Scorpios and the psychology of revenge

ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
One more thing (random): I think the scorpio energy, wether in the natal or in someon you know can teach you not to be victimised. I for one never allow my friends to think of themselves as victims, and if you have a scorpio in your life that seems to rule you life like it is their own I think it is time for you to learn to take charge and not be the victim.

The scorpio involved would at the very least respect you if you respectfully disallow them to rule your life...
 

natasa812

Well-known member
Sagmoon said:
..I feel so brave today.

I had once slapped a man. He cheated on me with my friend. I regreted that i did it, ever since...:(

S

Dear Sagmoon, feel brave everyday and dont regret for the past since it is not comming back. You can forgive yourself and what he did was terrible.
Best regards
Natasa
 

natasa812

Well-known member
ScorpiosRock said:
One more thing (random): I think the scorpio energy, wether in the natal or in someon you know can teach you not to be victimised. I for one never allow my friends to think of themselves as victims, and if you have a scorpio in your life that seems to rule you life like it is their own I think it is time for you to learn to take charge and not be the victim.

For some reason, I foud this very true. There is something harismatic about the sign indeed...
Best regards
Natasa
 

OctGirl

Well-known member
dog8818 said:
I'm pretty sure I didn't coin the phrase, so please, go ahead.

One more thing on what brings out the "revenge" desire in me: betrayal. As a scorpio moon I am very, very loyal. If someone that I've been loyal to does not give me the same benefit, it's hard for me to just say "oh well, that's life". I brood about it, usually for way too long that is healthy. Sometimes it's been years of brooding. How boring is that? That's when I know I've swallowed my own poison.

How well said!

I am not Scorpio Sun / Moon / AC but I have Sun conj Pluto in Libra and Venus in Scorpio. And I can related to this so well. I go to extremes for people I love and love them too deeply but when I discover the other person is not capable of that intensity or loyalty or not willing to bestow on you - heart breaks and its so hard to overcome that sense of betrayal. I fight almost years but its kind of repulsion built up hard to break.

I am in an intense relationship with a strong Scorpio Sun + Merc. Some times all the intensity is so much - I feel it is two Scorpios fighting, my Libran tendencies are gone. Like - you inflicted pain on me, I will not leave you without tasting what you made me suffer. Add to it, my Mars in Libra - justice at any cost :( It goes on and on till I finally say am tired of it all - no resolutions and he never backs from his stance. But Scorpios are so sensitive and insecure I feel I should be more liberal with him and his pride and make peace and I give up.

Ha... how I wish I never met a Scorpio nor fell in love with him. I never imagined I had these kind of emotions he invokes in me or I should have run from him at first danger signal.

We are on the verge of break up (I wish no more making up) and I never felt I will take revenge nor he will take on me.
 

R4VEN

Well-known member
ScorpiosRock said:
Scorpio and revenge:
After you went through all that trouble of outlasting/ignoring the sting, knowing better because you know scorpios as a subject, the next phase will soon come into place. This is after you've gained their trust and respect:

The scorpio will try to some extent to reshape/teach/train you to reach his standards/agree with his view/do it the way he likes it. Here comes a lot of problems, especially if you've held out for so long and now you're constantly told you're at fault.

Seeing as the scorpio is trusting you at this stage he becomes slightly if not excessivly vindictive if you don't dance to his playlist. He at least thought you were going to....
The second paragraph quoted above gives me deep insight into this Scorpio behaviour. Particularly a person with Scorpio and Libra prominent in their chart will see this behaviour - almost of `retraining' or `reprogramming' another as a gift to the object of their `retraining' - weird!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (and scary, too)

This explains a lot.

Thanks, ScorpiosRock
 

ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
R4VEN said:
The second paragraph quoted above gives me deep insight into this Scorpio behaviour. Particularly a person with Scorpio and Libra prominent in their chart will see this behaviour - almost of `retraining' or `reprogramming' another as a gift to the object of their `retraining' - weird!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (and scary, too)

This explains a lot.

Thanks, ScorpiosRock
Hon, I live with a Libra girl. She has me, her mom/dog/boyfriend/sister and a few other prominent people in her life who is scorpio. Believe me I know libra scorpio dynamic. I don't think that libra itself will be the retrainer, but as the prequal to scorpio they tend to be easily trained by scorpio.

(I have libra and scorpio prominent in my chart - oops)
 

OctGirl

Well-known member
ScorpiosRock said:
Hon, I live with a Libra girl. She has me, her mom/dog/boyfriend/sister and a few other prominent people in her life who is scorpio. Believe me I know libra scorpio dynamic. I don't think that libra itself will be the retrainer, but as the prequal to scorpio they tend to be easily trained by scorpio.

(I have libra and scorpio prominent in my chart - oops)

That's wierd. I am a Libran (with some Scorpio in my chart) and I am with a Scorpio. I would say the whole issue is neither will let the other train or retrain or even ready to listen to the other person (that's what is polarising I guess).

