Putin: White hat or villain?

There are mass swathes of Libra deniers but also people who wish to only be seen in a certain way, Libra is the only zodiac sign, perhaps Leo to some extent where they hike this up to 10,000 comapred to any other zodiac sign, their superficiality is expressed through illogic as such.

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God help you if you met me in a truly dark place, luckily I am in control of myself, I have my outbursts, but as with any sign they have apolar opposite and the shadow of the opposition also exists within the opposite sign, example Cancer - Capricorn and feelings, Aries - Libra and strategy / morals / justice.
Taurus - Scorpio desires / morals / money/ power.


Venus is just as bad as Aries or any other sign for injustice and also bad rule. When you begin to believe you are that power that be, you have now exalted the self beyond all life and think you are always right no matter what.

John Kramer in the SAW franchise is a look into Venus, the other side of this is Scorpio where one applies their desires to help others, Taurus Venus ruled applies it to the stable self of which always believes they are mentally stable, sound, untouchable.. if it goes to their heads.


I feel as if this will help, Venus and Mars relationship.

When Venus goes bad.


Below is from the "Why is Venus exalted in Pisces" thread, I think my post may help shed light from someone with a Venus ruled Moon which is ruler of their Sun.. exalted and domiciled 8th house Pluto in opposition.



If you are into understanding Venus.. Taurus with the backdrop of Scorpio.


Coincidentally the actor has Venus conjunct Jupiter in Cancer.

View attachment 106783


Some lesser known secrets to the SAW franchise.

Chester Bennington lead singer of Linkin Park a Sun in Aries with Cancer Mars was in this film.


Someone who went through his entire life with trauma and ended himself.



Makes much better sense that where Mars falls, Venus would exalt.


Him loving the company of others completely free of arrogance, a Cancer trait, being host.
His performances were never in the end for him, they were for the world, we needed to hear him.






As with the previous post, the opposite of Mars is Venus. Venus when left to their own devices, will also crumble to their own morality and lash out.
Mars in Cancer for Chester meant he would unleash it on himself.

But guess what? He has Venus in Pisces.

So do we work with Mars in Cancer or Venus in Pisces?


His sun's ruler is in the 8th which is the ascendant ruler, regardless of his Mars being in fall, it is accidentally dignified, his North Node is also in Scorpio.


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It's amazing how he starred in a movie that had Taurus - Scorpio themes and was just an extra.


The universe is not so mystical at times and makes sense.

How it kinda conceptualized into song. Saving ones morality from the depths of the lonely self where desperation becomes the only outlet.

JIGSAW is TAURUS - SCORPIO, the kjey to transformation, the key to being grateful for what you have (2nd house vs 8th).

[Intro]
(Thou shall not kill)
JIGSAW: "Congratulations. You are still alive. Most people are so ungrateful to be alive. But not you. Not anymore."

[Verse 1]
A last fire will rise behind those eyes
Black house will rock, lost boys don't cry (thou shall not fall)
(Thou shall not die) Lost boys don't cry
(Thou shall not fear) Cry, little sister
(Thou shall not kill)
Temptation heat beats like a drum
Deep in your veins, I will not lie

[Build-Up]
(Thou shall not kill)
(Thou shall not die)
*Jigsaw laugh*
DAVID: "I tried to make you immortal."
MICHAEL: "You tried to make me a killer!"

[Drop]
Cry, little sister
DAVID: "You'll never grow old, Michael. You'll never die. But you must feed."
Cry to your brother
Cry, little sister
JIGSAW: "Let the game begin. *Jigsaw laugh*"
JIGSAW: "Live or die. Make your choice."
AMANDA: "No!"
Lost boys don't cry

[Verse 2]
(Thou shall not kill)
(Thou shall not die)
(Thou shall not die) Cry, little sister
(Thou shall not fall) Cry to your brother

[Build-Up]
(Thou shall not kill, thou shall not kill)
(Thou shall not kill)
MICHAEL: "You tried to make me a killer!"

