Lots = Pillars of Fate

Omnisphericus

Well-known member
Again Smchmidt:


And the lord of a lot generally indicates the outcome of an issue. Hence Rhetorius’ delineation of Basis.

Eros and Necessity are formed from Fortune and Spirit. Such derivative lots make the meaning of Fortune and Spirit more specific. I see no reason why we cannot form many more derivative lots along the same pattern. For instance, there are two generally noxious lots formed from the two malefics, and both are reversing lots. One is counted from Saturn to Mars by day and the reverse by night; the other is counted from Mars to Saturn by day, and the reverse by night. These two lots will always be symmetrical to each other across the Asc/Dsc axis in the same manner as Fortune and Spirit, and I maintain that they will have complementary meanings in the same way that Fortune and Spirit do.
 

Omnisphericus

Well-known member
Whitney Houston LOF chart

Whitney Houston POF 1st.jpg

Here's a chart of Whitney Houston with LOF as her Ascendant.
Now is more clearly that she has two great significators for eminence.
You see that the Fortuna (chart's) ruler is on high Elevation up in MC alongside with Jupiter (exaltation ruler of Fortuna and triplicity ruler of the main Light - Moon).
Mars, ruler of LOB, LOS and Exaltation is on the angle (4th).
Pars Hyleg is in 11th.

Look also for that Grand Trine between the Mc, Sun and Moon/Jupiter in the fiery triplicity (the main triplicity of the Light-Moon with the main ruler of the triplicity (Jupiter) aspecting the other ruler of the triplicity (Sun) and they both aspecting the radical MC).
Like they all hold their hands together.
This is another indicator for fame and strength of the eminence.
 
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sandstone

Banned
dr farr - i wouldn't want to remove all the wiggle room astrologers have for explaining away things, but only point out the superficiality of such an approach where one always has a reason why they can't predict much of anything in advance and only after the fact.. obviously some of us see what is going on here..
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
Thanks for taking the time to reply to my query!:smile:
The problem with words , especially when utilizing just one word, [and especially when translating from one language to another...and extra especially from ancient cultures and languages to the present and into English.] is that, quite often, whatever word is applied to any of these formulae for the 'Lots/Parts' is that they don't always convey or impart the full concept of whatever the precept is that is extracted by the formula...sometimes they miss the 'mark' entirely.
I have always seen the Part of Fortune as that which one needs to be conscious of and employ in action or attitude, adapt as outlook, etc. to be the most 'fortunate' in accomplishing ones' 'dharma'.
The Part of Soul or Spirit being just the opposite, as that of which we already know deep down within our soul and need not really be concerned with other that what already is.
As I am a Sabian Astrologer, I do have the advantage of recognizing what was needed in charts of historic personages.
I did just write of my findings to date on three Hermetic Lots, those of Necessity, Courage and Victory. In that thread I do comment on why such a thing is of 'Necessity', as I was able to conclude. It is different from the 'necessary' employ of that of 'Fortunate'...if you can 'lower yourself' to visit the 'Degree Symbols' sub-forum, you'll be able to read why I did. I'm pretty confident of what I've concluded.
I noted that the formula in determining the Lot of Basis you all have mentioned is different in that it use the POF as the 'Significator' and the Part of Spirit as the 'Trigger'. The Lot of Eros uses Venus as the 'Significator' and the Lot of necessity uses Mercury as the 'Trigger'. Thus I don't see how it could be the same thing.
Could you explain this to me?

