An Introduction to Planetary Dignity and Debility

Mad Madam Mimm

Well-known member
Old time astrology (13th century and earlier) particularly Islamic astrology, followed the doctrine called "benefaction" (also called "recovery" and "pleasantness") in which, if planet A is dignified and planet B is debilitated (essentially dignified or essentially debilitated, although it can apply also, to some extent, to a rescue from accidental debility) and they conjoin (or are applying to conjunction) then the dignified planet A "benefits" ("recovers") planet B from planet B's debility. I largely follow this concept*...However, this principle (apparently) does NOT apply to aspects between the planets...


*this concept is discussed by various authors of those times; see for example Al-Biruni's "Book of Instruction in the Elements of the Art of Astrology" (1029 AD) and Ibn Ezra's "Beginning of Wisdom" (1158 AD)
That’s interesting. Kinda like the phenomenon of a dying star, and the one close by joined it with some type of fusion, so its neighbor wouldn’t die.
Probably not the same thing, but, how sweet.
Jesus Christ where is my tissue and I’m not even cussing either.
 

Mad Madam Mimm

Well-known member
That’s interesting. Kinda like the phenomenon of a dying star, and the one close by joined it with some type of fusion, so its neighbor wouldn’t die.
Probably not the same thing, but, how sweet.
Jesus Christ where is my tissue and I’m not even cussing either.
That’s interesting. Kinda like the phenomenon of a dying star, and the one close by joined it with some type of fusion, so its neighbor wouldn’t die.
Probably not the same thing, but, how sweet.
Jesus Christ where is my tissue and I’m not even cussing either.

That’s interesting. Kinda like the phenomenon of a dying star, and the one close by joined it with some type of fusion, so its neighbor wouldn’t die.
Probably not the same thing, but, how sweet.
Jesus Christ where is my tissue and I’m not even cussing either.
⭐️ struck lol

I need those books. Thanks
 

Mad Madam Mimm

Well-known member
.

Amor Fati….Inception!
Thank you for this website. I loved the deep knowledge it imparted.
The big names , Ptolemys, for example ,was a much appreciated dot to connect . I hear the mentions frequently from the well educated, and never knew who he was. A founding father, of sorts ? Thank you ! I had to put the phone down quit reading.
I’m going to go with my former muse, formerly known as my original thought lol…Astrology is a reflection… however, I’ve been made acutely aware of the importance of good morals and integrity, or, the danger of sleepwalking without them. You don’t like the reflection ,just start smashing everything. It’s the only wildcard we got, what’s inside of us can challenge anything… and it’s mysterious . The planets test us is my belief. Who is my daddy for this school of thought ? Not sure .
Have all thoughts been already thought of?
Jk… here comes the horses
Jumping over the belt ⭐️

Never a dull moment
 
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JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Amor Fati….Inception! Thank you for this website. I loved the deep knowledge it imparted.
The big names , Ptolemys, for example ,was a much appreciated dot to connect . I hear the mentions frequently from the well educated, and never knew who he was. A founding father, of sorts ? Thank you ! I had to put the phone down quit reading.
Ptolemy '..compiled..' altering techniques according to personal prejudice/whim
Ptolemy, mathematician/astronomer was not a practising astrologer
- so left no natal charts
because Ptolemy was a copyist :)

Ptolemy built on the work of Apollonius of Perga
who approximately four centuries earlier than Ptolemy developed
a form of geometric particular methods within the geometrical practice

that are to do with circular motion - as well as motions of circles moving on circles and so on
- that Ptolemy then applied to discovering

the much sought-after geometrical rationale thought to be underlying appearances
Thus Ptolemy described a rationale
that '..explained..' retrograde motion - but incorrectly
- because the planets do not move with uniform circular motion in circles

Ptolemy's incorrect, yet mathematically appealing, idea of the universe was wrong :)

PtolemyModel.gif

Ptolemy doesn't talk very much about people of his own time :)
instead he talks about observations made centuries earlier by Hipparchus
Observations used by Ptolemy are largely Babylonian via Hipparchus :)


