Childhood trauma?

l1lp

Active member
Childhood trauma in natal chart?

Hey guys,
What kind of childhood trauma this person might have had? What are they dealing with that 8 house Saturn/Mars/Neptune conjunct? Chiron Conjunct Jupiter on ASC? Pluto conjunct Lilith in 6th?

On the outside they are mature, successful, talented super functional and career driven, social, but underneath theres something very dark brooding, fear of rejection, intimacy problems, depression, seasonal mental mood swings, drinking/substance abuse then switching to sobriety, suicidal thoughts

What do you see in this chart?
 

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l1lp

Active member
I just checked and Dejanira is conjunct Child and conjunct Mars in 8th house, could this be a clue?
 

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MoonBucket

Well-known member
May I ask, what is your relationship with this person?

Are the drinking and depression something you could discuss with them directly, to encourage them to seek help (which would probably involve counseling to help them sort out their underlying issues)?

Do they seem at all willing to seek healing for themselves?
 
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l1lp

Active member
May I ask, what is your relationship with this person?

Are the drinking and depression something you could discuss with them directly, to encourage them to seek help?

Do they seem at all willing to seek healing for themselves?

Its somone im really close with but due to the above behaviour keeping distance atm.
They are not a toxic presence and very caring but trying to talk to them about these issues triggers like a split personality that goes in circles.
They have been in therapy but it doesnt seem to be helpful becouse i feel like they might have a deep rooted issue they are in denial and /or unaware of. They mentioned that therapist said that in order to progress with their relationship problems in life they need to face deeply rooted emotions from childhood but the person said they dont want to go into that and stoped the therapy.

As i said for the outside world they are extremly outgoing and socially sucesfull, when u get to know them - intimate relationship open up some deeply rooted depressed states.

From their words - loads of suicidal thoughts, something to do with childhood and mentioning bad relationship with father who was an alcoholic. I met their family and they have quite nice and normal relationship w them, parents are still together etc.

Its a big enigma
Looking at the chart i see loads of things that are accurate to their personality, also few suspicious things pointing to abuse? but im not a great specialist in astrology so would love some help with this!
 
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MoonBucket

Well-known member
Its somone im really close with but due to the above behaviour keeping distance atm.
They are not a toxic presence and very caring but trying to talk to them about these issues triggers like a split personality that goes in circles.
They have been in therapy but it doesnt seem to be helpful becouse i feel like they might have a deep rooted issue they are in denial and /or unaware of. They mentioned that therapist said that in order to progress with their relationship problems in life they need to face deeply rooted emotions from childhood but the person said they dont want to go into that and stoped the therapy.

As i said for the outside world they are extremly outgoing and socially sucesfull, when u get to know them - intimate relationship open up some deeply rooted depressed states.

From their words - loads of suicidal thoughts, something to do with childhood and mentioning bad relationship with father who was an alcoholic. I met their family and they have quite nice and normal relationship w them, parents are still together etc.

Its a big enigma
Looking at the chart i see loads of things that are accurate to their personality, also few suspicious things pointing to abuse? but im not a great specialist in astrology so would love some help with this!

Thank you. I feel more comfortable saying something now. I'm just a beginner in astrology, so please keep that in mind.

EDIT: Sorry, just noticed the tilted MC -- please disregard previous comments about empty 4th and [edit: meant 10th, not 9th] houses -- I misidentified the houses.

Recently I read that a lot of people with addiction issues have a Chiron-Uranus opposition (I have both that opposition as well as long-term problems in that area). The Mars-Saturn conjunction (fading) and Neptune in Capricorn are probably also indicators for potential addiction.

Neptune is close enough to Uranus (remember these are outer planets, so this near conjuction is a generational aspect) that it is probably participating somehow in the Chiron-Uranus opposition.

As for Chiron, its placement in the first house indicates a wounded self-concept. Cancer represents home and security.

Of course the other end of that opposition is in the 7th house of relationships, colored by Capricorn, so this corresponds to the childhood wounding of self and sense of security affecting relationships with others. Those particular four planets in Capricorn in the 7th and 8th houses probably don't help either.

So really, you have already identified by observation the problem areas and probable root cause(s) that are reflected in the chart.

