Refuse your "lessons"

RuledbySaturn

Well-known member
Have you ever thought of this or tried this: Let's say you know what lessons you are here to learn by looking at your birth chart or just by living life (because the same "lessons" usually keep appearing). Have you ever thought of the idea that you have the right to say NO to any "lessons" you do not wish to learn?

For example, I am a Capricorn, say one of my lessons is to learn patience. And say I tell the Universe, "No, I am here to have fun. I refuse to learn patience. Save that for someone else..."

My opinion is that we have the right to say No. If you've tried it, maybe you'd like to share your findings?
 

gaer

Well-known member
Have you ever thought of this or tried this: Let's say you know what lessons you are here to learn by looking at your birth chart or just by living life (because the same "lessons" usually keep appearing). Have you ever thought of the idea that you have the right to say NO to any "lessons" you do not wish to learn?

For example, I am a Capricorn, say one of my lessons is to learn patience. And say I tell the Universe, "No, I am here to have fun. I refuse to learn patience. Save that for someone else..."

My opinion is that we have the right to say No. If you've tried it, maybe you'd like to share your findings?
It doesn't work. If you are here to learn a lesson and you refuse to, it always comes back again and again and again until you listen.

I'd be shocked if anyone else here has had different experiences. :)
 

katydid

Well-known member
Sure, as long as you like living on the Earth, you can just keep refusing your earthly lessons, that way you know you will keep coming back here. It may be harder to learn those lessons of patience when you are a fly though....jjust kidding
 

RuledbySaturn

Well-known member
I will not have to come back to Earth again because I've already worked hard and accomplished many things. They cannot force me because I've not met one successful business person in my life who does not have the power to override the planets and get what they want. They can not override my freewill. They never did. They just protect me silently.
 

aquarius7000

Well-known member
Hi,

This can be seen as a very vast topic which digs deep into the realms of Karma Astrology. In brief though, I too think that lessons that need to be learned keep coming back to you in the shape of different circumstances and through different people till they have been 'worked off' by you. I also feel that our unconscious self is always aware of this, but the conscious self may be led a bit astray in the world around us and refuse to work 'with' the soul/the unconscious self. That is when we may feel this inner tension and are, at all, aware that we "can or want to say no", that the choice exists. It is all a part of internal growth and evolution. For instance, I repeatedly encounter the theme of Nep-Ven square in relationships, and I know that there is a reason, a message behind it.

Btw, a thread along similar lines was recently started by Mayin in the 'Spiritual Realm' section: recurrent theme.

:)AQ7
 
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dreamtimez

Well-known member
This relates to the law of karma :smile: You keeping coming back to earth, evolving, learning your lessons. When you have learnt all your lessons you achieve nirvana ... freedom from the cycle of birth and death.
 

RuledbySaturn

Well-known member
My clever idea was this: If someone keeps encountering issues in the love department for example, he/she can certain say: "From now on I stay single..." Therefore no more love issues because they won't ever be putting themselves in those situations where the Universe has any opportunities to throw them lessons. Speaking from personal experience, once you stop caring or wanting, the Universe has no power over you.
 

katydid

Well-known member
My clever idea was this: If someone keeps encountering issues in the love department for example, he/she can certain say: "From now on I stay single..." Therefore no more love issues because they won't ever be putting themselves in those situations where the Universe has any opportunities to throw them lessons. Speaking from personal experience, once you stop caring or wanting, the Universe has no power over you.

But isn't that a little like 'cutting off your nose, to spite your face.'?
I mean, the lessons of love are hard, and the potential pain is annoying and difficult, but it is better to have loved and lost then to never have loved at all, imo.
Staying single does not really solve anything, it just brings on loneliness and isolation, and prevents one from getting their lovin. :bandit::love:
 
haha.... I love the idea!

Yet, I have to agree with what katydid says.... if we use your same example of love, is it really living, not to experience it?

Maybe we need to learn in what AREA of love we choose to say No. For me, it would be to hold something back for myself, so, even with a broken heart, I know what lesson I kept missing, and kept going for guys who take, take and take.

I believe my lesson here is to hold back until I meet someone who also wants to give in a healthy way.

Just my thoughts.... :whistling:
 

Rasalhague

Well-known member
Have you ever thought of this or tried this: Let's say you know what lessons you are here to learn by looking at your birth chart or just by living life (because the same "lessons" usually keep appearing). Have you ever thought of the idea that you have the right to say NO to any "lessons" you do not wish to learn?

