December 21, 2012

F

flare

Active member
Has anyone calculated how long it'll take for a black hole to swallow the whole earth if it was created by something such as Large Hadron Collider. Could December 21, 2012 refer to when the earth or universe is TOTALLY destroyed?


[Moderator note - thread moved here from the 'Other branches of Astrology' board, as it has nothing to do with Astrology.]
 
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Sanaqua

Sanaqua

Well-known member
Personally, i believe on astrology but i dont believe that World will end on this date. It could mean very very big changes but not the destruction really. I would say you to be optimistic in this regard. :)
But you can search some Scientific website dealin' with astronomy, space and Physics stuff to know your answer about Blackhole.
 
Matthew The Astrologer

Matthew The Astrologer

Well-known member
1) It would depend entirely on the mass of the hole in question, but what you saw in the last "Star Trek" movie is roughly accurate.

2) The LHC doesn't and cannot produce a black hole of any magnitude beyond the quantum level... and those appear and disappear all the time without doing any harm.

3) The world isn't ending in 2012.

4) There's still no such thing as "Nibiru."

Thank you. :)
 
Kuntuzangmo

Kuntuzangmo

Well-known member
From everyone I've talked to and researched about in the Native cultures of the Americas and others......the winter solstice 2012 is pointing to a time of transformation and renewal that is already occurring now.
Sadly, many ignore the renewal part which is rather excellent and can been seen all around us. We get stuck in these frightening visions of destruction and doom. Personally I feel this is a magnificent time of awakening....and all can benefit if they turn their mind and hearts within.
 
F

FreeVirgo

Active member
Kuntuzangmo said:
From everyone I've talked to and researched about in the Native cultures of the Americas and others......the winter solstice 2012 is pointing to a time of transformation and renewal that is already occurring now.
Sadly, many ignore the renewal part which is rather excellent and can been seen all around us. We get stuck in these frightening visions of destruction and doom. Personally I feel this is a magnificent time of awakening....and all can benefit if they turn their mind and hearts within.
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I so agree with this Kuntu!! I think so many people are stuck on the negative aspects or loss of way of life that they refuse to see that it is also a wonderful opportunity to begin and start new things!! Like our economy is collapsing (worldwide), business, govenments, tyrannies... this is the time to rebuid or replace new structures in its place.. JMO
 
A

AspieTaurus

Well-known member
the 2012 stuff is so much nonsense. It is nothing but the result of a Mayan mathematician calculating the calender out to 2012 and then said, "OK, I think that is far enough". I wonder how many hucksters have made millions scamming people selling all these 2012 books.

Unfortunately, given that we will be in a very eventful and transformative time over the next 20 years the 2012 hucksters will pick up the smallest thing and claim they were right. :rolleyes:
 
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Kuntuzangmo

Kuntuzangmo

Well-known member
AspieTaurus said:
the 2012 stuff is so much nonsense. It is nothing but the result of a Mayan mathematician calculating the calender out to 2012 and then said, "OK, I think that is far enough". I wonder how many hucksters have made millions scamming people selling all these 2012 books.

Unfortunately, given that we will be in a very eventful and transformative time over the next 20 years the 2012 hucksters will pick up the smallest thing and claim they were right. :rolleyes:
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Well Aspie, the Mayans were A+ astronomers, more accurate than the Europeans. So when they say it's the end of a cycle and the start of a new one, we can bank on that. How this change is interpreted depends on whose heart and mind the information lands. Some beings have such a negative world view embedded in their mythology, they are convinced it's the end of the world and also welcome it because somehow according to their story a world teacher will emerge out of the ashes and take them to a god realm. I personally feel this view is a cheap way out of responsibility to protect our planet and to run rampant with negativity.
Other views see this as a time of awakening and that everyone has an opportunity to take care and responsibility for their role on the planet, as part of one family. And I'm sure there are other views as well. We have only one home. If we human animals don't protect it, cherish it and its diverse species, as individuals and collectively, in my opinion we've missed the boat and are headlong speeding to our own demise. Most humans have forgotten they are just another animal and in our arrogance and lack of appreciation of how nature works think we can just take and take and take. Mother nature will balance out our ignorance, with or without us.
Many do remember and are desperately doing what they can to give back, protect, purify and cherish that which gives us all life.
I hope that all these divergent viewpoints will at least get together and discuss these crucial matters.
 