He's going to have to heal that deep wound indicated by Chiron but it won't happen until he is ready to seek help for himself. He'll have to deal with that trauma sometime by talk therapy or whatever, to resolve it and move on.

The Sun and Moon are also in opposition, and forming helpful angles to Mars, Saturn, and Neptune in Capricorn -- so this could be a big sign of hope. Someone with more experience would have to comment on that potential, though.

Wishing you and him the best,
MB
 
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l1lp

Active member
So really, you have already identified by observation the problem areas and probable root cause(s) that are reflected in the chart.

He's going to have to heal that deep wound indicated by Chiron but it won't happen until he is ready to seek help for himself.

Wishing you and him the best,
MB

Thank you for looking at the chart MoonBucket!
I will have a closer look at the aspects you pointed out, it's really helpful

I absolutely agree with you in regards to the fact the person needs to be ready to face their problems. Their Saturn return in Capricorn just started, and being in 8th house - I really feel like they are going to be processing these past themes and emotional traumas and leaving them in the past

The opposition you pointed out is very interesting and rings true. My initial feeling even before looking at the chart was - there is some deeply rooted childhood trauma that person might be in denial of or trying to justify (8 house?) that affects their feeling of identity/self worth on subconscious level (1 house) - making it impossible to build intimacy/close relationship (7th house). Person has such a strong personality and doing so well socially, they built up great life but as soon as prospectively positive and promising relationship gets in the picture - it triggers this whole trauma-chain and they basically go into weird unexplained depressive states. But even tho the states are scary and emotional, I feel the fact the chain is triggered is a good sign they will make their way out during this Saturn return. Obv they have my support if anything

The only thing that sort of scares me is that trauma indicators Dejanira and Child is in 8 house.
 

ZoraEos

Well-known member
Re: Childhood trauma in natal chart?

Hey guys,
What kind of childhood trauma this person might have had? What are they dealing with that 8 house Saturn/Mars/Neptune conjunct? Chiron Conjunct Jupiter on ASC? Pluto conjunct Lilith in 6th?

On the outside they are mature, successful, talented super functional and career driven, social, but underneath theres something very dark brooding, fear of rejection, intimacy problems, depression, seasonal mental mood swings, drinking/substance abuse then switching to sobriety, suicidal thoughts

What do you see in this chart?

Hi! I am very curious to take a closer look at this chart. But I prefer Equal Houses, I don't find Placidus to be as accurate as Equal House. Can you also upload the chart in Equal Houses?

I am very curious to interpret this chart because he reminds me a bit of me -Mature and Successful on the outside, but a bit darker or more depressed on the inside. I can relate to relationships setting off a trauma chain for me and having intimacy problems/fear of rejection. I also had an alcoholic father. I have never had drinking or substance abuse however (Unless coffee counts :) ). I think he may be a bit of a perfectionist, maybe very hard on himself. Astrologically so far, I see that he has the same Sun-Moon opposition, Sun-Mercury conjunction, and Moon-Mercury opposition as me.
 

MoonBucket

Well-known member
Just checked the current planets:

Hmm, Mars (12 Cap) and Saturn (9 Cap) are both transiting his 7th house, in between his natal Uranus and Neptune, at the other end of the "wand" (my term) from Chiron.

Not sure what that will mean for that natal Uranus-Chiron axis, but I feel the Mars-Saturn conjunction (it was exact on April 2) was significant for me somehow and I'm surprised there hasn't been a general thread about it here.

Transiting Pluto (21 Cap) has been in conjunction with his Saturn, so might help with purging or transforming old Saturnian issues.

I think this might be good news: Venus at 11 Taurus is sextile his Chiron and trine his natal Uranus-Neptune (plus the transiting Mars-Saturn mentioned above) so might be able to help smooth things over among all those relatively difficult elements and help them to work together for good.
 
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l1lp

Active member
Re: Childhood trauma in natal chart?

Hi! I am very curious to take a closer look at this chart. But I prefer Equal Houses, I don't find Placidus to be as accurate as Equal House. Can you also upload the chart in Equal Houses?

I am very curious to interpret this chart because he reminds me a bit of me -Mature and Successful on the outside, but a bit darker or more depressed on the inside. I can relate to relationships setting off a trauma chain for me and having intimacy problems/fear of rejection. I also had an alcoholic father. I have never had drinking or substance abuse however (Unless coffee counts :) ). I think he may be a bit of a perfectionist, maybe very hard on himself. Astrologically so far, I see that he has the same Sun-Moon opposition, Sun-Mercury conjunction, and Moon-Mercury opposition as me.

