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Moog
01-19-2012, 01:19 PM
Is this something you consider? Example; say you have Scorpio on the 9th but Mars is in Gemini in the 4th, then with the traditional aspect doctrine as I know it, Mars would be in aversion to his own house, unable to see what's going on there.

Culpeper
01-19-2012, 05:54 PM
What I have found is that when a planet does not behold a house it rules, the effects or benefits of that house are delayed or do not work so well for the native. And this is important in electional astrology: be sure that the relevant houses and significators behold each other if the electional chart is to be effective.

Moog
01-19-2012, 08:24 PM
Thank you Culpepper. Does that apply to Natal astrology as well as elections/horary?

tsmall
01-19-2012, 11:01 PM
Moog, I have been turning this one over in my head all day, mainly because the two signs you indicated in your OP are in neither a commanding and obeying relationship, nor in a "hearing" relationship. So, that leaves me to wonder two things regarding natal charts. And, since I'm still a noob, I can ask silly questions, right?

If there really is no way for the ruler of the house to have access to the house, would that indicate (in this example) that the matters of that house are completely out of the native's control?

The other wacky thought I had was whether antiscia works with houses/signs, or just planets. A planet in Gemini will have it's antiscia in Cancer, which then (if I have this right) trines Scorpio? But, reading this link

http://www.skyscript.co.uk/antiscia.html

it does not say if this also works for "points" (Lots or parts) or cusps. But, if Mars in Gemini in 4th is within orb of the cusp of the house, could it access the cusp, or strongest point, of the 9th?

Moog
01-20-2012, 12:52 AM
Have you been applying antiscia to chart reading Tsmall? If so, do you find them useful?

tsmall
01-20-2012, 01:09 AM
Only with my own, and only quite by accident. :smile:

On this thread

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40285

specifically this post

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=314485&postcount=35

So, the meaning of antiscion entered my brain, and now I'm wondering if it would work with rulers of houses/signs not being able to see what they rule?

To answer your question, yes, I really did find it helpful in this case.

Moog
01-20-2012, 01:16 AM
I like the word antiscia. It sounds like a girl's name.

tsmall
01-20-2012, 01:27 AM
I like the word antiscia. It sounds like a girl's name.

I think it sounds like the name of a yummy Italian dessert. :biggrin:

Moog
01-20-2012, 01:48 AM
I think it sounds like the name of a yummy Italian dessert. :biggrin:

Tiramisu

Maybe if we invent an astrological technique, we can name it after pudding.

dr. farr
01-20-2012, 05:35 AM
Here I am greatly influenced by Bhrigu Sutram doctrines (that's an early Vedic astrology sage): and also, by early Modernist Vivian Robson in his "horoscope" books, ie, that the lord of a given house, placed in another house, will have influence upon that house, regardless of considerations regarding sign-to-sign aspect, or the seeing/hearing "relationship" of the signs involved*. These influences would be in addition to our "normal" or "regular" considerations of the state, condition and aspects to and/or connections of, that planet in that sign.


*and, that the lord of the sign/house, being posited in any other sign/house, will ALWAYS reflect back and connect with the house/sign it is lord (dispositor) of, regardless of seeing/hearing, etc, considerations.

JUPITERASC
11-05-2012, 08:36 PM
Is this something you consider? Example; say you have Scorpio on the 9th but Mars is in Gemini in the 4th, then with the traditional aspect doctrine as I know it, Mars would be in aversion to his own house, unable to see what's going on there.
Mars although in aversion, is in this example in Gemini, so Mars relies on Mercury - as well as on Mercury's sign ruler - for information regarding 9th matters :smile:
....*and, that the lord of the sign/house, being posited in any other sign/house, will ALWAYS reflect back and connect with the house/sign it is lord (dispositor) of, regardless of seeing/hearing, etc, considerations.