Black Sun ?

Orsoblu1

Member
Hi all,
please does anyone heard about the black sun in the natal chart ?
I know about the black moon / lilith, but I cannot find any information about the black sun and his interpretation and how can you calculate its positision.
Can anyone help me?
thank you,

:confused:

Ob1
 

starlink

Well-known member
Hello Orsoblu, welcome to the forum. No, there is no such thing as the black Sun, at least not that I am aware of, so dont worry. Black Moon is also something you dont have to really know about unless you are very advanced in astrology. Just start with the very basics, that way you can increase your knowledge step by step. There are basic natal explanations to be found in our Education Board. Have a look!

Cheers, Starlink
 

wilsontc

Staff member
Black Sun info, to Orso

Orso,

Normally we require that everyone posting a new posting give some astrological interpretation with their posting, but since your posting is about something no one knows about, I'll "let it slide" this time! :D In the future, when you post an astorological request about something in your chart, make sure to also give an astrological interpretation or, at least, an astrological "guess"! :D

I, like star, have never used the Black Sun and have no idea how to use it in astrology. But I did find something about it online:
Black Sun

The Black Sun is a mathematical point that corresponds to the position of the Sun when it is at Aphelion (that point in its apparent orbit when it is farthest from the Earth).

Sunnily,

TIm
 
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starnoud

I see Starlink is Dutch. She ( ? ) could have known better.... Because in her and my country there lives a certain George Bode.... best astrologer/writer I have ever experienced. He wrote a book about the Black Lights a long time ago. For some reason this 'stuff' is difficult for many people to understand or to accept or whatever. Unfortunately this beautiful book (I bought it at De Slegte, just a note for Starlink) is not to be found easily i guess.
Anyway, the Black MOON is VERY important [Off topic comment. Moderator]To be a bit specific: the Black Moon is simply ruler of Capricorn. Saturn is not.
This is and will be a shock for many astrologers and students but i can tell ya this: I am studying charts for 15 years now, and have always used Lilith the Black Moon (as given at astro dot com , although i calculate a corrected BM as well) and what I personally found: Lilith as ruler of Capricorn does make sense. I mean, I would dare to do some kind of funny test to see what makes more sense, Lilith or Saturn as ruler of Capricorn and therefore also interpretting the House(Cusp) that is in Capricorn. Maybe nice to start : look at people with Ascendant Capricorn and see the direct meaning of Lilith in those charts.
Well, to not make it too long here, something about the Black Sun:
Black Sun is in aprox 12 or 13 Cancer, it moves very slow so its been there for hundreds of years. We all have the Black Sun in say 13 Cancer. As with the Black Moon axis (Black Moon_____Priapus), also the Black Sun is about a polarity, an axis: Black Sun in 13 Cancer ________the Diamond in 13 Capricorn. Check it out, and you will be amazed (by finding out that historical people have Diamond conjuncts or themes). I wont say that I could easily explain this astrological 'mechanism' but I could try a bit. Since I am not afraid to make mistakes lol , just kidding.... here we go:
Look at our Solar system as 'a complete system', ok. It's got an 'opening' to what is 'outside', to other systems, to space, to the universe, to god.
This opening, you can imagine, will be the place where new energy enters. The Black Sun therefore has something to do with the skill of IMPROVISATION, for example. It is a very dynamic, fresh , 'young' energy. Vitalising, thats the word. (forgive me I am just Dutch looking for the right english words always, it is kinda tiring)
So the Black Sun is about
- new
- vitality
- blanc, not filled in
- democratic ! (since we all have the same Black Sun...)
- being absolutely free of restrictions, playtime ! (jazzmusic I would say)
- for you to think of other themes related to this energypoint where we still are able TO BE AMAZED (like how one sometimes feels seeing the incredible overwhelming hugeness of a sky full of soooooooo many starsssssss)
- yes, SPONTANITY too

Where the Diamond CAN be reached,fullfilled or so.... but it WILL take TIME (I see a connection with Saturn there). Our individual Diamond is only gonna shine (beautifully of course) when we become aware of things related to the house it is in or whatsoever.

Perhaps this is enough for now. Hope you can enjoy it. Thanks.:sunny:
 
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starlink

Well-known member
I see Starlink is Dutch. She ( YES, I am a she) could have known better.... Because in her and my country there lives a certain George Bode.... best astrologer/writer I have ever experienced.

Starnoud, I am Dutch but have not lived in Holland for over 40 years so I haven't got a clue about what goes on there astrologically apart from Karen Hamaker Zondag who's books I all have. I do however remember "De Slegte".
Surprised it still exists!

