sometimes because of the way the 1% media slanders anti-establishment people. No wonder the American people sometimes feel despondent!

And realistically, people need to be able to initiate their own projects without having to borrow money from other people. It's another gamble just like anything else in a wall-street based system because the sad part is that not every wonderful innovation or individual initiative is financially cost-effective, and even if it is, people can't buy stuff all the time without waste-inducing advertising (consumerism is promoted by manipulative advertising). If you have ever played the game Monopoly, you will realize that once powerful economic players are established, newcomers cannot promote their ideas as much, even with anti-trust laws that have been reduced to meaninglessness. Innovation shouldn't be limited by a monetary budget, but rather by a natural resource budget. If an innovation pollutes too much, a lighter design should be considered.

I am aware of the contradiction between the conservative sun in Cancer and the idealistic (at best idealistic, at worst hypocritical) ascendant of Sagittarius in America's chart, but I want to try to bring the best of those aspects.

The solutions I have developed result from my work experience (I had a short stint in a small business, I've been working in the non-profit world, and I may spend some time in government) and my scientific, geological and ecological background. Usually I'm the type of person who is skeptical unless I am confident an idea can work and can last. I don't think in -ism, I just combine the mindset I apply in science with a sense of ethics. I have mercury sextile saturn and mercury sextile uranus.

I don't know if you follow my Sabian threads...but do you know about Obamas Part of Catastrophe [1st degree of Pisces...Sabian Symbol for 'Commerce'/the Economy and his Part of Imprisonment {also Amy Winehouse's Part of Imprisonment...savy?....and No,I don't believe it is just some odd coincidence,]...and also my Part of Inheritance/Legacy 19th degree of Pisces Sabian symbol: "A Master Instructs His Disciple{s}]..if not you should look those two threads up that I have in the degree symbols forum...[I said 'NAY' from day one...and all my old...too **** liberal for their own good ..and too stubborn to admit a mistake still profess a belief in the Obamanation...[and, alas...yesterday Bernie Sanders said to forget about trying to petition Him to run.]

...the Part of Imprisonment has shown itself to be symbolically 'That' which is kept from us...


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I had a look at the Sabian Symbols you've highlighted piercethevale. Wow, I see I have a lot to learn about Arabic Parts. I only knew about the Part of Fortune, and I did come across Sabian degrees with

What are the most important Arabic parts to look at?


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Also, as to Obama [and this is getting off topic but I feel I must now include it as I did mention His Part of Imprisonment] is his Part of [as I call it] Innocence...but which is presently called either Part of Disputes or the Part of Lawsuits [see my thread in the Degree Symbol forum; 'Astrological Parts, Known and Unknown. A Project' for more on that... ]
is 27* Sagit. 47'...which happens to be the Part of Tragedy/Fatality for the chart I have proposed is that of Jesus/Yeshua [From Rudhyars book on the Sabian Symbols]
[Rudhyar's Keywords] THE BEAUTIFUL NECESSITY." it is said that by becoming the Christ that Jesus became the bridge to the 'Father' or 'God'...and I've interpreted this to mean that the symbolism of the 'Tragedy' of the 'Fatality' of Jesus is a "Beautiful Necessity" in that he became the 'Bridge'.
Thus what I'm implying here is that Obama disputes this [or is innocent of understanding it]...along with not being able to embrace the 'Teachings' [His Part of Imprisonment] to me clearly gives evidence that He is not an apostate...but rather an 'Impostor'.
...and goes along with what is presented in an Alex Jones video about Obama having been cleverly picked and groomed for a most complex and insidious scheme. As to what he has demonstrated in office for 3 years now...I'd say I have to agree with Alex Jones.



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My original intent to post on this thread today [as I did get sidetracked into adding the post above...and I do apologize for getting off topic...but I wanted to be clear as to my obvious distrust of the man]

An interesting blog, titled; "The Four Companies That Control the 147 Companies That Own Everything."

If they are all puppets then all Presidents are suspect - electing a new President changes nothing - non-suspect presidents are promptly assassinated :smile:

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I had a look at the Sabian Symbols you've highlighted piercethevale. Wow, I see I have a lot to learn about Arabic Parts. I only knew about the Part of Fortune, and I did come across Sabian degrees with

What are the most important Arabic parts to look at?

Might I suggest my thread on Arabic Parts and the Sabians here
there is a thread on this in the degree forum but I deleted a great deal of it awhile back when i was in a 'pissy' mood and intended to leave this forum for good.
The are additional threads at of mine on Sabians and the Arabic the Sabian sub forum and the prediction forum, which you might also find of interest as you obviously seem to be interested in mundane astrology:

...thanks for both the interest and the compliment :happy:


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that's just a little too general a statement...I certainly wouldn't include Washington, Jefferson, Madison or Jackson as puppets ... after Kennedy we have been subjugated to nothing but puppets in my estimation ...and Kennedy is said to have supposed to have been one...or one, 'THEY' figured, that could be easily manipulated and or controlled....but proved otherwise and that's why he WAS assassinated...and THEY have been more careful ever since as to ensure that a President is in 'Their back pocket'...