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tikana

tikana

Well-known member
AspieTaurus said:
the 2012 stuff is so much nonsense. It is nothing but the result of a Mayan mathematician calculating the calender out to 2012 and then said, "OK, I think that is far enough". I wonder how many hucksters have made millions scamming people selling all these 2012 books.

Unfortunately, given that we will be in a very eventful and transformative time over the next 20 years the 2012 hucksters will pick up the smallest thing and claim they were right. :rolleyes:
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yepp yepp

nothing will happen at all!

World is not coming to the end, Kunt
 
Mark

Mark

Well-known member
This is a simple matter of misunderstanding. The year 2012 has to do with the end of the world as we know it. The planet will still be here. There will still be humans doing people stuff. Many things will continue, but things will never be the same again. Said that way, we realise that nothing will ever be the same again anyway. Tomorrow is always different than today. All the hype about the "end of the world" is a fear reaction to the idea of losing something. If you face forward, you will see that old endings are followed by new beginnings. It's all a matter of perspective.
 
A

AspieTaurus

Well-known member
Mark said:
This is a simple matter of misunderstanding. The year 2012 has to do with the end of the world as we know it. The planet will still be here. There will still be humans doing people stuff. Many things will continue, but things will never be the same again. Said that way, we realise that nothing will ever be the same again anyway. Tomorrow is always different than today. All the hype about the "end of the world" is a fear reaction to the idea of losing something. If you face forward, you will see that old endings are followed by new beginnings. It's all a matter of perspective.
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I agree, though in my reading the "Time of change" started in 2008 and the Mayan 2012 stuff has nothing to do with it, though Pluto moving into Capricorn possibly does, as does an 80-year long social cycle (Uranus involved?) described by the social historian Neil Howe and the late social historian and political insider William Strauss in their 1991 book Generations and their 1997 book The Fourth Turning. According to them we are now at the start of a "Crisis Era" similar to the American and French Revolutions, the US Civil War and the unification of Germany and Italy, and the Great Depression and WW2; and this Crisis Era will last until the late 2020s.

Interestingly enough, all the modern planets were discovered in or just before these Crisis Eras, Uranus during the American Revolution, Neptune just before the Liberal Revolutions of 1848, Pluto at the start of the Great Depression, and Eris at the start of this Crisis Era.
 
tikana

tikana

Well-known member
I am pretty sure there will be suicides or some ppl will claim that mayan calculations are off (ohh wait that already happened)
 
tikana

tikana

Well-known member
Mark said:
tikana: You have evidence that says nothing will happen? Please do tell.
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Try Common sense, Mark .. i am not some mad sheep who will follow a blind hysterical shepherd. Voltaire was right when he said "Common sense is not so common!" .. show me 1 mayan prediction that came true thus far.. isnt it easy to say The world will come to the end thousands years ahead vs saying the world will come to the end next year? how many predictions of the end of the world didnt come true? Look up the link i posted a few posts ago..

You ppl are so freaken blind! Even if there is a way put a telescope in your eyes, you still wont see...Mayan calendar STOPPED on dec 21 2012 okay fine... blind sheep screaming "The world is coming to the end!" Now "ohhh nooo now it is not the world that is coming to the end but the world is changing!" ... REALLY ??? why the h*ll the calendar stopped? OF COURSE the world does change.. the way the world viewed itself changed on Sept 11 2001 for mostly for americans.. The world has changed in the middle east when Egypt kicked out their dictator.. Now whole middle east is rising ... All predictions that you ppl come up with about Dec 21 2012 is all about fitting the slogan "MAYANS are right!" just for the sake of it.


Process of ellumination
1. Asteroid impact
None seen atm .. for astronomers to see incoming asteroid, the asteroid will be seen after it passes the sun which takes YEARS ahead of the impact.