Many newcombers in this Forum have very little knowledge about Astrology to begin with, so in the light of that (Greenhorns lounge is for strict beginners and for those who have not given own interpretation in other forums on their own questions) I thought it wise, to let them know that to start looking at the Black Moon right at the beginning of their studies, is not advisable no matter how essential you might think this is. When you start with astrology there is enough to learn about the basics.

To be a bit specific: the Black Moon is simply ruler of Capricorn. Saturn is not.
Now, if you state a bit furtheron that this is just your own experience:
I wont say that I could easily explain this astrological 'mechanism'
, dont you think that your are doing the same thing you are telling us not to do ?, giving a "false" (originally written by you but deleted by me) advise? Saturn not being the ruler of Capricorn is what you think, not what is generally accepted in traditional, nor modern astrology. So please just state that you think it is so, not telling members that Black Moon (lillith) is simply ruler of Capricorn.

Why dont you start a thread about the Black Moon in this Forum explaining why you think this is so? You seem to know a lot about it and it would be interesting to all of us.
Groeten, Starlink
 
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starnoud

starlink said:
to start looking at the Black Moon right at the beginning of their studies, is not advisable no matter how essential you might think this is. When you start with astrology there is enough to learn about the basics.

I see .... the basics..... and anything ruling Capricorn, and therefore having control over one or two houses, should be considered what exactly?

[deleted request to moderator which should have been PMed not posted - Moderator]
 
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piercethevale

Well-known member
starnoud said:
I see .... the basics..... and anything ruling Capricorn, and therefore having control over one or two houses, should be considered what exactly?

Please unsubscribe me from this forum, thank you.

Starnoud...don't go! I found your post to be most interesting.
I know from experience how uncomfortable some of these forums can be insofar as trying to promote new ideas...why don't you give it a try awhile longer.
I have my own theory that Capricorn and Pisces are ruled by the former planet now known as the 'Asteroids'...and I agree with you that 'Lilith' is connected to Capricorn...possibly 'Exhalted'!
Again...please stick around!
...and thanks for the info on the 'Black Sun'...I've been trying to get the info on this!
Sincerely, ptv.:(
 
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I agree with Starlink, its important to get the basics first before looking at astriods and specs of dust.

There is a good Education Forum on here, plus loads of people willing to help. I have sent you PM with some useful info...;)
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
...but then again...could Orsoblu1 possibly be refering to the Black Sun/Kochab ??? ...that is something altogether different.
I collect Sun kochinas...Tawas...and I acquired a Dark/Black Sun kochina not too long ago and placed it on my altar with the Tawas.



Kochinas!!!!
 

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piercethevale

Well-known member
[If we are indeed talking about the 'Dark Sun/?/Black Sun Kochab here]
I did some checking with a star map and found that Kochab is a star in the 'bowl' of Ursa Minor...and as near as I can est. it is apprx. in line with 7* Libra.
Now what made this discovery and assumption of degree so very intriguing is that when I looked up the Sabian for the 7th degree of Libra I found that the Keyword for this degree by Rudhyars definition is "Guardianship"...how very intriguing as Kochab is referred to as "one of the 'Guardians' of the Pole Star" i.e. the star Polaris...hmmmm!!???!!

ps...also, it may be of interest that Arcturus, referred to by Edgar Cayce in a reading as being the Star souls pass through between incarnations, is at apprx 6* Libra...
 
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starlink

Well-known member
I know from experience how uncomfortable some of these forums can be insofar as trying to promote new ideas...why don't you give it a try awhile longer.

Hi Pierce. Well I told Starnaud to start a new thread:
Why dont you start a thread about the Black Moon in this Forum explaining why you think this is so?
on this as he is obviously more knowledgable than a Greenhorn, so I find his reaction a bit abrupt. Too bad.
 

RockFish

Well-known member
I think trying to promote new ideas is very nice.

Trying to shove them down other people's throats as the ultimate truth is not. Particularly without any decent explanation apart from "makes sense to me". Well, Saturn as Capricorn ruler makes sense to me. Now what?

New ideas + social aptitude = Great Debate.

New ideas + Arrogance = No Audience. :cool:
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
RockFish said:
I think trying to promote new ideas is very nice.

Trying to shove them down other people's throats as the ultimate truth is not. Particularly without any decent explanation apart from "makes sense to me". Well, Saturn as Capricorn ruler makes sense to me. Now what?

New ideas + social aptitude = Great Debate.

New ideas + Arrogance = No Audience. :cool:

...Now What?? ...well that's one more vote for that 'camp'...that's what!!:p
 

aquarius7000

Well-known member
Ok, guys.