[Drop]
(Yeah, yeah, yeah)
Cry, little sister
Cry to your brother
Lost boys don't cry
(Thou shall not fall)
(Thou shall not die)
(Thou shall not fear) Cry, little sister
(Thou shall not kill)

[Outro]
JIGSAW: "Oh yes: There will be blood."
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Just a bit more on Putin's 7th house Jupiter retrograde and its quintiles. Jupiter is usually the good luck factor. It takes a liberal, expansive view of things. But the 7th house is also the house of one's "open enemies" (vs. 12th house secretive back-stabbers.) It just occurred to me that precisely what Putin hates about the West is its culture of permissiveness.

Putin's Pluto conjunct MC square Jupiter emphasizes the hard, ruthless edge (Pluto) to Putin's staking a lot of his career (MC) on stamping out "western decadence" (Jupiter) as he understands it.

The trouble is, Vladimir, you are all of the planets in your chart.

The Gay Pride parade in Kiev was a motivating factor. Saturn versus Jupiter is a general theme in astrology, and the (Jupiterian) parade "crossed Putin's (Saturnian) red line". In fact, his spiritual advisor, Bishop Kirill, gave his blessing to the invasion for that particular reason. Western "decadence" - the idea that the West has abandoned "Traditional-values" - is a recurring theme regarding this war.

Here's a couple of Biblical, Traditional-values, that Putin himself has abandoned - "Thou Shalt Not Kill", and "Love Thy Neighbor as Thyself".
 
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Nexus7

Well-known member
What's a Libra denier?

Ever heard of a rusted mirror? Well,they reflect either poorly, or they reflect nothing.

Or did you forget that Hitler had Libra rising? And he was a Uranian too, he had it on his ascendant. And he did want to make the world a better place, by his, well, lights.....

Putin may have whole stellium of Libra, but it falls in what is either known as the house of self undoing and deception, or more recently, a house commonly seen in the the charts of world leaders. And that stellium includes Saturn and Neptune. Malefics.
 
What's a Libra denier?

Ever heard of a rusted mirror? Well,they reflect either poorly, or they reflect nothing.

Or did you forget that Hitler had Libra rising? And he was a Uranian too, he had it on his ascendant. And he did want to make the world a better place, by his, well, lights.....

Putin may have whole stellium of Libra, but it falls in what is either known as the house of self undoing and deception, or more recently, a house commonly seen in the the charts of world leaders. And that stellium includes Saturn and Neptune. Malefics.
Welcome to the age of Pisces.

Judge by action, not thought and you will escape the trap.
 

Nexus7

Well-known member
That doesn't really address my question. Blind faith in newspaper column astrology and generalisations do not an understanding of a Putin make IMO.
 
That doesn't really address my question. Blind faith in newspaper column astrology and generalisations do not an understanding of a Putin make IMO.
You mentioned nearly all folks in power have placements in the 12th, you are not wrong, the age of Pisces is why, 12th house?
It's not that hard to observe what gets people in control of the butttons to large swathes of life.

Lies, deceit, covering up of background, covered injustices. Corruption.

Undoing of life.

Neptune has been in domicile for a long long time, it's been trine and sextile all my natal placements for years, I have seen it all happen as a bystander, I can't cover myself though, I drift through it, there is only 3 squares, my MC / IC and Venus in Gemini.
 

Nexus7

Well-known member
I think there was a Frenck King with a new moon in the 12th who once declared, 'l' etàt c'est moi.'

The ego extends to encompass something bigger than one mere individual, such a native then identifies with a whole nation. And with Neptune to Sun on the one hand and Saturn on the other, it is easy to see how dangerous that could become.
 

david starling

Well-known member
You mentioned nearly all folks in power have placements in the 12th, you are not wrong, the age of Pisces is why, 12th house?
It's not that hard to observe what gets people in control of the butttons to large swathes of life.

Lies, deceit, covering up of background, covered injustices. Corruption.

Undoing of life.

Undoing of life is Saturnian. Old age is considered a "natural" cause of death.
 
Undoing of life is Saturnian. Old age is considered a "natural" cause of death.
Death is not just the only undoing, Neptune is responsible for way more negative things such as slow long painful deaths because they all at once believe all life should be helped and that drugs will fix the problem.
Undoing of life is not finalized with Neptune, it is carried to it's end.

