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WhtWldVlnsDo
01-02-2014, 05:16 AM
What is the difference between a planet ruling a house via its house cusp and residing there directly?

for example:

What is the difference between having the Moon in the 2nd house, and having Cancer on the 2nd house cusp?

JUPITERASC
01-02-2014, 02:00 PM
What is the difference between a planet ruling a house via its house cusp and residing there directly?

for example:
What is the difference between having the Moon in the 2nd house,
and having Cancer on the 2nd house cusp?
The difference is:
position is stronger than rulership

So

Moon in 2nd house AND in Cancer
is strong by position AND rulership


By the way, keep in mind also that since Jupiter is exalted ruler of Cancer
then Jupiter influences matters of the house with Cancer on its cusp :smile:


Moon in 2nd house
but not in Cancer
could be in any one of the remaining signs
i.e. could be in
Aries, Taurus, Gemini, Leo, Virgo, Libra, Scorpio, Sagittarius, Capricorn, Aquarius or Pisces
AND
Moon in 2nd house
but not in Cancer
brings the agenda of the house with Cancer on the cusp to the matters of the 2nd house

which in this particular case under discussion
may have any one of the remaining eleven signs on its cusp
i.e.
Aries, Taurus, Gemini, Leo, Virgo, Libra, Scorpio, Sagittarius, Capricorn, Aquarius or Pisces

IN CONTRAST

Cancer on 2nd house cusp and Moon in a different house
=
Moon in that different house brings the agenda of the 2nd house
to that different house

DELINEATING NATAL CHART THREAD for examples of this useful technique http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=382268#post382268
The type of Delineation I'm giving here is a mix of medieval techniques with those of the Hellenistic authors.

Robert Zoller played great role in my traditional astrology education and this is obvious for those who are familiar with his work.

I need to mention that even though Zoller was initially very fond on Arabia authors, his basic delineation techniques are taken from the early renaissance French astrologer Morin.

ZOLLER studied with ZOLTAN MASON who introduced MORIN and his basic natal delineation to Zoller. ZOLTAN was also one of the first translators of MORIN.


Here are some tips for delineating the chart in this manner


1. The good or bad signified by a house emanates from the ruler of the house.

This is the basic rule. The ruler of the house is giver of the material of the house.


ZOLLER gives the example of his own chart where he has Combusted Mercury in 11th, ruler of 4th. He comments that this kind of placement brings adversity to ones home and dwellings.


2. Benefit in one area of life can be produced by adversity, or even conflict, in another.

Again Zoller gives example from his own chart.
Jupiter in 9th in Scorpio disposited from Mars in 11th: Wisdom coming from conflicts.

3. The delineation tells you the what. The
predictive techniques tell you the when.

I will continue with the tips in my next post.

WhtWldVlnsDo
01-02-2014, 09:08 PM
Thank you JUPITERASC. You've given me much to dwell upon.

IleneK
01-02-2014, 11:02 PM
What is the difference between a planet ruling a house via its house cusp and residing there directly?

for example:

What is the difference between having the Moon in the 2nd house, and having Cancer on the 2nd house cusp?

Moon in the 2nd house is the subject of and is subject to the arena of life governed by the 2nd house.

Moon as ruler of the 2nd house influences the events and planets [subjects] of the 2nd house.

greybeard
01-10-2014, 04:42 AM
The lord of a house dominates the house. But it does so "from a distance."
A planet in a house acts directly on and through the affairs of that house. Its influence is direct and immediate.

Generally speaking, planets in a house act earlier -- their influence being direct and immediate. The lord of the house will prevail over time; its influence determines the final outcome.

The lord of the house is like a king who lives in a castle at some distance from a shire. The folks living in the shire (the planets in the house) may do things pleasing or not pleasing to the king. Sooner or later the king finds out and imposes his will on the folks in the shire. The king prevails in the long run.

The lord of a sign (and therefore house) Disposes the sign and what is in it. Planets in a sign are always subject to their dispositor.

red
01-10-2014, 05:36 AM
The lord of a house dominates the house. But it does so "from a distance."
A planet in a house acts directly on and through the affairs of that house. Its influence is direct and immediate.

Generally speaking, planets in a house act earlier -- their influence being direct and immediate. The lord of the house will prevail over time; its influence determines the final outcome.

The lord of the house is like a king who lives in a castle at some distance from a shire. The folks living in the shire (the planets in the house) may do things pleasing or not pleasing to the king. Sooner or later the king finds out and imposes his will on the folks in the shire. The king prevails in the long run.

The lord of a sign (and therefore house) Disposes the sign and what is in it. Planets in a sign are always subject to their dispositor.

Hi Greybeard,

What are your views on mutual exchange of sign rulership? For instance, Mercury that rules H6 Gemini is in H7, ruler of H7, Moon is in H6?

IleneK
01-13-2014, 04:58 PM
The lord of a house dominates the house. But it does so "from a distance."
A planet in a house acts directly on and through the affairs of that house. Its influence is direct and immediate.

Generally speaking, planets in a house act earlier -- their influence being direct and immediate. The lord of the house will prevail over time; its influence determines the final outcome.



I appreciate your reference to time and space elements for planets in a house versus planets dispositing that house. These nuances make it even clearer to me. As usual, many thanks and wishing you a good new year.

JUPITERASC
01-13-2014, 06:39 PM
I appreciate your reference to
time and space elements
for planets in a house
versus
planets dispositing that house.

These nuances make it even clearer to me.

As usual, many thanks and wishing you a good new year.
Keep in mind that


The house represents the beginning of a matter,

the ruler of the house represents the development of the matter, a kind of middle point

and the final dispositor i.e. the planet that rules the sign in which
the ruler is placed
represents the end of the matter


Planets can do 3 things.
They can produce something,
they can deny something,
or they can destroy something once it has been
produced.
By the way, WhtWldVlnsDo
the planet IN a sign
IS NOT ALWAYS
the same as that planet RULING the sign
i.e.
For Mars in Aries
Mars rules the sign it is IN
So Mars represents the end of the matter
For the house with Aries on the cusp

BUT

for Mars in Gemini
although Mars rules Aries
Since Mars DOES NOT rule the sign it is currently IN - i.e. in this instance, Gemini
So then Mercury represents the end of the matter for the sign with Aries on the cusp
because Mercury rules the sign Gemini :smile:

JUPITERASC
01-13-2014, 11:14 PM
No. It's not the same.

But you can read a description for a planet in a house even if it isn't in that house and is just the ruler.

Ie Leo on the 1st house cusp,
you can read the descriptions for a 1st house sun
and it will be pretty accurate,
even if that house is empty.
Notice as well
that because Sun is ruler of Leo :smile:
then
the natal Sun
brings the agenda of the house in which it is located
to the significations of the empty house with Leo on the cusp