Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Happy birthday to Marilyn Monroe, who would be 94 years old today.
Here she is doing yoga.
Here she is doing yoga.
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Marilyn Monroe
- Thread starter Ukpoohbear
- Start date
Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Happy birthday Marilyn Monroe…!!! Who would be 94 years old today, June the 1st.
Please if anyone has any astrological interpretations to add, feel free
Please if anyone has any astrological interpretations to add, feel free
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Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Marilyn's Moon at 19 Aquarius sabian symbol:
PHASE 320: (AQUARIUS 20°): A LARGE WHITE DOVE BEARING A MESSAGE.
KEYNOTE: The answer of spiritual agencies to thorough, sustained and victorious individual efforts.
This concludes most significantly this series of five symbols. The individual who has gone courageously and with indomitable spirit through his crucial crisis receives, as it were, a deep spiritual blessing from the Soul-realm: "Mission accomplished. Peace be with you." And in this blessing a secret prophecy of what is yet to come may be seen by the perspicacious and spiritually sensitive mind of the recipient. Every real spiritual step a man takes in his development is the result of a victory over forces of inertia or destruction. The Divine is totally "present" in the heart of all true victories.
This is the fifth and last symbol of the sixty-fourth series. What the "message" is depends on the particular situation, but the white dove always signifies peace; at the very heart of this peace is the CERTIFICATION of individual worth and victory.
- http://www.mindfire.ca/An Astrological Mandala/An Astrological Mandala - Aquarius 16-30.htm
PHASE 320: (AQUARIUS 20°): A LARGE WHITE DOVE BEARING A MESSAGE.
KEYNOTE: The answer of spiritual agencies to thorough, sustained and victorious individual efforts.
This concludes most significantly this series of five symbols. The individual who has gone courageously and with indomitable spirit through his crucial crisis receives, as it were, a deep spiritual blessing from the Soul-realm: "Mission accomplished. Peace be with you." And in this blessing a secret prophecy of what is yet to come may be seen by the perspicacious and spiritually sensitive mind of the recipient. Every real spiritual step a man takes in his development is the result of a victory over forces of inertia or destruction. The Divine is totally "present" in the heart of all true victories.
This is the fifth and last symbol of the sixty-fourth series. What the "message" is depends on the particular situation, but the white dove always signifies peace; at the very heart of this peace is the CERTIFICATION of individual worth and victory.
- http://www.mindfire.ca/An Astrological Mandala/An Astrological Mandala - Aquarius 16-30.htm
Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Marilyn's Mars at 20 Pisces:
SECOND LEVEL: EMOTIONAL/CULTURAL
PHASE 351 (PISCES 21°): UNDER THE WATCHFUL AND KIND EYE OF A CHINESE SERVANT, A GIRL FONDLES A LITTLE WHITE LAMB.
KEYNOTE: Growth in consciousness in its earliest tactile awareness of the wonders of unsophisticated living.
This symbol recalls the one for Phase 174 (Virgo 24°) — "Mary and her little lamb" — but it occupies a different position in the five-fold sequence and a new factor is added: the "Chinese servant." According to the occult tradition, the original Chinese race was an extension of the humanity (or "Root Race") preceding ours — thus the stress upon the biological factors of family and ancestors, and also on the dualism of the Yang and Yin interplay. The "Chinese servant" represents the past as a servant of the new evolution. (The "white lamb" suggests the sign of all beginnings, Aries.) This new evolution is just about to begin during the late Pisces phase of the year cycle. It is as yet an ideal, a white loveliness. The girl discovers the new feeling of the touch of wool and of animal warmth. The preceding five-fold sequence began with a symbol suggesting the inspiring revelation of new truths or facts which the creative person is seeking to formulate. Now we witness another kind of discovery — a sensuously emotional discovery, perhaps a presentiment of the mother-feeling.
This is the first symbol of the seventy-first sequence. It brings together past and future, an overlapping of levels. The Chinese kindly watching the white girl; the girl fondling the white lamb. There is charm and ingenuousness in the scene — a vision of WHITE HOPE, a hope for a future that can only be felt, almost naively.