Hello ZoraEos - thank you!
Here is equal house chart, would be really helpful to hear what you think, especially since you have so much in common
 

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l1lp

Active member
Just checked the current planets:

Hmm, Mars (12 Cap) and Saturn (9 Cap) are both transiting his 7th house, in between his natal Uranus and Neptune, at the other end of the "wand" (my term) from Chiron.

Not sure what that will mean for that natal Uranus-Chiron axis, but I feel the Mars-Saturn conjunction (it was exact on April 2) was significant for me somehow and I'm surprised there hasn't been a general thread about it here.
d.

I have seen you mentioning Mars-Saturn somewhere and wanted to reply - I felt it very intensely as well (feeling low energy, bad sleep patterns, generally very lethargic and lifeless) but I can’t say about significance or anything since basically everything that’s been going on in transit since December is happening on my Saturn return placement, so I’m not sure where it’s all going :alien:
 

MoonBucket

Well-known member
|1|p, I'm glad you mentioned the trauma aspect of the 8th house because that was a gap in my knowledge, and I think it's relevant and worth investigating in my own chart.

Interesting that with Equal Houses we are back to empty 4th and [edit: 10th] houses and four planets in Capricorn in the 7th house. I'll have to read up on the pros and cons of house systems now.

Also looking forward to ZoraEos's views.
 
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l1lp

Active member
|1|p, I'm glad you mentioned the trauma aspect of the 8th house because that was a gap in my knowledge, and I think it's relevant and worth investigating in my own chart.

Interesting that with Equal Houses we are back to empty 4th and 9th houses and four planets in Capricorn in the 7th house. I'll have to read up on the pros and cons of house systems now.

I just wanted to say that your commemt on what empty 4th 9th house meant was quite close to reality. Person is a workaholic and is extremely driven to be usefull/importaint for everyone around them. Bascially need to be loved by literally everyone but not in an egoistic but more of a childish way. Thats how i seen it and it blew my mind - like a child trying to win love and appreciation of parent.
They sort of parent everyone around them, take care, look after, help literally everyone, put their soul in this only to get really depressed when people wont reciprocate. The trick is that they especially happy to do this for co-workers, casual friends, strangers etc, people at a safe distance and would alianate themselves from somone who loves them unconditionally. Too scared to get all the love and care back unconditionaly becouse their trauma means they are scared they will eventually get rejected or pushed away or hurt?

But i need to point out that all of the above is not visible to anyone around them, not even to the person themselves. I think its due to my Pluto conjunct Moon Scorpio 8 house - i read somwhere that i trigger transformation in everyone i get close with and i feel its super accurate. Its also why i am interested to understand all this more as it also affects me etc

I would say that our connection was a nuclear trigger for both but in different life areas I dont know if composit would help here but its all about transformations and metamorphosis
 
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Therese

Well-known member
Do you think your friend would be open to forms of therapy that are not so much centered on talking? Some form of body-focused therapy or art therapy, etc.

Those who suffer trauma are often silenced by their environment - most people do their best to avoid having to empathize with victims too much because it is unpleasant and painful. And when it's a child, parents often feel guilt and shame about what happened (especially if abuse or neglect is involved) and they often just want to make it go away and/or pretend nothing happened. That means the child has to do the same, or else.

This puts the child in a situation where they feel betrayed and/or abandoned, left alone with their fear, anger and pain. It's actually another trauma on top of the other - they become "bad", "unwanted" and/or "invisible". But you cannot undo trauma, you can only work through it. If that's not happening and they don't get help, the person can develop a feeling that there is some "dark" or "bad" power at their very core, and they might avoid intimate relationships so they don't "contaminate" others.

In any case, they often mistrust words and verbal communication because it has been used against them one way or another. They might need to establish a connection with a therapist first via a non-verbal way, and then develop trust in words and their ability to communicate and being heard.
 

l1lp

Active member
Do you think your friend would be open to forms of therapy that are not so much centered on talking? Some form of body-focused therapy or art therapy, etc.