For example, I am a Capricorn, say one of my lessons is to learn patience. And say I tell the Universe, "No, I am here to have fun. I refuse to learn patience. Save that for someone else..."

My opinion is that we have the right to say No. If you've tried it, maybe you'd like to share your findings?

In the end I think it's how "refusing" or "accepting" a lesson is interpreted. Is it the immediate thing you're feeling that you need to conform to, or is it something you need to get smarter on without conforming to that immediate feeling?

The lessons I got offered and "refused" (and why):

- "Don't poke people where it hurts". I always got pulled back no the leash for that one. So frantically I researched and critically examined what it was I said and why that would hurt them. There were only a few times I saw that something was not wise, but often times I would come to the conclusion they were taking offense on something that could only be traced back to ego matters like jealousy, not acknowledging their own weakness and so on. So now, when I feel this lesson coming on and I know it can be traced back to ego matters I do not back down. Instead I hope these people poison themselves hating me; so hopefully the light will go on some day for them.

- "Know your place". This one really took the life out of me to figure out. Since in some situations it felt like the entire society was 'against' me, telling me to 'know my place'. I identified which rules I was not respecting only to form my own opinion about these rules. Some rules I understood to be important they be respected, other rules were applied unequally to young/old, female/male, this person/that person. I decided then and there that I wasn't going to know my place when the rules were only applying to subgroups or minorities and not everyone. Quite frankly, I hope that when I do not know my place, I shake up things well enough to break through the dogma.

- "Fit in better". This one is also partly 'know your place', though a little different. It's the result of defying 'know your place' and 'don't poke where it hurts'. You start feeling the pressure of missing out on things other people seem to be having. The answer so I figured out: it's the result of doing what is justified instead of doing what is accepted [but has no sufficient justification]. You will have to come to terms with the fact that there's no way you can avoid feeling lonely. Virgo/Cappy, sit on the mountain you just climbed but don't forget to smile at the theater going on in the valley (so I thought).

The lesson patience is pretty much the same. Take every scenario where you feel 'you're getting patience pushed onto yourself' and ask yourself as objectively as is possible if that is a justified request. Push on if it isn't justified, stand back when there's good reason to be patient. Reverse the tables on yourself.

It's not always "the path of the least resistance". It just depends on what's more important to you: justice or fitting in, just make sure it isn't only pride that makes you act 'contra'. When you do it for the right reasons, there's nothing to regret.

This is the essence for children of Saturn and Uranus. This is a way of succesfully learning a lesson for them. Not in the how many ways I can count to avoid a situation from repeating on itself. It's something I see forgotten a lot in the astrology community, which I regret and why I speak up.

Edit: As for the comments on love; people that "refuse", I'm sorry: don't avoid to tackle problems by fetching the horns, are just as capable and worthy of love. Their ardent nature makes them seem frightening or cold in the eyes of others; see paragraph 'Fitting in'. When it comes to this, our lesson as children of Saturn and Uranus is to learn to recognize who is not afraid to climb the mountain and enjoy the view together. By now I also know that it takes an enormous courage to do so and I come to understand it's not for everyone. Just like this lifestyle isn't for everyone.

I will not have to come back to Earth again because I've already worked hard and accomplished many things. They cannot force me because I've not met one successful business person in my life who does not have the power to override the planets and get what they want. They can not override my freewill. They never did. They just protect me silently.
It's nice to meet you!
 
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Steeler

Well-known member
Once you've fallen in to the trap of reincarnation, you can just wait till you die again so that you can walk away from the light and go somewhere else. They can't force you and they know it, but they can manipulate you with their warm light and love, which I believe is an utter illusion, because they NEED us to keep coming back because they get their energy from us. I know this sounds insane, but I've been through my Kundalini awakening and have realised that the world is nothing but an illusion, which means the astral planes and the beings there too, but someone SOMEWHERE is abusing this fact and using it as a way to drain our own soul-energy away from us, which just keeps happening over and over again.

In my case I have so many different examples of Karma coming back to me that there is no question whatsoever that it wouldn't exist, but I do wonder what kind of GOD would want us to reincarnate here 10000000 times just to learn ONE lesson?
That's not my god, because I know I am already a perfect being and so is everyone else on this planet.
We've just been fooled for energy reasons to think otherwise.