2. Gamma-ray burst
None close to us to impact

3. Collapse of the vacuum
Great theory - chances of that happening are 1% IF that

4. Rogue black holes
Takes centuries to reach Earth. It will be noticed when it enters our galaxy - NO one saw anything

5. Giant solar flares
it is a bit too early - we had one of those when north and south flipped.

6. Flood-basalt volcanism
Not enough to kill an entire population

7. Super volcano ..
AGAIN maybe 90% will be wiped off BUT it wont be eand of the world.
None of the supervolcanos are showing any signs of activity

8 Global epidemics
Well Black plague only recent mass plague - people survived and prospered

9 Global warming
Ehh not enough to kill everyone on dec 21 2012

10 Biotech disaster
Again the govts of the worlds have stored all seeds of fruits veggies whatever else just in case. it is not overnight disaster that can destroy the earth

11 Global war
we do not have strong armies anywhere in the world to start up a war. At the same token if there is a nuclear explosion somewhere nukes and etc - it wont end the world

12. Mass insanity
That is probably what will kill earth - INSANE PEOPLE!

Other than Dec 21 2012 - Mayan calendar - do you have anything to suport your theory that something will happen?

T
 
Mark

Mark

Well-known member
tikana: If you'll recall from my post before last, I wasn't arguing for the end of the world. I don't think people will be wiped out and I don't think anything because of the Mayan calendar. Actually, I doubt all modern interpretations of ancient calendars. I don't trust modern people (even modern "Mayans") to properly interpret the ancient Mayan calendar any more than I trust modern people (including modern Jews) to interpret the ancient Hebrew calendar. All of the people who knew how those calendars really work are dead. Thus, any modern conclusions drawn from ancient calendars are questionable at best.

Further, all you've done is named a bunch of things that won't happen. I can do that too. Supermodels won't rain from the sky, splatting on impact. Cows won't develop technology to threaten us. I can do this for a while, actually. What I asked in my last post is what reason you have to believe that nothing will happen. The fact that many specific things won't happen can't be generalised into "nothing will happen." If you don't have a reason to believe anything particular will happen, then that's what you should say. Even further, something will happen on December 21, 2012, because something happens on every day. I don't know what it will be, but I've never seen a day in which nothing happened. If you would be so kind as to debate fairly, I'll gladly tell my thinking on the matter.

I know that our development is, in fact, accelerating. We have refined and changed more in the last 100 years than in the previous 1,000 years. We are now slowly becoming a global culture that ties together all parts of the world. More than 100 years ago, how could social and political upheavals in Egypt effect anyone across the Atlantic? Then they couldn't, but now they can. By anyone's definitions, we are now moving into a state of being in which people in any part of the world are capable of effecting distant parts or even the whole world.

In a sense, our "collective mind" is getting bigger. Just as in the past we made the transitions from thinking about families to thinking about tribes, from tribes to nations, and from nations to empires, a great many people all over the world are now beginning to think globally. We have the ability to communicate, travel, act, and think farther and faster than we ever have in all of our recorded history. We can see that the people of Earth are changing systemically. Our systems (including our thinking) are now transitioning from a superpower/impirial mode of operations to a global mode. This will have definite consequences for everyone who depends on these systems (the entire "modern" world).

What I see is that we are getting closer and closer to a tipping point in our dealings with each other. We are nearing a point where something's gotta give. When it does, our systems will collapse, many will suffer and die, and then we will build bigger and better systems than ever before with all the knowledge we've gained along the way. This is the normal ebb and flow of societal evolution. I don't know when the triggers that will push us "over the edge" will happen, but I know they are coming because we are ripe for it.

It could also be thought of as a critical mass threshold. Once you've grown to a minimum point of sustainability, either your population must suddenly get smaller or your systems must change. Usually, these two go hand in hand. The harder we push to try to make our unsustainable habits continue to work, the harder it will be on all of us. The fact of the matter is that changes are coming. Maybe the events that will take place in 2012 will have something to do with that. Maybe they won't. All I know is that something's gotta give and soon.
 
tikana

tikana

Well-known member
Further, all you've done is named a bunch of things that won't happen. I can do that too.