Even with a strong Scorp, Libs are not that gullible nor do they bend easily - they just appear to be so for that moment - to gain peace. I can never give up fully on anything unless my point is well taken (or ill taken ;)). Prob with Libs (I have seen me, my sis, my mom and my bro in law and a few more Libs) is they think they are right and they are usually - it just takes a while for Scorps (or others) to admit :D

I am not saying they wont hit off - I guess this kind of intense bonding I would not have with any other sign - neighbors get along well in this case.
 
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ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
OctGirl said:
That's wierd. I am a Libran (with some Scorpio in my chart) and I am with a Scorpio. I would say the whole issue is neither will let the other train or retrain or even ready to listen to the other person (that's what is polarising I guess).

Even with a strong Scorp, Libs are not that gullible nor do they bend easily - they just appear to be so for that moment - to gain peace. I can never give up fully on anything unless my point is well taken (or ill taken ;)). Prob with Libs (I have seen me, my sis, my mom and my bro in law and a few more Libs) is they think they are right and they are usually - it just takes a while for Scorps (or others) to admit :D

I am not saying they wont hit off - I guess this kind of intense bonding I would not have with any other sign - neighbors get along well in this case.
I hope the fact that you and I start this debate will be a good example of the Libra/Scorpio dynamic. The fact that you argued my point is beautiful and I have to say that the Libra in me agrees with you as well as myself in the following ways: Libras are strong and not gullible especially when it comes to their principles. However I'd have to say that the dynamic I presented here is more of one sign admiring or striving to be (maybe subconsciously) like it subsequent sign. If the scorpio is adament enough the libra's bending (to keep the peace) become like being stuck in a permanent yoga posture. Remember water is patient/persisstant (think chinese water torture :))

I have noted that for some reason October Scorpios are way more leanient when it comes to the Scorpio-basic-instinct to take immediate control than November Scorpios (they appear waaay nicer/un-typical scorpio-like).

See, now you made me lose my train of thought, please help me regain it :).

PS: Scorpios that admit they are wrong are golden, don't ever let them go...
 

OctGirl

Well-known member
I am curious to peep into a Scorpio mind - what exactly makes them so insecure and vulnerable. All of us are vulnerable to pain - we fall down once, we get up and be a little careful next time and go on but why does a Scorpio feel so insecure about walking itself after the little fall? Why are they so extremely sensitive that they will have to sting even people they love - when ever they sense a remote possibility of getting hurt?
 

ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
OctGirl said:
I am curious to peep into a Scorpio mind - what exactly makes them so insecure and vulnerable. All of us are vulnerable to pain - we fall down once, we get up and be a little careful next time and go on but why does a Scorpio feel so insecure about walking itself after the little fall? Why are they so extremely sensitive that they will have to sting even people they love - when ever they sense a remote possibility of getting hurt?
In younger days or as children we are actually created as very sensitive beings. Little things hurt us deeply. We develop a do it again and die attitude to protect our very open/perceptive/sensitive nature.

The irony of the scorpion is being so affected and not being able to look as affected. Many of the books I've read on the social history of the scorpio indicates being resented/ignored/discouraged as a child, from here we can see the phoenix rising in this very determined being. Thus this person kind of dies emotionaly quite early in his life, then he needs to pick himself up and fly. This is where the scorpion's tendency to only do things for himself comes from/loyalty to the self standing first in the line of importance... (beautiful don't you think - epic-ish)

If a scorpio ever allows you his true trust and talks about what he remembers from his childhood he will tell you about hardship or claim not to remember much.

Apparently scorpios tends to be born into their families at a very tough time for the family, this causes the above mentioned resented feeling.

Another interrestin fact surrounding scorpios time of birth is it is often within a two year radius of a death in the family and this often reappears when a scorpio dies, another member is added to the family...

Hope this helps, know its incomplete so please debate.
 

OctGirl

Well-known member
Makes sense. But the person I know, he confides in me what he felt hurt in his childhood, I surely understand his pain and feel for him. But strange thing is I faced more humiliating experiences - from people I trusted as an innocent kid (even sexual molestation) and I did not get as sensitive or insensitive.

And most of our insecurities have strong base in the way parents treat us. But if an Aries kid is treated that way he will throw a tantrum, if a Leo is neglected he may pout, as a Lib kid I got hurt and may be tried to analyse why my parents did that but we do get over these things when we grow up.

Even when I am hurt with this guy I don't feel like saying hurtful things because he takes them to heart so much. Shows there is lack of positive trust others love him, they will hurt him but is that insecurity not giving away power to some one else? Making them or their words more important than your self esteem - may be this is Libran idealistic notions speaking. I feel for Scorpios for their sensitive natures - it must be so hard to protect yourself all the time from hurt. Its easier to let some one hurt you and get over it thinking your sense of self is more important than their view of you.
 

R4VEN

Well-known member
What I meant in my last post (and I didn't explain it clearly enough) is that the most `successful' retrainers/reprogrammers tend to be those with liberal doses of both Scorpio & Libra energy.

I know of two different people who are Libran with very strong Scorpio energy (eg. Mars, Moon or ASC) and they use the Libran energy of easy words to do the dirty work of the Scorpio desire to reprogam. At least, one still does, and the other is far more self-aware.
 

ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
OctGirl said:
But strange thing is I faced more humiliating experiences - from people I trusted as an innocent kid (even sexual molestation) and I did not get as sensitive or insensitive.
You have to remember your predisposition differs as an air sign. Water signs are emotion based, what we feel is what we are. We don't rationalize first, we feel first. Air signs is what they think and communicate. I have read that Libras also sometimes gets sexualized at an too early age, this is true for scorpio as well.

Remember that different signs will take the same life experience in different ways. Just think about having a baby or being a social worker, being a pet owner, being abused. It goes to where our predisposition of the sun sign can take it (as well as the rest of the chart).

Just realized after typing all this you actually agree with me. What is done is done.
 
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ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
R4VEN said:
What I meant in my last post (and I didn't explain it clearly enough) is that the most `successful' retrainers/reprogrammers tend to be those with liberal doses of both Scorpio & Libra energy.

I know of two different people who are Libran with very strong Scorpio energy (eg. Mars, Moon or ASC) and they use the Libran energy of easy words to do the dirty work of the Scorpio desire to reprogam. At least, one still does, and the other is far more self-aware.
I agree with this. My chart ruler/saturn is in Scorpio together with my sun and pluto. I also have both mars and venus in Libra in the tenth house.

I am usually at least able to see how people are affecting other by being who they themselves are as well as what they are telling other people to be. Luckily with venus ruling my mars and my sun being in society-loving 11th house I'm also able to keep tabs on when it would be too easy to bend someone's opinion. I believe in free speech/freedom/contentment and the individual.
 

scorpileo

Member
Leon said:
I have the Sun, Mercury, Mars, and Pluto all in Scorpio. I'm not a vengeful person at all.

Me too but I do use revenge alot as i have alrady said, it could be that mars is too strong and i think i have a fixed grand cross.
 

scorpileo

Member
waybread said:
Far be it from me to limit Scorpionic true self-expression, but just a couple of thoughts.

(1) Surely everyone here has gotten really annoyed at someone who (seemingly) treated us shamefully--only to find that we were mistaken about that person.

(2) Or that the fall-out of the verfiable shabby treatment (such as getting dumped by a BF/GF, getting fired from a job) actually led to a much better outcome? (Like finding a better partner, or getting a better job.) Under such circumstances, the bad partner or evil boss may actually be doing us a favour.

(3) Karma. So many times I've thought badly about someone, only to find myself doing the same thing myself. Or I have contemplated some kind of revenge, only to find out later (when thankfully I didn't do it) that it would have harmed me just as much.

I think sometimes revenge or demanding one's rights at any cost can be counter-productive. I have a neighbour who charged a local utility provider with mishandling their funds. To make her point, she stopped paying a portion of her bills. They shut off her utility. It's still off. She also got embroiled in a dispute with the local bus driver and bus company. Now the bus driver refuses to pick her up--his preorogative for disruptive passengers--and she has no transportation any more.

Physical revenge is generally called assault. It is illegal. I realize there are tough places where it may be necessary. But if it is not in immediate self-defense, "physical conflicts" can land you in jail. Then who gets harmed the most?

i only engage in phyical conflicts when i have to or when mars gets the better of me and then i seek revenge in an arien manner, there and then and normaly in self defence.

verbal conflicts are my norm.
 

ScorpiosRock

Well-known member
Jenna Jupiter said:
There is something stubborn with revenge.
Some Aquarius/Leo/Scorpio/Taurus i would look at for the most stubborn revenge.

Maybe 11th house placements (for persistance), but Aquarius is way to humanitarian as well as future orientated to hold on to vengeance. Aquarius's basic mindset is the now and the furture as well as letting go of the unneeded. Stubborn in principle, not grudging. (Sorry for saying this in about fifty different ways)

Leos as well is to open and instant to really get to real vengeance. Retaliation being blunt, open and honest, not really planned (vengeance suggests some strategy).

I can't disagree with Taurus as I do believe that revenge is a feminine principle, so to put it by element I'll go for earth and water, the elements with the longest memories.
 

gaer

Well-known member
Jenna Jupiter said:
I think revenge is something quite Saturn/Capricorn.
I think every astrological archetype is equally likely to indulge in revenge—or not. What changes from one to another is the *way* in which revenge is carried out. Also, each archetype is likely to define revenge differently.

For example (and this is very general and simplistic), Aries might get revenge immediately. Scorpio might take a very long time, plotting exactly the best time and place to get even. And so on.
 

waybread

Well-known member
Just to put in a plug for Aquarians (!)--I have sometimes contemplated revenge when I have felt deeply wronged, but I am a great believer that "what goes around, comes around." What you give out is what you get back, multiplied. This kind of limits any serious revenge I might contemplate.

Also, Aquarians are more likely simply to withdraw from a tense situation. This gives the sign the reputation of being indifferent or aloof, but actually it is a realization that sometimes simply taking oneself away from a bad situation is the best way to deal with it.

Revenge, to the avenger, sometimes seems only like getting justice where justice is due. But sometimes no justice will ever be forthcoming, or the avenger is simply mistaken about the circumstances. I have actually seen a few people (one Scorpio, for sure) actually destroy themselves in the process of trying to implement a system that seemed more just to them.
 
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