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One thing is for sure. Evilution is based on self preservation and elimination of your competition. This is the primary force behind greed. Some people are just motivated to take everything for themselves, and, unfortunately, mother nature is on their side. Competitive people will always ruin it for people that want to live a humble life.

For the entire human race to divorce itself from this competitive natural force would quit extraordinary... a first for life on this planet. Until then, plutocracy will always be part of any government because life is just a competitive elimination sport that everyone must play in. The winners always take a bigger share, even in the pseudo socialist societies we have already seen.

I do agree that corruption of free enterprise and free markets have ramped up and gone from secrecy to open policy. Officials don't even care to hide the fact that they are screwing the broader public to protect their plutocratic supporters. They even talk like they're entitled to this because of their "official" position. They've gotten crazy brazen since the 2008 financial meltdown. All attributed to Pluto in Capricorn.


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Although the "planet" discovered in 1930, but demoted in 2006: Pluto is the herald of death, depression and despair to some, if not all living things and institutions like governments.

The United States founded in 1776, will encounter a 248th year debacle when Pluto is in the same position it was on July 4th that year, nearly the quarter of a millennium of independence.

At the time the continental congress met, the Moon like Pluto was in Aquarius (I believe, but might be wrong) while the Sun was in Cancer and something about the influence of Mars for a nation devoted to peace only to fight war if justified: the policy fit for a Cancerian-Aquarian republic.

Our founding fathers held a keen interest in astrology and found powerful significance to (by coincidence, who knows?) when exactly to declare independence in Philadelphia sits exactly on the 40 North Latitude, 75 West Longitude...and where the city's location or delination is more coincidental.


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This thread has a lot of interesting and intelligent discussions, and I tried to read through everyone's opinions.

I just want to say that while everyone can recognize all the different problems around us, we may not be attributing the true causes to the problems.

I had always been a "socialist" because I care about the other poor souls who cannot afford to eat or live in a proper conditions. It's not until I started to read the writings by Martin Armstrong that I realize that things are actually so much more complicate than what they appear. I have tentatively become a pro-capitalist, because I realize that the current problems in our society are not really caused by capitalism, but rather on how governments are run.

I believe whenever there is a concentration of money or power (such as government), it can do great things, but can also do really bad things. We need some sort of free competitions or mechanisms to break up the bad ones that grab and hold onto the resources, and re-form better ones. We have capitalism for corporations, but unfortunately, I must say that democracy is very poor in breaking up a bad conglomerate of government.

The other things that I've recognized is that even in democracy, where the decisions are made by the majority, majority is simply not always right. In human nature, we have both elements from God and animals. We can sometimes act like an insane mob, and vote to put Socrates to death. Mob, while being the majority, is not always right. And sorry, I must also say that the historical intelligence of average citizens in respect to politics is not very high.

In the upcoming breakdownn of the society, we badly need some great leader and great thinker. Not only the ideas need to be right, but also the actual implementation of the governmental policies need to be efficient and fair. More often than not, it's the actual imperfect implementation that causes all the injustices and corruption, and I can already see that the internet boom was for a reason, and it needs to be highly incorporated into the next form of government implementation for instant feedbacks to correct any implementation mistakes.

The Utopian vision held by the socialistic humanists are great only in vision. However, it's truly the capitalisim that bring more of the scientific and industrial advances in our society.

Neptune (liquid/oil) is going out of Pisces, and the oil-based economy is probably going to come to an end. Based on Armstrong's economic cycle, the "great" depression would be coming after about 2032. We badly need someone or some group of thinkers to lay the foundation of the next Aquarian age. It's always much easier to place blames than coming up with an actual functional solution. Let us all take a step back and think clearly.


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[an excerpt from another post I wrote at another thread]

The gist of the whole situation is that until we end this oligarchy that imposes crass consumerism and capitalism for elitist greed and there after empower local economies, businesses and manufacturing of goods... [dis entangle our Federal gov't from, both, foreign Banks and mercenary capitalists and greatly reduce its size and limit its powers and eliminate most of those taxes...Nationalize all Foreign interests and all natural resources....end the private oil industry and thus free energy technologies now being withheld from the public and begin funding those alternative energy technologies that have been inhibited from being researched and developed...] ...this misery will continue because the same government will continue in the USA as we presently have and it will get more oppressive and destructive of personal freedom and rights...because the same Rich elitists will still be in control with their agendas of out doing one another for wealth and prestige at the expense and health of the 98% of the rest of the people.
To continue on as we are?...This will only end in exactly that kind of Armageddon that some Christians say is prophesied in the New Testament. ... or the NWO that the conspiratorialists say is going to occur...and the enslavement of most of humanity.


Eternal, it does my head in. Ever since we were having this credit crunch in the uk, I looked around and nothing much had changed really. I think the USA had it bad with all those people losing their homes, in the UK its not been the same. I just wonder where trillions and gazzillions of dollars went. If people have the power to rule and dictate they should also be responsible. They were not.

Its not a right world when children die of hunger daily whilst a few miles away rich women are getting diamonds put on their pooches nails.