*** AHHAHAHAHA now you make me laugh... seriously! you are too gullible to think that "WONT HAPPEN" actually stuff i wrote DOES and HAS happened. Collapse of the vacuum -I am pretty sure it WONT happen but then its only in theory and no one can prove one way or the other... Asteroid - FORGOT TUNGUSKA? If asteroid lands in one of the big cities say NY yeah the world will go into a spin -stock market of every country will collapse. Suprvolcano - again forgot mt Helen? one min it was dormant, within 2 months all hell broke loose. Supervolcanos HAVE erupted .. their waking time is unknown because there is no written record but we know they have eruped. There is geological evidence of that. When supervolcano does erupt, the ash of the volcano will circle the globe and wil lturn earth into ice ball for a few centuries. Again... there is enough evidence to support it. READ DUDE READ! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory***


\What I asked in my last post is what reason you have to believe that nothing will happen. The fact that many specific things won't happen can't be generalised into "nothing will happen." If you don't have a reason to believe anything particular will happen, then that's what you should say. Even further, something will happen on December 21, 2012, because something happens on every day.


** yawn .. sure whatever you say... What you are describing is sounds like a rant of New Agers. MAYANS didnt waste their time calculting such "important" date to THEM just so some New Agers in 21st century will be coming up with absolute lame interpretation. Astronomically i can explain you why dec 21 2012 is important but i refuse to follow mass hysteria. You said "The year 2012 has to do with the end of the world as we know it. " again my point is EVERy day the world changes Dec 21st will be no different !****

I don't know what it will be, but I've never seen a day in which nothing happened. If you would be so kind as to debate fairly, I'll gladly tell my thinking on the matter.

I know that our development is, in fact, accelerating. We have refined and changed more in the last 100 years than in the previous 1,000 years. We are now slowly becoming a global culture that ties together all parts of the world. More than 100 years ago, how could social and political upheavals in Egypt effect anyone across the Atlantic? Then they couldn't, but now they can.

** REAALLLY!? read history, pal, Egypt has been a focal point on Atlantic side for LONG LONG LONG time. As a matter of fact all started when Napoleon entered Egypt through west side Nile River in 1798. Britain's main interest was in stabilizing Egypt so Brits can trade. Why else d you think Suez canal project took off in 19th century? Where are Brits there are Americans ... UK was backing Ottoman empire Where is UK? ATLANTIC.. go on... ****

By anyone's definitions, we are now moving into a state of being in which people in any part of the world are capable of effecting distant parts or even the whole world.

**** havent we been doing that since 1900s? ***

In a sense, our "collective mind" is getting bigger. Just as in the past we made the transitions from thinking about families to thinking about tribes, from tribes to nations, and from nations to empires, a great many people all over the world are now beginning to think globally. We have the ability to communicate, travel, act, and think farther and faster than we ever have in all of our recorded history. We can see that the people of Earth are changing systemically. Our systems (including our thinking) are now transitioning from a superpower/impirial mode of operations to a global mode. This will have definite consequences for everyone who depends on these systems (the entire "modern" world).

*** " We have the ability to communicate, travel, act, and think farther and faster than we ever have in all of our recorded history." You just realized that?! where were you in 1920s? ****

What I see is that we are getting closer and closer to a tipping point in our dealings with each other.

*** Pisces delusion here? ****

We are nearing a point where something's gotta give. When it does, our systems will collapse, many will suffer and die, and then we will build bigger and better systems than ever before with all the knowledge we've gained along the way. This is the normal ebb and flow of societal evolution. I don't know when the triggers that will push us "over the edge" will happen, but I know they are coming because we are ripe for it.

*** :rolleyes: HOW IS THIS ISNT end of the world in your words? what you are describing is apocalypse .. RIGHT NOW i dont see 1 single shred of evidence of anyone being on the edge of tipping over. But then again if Facebook / YouTube / Tweeter will go belly up all at the same time, I BET YA there will be some deaths and collapses!****


It could also be thought of as a critical mass threshold. Once you've grown to a minimum point of sustainability, either your population must suddenly get smaller or your systems must change. Usually, these two go hand in hand. The harder we push to try to make our unsustainable habits continue to work, the harder it will be on all of us. The fact of the matter is that changes are coming. Maybe the events that will take place in 2012 will have something to do with that. Maybe they won't. All I know is that something's gotta give and soon

**** You do realize that most people DO NOT know how to survive in the wild. Hardly anyone knows how to SURVIVE on bare basics. right? "All I know is that something's gotta give and soon" that is in YOUR mind .. what you are descibing is called BOTTLENECK phenomenon .. BOTTLENECK HAS happened before at least once. Last one known happened 70,000 years ago, .. It was Toba catastrophy - super volcano in Toba erupted. KNOWLEDGE IS POWER! ***
 
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