Suffering, religion, indoctrination.
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Reality is not real, when every individual is against each other, when powers that be seek to only destroy, this is not reality, you should not trust what will destroy you. - Pluto in Scorpio.

Unlike Saturn, Neptune isn't about power, authority, and domination. It's about the song, "....Life is but a Dream."

Saturn is about fear and suffering, and mistaking the Dream for Reality.
 
Unlike Saturn, Neptune isn't about power, authority, and domination. It's about the song, "....Life is but a Dream."

Saturn is about fear and suffering, and mistaking the Dream for Reality.
A dream is just a perception, it's not my dreams but someone elses, mental bondage when ones dream ruler over all others.

Just like Libra, I guess Pisces are all good guys, as expressed by waybread before, the observations are that simple, but fixed logic is not how you go about this, you must observe and make sense, the opposite of the age.
 
The most intelligent people of our era who had impact way beyond their scope are Water signs.

Nikola Tesla. Free power to everyone, world gets a hold of it, destroys the internal image of Tesla and sells images of stuff that are illusions whilst paying credit to Edison.

Albert Einstein.

It was so good that science is more a cult following more so than a tool to many of every day people, they follow but don't use it appropriately.
Like astrology is a tool, science is, where do you think the rejection of astrology comes from?

Battle of beliefs, the non reality we all believe in makes room for us to easily dismiss the other as a belief when in truth it is the belief in a tool we not only take for granted but also misuse to stave off any other type of thinking, and so we used to put those types into mental asylums or other places, locked away from the "Normal people" Piscean.. 12th house stuff.

Think of the age as the 12th house and Pisces, but the actioning in that age is everything, but the age is the outer influence none of us can consciously tap into, this is the collective unconscious.

A song that represents the age.

 
I have prepared a new round of refutations.





If you don't like the definitions from Kepler, then here are the interpretations from Solarfire:

ASPECTS OF THE MOON

TRINE THE SUN Orb 11°01' Applying

Your basic nature is easy-going. You find that your emotions contribute positively to your life. You have a tendency to sit back and let things slip past rather than being assertive as you are not personally ambitious.

TRINE SATURN Orb 14°33' Applying

You have an inner self-confidence which helps you build firm foundations in your life and achieve your ambitions. You work solidly to build yourself a secure and firm footing, earning the respect of those around you.

OPPOSITION MARS Orb 23°37' Applying

Your struggle to express yourself assertively usually ends in conflict. Arguments and emotional disputes abound in your life. You may find that your loved ones are often angry. Letting off steam in sports or activities that demand high concentration will help you achieve a balance.

TRINE MERCURY Orb 20°16' Applying

You are able to communicate your thoughts and feelings with ease. You may be a charming person, at times manipulative. You have a talent for making decisions based on both your heart and mind.

SEXTILE THE MIDHEAVEN Orb 18°18' Separating

Intuitively you know where you are heading in your life. This may be as a result of the loving and guiding hand of your mother, or a member of your mother's family. You are able to choose a career that suits you, one that enables you to make a positive contribution in your public life while supporting your foundations.

That is now 3 respected sources that totally reject your very bad reading of Putin's chart.



Let's see what Solarfire says about Mars.

MARS

MARS IN SAGITTARIUS


You are an inspirational leader, and have a strong desire for exploration and adventure. You may be one-pointed in your desires.

MARS IN THE 2ND HOUSE

You have an aggressive approach to making money. You equate strength and power with money and possessions. You will develop a strong set of values.

27TH DEGREE OF SAGITTARIUS

Sabian Symbol: The sculptor's vision is taking form.

RAYS RELATING TO MARS

Ray of Mars is the 6th

Devotion and idealism

Rays of Mars's Sign (Sagittarius)

6th Ray

Devotion and idealism

5th Ray

Concrete knowledge and science

4th Ray

Harmony through conflict

Ray of Modern Dispositor (Jupiter) is the 2nd

Love and wisdom

HOUSE RULED BY MARS

RULES 6TH HOUSE (Modern)

The Sixth House is about day to day life. It is about work, health, the service you give and your habits. It also relates to small animals. Other exoteric and esoteric keywords include: health, daily routine, working environment, skills, pets and animals, service

MODERN DISPOSITOR: JUPITER

DISPOSITOR'S HOUSE: 7TH HOUSE

The Seventh House is about partnerships. This can be partnerships in business, marriage or a committed relationship. Other exoteric and esoteric keywords include: business partnerships, marriage, long-term associations, open enemies, the animus, the relationship between soul and personality.