- “Norma Jeane posing with a lamb in 1945. Although the pictures are charming, Marilyn later revealed that she did that photoshoot with mixed feelings. The lamb in the picture had been rejected by its mother, and would eventually die. Marilyn always loved animals, and found things like this heart-breaking.
Shot by Andre de Dienes, and made it to the cover of the magazine The Family Circle in April 1946 (as her first cover)”
- https://www.goodreads.com/photo/author/82952.Marilyn_Monroe
SECOND LEVEL: EMOTIONAL/CULTURAL
PHASE 351 (PISCES 21°): UNDER THE WATCHFUL AND KIND EYE OF A CHINESE SERVANT, A GIRL FONDLES A LITTLE WHITE LAMB.
KEYNOTE: Growth in consciousness in its earliest tactile awareness of the wonders of unsophisticated living.
This symbol recalls the one for Phase 174 (Virgo 24°) — "Mary and her little lamb" — but it occupies a different position in the five-fold sequence and a new factor is added: the "Chinese servant." According to the occult tradition, the original Chinese race was an extension of the humanity (or "Root Race") preceding ours — thus the stress upon the biological factors of family and ancestors, and also on the dualism of the Yang and Yin interplay. The "Chinese servant" represents the past as a servant of the new evolution. (The "white lamb" suggests the sign of all beginnings, Aries.) This new evolution is just about to begin during the late Pisces phase of the year cycle. It is as yet an ideal, a white loveliness. The girl discovers the new feeling of the touch of wool and of animal warmth. The preceding five-fold sequence began with a symbol suggesting the inspiring revelation of new truths or facts which the creative person is seeking to formulate. Now we witness another kind of discovery — a sensuously emotional discovery, perhaps a presentiment of the mother-feeling.
This is the first symbol of the seventy-first sequence. It brings together past and future, an overlapping of levels. The Chinese kindly watching the white girl; the girl fondling the white lamb. There is charm and ingenuousness in the scene — a vision of WHITE HOPE, a hope for a future that can only be felt, almost naively.
- “Norma Jeane posing with a lamb in 1945. Although the pictures are charming, Marilyn later revealed that she did that photoshoot with mixed feelings. The lamb in the picture had been rejected by its mother, and would eventually die. Marilyn always loved animals, and found things like this heart-breaking.
Shot by Andre de Dienes, and made it to the cover of the magazine The Family Circle in April 1946 (as her first cover)”
- https://www.goodreads.com/photo/author/82952.Marilyn_Monroe
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Aside from the obvious, the Leo ascendent, the moon/neptune opposition square Saturn that gave her talent, but caused her so much grief in her early years at home, and her insecurities.
Chiron on the midheaven, how much she suffered from her fame.
The yearning lost look on her face in the tulle photo, with the disarming unselfconscious sexual appeal.
The contradiction of the photo with the lamb of innocence, and the quote about her doing the photo reluctantly because she knew the lamb was abandoned and destined to die.
A tortured soul, who brought so much pleasure to others.
Chiron on the midheaven, how much she suffered from her fame.
The yearning lost look on her face in the tulle photo, with the disarming unselfconscious sexual appeal.
The contradiction of the photo with the lamb of innocence, and the quote about her doing the photo reluctantly because she knew the lamb was abandoned and destined to die.
A tortured soul, who brought so much pleasure to others.
Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
It is a very bitter sweet photo of Norma Jeane with the lamb who was abandoned
Your post described her well.She was such an enigmatic figure, don't you think? She on the one hand had enormous public success and was envied by all, on the other she considered herself a failure and in fact wasn't able to maintain a solid intimate relationship.
The photo of Joe DiMaggio made an impression on me, a man who was so deeply in love with her, but couldn't stay in a close relationship with her.
He continued to bring roses to her grave for the rest of his life.
It makes me wonder about the karmic side of their relationship.
The photo of Joe DiMaggio made an impression on me, a man who was so deeply in love with her, but couldn't stay in a close relationship with her.
