PDA

View Full Version : interpreting my chart using the Lilly method


DreamingTheSeas
11-20-2011, 09:51 AM
The math for this isn't really hard, it's just tedious. This works only for Ascendant/Descendant. For Primary Directions to the MC, it's different math (but easier) since you're working mostly with Right Ascension. Planet to Planet aspects is not too much more complicated, but different still.

There are only 5 terms you need to know (and the abbreviations I use so I don't have to type/write so much):

1] Ascensional Difference (AD): difference between the Right Ascension (RA) and Oblique Ascension (OA).

2] Semi-Arc (SA): the Ascensional Difference (AD) +/- 90 it is added if Declination is North, but subtracted if Declination is South (and I hope people living in the Southern Hemisphere understand that is reversed and why).

3] Meridian Distance (MD): is the difference between the Right Ascension of the Midheaven (RAMC) and the Right Ascension of the Nadir (RAIC) and the Planet's Right Ascension.

4] Arc of Direction: the difference between the Semi-Arc (SA and the Meridian Distance (MD).

5] Equatorial Time: Proportion of Distance traveled. Simply divide by 12

Going back to this Chart, we'll use Ptolemy's method to calculate the base Life-Span:T

I am trying to understand this but i get confused. My Moon is in 10th sign and i am a night born person. So (i think) my Hyleg is Moon.
My birth longitude is 39,38 N.
My Moon in Celestial longitude is 177, 54 so lets say 178.
My MC is 174,44 in Virgo.
AD is 98.
SA is 98 +90= 188
MD is 174-98= 76
Arc of Dir is 188-76= 112

Then i move to the Descendant (clock wise) and is 181,13 in Libra. So,181-112= 69.
The base of life span is 69.
After that is the chaos for me, because I can;t understand when Malefics and Benefics aspects to the Descendant.

Any help will be very very thankful.

DreamingTheSeas
12-08-2011, 05:37 PM
That's probably because Ptolemy is .....
Once he finds the Hyleg, then he directs it by Primary Direction. If the Hyleg is in the 7th or 9th House, then he directs it clock-wise to the Descendant (7th House Cusp) and the Arc of Direction (the number of degrees) is how long the Native will live........

......

And when the Hyleg is in other houses than 7th and 9th still directs it clock wise to Descendant?
(sorry for being so persistent but i cant find any info in Greek language)

DreamingTheSeas
01-10-2012, 03:30 PM
As i read this again i think that BobZemco was saying those calculations were for those who have Asc or part of fortune as HYLEG. Is there anyone who can give us the calculations when the HYLEG is SUN or MOON??

DreamingTheSeas
01-10-2012, 06:37 PM
It's the same, just Direct it to the Descendant

Thank you very very much!!!!

DreamingTheSeas
01-13-2012, 10:03 AM
Roy, (and anyone else who wants to discuss on this very interesting topic)

The ZET9 program (the free version) has astronomical data when you right click any planet. i think that has this information ready (i mean MD, Semi-Arc, Ascentional difference). If you already have dowloaded ZET9 could you take a look and see if its the same?

DreamingTheSeas
01-24-2012, 04:43 PM
<<mr bobzemco wrote

Re: William Lilly's indications of a violent death.Do they work?
Quote:
That's probably because Ptolemy is discussing Primary Directions, not the planetary situation in a Natal Chart. If you're researching Death (and it appears you are), then you've probably ran into comments on the Hyleg and Alcocoden.

Ptolemy doesn't use an Alcocoden. Ptolemy's theory is that what is Above Horizon is alive, what is Below Horizon is dead. When looking at the Houses Above Horizon, all of them make aspects to the Ascendant except the 12th and 8th Houses, which are inconjunct the Ascendant.

For Day Chart, where the Sun is Above Horizon, Ptolemy wants to find the Planet that has the most Dignity in the Sun, the pre-Natal New Moon, and the Ascendant. For each of those points, he is looking for a Planet that meets 3 of these 5 conditions: is the Sign Ruler, Exaltation Ruler, Sect Triplicity Ruler, Term Ruler or makes a partile or very close applying aspect to the point in question.

So, if the pre-Natal New Moon was at 6 Virgo, the Mercury is the Sign Ruler, Exaltation Ruler and Term Ruler, which is at least 3 dignities, and Mercury is a potential Hyleg candidate, assuming Mercury is in the 1st, 11th, 10th, 9th or 7th House of the chart.

If the Ascendant was at 22 Gemini, then Saturn is the Sect Triplicity Ruler and the Term Ruler, and suppose Saturn was at 21 Pisces in the 10th House in square to the Ascending Degree, so that is 3 dignities and Saturn is a potential Hyleg candidate.