ps. I know this is the 'Trad' only forum and I respect that, I apologize for having bought up Sabians...but it is what I do. I did figure the Lot of Basis for a few natal charts of folks that I know most intimately, as per the formula you all gave, and the symbology does intrigue me...mine is most interesting as to what I know of myself..and as I do always find a common theme running through a natal chart, a 'Gestalt' or 'Tenor'...the ones I determined do 'ring' with those natal charts...[but one has left me a bit puzzled...I'm sure a few of you know of what chart I speak...and if I've done the exercise correctly, I'll probably do a piece on all of that at some date. Like I said, this Lot of Basis is quite a new thing to me.]
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
In calculating the Foundation ("Basis" or "Pillar"), we find that the early Islamic-transitional era practitioners (who seem to have used this Lot much more frequenty than the earlier Greco/Romans did) gave reversed formula for day/night: eg, the day formula was asc+POS-POF, while the night formula was asc+POF-POS; so the significator and trigger elements, reversed for diurnal vs nocturnal nativities.
In my own use of the "Foundation" ("Basis"), which I have applied for synastry evaluation purposes (which I have given a few examples of in posts to some synastry questions here on AW) I stick to only one formula, regardless of day or night, and that forumla is asc+POS-POF.
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
In calculating the Foundation ("Basis" or "Pillar"), we find that the early Islamic-transitional era practitioners (who seem to have used this Lot much more frequenty than the earlier Greco/Romans did) gave reversed formula for day/night: eg, the day formula was asc+POS-POF, while the night formula was asc+POF-POS; so the significator and trigger elements, reversed for diurnal vs nocturnal nativities.
In my own use of the "Foundation" ("Basis"), which I have applied for synastry evaluation purposes (which I have given a few examples of in posts to some synastry questions here on AW) I stick to only one formula, regardless of day or night, and that forumla is asc+POS-POF.

I agree as to dirunal formulas in general...possibly overall...Oh my, then I applied a nocturnal formula!!?!...I wonder what that might other wise be the 'Part' of,,,as per a 'Fortuna' ~ 'Spirit', like comparison?... I am going to pose this one to my clairvoyant friend and see what she comes up with.
It's been a 'slice', ya' all. Thanks for the edification!
 
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piercethevale

Well-known member
I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that at least one member of the forum will be curious as to what I derived for the chart I've been 'championing' as being that of a certain well known and very controversial person in Biblical history.
By the formula Dr. Farr says is diurnal, i.e. Asc. + Part of Spirit - Part of Fortune, I get 25* Libra 36'. The Sabain Symbol for this degree, i.e. the 26th of Libra is certainly one that 'fits the profile' if this particular formula does actually reveal what has been defined here in this thread.
The 'nocturnal formula', produces 05* Virgo 50'.
Considering that my diurnal Part calcs. to 01* Taurus 33' and what the Sabian Symbol that is found for the 2nd degree of Taurus is and that the nocturnal formula produces, 02* Gemini 47', I would agree with Dr. Farr and stick with my general rule of thumb when dealing with Parts/Lots which call for reversal of formulae depending of whether it is night or day. That being to only use the 'Day Formulas' for all Parts regardless of time of day.
I consider the Symbolism found at these diurnal charts to be that of a 'Basis of Being'. The nocturnal formula would then have to be something indicative of that is the antonym of that...of ones 'Basis'.
Anyone that is curious/interested [that one person I know that is reading this anyways] can read the symbols I identified above for them self and see what I mean.
[I apologize to the 'Trads' here, but I'm only giving the link to the Sabian Symbols site {Free, no charge...} ... while I did talk about them I didn't recite once from Rudhyars text nor did I post a single word of description or paraphrase any definitions.]
Sabian Symbols site:
http://mindfire.ca/The Sabian Symbols/An Astrological Mandala - Virgo 1-15.htm
 

poyi

Premium Member
Re: 10 rules of Antoine Garth

Look for this:

1. Seek the Lot of Fortune and note whether it is either angular (in the 1st, 10th, Seventh, Fourth) or in the house of the Good Spirit (11th or 5th). If Fortune is found in any of those houses, take a note.
(Find the Lot of Fortune and determine whether it is angular, or if it culminates from the
Ascendant. Culminate means to count ten houses away. Or, if it culminates from the Lot of
Fortune . That’s our first, ‘ooh, something’s going on here.’ As an addendum to that, if you see
the Lot of Fortune in these houses, you will start to get interested. In any house, the Lot of
Fortune can show great fortune, but in these particular houses, it tends to be a marker or kind
of like a sign post. 1st house, 10th house, Seventh house, Fourth house, Eleventh House, Fifth
House. In general those are the ‘good’ houses, the productive houses of the chart.)


2. If the ruler of the Lot of Fortune culminates – that means if it is ten houses away from the Lot of Fortune or the Ascendant.