He continued to bring roses to her grave for the rest of his life.
It makes me wonder about the karmic side of their relationship.
Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Yes it is fascinating but so tragic that she got every girls' American Dream but she had been too hurt by her childhood, I have previously described her as tragic as the Titanic, like she was on borrowed time. It is a very intense example of the dual sides to the Gemini personality: what we saw on the outside was not what was going on in the inside.
There is a quote I came across recently that said Hollywood actually saved her and gave her a bit longer than what she would have had otherwise. I'll try find it.
A look at the synastry and composite of Marilyn and Joe DiMaggio's relationship would be fascinating, great idea.
This is a fascinating study in Karmic love.
I've posted each of the natal charts, Joe DiMaggio and Marilyn Monroe, the synastry and the composite.
I've entered the asteroids Joseph and Marilyn.
In the natal chart for DiMaggio we see he is a Sagittarius with Sagittarius rising. His descendent is gemini, corresponding to Marilyn's sun sign.
Her sun was exactly opposite his mars, and in wide orb opposing his sun/venus conjunction.
What is remarkable is that the ruler of his 7th house of marriage is mercury.
His mercury is located in his 12th house of sorrows and restrictions, and exactly conjunct the asteroid Marilyn!
His pisces moon on the cusp of the IC is exactly conjunct Chiron, showing the pain he suffered through women.
Marilyn's chart has a Leo rising, with Aquarius on her house of marriage, conjunct her moon and the asteroid Joseph! In addition, his Jupiter is exactly conjunct this point!
Note that she also has an important contact with Chiron, conjunct Venus exactly on her midheaven.
In doing the synastry, another interesting element popped out, in Marilyn's chart the asteroid Marilyn is exactly conjunct her sun!
Looking at the composite, we see asteroid Marilyn exactly conjunct mercury, and sitting exactly on the cusp of the marriage house is Chiron.
The composite also tells us why they couldn't remain married, moon conjuncts Uranus and they oppose the composite sun, so the union was irregular and sporadic, with the strong Chiron theme.
The nodes aren't particularly involved in the charts, aside from his nodes sextile her Venus, showing a karmic love relationship.
I've posted each of the natal charts, Joe DiMaggio and Marilyn Monroe, the synastry and the composite.
I've entered the asteroids Joseph and Marilyn.
In the natal chart for DiMaggio we see he is a Sagittarius with Sagittarius rising. His descendent is gemini, corresponding to Marilyn's sun sign.
Her sun was exactly opposite his mars, and in wide orb opposing his sun/venus conjunction.
What is remarkable is that the ruler of his 7th house of marriage is mercury.
His mercury is located in his 12th house of sorrows and restrictions, and exactly conjunct the asteroid Marilyn!
His pisces moon on the cusp of the IC is exactly conjunct Chiron, showing the pain he suffered through women.
Marilyn's chart has a Leo rising, with Aquarius on her house of marriage, conjunct her moon and the asteroid Joseph! In addition, his Jupiter is exactly conjunct this point!
Note that she also has an important contact with Chiron, conjunct Venus exactly on her midheaven.
In doing the synastry, another interesting element popped out, in Marilyn's chart the asteroid Marilyn is exactly conjunct her sun!
Looking at the composite, we see asteroid Marilyn exactly conjunct mercury, and sitting exactly on the cusp of the marriage house is Chiron.
The composite also tells us why they couldn't remain married, moon conjuncts Uranus and they oppose the composite sun, so the union was irregular and sporadic, with the strong Chiron theme.
The nodes aren't particularly involved in the charts, aside from his nodes sextile her Venus, showing a karmic love relationship.
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aquarius7000
Well-known member
Hi,
Look at where the ruler of her 4th house (home and family) is - in the 8th house of sorrow and anguish. It is conjunct Ura - change of families, not settling in one place, she was in multiple foster homes. Saturn in the 4th house further underlines the sorrow involved.