DISPOSITOR'S SIGN: TAURUS

Stable and enduring, strong values, unyielding, earthy, acquisitive, strong desires. Can be stuck, stubborn, overly possessive, self-indulgent.

ASPECTS OF MARS

SEXTILE SATURN Orb 9°04' Separating

You have opportunities to express your energy in a self disciplined way. Self control is one of your talents.

Again, you cannot possibly justify your claims astrologically.




I never said I hated the US. I said the US lies. That's what they do.

Not according to the APA and since you're neither a board-certified psychologist or psychiatrist, and not even educated in psychology, not to mention you have not administered the proper tests and conducted the necessary evaluations, an intellectually honest person would refrain from discussing something they know nothing about.



I'm college educated. That's what I did when I got out of the Army so I didn't die making people rich. You're obviously not.

When a country is under attack by the US, they will often infringe on civil liberties, but that is to protect their country from the US.

Americans complain that Russia interfered with their election. Turn about is fair play. After all, the US interfered in Russian elections, specifically Obama, and that is specifically why Russia expelled USAID.

When a country is under attack by the US, it will also often nationalize its industries. This is because to allow US companies in your country or allow investors to have controlling or other interests in your country's enterprises gives the US the "justification" for intervening militarily under the guise of "protecting" US interests.



The war was not unprovoked. It was provoked by the US and Britain to advance their agendas.

Since you don't have a political science and history degree like I do, so you don't know who Command McCollum is and you never read his now declassified October 1940 memorandum to FDR.

McCollum was a US Navy commander and listed 8 specific things that FDR needs to do to provoke Japan to become more hostile and attack the US in order to get the public would be behind a war effort.

FDR did all 8 of those things to provoke Japan into attacking the US and Japan ultimately attacked.

Item #1 on the list was moving the Pacific Fleet from San Diego to the territory of Hawai'i.

Since you didn't read the now-declassified documents, you don't know the Pacific Fleet Commander, Admiral James Richardson vehemently protested in a letter to FDR stating that it was an unwarranted risk that put the Fleet in danger and that it would provoke Japan into attacking.

For his efforts, FDR relieved him of duty and replaced him with a Yes-Man who wouldn't question FDR.

Admiral Richardson was right.

That's what the US does. It provokes through all manner and means and soon you will learn that the US provoked the Korean War.

[deleted attacking comment - Moderator]
These orbs are far too wide... no?
 
That is a false interpretation not supported by astrology and certainly not supported by modern astrology. Sorry, but Saturn is not exalted.

Modern astrology says, and I quote: People with Saturn in Libra are disciplined, responsible, and serious, they are pleasant , philosophical and have a great sense of justice and fairness. It is a good placement of government work. Diplomatic and tactful, you work well with others as you prefer cooperating to competing. Difficult aspects can make you demanding, intolerant, lacking in forgiveness and even insincere.

It also says people with Saturn in the 12th place are morbidly sensitive and inclined to isolate themselves. Because you are tied to responsibility and accepted mores, you tend to keep your problems locked up within yourself. With difficult aspects, your father may have faded out of your life early.

Saturn square Uranus makes individuals who can be radical, a bit drastic, and have a know-it-all attitude. Yet you are also apprehensive about making decisions; you look for approval before you assert yourself.



Your claims continue to fail. The modern interpretation of Saturn square Neptune is you can be either craft and designing or the complete opposite, lacking all ambition. You may assume other people's guilt; instead you should overcome your fear of failure, face competition, and learn to like yourself.

Mercury conjunct Neptune makes people abnormally sensitive,; you are dreamy, musical, poetic, and fond of dancing, water sports, and photography.