This puts the child in a situation where they feel betrayed and/or abandoned, left alone with their fear, anger and pain. It's actually another trauma on top of the other - they become "bad", "unwanted" and/or "invisible". But you cannot undo trauma, you can only work through it. If that's not happening and they don't get help, the person can develop a feeling that there is some "dark" or "bad" power at their very core, and they might avoid intimate relationships so they don't "contaminate" others.

Hello Therese! The person is in a very creative profession so I think its been an outlet in a way for their emotions/subconscious, in fact I think the passion they have for what they do will get them far and eventually help them.

you are right, very wise words - verbal communication isn't effective in many cases due to what you described. also often times person would want some help but they feel like trusting someone is dangerous so they keep it to themselves

As I said I feel like they will come around and find their way out of this in the process of their Saturn return. I am just trying to understand the themes of what they are dealing with with the help of Astrology. I want to see what aspects they have and what information their chart can provide so it's easier to navigate the situation without getting swiped away with a wave of confusion and emotion. I am quite empathic and sometimes can't tell when I feel someones emotions (learning about that Moon/Pluto/Scorpio/8house of my own makes it easier to deal with this) So as I said, I am learning about my own problematic moments and how to help without getting too involved or taking personal whats not really mine to deal with etc :alien:
 

Whoam1

Well-known member
Your Capricorn energy is kind of like. Mooood swing, and it's the most enigmatic of all the signs. Mars is in Capricorn, therefore exalted and I have this placement too, it increases the strength if Scorpio energy espicaly if there are other Scorpio bodies and Scorpio is the next most enigmatic sign. Your vertex is actually a third angle and it is in Scorpio, making your most angular planet Pluto. I argue Pluto is normally the most impersonal unemotional planet but your chart makes it personal, this planet wants to be left alone because it's been hurt so much. It also wants to blow things up and throw a wrench in every functioning system . I won't say it rules Scorpio but I will say it is strong there. Your Sun moon opposition also causes friction in your personality. I would say however that your sign is Capricorn try to learn more about it (not the business climbing b.s. but the dark and hurting Capricorn).
 

l1lp

Active member
Your Capricorn energy is kind of like. Mooood swing, and it's the most enigmatic of all the signs. Mars is in Capricorn, therefore exalted and I have this placement too, it increases the strength if Scorpio energy espicaly if there are other Scorpio bodies and Scorpio is the next most enigmatic sign. Your vertex is actually a third angle and it is in Scorpio, making your most angular planet Pluto. I argue Pluto is normally the most impersonal unemotional planet but your chart makes it personal, this planet wants to be left alone because it's been hurt so much. It also wants to blow things up and throw a wrench in every functioning system . I won't say it rules Scorpio but I will say it is strong there. Your Sun moon opposition also causes friction in your personality. I would say however that your sign is Capricorn try to learn more about it (not the business climbing b.s. but the dark and hurting Capricorn).

Thank you! I will try to learn about dark side of Capricorn as well.
It's not my chart but all of the above applies/similar to my own chart which made me realise how similar it is and maybe why im digging into this haha
 

l1lp

Active member
having said that I might attach our composite/synastry

Curious finds in Synastry:
My 8th house Pluto/Moon falls onto their Pluto/Lilith
Their Eros on my Asc, mine on their Saturn - instant connection
My name asteroid in their chart falls onto my Venus, My name asteroid in my chart falls on their Moon. Their surname asteroid is in my 10th house - this relationship greatly enchanted my career (we work in same field and have done loads of projects together benefiting to each other’s career actually) My asc connected to their 10house/mc (their birth time is slightly off so theres some room for speculation based on my experience w them as well)
My Sun conjuct their North Node, their Sun conjuct my North Node

Composte:
Sun conjunct North Node and Venus in 11 house Pieces
Juno 29 Capricorn close to MC
Heavy Capricorn 9th house
7th house Pluto/Scorpio / intensity transformation?

It’s a very intense relationship but for wierd reasons, both people are positive and caring towards each other but somehow it seems that us coming in contact triggers our plutonic/intensity in each other that makes us want to deal with each of our issues on our own. Hard to explain. I’m trying to figure it out with this theme
 

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l1lp

Active member
Also attaching the equal house here to see if it’s easier to understand <3

Thanx!
 

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