Her 10th house ruler, Venus, in Aries - she is known and admired for her sex appeal. In fact, the Neptune aspect to Venus makes her in to a glamour girl for it. She used her sex appeal to get her men (Mars-Jup) of which she had quite a few - Jup and Moon in the 7th.
Nep at the forefront - the 1st - and aspecting many of her personal planets - addiction and drugs were her bane.
Look at where the ruler of her 4th house (home and family) is - in the 8th house of sorrow and anguish. It is conjunct Ura - change of families, not settling in one place, she was in multiple foster homes. Saturn in the 4th house further underlines the sorrow involved.
Her 10th house ruler, Venus, in Aries - she is known and admired for her sex appeal. In fact, the Neptune aspect to Venus makes her in to a glamour girl for it. She used her sex appeal to get her men (Mars-Jup) of which she had quite a few - Jup and Moon in the 7th.
Nep at the forefront - the 1st - and aspecting many of her personal planets - addiction and drugs were her bane.
Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Thank you Elena for looking at Marilyn and Joe's synastry! How amazing is it that she became glued to her identity of Marilyn and that asteroid happens to be conjunct her Sun! I searched the asteroid Norma and it is conjunct her Chiron too
Joe is my favourite out of Marilyn's 3 husbands.' There is a famous picture of him looking heartbroken at her funeral, that pain can be felt astrologically in your finding of her asteroid Marilyn conjunct his Mercury in the 12th house, ruler of his 7th.It is well-known he sent a dozen roses to Marilyn's graveside every week for 20 years. Marilyn had previously requested this from Joe during their short marriage after hearing the story of her heroine Jean Harlow, who died at 25 years old.
It's interesting the Sun is in 11th house in the composite because there's was a very public relationship but there was conflict because Joe was already retired when Marilyn was just beginning to reach the peak of her career. This can be seen with the oppositions coming from the 5th house in Uranus. But they remained live-long friends and cared for each other a lot, which can be seen from Venus conjunct Jupiter in the 5th also.
It is also known he was violent to her though. We can see the tendency for abrupt emotions with his Sag Venus conjunct Mars in the 1st house squaring the Moon. There is a famous story that while Marilyn was modelling the famous New York subway grate photo (one of the most famous photos of the 20th century), where her white dress got blown up with the wind of a passing train, that Joe grew enraged with the sound of the jeering crowd and stormed off. When Marilyn got back to her hotel room, they allegedly got into a violent altercation. Her movie studio, who did not want to see their most bankable star become disfigured, ordered she divorce him immediately.
She chose not to tell the press this though and recommended one of her therapist's to him to deal with his anger, which he completed and which was quite a big deal for a traditional macho Italian sport's man to do. He always thanked her for it.
In Marilyn's chart, even though she craved security with Saturn in 4th, her childhood had effected her in such a way that she could not be the settling down type. She was married to the public with Moon conjunct Jupiter in the 7th house, and opposing Neptune in the 1st shows her unstable nature. Add to that her Moon conjunct Uranus in 8th, it just adds to her lack of settling down nature.
Although Joe always held a torch for her, he had become used to her ways and instead reconciled to be her best-friend, which shows the maturity compared to his earlier years. Marilyn's nature was probably a big catalyst to teach him to learn to 'let go' and be less controlling.
Joe repaid her for helping him with his anger. In the late 50's, after Marilyn had divorce her third husband, the playwright Arthur Miller, she had confided to one of her psychiatrist's that she had contemplated throwing herself out of the window of her New York apartment. Her psychiatrist recommended a 'respite' at a hospital called the Payne Whitney, which Marilyn agreed to and signed the papers for. However, when she got there, she was escorted to a concrete cell and her request's to communicate with anybody from the outside world her refused. Her psychiatrist who had prior agreed to meet up with her the next day, didn't show up and her ex husband Arthur Miller, refused to see her. One of the doctor's told her she was a 'very, very sick girl' and had been a 'very. very sick girl for a very long time.' The Doctor did not seem to understand that mentally ill people could still have a life, even though Marilyn pointed out to him former stars like Charlie Chaplin who still worked and were known to be mentally ill. Eventually, after 3 days, she managed to persuade a nurse to contact Joe for her, who flew over to the hospital as fast as he could and threatened to break down the walls of the hospital 'brick by brick,' unless they released her. Not wanting the bad publicity, the hospital agreed and they let her go. Joe then flew her over to Florida for a holiday, but Marilyn never recovered from the trauma of being locked up. It was one of her greatest fears because her Mother had been permanently locked up.