Mercury square Saturn makes people who are traditional, reserved, shy, hard-working, responsible and ambitious.

If you want, I can cite other modern astrology sources that totally refute your claims.




No, next up is Sun five years from now, so your claims fail.



Sun is not in fall and that is not the correct modern interpretation.

In modern, the Sun in the 12th place operates like Sun in Pisces and those people are creative, spiritual, sometimes mystical, and may even be impractical.


They're not afflicted by Uranus. I just proved they weren't.

The Sun is not at all strong in Libra, the actual expression of self is lost due to the fact Libra is all about partnerships and exploring through others.

Saturn is in my 12th domiciled in Capricorn, North Node too (Aqua), it is not the 12th that gives me any spirituality, that would be the planets Neptune, Uranus, Pluto in aspect to my lights, Moon and Sun. Saturn somewhat dulls the ability of my self expression but with Jupiter in conjunction I can play by the rules of Jupiter also and be brave. Moon conjunct Vesta too.

The 12th house it's self is just a tomb of both undoing but also you can find locked away goods here that deserve to be used... As such the next house is the first where the exaltation of the self is and domicile of direction, Sun and Mars.



It also says people with Saturn in the 12th place are morbidly sensitive and inclined to isolate themselves. Because you are tied to responsibility and accepted mores, you tend to keep your problems locked up within yourself. With difficult aspects, your father may have faded out of your life early.

I am sensitive, but morbidly? this is not correct.



An excerpt in reply to someones views on "Is torture morally permissible"

In the case I mentioned it was the right of the kidnapper to have no bodily harm done to him against the right of his victim of staying alive and no bodily harm done to him.
The judge put the right of the perpetrator over the right of the victim in the end.

How would you decide if it is your child, mother, partner who got kidnapped? Still stick to principle?
If not, your words are not worth one cent. If you do, you are cold as ice.
I would say I don't care either way as I don't know them. -Able to understand that perceptions are limited and are known to make us side with no rationality. Now if I pretended I care that means I am trying to look good in front of others in favor of myself, not them. -Understands that stating so does not make it so, appeal to ego is not on my mind.

How I act and perceive in the moment tells the truth, not my thoughts, thoughts only work for the past or the future, the self is automatic, myself requires no mind. Don't waste it, the life is limited but your soul will live on for eternity. -The Moon is conjunct Mars and these 2 Taurus placements are in the Aries Mars ruled 2nd house adding a direct flavor. Part of fortune is in Aries conjunct natal Mars, the Moon - Mars conjunction is 9 degrees.

So called empathy is a load of BS - it is at once easy to display that you care whilst not caring at all
, people who often speak about it neglect the self and so fall over and curl up into a ball quicker, grow some armor from the world or die on sight. -Best to leave it to observation in that moment something is required.

Dog eat dog world. -Pluto in 8th, understanding basic instinct and primal needs, Sun trine Pluto, Moon opposite Pluto.

Song for the moment.


I have to protect so I must also realize my capability of hurting. - Identifying Cancer Sun, ruler Moon, trine Neptune 0 degree, Trine Saturn, 9 degree, Trine Uranus 6 degree. Identifying with Saturn and what must be done to realize the true self.

Male, not female.

Females have a backing group by the same sex... mostly, men don't. - Uranus trines help me connect but also disconnect and distance my self to see how groups work collectively,



The sun as you mentioned falls in Cancer apparently?
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Good to know.

I think it says a lot about his deviousness and his need to hang onto power. I think he may have a Mercury opposition Eris too.

"Devious" fits Mercury, and "Fantasy" goes with Neptune. Their conjunction in Putin's chart explains his ability to concoct self-serving, reasonable-sounding propaganda (which I'm calling "Putinganda") from half-truths and outright lies. It takes some effort to sort out fact from fiction, and his supporters don't bother to do that. They just take what he gives them and run with it, using deceptive memes and constant repetition ad nauseam.

Here's the latest Putinganda gambit -


It's nonsensical that Ukraine would do this, considering it desperately needs all the weapons it can procure for its counter-offensive. But, that won't deter Putin supporters from believing it and spreading it, along with all of his other nonsense.
 
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