It's actually very rare to find a Planet with at least 3 dignities in the Sun, Ascendant or pre-Natal New Moon.

The Houses in order of power are the 10th, 1st, 11th, 7th and 9th. He will take the best one out of the Sun, Moon and any Planet that has at least 3 dignities in either the Sun, pre-Natal New Moon or the Ascendant and determine which is the Hyleg.

If the Sun is in the 8th or 12th House, and the Moon is Below Horizon and no Planet meets the dignity conditions, then the Ascendant is automatically the Hyleg (and a Planet Combust cannot be Hyleg either).

For a Night Chart (Sun Below Horizon), Ptolemy is looking for the Planet that has at least 3 dignities in either the Moon, the pre-Natal Full Moon, or the Lot of Fortune, and again you're looking at the Sign Ruler, Exaltation Ruler, Sect Triplicity Ruler, Term Ruler or a very close applying or partile aspect to one of those 3 points.

If you can't find a Planet, and Moon is in the 8th or 12th House, then the Lot of Fortune is automatically the Hyleg.

Once he finds the Hyleg, then he directs it by Primary Direction. If the Hyleg is in the 7th or 9th House, then he directs it clock-wise to the Descendant (7th House Cusp) and the Arc of Direction (the number of degrees) is how long the Native will live.

That isn't just counting the number of degrees between the Hyleg and the 7th House Cusp, rather you're looking at Temporal Hours to arrive at the 7th House Cusp.

If it's 68, then the Native lives 68 years. That's modified by the rays of the Benefics and Malefics who come to the Descendant by aspect through Primary Direction. The Benefics add years, the Malefics take away years.

Saturn and Mars (unless one of them happens to be Hyleg) you direct clockwise to the first square, opposition or conjunction of the Descendant, the Benefics (Venus and Jupiter unless one of them is the actually the Hyleg) you direct clock-wise to the first conjunciton, sextile or trine to the Descendant. Again, you're using Temporal Hours not actual degrees, and you add or subtract their Arcs of Direction to the Hyleg's Arc of Direction and that will tell you when the Native dies (and it will be dead on or less than 30 days -- usually within 4 days).

If the Hyleg is not in the 7th or 9th House, you direct it counter clock-wise, and here's where it can be attack by the rays of the Malefics or you can also direct the Malefics to the Hyleg.

The other times, and this is general and not very specific as the Hyleg, is when the Sign Ruler in a Profectional Chart is in very bad condition and in the Solar Return Chart the same Planet is Cadent, or worse yet in the 12th House, and then totally savaged by Mars and Saturn or Combust or where the Sun is Malefic (in square or opposition and not received by the Planet Sun is squaring or opposing), and then Mercury in square or opposition and not received is Malefic as well. That's an indicator of death, but it won't give the the time like Primary Directions will. >>

Roy,
This is my chart. My Moon which i think is my Hyleg is 93 degree to the Descendant. This means my base life span is 93.
So now i am doing the math which clearly has been explained by Bobzemco, but its hard for me to understand.
Mars is coming to Square to Dsc in 8' degree of Virgo. Saturn makes square in Dsc in 8' degree of Gemini.
Now, Jupiter Sextile Dsc in 8' of Leo. Venus Trine Dsc in 8' of Gemini.

For Saturn i do the math AD=4.86, SA=90-4.86=85.13, MD=24.77,
ARC OF DIRECTION=85.13-24.77=60.36
EQUATORIAL TIME=60.36/12=5.03
That means Saturn will take 5 years and 3 months.

Now lets take Venus. AD=2.35, SA=90=2.35=92.35, MD=7.58,
ARC OD DIRECTION= 92.35-2.35=90
The total number of degrees between the Ascendant and the Nadir (Imum Coeli) is 106.97 and i must move Venus to 8' of Gemini.And here is that makes me confused and cant do the rest.

julia
02-18-2012, 08:26 PM
why don't you upload your natal chart?

DreamingTheSeas
02-18-2012, 09:58 PM
why don't you upload your natal chart?

My chart is on the above post. I saved as mother because i have storaged it like this because in another thread i was asking something about me and my daughter.

DreamingTheSeas
08-08-2013, 09:37 AM
Bob made things clearer a few days ago so i continue with new questions.

When Hyleg is II Quadrant we bring the Ascendant degree to Hyleg by Primary Direction and look for the conjuction.

Then we bring Venus and Jupiter to the first conjuction/trine/sextille to Hyleg, or we bring the Ascendant degree to Venus/Jupiter?
Same for Mars/Saturn?