Here is an article containing information from a letter Marilyn wrote during her stay at Payne Whitney
- https://www.redbookmag.com/life/news/a44140/marilyn-monroe-letter-auction/
Marilyn and Joe when they first started dating
Marilyn and Joe on their wedding day
Newly released from the Payne Whitney hospital and relaxing at the beach during their Florida holiday.
Joe on the day of Marilyn's funeral
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Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Thank you Aquarius for taking the time to analyse Marilyn's chart. I have not noticed before the ruler of her 4th is in her 8th house of anguish and conjunct Uranus. The Saturn in 4th is very telling of somebody who always felt she was always alone, even with the Moon-conjunct Jupiter in the 7th.
Here are some quotes where Marilyn speaks of her loneliness:
"Starting tomorrow I will take care of myself for that’s all I really have and as I see it now have ever had."
"“I have always been deeply terrified to really be someone’s wife since I know from life one cannot love another, ever, really.”
"on the screen of pitch blackness comes/reappears the shapes of monsters my most steadfast companions … and the world is sleeping ah peace I need you—even a peaceful monster."
- https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2010/11/marilyn-monroe-201011
I think, along with the Venus-Neptune, even though her prominent Neptune caused her drug issues, which eventually killed her, I love that the Neptune is in Leo, which was the glamour girl era! And hers being in the first and aspecting her Venus, her most elevated planet. Venus is in fall but I have heard fallen planets have to 'work harder' and in Aries, it could probably signify how her sexuality pushed boundaries (not to mention her Lilith at Leo 29 in the 1st house too).
Thank you for all the documentation on Marilyn, that is hard to come across normally.
"reconciled to be her best-friend," Shades of composite sun in the 11th house.
True, Neptune is drugs and addiction, but it is also illusion and dreams.
And perhaps of all the famous Hollywood movie stars, she is the one who most provokes dreams in their public, even to this day. She is an icon.
"reconciled to be her best-friend," Shades of composite sun in the 11th house.
True, Neptune is drugs and addiction, but it is also illusion and dreams.
And perhaps of all the famous Hollywood movie stars, she is the one who most provokes dreams in their public, even to this day. She is an icon.
aquarius7000
Well-known member
Personally my observations about Neptune have been that you would be known for your magenetism and charm via Neptune of Neptune is in the 10th or 11th houses. Even 5th. In the 10th, I know people that have have trouble settling in their careers, or they do quite a bit of social work.
In the 1st house, Neptune has to do, IMO, more with either one being very intuitive, a brilliant artist (have 2 friends) or taking to drugs or some addictive substance.
Notice that Marilyn had her Sun in the 10th moving into 11th. People and society were very into her (icon) and she focused on society. She was a complete society girl.
In the 1st house, Neptune has to do, IMO, more with either one being very intuitive, a brilliant artist (have 2 friends) or taking to drugs or some addictive substance.
Notice that Marilyn had her Sun in the 10th moving into 11th. People and society were very into her (icon) and she focused on society. She was a complete society girl.
I think it's not so much magnetism and charm.
She was the thing dreams are made of.
You look at her, through her ascendent, and come face to face with dreamy Neptune.
And Neptune counterposes emotional moon, sigh sigh, in the public house of the 7th.
She is enigmatic, illusive, that is why she captured the imagination of so many, not only on the screen.
She is the woman who can represent everything to everyone, sexy but timid, naive but intelligent, victim and predator, unaware of her powers but capable of manipulating men.
She is as fixed as fog.
When you think you know her, a different image of her presents itself.
She is the unknowable, unattainable, and being so blatantly vulnerable she is as much of a threat as a two day old kitten.