So can you avoid your lessons? Yes. Stop reincarnating, walk away.
Hindus believe reincarnation is a trap, some Buddhist too...So it's not just me who sees this, so the whole point of NIRVANA or awakening, is so that you'll realise that you are inside a prison, but that the prison door is also always open.
 

RuledbySaturn

Well-known member
Rasalhague - Thank you for such a powerful post so brilliantly written,

This is what I believe about karma and "lessons": Where I've put in the effort I expect to see results. If results are not there after a reasonable amount of time I will take charge and consider this lesson "finished."

Most successful people I personally know do not use astrology. I see them do a bunch of "wrong" thing including making major moves on VOC moon, yet they turn out richer than everybody else I know - Such amazing ability to be above the influece of the planets and determine their own destiny - If I wasn't because I knew them personally I wouldn't believe it.

I can totally relate to what you are saying. Fitting in isn't my problem but that's because I just don't care - if you are good at what you do you usually end up in a leadership capacity anyway where one does not have to fit in unless by choice. Of course I know that this can be a double-edged sword since after a while one starts to expect that the Universe will accommodate one's needs 24/7, which is why I think you made such an excellent point about determining whether or not a request is justified before pushing on. I am old enough to not make premature moves yet controlling enough (haha) to not accept any lessons I find to be ridiculous, unnecessary, or unfair. So I know how you feel.

Of course, to be fair to the Universe, I know I do get what I want when I articulate my requests clearly - I admit that the things I haven't gotten was often due to the fact I was unclear about them. But as far as I am concerned, "patience lesson" is done. Period. Next lesson is to "articulate needs clearly."

It's nice meeting you, too! I've never written such a long post in my life...
 
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RuledbySaturn

Well-known member
Steeler, I do not believe in reincarnation. I myself got into astrology to give me an edge in the marketplace, not to find out my "lessons." That's why I do not go to any regular spiritual or religious meetings because I know they would try to brainwash me.

BTW, Who are the "they" that you are referring to that want us to come back?

I will not reincarnate. Period.
 
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Steeler

Well-known member
Ruledbysaturn, I have a feeling there is no point in discussing this with you,
since you have already made up your mind. I don't honestly care whether you believe in reincarnation or not, but that's what there is and it has been proven. You should read up on doctors like Brian Weiss, Michael Newton and so on if you're interested.

I've had past-life dreams because of my Kundalini awakening and I didn't believe in chakras, reincarnation or any of that stuff, because I thought it was all new-age nonsense. Well, this stuff is something that people have been writing about for centuries, it's not "new" and definitely not nonsense.

In your case, since you seem to be all about business, I believe that maybe some lessons are in order for you and your evolution. In my case I know Im done, but know that I could be fooled to come back again.

When it comes to Karma, it doesn't work in the same way with everyone. Horrible people get away with anything and people who do nothing whatsoever are constantly being hit by it. This I believe to show in what "level" you are on the evolution process. The "younger" you are, the less you notice Karma and can do whatever you please, but as you keep getting "older", Karma starts showing up at all times reminding you that your actions do have consequences. This is why as an example those who cause wars are still running around enjoying their money and power.
 

Cupcake

Well-known member
^that's a good point Steeler, I always felt that people that have it "easy" are younger souls, therefore their lessons are easier. Mine are too hard lol
 

Nexus7

Well-known member
I sometimes think that in readings there can be such an emphasis on 'learning lessons' that it can be a little oppressive - too much like horrendous cosmic karmic punishments that the querent is powerless to avoid.

I think it is up to each individual to decide for themselves where they have learnt the most in their particualr lifetime.
 

RuledbySaturn

Well-known member
When it comes to Karma, it doesn't work in the same way with everyone. Horrible people get away with anything and people who do nothing whatsoever are constantly being hit by it. This I believe to show in what "level" you are on the evolution process. The "younger" you are, the less you notice Karma and can do whatever you please, but as you keep getting "older", Karma starts showing up at all times reminding you that your actions do have consequences. This is why as an example those who cause wars are still running around enjoying their money and power.
In case anyone cares to know, I know plenty of seemingly successful people who suffer silently - not in areas the public can see that's why most don't know - so I know there exits some sort of Universal law (or "Karma" if that's what people want to call it), but I simply can't stand the idea of reincarnation lol. In my opinion, that's like forcing, or "tricking," like you mentioned, someone to go to a particular college when the person really belongs somewhere else. Still interested in learning someday who those beings are that you've mentioned that want us to come back because I think it would shed light for a lot of people on this issue. I myself will not be tricked into coming back here, either.
 
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