Do you realize that we are derailing poor Orsoblu's thread? If you want to continue a discussion on social attitude - astrological input => posts will have to be moved to a new thread.

Now getting back to the Black Sun, does anyone have any information to share?I read about the Black Sun many moons ago, but have to admit that I never really bothered to enlighten myself on it any further. I will have to see, if I can find anything in my books or notes.

:)AQ7
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
aquarius7000 said:
Ok, guys.

Do you realize that we are derailing poor Orsoblu's thread? If you want to continue a discussion on social attitude - astrological input => posts will have to be moved to a new thread.

Now getting back to the Black Sun, does anyone have any information to share?I read about the Black Sun many moons ago, but have to admit that I never really bothered to enlighten myself on it any further. I will have to see, if I can find anything in my books or notes.

:)AQ7

I'm still wondering which of the two possible refs. to a Dark/Black Sun Osoblu is asking about...that of the Aphelion or that which is associated with Kochab.

...Andiamo mi amica!!
 
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Claire19

Well-known member
Orsoblu1 said:
Hi all,
please does anyone heard about the black sun in the natal chart ?
I know about the black moon / lilith, but I cannot find any information about the black sun and his interpretation and how can you calculate its positision.
Can anyone help me?
thank you,

:confused:

Ob1

I have practised astrology for many many years and I have never heard of the Black Sun. I would forget about it. Not valid. I dont even use Black Moon Lilith.
 

starlink

Well-known member
...that of the Aphelion or that which is associated with Kochab.
Dear Pierce, I think you are way too clever for me:) Never heard about these terms (shame....), maybe because I focus on simple natal astrology and no research into other things like Black Sun, Lillith, asteroids etc. I will see what I can find in the Internet and our own forum about fixed stars etc. and then hopefully understand what you mean next time.

Cheers, Starlink
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
starlink said:
Dear Pierce, I think you are way too clever for me:) Never heard about these terms (shame....), maybe because I focus on simple natal astrology and no research into other things like Black Sun, Lillith, asteroids etc. I will see what I can find in the Internet and our own forum about fixed stars etc. and then hopefully understand what you mean next time.

Cheers, Starlink

Well, the Kochab biz. is pretty occult and esoteric...in fact about as much as those two terms get.
The 'Black Sun' kochina in my photo above is made by a Hopi woman who had a vision of it sometime back...apparently she isn't the only member of her tribe that has had this vision or one quite similar as of late.
[I assume that you know that the kochina is unique to the Hopi tribe...[I assume you know that these people do rites to the Sun and 'vision quests', of a type, hopefully during this 'quest' they 'See' the sun take human like form and thus they create these Kochinas as repilcas of what they 'saw'.]

...and then there's a rather 'far out' story about something called the 'Vrill Society' which gets into Hitler and all his studies into the spiritual occult knowledge...very strange tale that gets into UFOs and such. [but then I did know a Man who worked at Area 51 doing reverse engineering of, 'foreign aircraft', let us say.]

...I had a vision of this 'Black Sun' one day about 4 or 5 years ago and having had 'Tawa' visions the year before I pursued the understanding of what it could mean...[I had started doing Sanskrit/Hindu Surya [Sun] Mantras/Pujas back in 2003 when I needed extra spiritual protection. [I was dealing with some very dark and malicious individuals]...soon afterward a fellow moved in next door to me with the name of Suryakant [Ray of the Sun], given to him by his Swami, he had the other mantras I had been seeking and had prayed for assistance in finding...he also gave me a huge 'Leg Up' in astrological undersanding...most esp. of Rudhyarian technique...then I found the 'Black Sun' kochina in town near here at a Native American store where I had puchased a couple of Tawa Kochinas [one of which is also in the photo above...as the other two above are 'Tawa' kochinas]
Anytime I get visions, and I do have the natal astrology to provide that proclivity, I know they are important messages from my 'Higher Self' and they are usually followed by events of symbolic and of a sychronistic nature which validates the vision...so, I feel there is something about this Kocab biz...that very much deserves a good investigating!...and speaking of 'symbolic sychronisticity the biz. about my figuring Kochab to be at apprx.7* Libra and that 'Guardian' thing, I mentioned in my earlier post, is just such an example.


here's a link to the 'Vrill' thing...

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/sociopol_vril05.htm
 
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Orsoblu1

Member
Hi all,
thank you very much for your contribute to my post.

There was a person that told me I have black sun near my natal sun in my house of work, I wanted to know more and that's why I post the thread,
but I admit that I didn't know anynthing about it.
I'm sorry for that, and your discussion now is over my capacity at the moment. Please excuse me.

From the other part, I'm glad this discussion is become so instructive for all us.

Thank you all,

ob1:)
 
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