She was the thing dreams are made of.
You look at her, through her ascendent, and come face to face with dreamy Neptune.
And Neptune counterposes emotional moon, sigh sigh, in the public house of the 7th.
She is enigmatic, illusive, that is why she captured the imagination of so many, not only on the screen.
She is the woman who can represent everything to everyone, sexy but timid, naive but intelligent, victim and predator, unaware of her powers but capable of manipulating men.
She is as fixed as fog.
When you think you know her, a different image of her presents itself.
She is the unknowable, unattainable, and being so blatantly vulnerable she is as much of a threat as a two day old kitten.
Now that we've looked at her relationship with Joe DiMaggio, I'm curious about Arthur Miller.
Here attached are the charts for natals, synastry and composite.
I reposted her chart, not only for convenience but also because I was reminded that her real name was Norma, so that has been entered.
And where in her chart could the name Norma be possibly situated?
It is conjunct Chiron on the Midheaven!
The links with Miller seem to be less binding than those with DiMaggio, but there are some signifiant ones.
While asteroid Marilyn is conjunct her sun, asteroid Arthur is conjunct his sun and ascendent. So both of them closely identified with their own personal energies, and I'm wondering how this might have produced a conflict in the marriage with each centred on their own ego.
His Saturn is on her north node, which reflects the image the public was given of the "seriousness" and "intellectual" nature of this marriage.
In fact, asteroid Arthur is in her 3rd house.
They had almost the same moon, which is a very compatible aspect, added to his north node there, except that his Uranus is also there, and they are all on her descendent.
Asteroid Norma is exactly on his Pluto in his 9th house, which reeks of psychoanalysis, of getting to the roots of the child in her, an obsessive instinct to unearth and transform.
Although Miller was known in literary circles and respected, he was not known to the general public. Thanks to her north node on his midheaven his marriage to Marilyn boosted his public image.
Note: Charts are: Marilyn natal, synastry, composite, Miller natal.
Here attached are the charts for natals, synastry and composite.
I reposted her chart, not only for convenience but also because I was reminded that her real name was Norma, so that has been entered.
And where in her chart could the name Norma be possibly situated?
It is conjunct Chiron on the Midheaven!
The links with Miller seem to be less binding than those with DiMaggio, but there are some signifiant ones.
While asteroid Marilyn is conjunct her sun, asteroid Arthur is conjunct his sun and ascendent. So both of them closely identified with their own personal energies, and I'm wondering how this might have produced a conflict in the marriage with each centred on their own ego.
His Saturn is on her north node, which reflects the image the public was given of the "seriousness" and "intellectual" nature of this marriage.
In fact, asteroid Arthur is in her 3rd house.
They had almost the same moon, which is a very compatible aspect, added to his north node there, except that his Uranus is also there, and they are all on her descendent.
Asteroid Norma is exactly on his Pluto in his 9th house, which reeks of psychoanalysis, of getting to the roots of the child in her, an obsessive instinct to unearth and transform.
Although Miller was known in literary circles and respected, he was not known to the general public. Thanks to her north node on his midheaven his marriage to Marilyn boosted his public image.
Note: Charts are: Marilyn natal, synastry, composite, Miller natal.
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Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Neptune definitely gave her an artistic streak, and many have said she came alive on camera. Some have gone as far to say she was not even attractive off camera and I'm sure Dean Martin said there was 'nothing there.'
I think what happened was she was so disillusioned and depressed that, like many artists, she expressed her happiness and charisma through her art. It reminds me of something her 3rd husband Arthur Miller said about how he ran away from conflict in real-life (Sun Libra) and worked it out through his writing. I think Marilyn literally concentrated all her energy to society, and this came from a deep-rooted pain of just having 'given-up' on the world.
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Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
Wow, that describes her perfectly.
I'm going to reply to your post on her and Arthur Miller's synastry tomorrow. Thank you for posting it. I think you hit the nail on the head with them both being attached to their ego's.
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Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
I think you can really see the dreamy Neptune qualities in this photo. Although all of Marilyn's photos capture something different.