And it was Hipparchus who, a century after Apollonius
began applying the Apollonian geometry in the first attempt to describe the movements
of the heavenly spheres geometrically.
Hipparchus took the first steps in attempting to make the Apollonian geometry
fit the appearances of the heavens
- particularly in relation to the moon and the sun
- by developing those moving circles as a technique

for dealing with the confusing appearances of the heavens

Ptolemy then expanded on the original ideas of both his predecessors
Apollonius and Hipparchus
Albert Timashev article entitled
"..Reconstruction of The Major Egyptian Years.." has this to say of Ptolemy:

"..Today it is well known that Greek scientist Claudius Ptolemy
was not a representative of a traditional Greek astrological school
and, most likely, he was never a practicing astrologer at all.
Ptolemy's work Tetrabiblos reflects his personal
and sometimes disputable opinions on many questions.." http://www.astrologer.ru/article/mey.html.en

Galileo disproved Ptolemy's model :)

while using his telescope to investigate the planets.
During his observations he discovered
that the planet Venus goes through phases, just like our moon
which causes it to appear to change shape.
Galileo realised
that this would not be possible under the Ptolemaic system :)

INCORRECT PTOLEMAIC SYSTEM :)

YJ1CefJh3dt5itr5deQaCKM5aiMgoHohqp6SA0JtdM_ZPw5ThPkIWfbxj7FEXYWhh4OyWftgxHsz4Cx_GnTR0a0nUa4yOt4FnJHEjOkQiVKDChxBS3uCfXJ-



1a34dba249217254db73173ccee3998785bd159a.gif





I’m going to go with my former muse, formerly known as my original thought lol…Astrology is a reflection… however, I’ve been made acutely aware of the importance of good morals and integrity, or, the danger of sleepwalking without them. You don’t like the reflection ,just start smashing everything. It’s the only wildcard we got, what’s inside of us can challenge anything… and it’s mysterious . The planets test us is my belief. Who is my daddy for this school of thought ? Not sure .
Have all thoughts been already thought of?
Jk… here comes the horses
Jumping over the belt ⭐️

Never a dull moment
 

Mad Madam Mimm

Well-known member
Ptolemy '..compiled..' altering techniques according to personal prejudice/whim
Ptolemy, mathematician/astronomer was not a practising astrologer
- so left no natal charts
because Ptolemy was a copyist :)

Ptolemy built on the work of Apollonius of Perga
who approximately four centuries earlier than Ptolemy developed
a form of geometric particular methods within the geometrical practice

that are to do with circular motion - as well as motions of circles moving on circles and so on
- that Ptolemy then applied to discovering

the much sought-after geometrical rationale thought to be underlying appearances
Thus Ptolemy described a rationale
that '..explained..' retrograde motion - but incorrectly
- because the planets do not move with uniform circular motion in circles

Ptolemy's incorrect, yet mathematically appealing, idea of the universe was wrong :)

PtolemyModel.gif

Ptolemy doesn't talk very much about people of his own time :)
instead he talks about observations made centuries earlier by Hipparchus
Observations used by Ptolemy are largely Babylonian via Hipparchus :)


And it was Hipparchus who, a century after Apollonius
began applying the Apollonian geometry in the first attempt to describe the movements
of the heavenly spheres geometrically.
Hipparchus took the first steps in attempting to make the Apollonian geometry
fit the appearances of the heavens
- particularly in relation to the moon and the sun
- by developing those moving circles as a technique

for dealing with the confusing appearances of the heavens

Ptolemy then expanded on the original ideas of both his predecessors
Apollonius and Hipparchus
Albert Timashev article entitled
"..Reconstruction of The Major Egyptian Years.." has this to say of Ptolemy:

"..Today it is well known that Greek scientist Claudius Ptolemy
was not a representative of a traditional Greek astrological school
and, most likely, he was never a practicing astrologer at all.
Ptolemy's work Tetrabiblos reflects his personal
and sometimes disputable opinions on many questions.." http://www.astrologer.ru/article/mey.html.en

Galileo disproved Ptolemy's model :)

while using his telescope to investigate the planets.
During his observations he discovered
that the planet Venus goes through phases, just like our moon
which causes it to appear to change shape.
Galileo realised
that this would not be possible under the Ptolemaic system :)