3. If the ruler of the Lot of Spirit culminates from the Lot of Fortune, or the
Ascendant, but most specifically from the Lot of Fortune.

4. If the ruler of the Exaltation is culminating from the Lot of Spirit or the
Ascendant.

5. If the ruler of the Spirit is on the Fortune, and the ruler of the Fortune is on the Spirit.

6. If the ruler of the Lot of Basis is with the Lot of Fortune that creates – not
gigantically notable but notable nonetheless.
If the ruler of the Basis is on the Lot of
Fortune , or the Spirit, if it’s on either of these lots – that’s good.

7. If the ruler of the fortune is on the Spirit, the ruler of Spirit is on the Basis
and the ruler of Basis is on the fortune.

8. If all four of fortune, Spirit, Exaltation, Basis are exalted or in their own
domicile – or even just two of the four.

9. If there is an exalted planet on the Lot of Fortune , Spirit, Basis, Exaltation, it creates notable genitures. Exalted planets on any of the lots but especially the Lot of Fortune and the lot of Exaltation.

10. If a benefic is with the ruler of the Lot of Fortune. If Jupiter is exalted it’s even better.

Omnisphericus! I would like to ask a few questions if you don't mind :joyful:?

1. My LOF is in 10th house in Cancer sign

2. Ruler is the Moon, Capricorn in detriment but trine Mars as Mars' exaltation sign less than 2 degrees trine, Moon sextile Mercury, Mars sextile Mercury.

3-10...I am not quite sure. I post my chart here instead!!

View attachment 29283

I am new to Arabic Parts, currently exploring them :happy:
 
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Omnisphericus

Well-known member
Re: 10 rules of Antoine Garth

Omnisphericus! I would like to ask a few questions if you don't mind :joyful:?

1. My LOF is in 10th house in Cancer sign

2. Ruler is the Moon, Capricorn in detriment but trine Mars as Mars' exaltation sign less than 2 degrees trine, Moon sextile Mercury, Mars sextile Mercury.

3-10...I am not quite sure. I post my chart here instead!!

View attachment 29283

I am new to Arabic Parts, currently exploring them :happy:

In this method Whole Signs are assumed.
Your Fortune would be in the 11th Sign.
Your Moon is in 7th from Fortune and that is good - it is angular. It is in 5th from Ascendant = the house of Good Fortune.
Spirit is in 5th from Fortune and its Ruler - Mars in 1st or in 11th from Fortune - the House of Acquisitions.
These are not bad positions, you need to calculate the Basis and Lot of Exaltation and match these two with the Spirit and Fortune and their rulers.
 

poyi

Premium Member
Re: 10 rules of Antoine Garth

In this method Whole Signs are assumed.
Your Fortune would be in the 11th Sign.
Your Moon is in 7th from Fortune and that is good - it is angular. It is in 5th from Ascendant = the house of Good Fortune.
Spirit is in 5th from Fortune and its Ruler - Mars in 1st or in 11th from Fortune - the House of Acquisitions.
These are not bad positions, you need to calculate the Basis and Lot of Exaltation and match these two with the Spirit and Fortune and their rulers.

Thanks! :biggrin:

Basis - Ascendant + Fortuna - Lot of Spirit...

Exaltation -- Depends on whether the chart is diurnal, or nocturnal. If by day, this is the amount of whole signs away from the sun's position to aries, if by night, the amount of whole signs away the moon is from taurus (always counting the sign you start at). Then, the amount of whole signs away from the ascendant (wherever the asc is, not the fortune first house) is the native's place of exaltation.

Use these method to calculate?

BTW, since you mentioned about whole sign housing then I remembered several members in the forum also recommended whole sign housing system..Man! :w00t:I love whole sign housing now because the interpretation is far more accurate than Placidus (IMO!). Apparently whole sign system is the oldest system. I came from Chinese astrology background, like Vedic we also use whole sign system. The chart style we used look exactly the same as the south Indian Chart style. Thanks!
 