INCORRECT PTOLEMAIC SYSTEM :)

YJ1CefJh3dt5itr5deQaCKM5aiMgoHohqp6SA0JtdM_ZPw5ThPkIWfbxj7FEXYWhh4OyWftgxHsz4Cx_GnTR0a0nUa4yOt4FnJHEjOkQiVKDChxBS3uCfXJ-



1a34dba249217254db73173ccee3998785bd159a.gif
Makes more sense. The rest are behaving , following their predictable route.
Then , MARS
SMH 🤦‍♀️🔥♥️

I don’t know who’s more insufferable, Mars or Uranus
New beginnings are Fun tney said, let them loose

Meanwhile, every Virgo known to man is cussing them out after they do what they do lol ( metaphorically speaking) ,as they sweep and clean up their mess. A true delight lol
Worth it in the end .good thing we all have a function.

All those overlapping circles
Kinda seems like a big cosmic clock

What would be the most exciting alignment ever I wonder
Hmm
 
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JUPITERASC

Well-known member
yyRle9xMRIavEVldHokB_epicycle-move.gif

All those overlapping circles
Kinda seems like a big cosmic clock
1.png


We've had a bit of a cage match on other threads between two 2nd century AD Hellenistic astrologers. In this corner: Ptolemy, author of the astro-books Almagest and Tetrabiblos, who attempted to place astrology on a systematic, scientific (for his day) footing.
images

No, he was trying to cram astrology into the Aristotelian view and he failed spectacularly but he did succeed in making a mess that we're still trying to clean up.

Fraud.
Ptolemy deceived others.
Other astrologers make it clear when they are quoting other astrologers. Ptolemy is quoting Petrosiris and Nechepso but he never once says that which is dishonest.
Also, by the time Arabic tribes gained control of Egypt, the Middle East and Mediterranean Region was in total disarray.
Ptolemy's work was the only work the Arabs had access to.

That's called an anachronism. It happens when people try to crowbar the present into Earth-of-the-past.

It saddens me to report that at and around the time Valen's lived, there wasn't a Kinko's or a UPS Store or a Fedex Store anywhere around to photocopy the texts.

How did texts get replicated? They paid scribes to copy them and apparently some got paid by the page.

The scribes made mistakes. It's also known that students copied texts and because they did not fully understand many of the concepts they made changes to the text to fit their understanding.

It's also know that copyists often inserted charts into texts. The chart in Rhetorius could not have been made at the time he lived or in the 1,000 years prior to that so many think he made it up as a hypothetical example since he wasn't an astrologer and didn't even know how to cast charts. The other possibility is a later copyist inserted the chart 150 years after Rhetorius died, but that still doesn't work because that chart isn't possible.

Valens' text is disjointed and disorganized because copyists moved sections and chapters around over the centuries and we know there's a 5th century addition to the text.

Valens quite clearly states when he is quoting other astrologers unlike Ptolemy. Even Rhetorius noted when he was quoting other astrologers.

That some of the Greek is archaic is not relevant.

I regret to inform you Twitter wasn't up and running so the Greeks could not send out a tweet to all the Greeks everywhere living in Greece, Turkey, Italy, Bulgaria, Romania, Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Israel, Jordan, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and the Kashmir Region of India to stop using archaic Greek.

If Valens was part and parcel of the intelligentsia, you know, the high culture, then he would have used archaic Greek.

If Valens went to school or was educated by a tutor who taught him archaic Greek because the school/tutor did not get the tweet or the memo then he would have spoken archaic Greek.

Also, if Valens intended his work to be a scholarly work, then he would have used archaic Greek.

To that end, you ignore everything Valens said.

Valens repeatedly states that his work is intended to be read by serious students of astrology. That is reason alone to use archaic Greek.

Valens also expresses concerns on numerous occasions throughout the text that his work might fall into the hands of "triflers" -- what he called "unworthy" people.

He also cautions readers to guard against that eventuality, meaning if you copy my text do not dumb it down for the idiots.

To paraphrase Valens, a little knowledge in the hands of idiots is a dangerous thing.

And that is a good reason to use archaic Greek.
..
 
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