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theV

Well-known member
Re: Calculations of the Lots

Lot of Fortuna:
Asc + Moon - Sun (by day)
Asc + Sun - Moon (by night)

I am night born 3:45 am,I was in first quarter moon I think that make my Part in my 4th house,all people born during first quarter moon has 4th house POF,my part of fortune is in Scorpio 2°40,it ruler pluto is is 27°59 socrpio moving toward the 5th house (3 degree away),It conjunct moon 7 deg,and contra parallel sun/venus

Lot of Spirit
Asc + Sun - Moon (by night)
Asc + Moon - Sun (by night)

With POF in scorpio,that make my POS is in taurus 9°34 in the 10th house,it ruler venus is in the second house conjunct my sun

Lot of Basis
Asc + Lot of Fortuna - Lot of Spirit

My lot of basis is in leo 6°24 tightly conjunct my ASC,it contrapallel the moon,the ruler Of LOB sun is in virgo conjunct venus

Pars Hyleg
Asc + Moon - SAN (syzygy, the last lunation prior birth).

My Pars of hyleg is in scorpio 9°39 opposite my POS

Exaltation
The amount of signs from the placement of the Sun to the Aries, then that number of signs added to the Ascendant (by day).
The same but instead of the Sun and Aries, you go with the Moon and Taurus (places of exaltation).

Day Lot = Asc. + 19 Ar - Su; Night Lot = Asc. + 3 Ta - Mo

Is in 03'40 capricorn in the sixth house,it ruler saturn is in the 9th house only
1'55' degree

 

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dr. farr

Well-known member
The Basis was also known as the "Foundation" of the horoscope, and was used during Islamic transitional era times, upon through the time of Guido Bonatti; use of this Lot rapidly disappeared (unfortunately) during the Renaissance time: I consider this Lot, together with the Pars Hyleg and Part of Life, the central trilogy in any natal chart (with further additional input from the Lot of Fortune and the Lot of Spirit).
A "Foundation" chart can be erected by using the "Basis" (Foundation) as the denominator of the 1st house, the rest of the chart being turned around that point.
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
Ive been researching these points a bit lately. Are there any good books on the parts of spirit and fortune?


Try L. Weber's "Arabian Parts Decoded", and J. Hill's booklet "Part of Fortune in Astrology"; Zoller's "The Arabic Parts", though now dated, is important for a philosophical understanding of the Lots: the Weber and Hill books are more for practical applications and delineations...
 

poyi

Premium Member
Re: 10 rules of Antoine Garth

In this method Whole Signs are assumed.
Your Fortune would be in the 11th Sign.
Your Moon is in 7th from Fortune and that is good - it is angular. It is in 5th from Ascendant = the house of Good Fortune.
Spirit is in 5th from Fortune and its Ruler - Mars in 1st or in 11th from Fortune - the House of Acquisitions.
These are not bad positions, you need to calculate the Basis and Lot of Exaltation and match these two with the Spirit and Fortune and their rulers.

Wow it has been a while since I started learning Western astrology. Feeling a bit embarrassed reading my own newbie posts :lol: Approaching nearly 2 years later, I still find Omnispherius's post very inspiring and totally made a lot of sense to me particularly now after working more on derived house method.

I wonder how do we calculate Lot of Exaltation. What is Basis by the way?
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
Re: 10 rules of Antoine Garth

Basis is a Lot mentioned by Bonatti and extensively applied during the Islamic transitional era: it was looked at as part of the "fundamental natal Lot" basis of a horoscope, together with the Pars Hyleg and the Pars Vitae (Part of Life); the Basis (ascendant + POF - POS) can be used as the first house of a "Foundation" chart, perhaps even more effectively than the Fortuna chart (where the POF is used as the first house of the turned horoscope)
 

poyi

Premium Member
I always wish I could read all languages Latin, Greek, Arabic etc so I can learn their astrology first handed! Language is a huge barrier to learn advance astrology more than anything else! :sick::(:crying:
 

poyi

Premium Member
Wooooow I google Part of Basis and Exaltation and found this Awsome member RayAustin who has not logged in for a very long time (shame). His thread is relevant to this thread so I will link it here.

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13197

In his signature he even said:

“Famous are those persons in whose Nativities the Moon receives the light of many Planets.”
—Cardanus.

I do remember reading Moon and it aspects from planets signify fame in one of my many books.
 
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