England or France?

Bizquit · #1 10-13-2007, 11:22 AM

Today, in Paris, at 21:00 local time, England vs. France.

OK. It is rugby, and I am an absolute newby. So here goes my very first attempt:

I guess in this case it is correct to place France (the locals) on the ASC, and England on the VII?

So, now I look at the significators:
ASC is in Gemini (8Ge06). Mercury being its ruler is retrograde in Scorpio (8Sc55), and in the VI house. Because it is in the VI house it is somehow strengthened, but because it is retrograde is is not at its best.

The VIIth house cusp is in Sagitarium and Jupiter, its ruler, is at 16Sa15, very happy in its own sign.

Moon is at 18Sc10 in the VIth, and ... I have many doubts now:

1) Is the Moon VOC or not? It is applying to a square with Neptune, and then a semisextile with Sun - but I read we disregard minor aspects and for horary (or event charts interpreted as horary) only the traditional planets are considered.
2) Looking at the relative strengths of the two significators, I would say England are going to win... but it niggles me that Jupiter is actually "the local" in the chart. So, I am wondering whether I should reverse the significators. (England is *my* team this time).

Please, could I have your opinions on my thought process and some advice on what else should I look at now?

Thanks!

fensi88 · #2 10-13-2007, 12:43 PM

Hi Bisquit,
You want to read event chart. For reading event chart there are several tecnique, as favorite on ASC, home team on ASC, but I prefer my color method which is upon sport kit of teams.
You can read about that on this site:
http://www.geocities.com/astrosport88/engleski.html

But if you ask horary question "Will England, your team, beat France?" than you put England on ASC.

Because I do not know colours of sport kit for these teams, I would try to predict winner by "chinese method".

England....Sheep Yin Metal
France...Sheep Yin Earth
2007 year of Pig yin fire
England:Pig supports Sheep, fire fight with metal
France: Pig supports Sheep, fire supports earth

France will win in my opinion.

Siderum · #3 10-13-2007, 06:26 PM

Hi Goca
In my opinion, England have in your Natal Chart Moon Conjuntion Neptune, today Moon Square Neptune, my forescats is: many confusion, disorder, perplexity in England Team!!!, Win France!!!!
Regards
Mario

fensi88 · #4 10-13-2007, 09:21 PM

England won?!!!
I really do not see where I made mistake regarding "chinese method". If someone see, let me know.
Mario, I would agree with your explanation about Moon conjunct Ne, that stands in most cases, but sometimes it may mean great inspiration!

Bizquit · #5 10-13-2007, 09:29 PM

Hi Goca and Mario,

England won, and will play the final!!!

Thank you for your replies and insight into different techniques to answer this question. I am just learning how to read event charts, that's why I chose this particular event as an interesting exercise.

So, judging for the outcome, I can asume it was right to place the locals in the ASC and, because their ruler was 'weakened' compared to their oponents', they lost.

Best regards,

Bizquit

PS: Mario, te parece que ganaremos mañana?

Siderum · #6 10-13-2007, 10:40 PM

I was mistake!!! ( sorry for my english)
1.- MC=6º54' Aquarius conjuntion Sun RFU (Rugby Football Union- England)
2.- Neptune Square Sun FFF (Fédération Française de Rugby)
3.- Moon Oposite Sun FFF
Regards
Mario

Bizquit · #7 10-13-2007, 11:23 PM

Mario,

I am not sure what technique you are using, but it is not just an event chart, is it? Could you please expand a little?

fensi88 · #8 10-14-2007, 04:14 PM

I have eventual explanation why France do not win:

Sheep compatible with pig=9
sheep=yin earth+ yin fire
year of birth= yin earth
2007=yin fire+yin water+yin wood
so we have
2 yin earth
2 yin fire
1 yin water
1 yin wood

Fire "produce" earth, but too much earth decrese water, that decrease produce wood, so flame is not so big.

But for England, Yang Metal Horse...

Horse and Pig are not so compatible=6
Horse=yang fire
year of birth=Yang Metal
2007=yin fire+yin water+yin wood
so we have
1 yang Metal
1 yin fire+ 1 yang fire
1 yin water
1 yin wood
yang Metal+yin wood=Metal
Metal produce water, water wood and wood help fire to burn! All will be OK if we do not count that Horse and Pig are not so compatble. But from future investigation we will see what is more important, year or element...

Siderum · #9 10-14-2007, 05:25 PM

Hi Bizquit!!!
I don`t used Horary Chart, i work with the Team Chart, Coach Chart, Captain and others chart in sinastry with the Event Chart!!!
Regards
Mario

Tata · #10 10-15-2007, 02:08 PM

Ironically, i have the similar Asc sign and the team rullers (i am workign on the football chart Russia-UK, which will take place in Moscow on Wednesday, October 17th, at 19:00 pm Moscow time). And i am debating if mercury retro in the VI house (significator of Russians will be THAT weak, if it has many harmonious aspects from the other planets, PLUS the 1st aspect after the beginning of the match is Moon from Capricorn sextiling Mercury). Yes, Jupiter for UK team in the VII house in Sagitarious is strong - BUT it has no strong connection from the other planets... Definitely, that is the 1st step in my analysis... i will carry on looking into 10th from the 7th etc. - just a note in connection with the previous game if you are interested.

Bizquit · #11 10-15-2007, 08:10 PM

Hi Tata,

Glad you are using that technique - it is nice to compare thoughts and doubts!
I always find it difficult to measure "how" weak or strong a significator is, but the again, I am a beginner.

Also, something I could not find anywhere... do you know what would be the significator for the referee? And the fans?

Cheers!

Quote:

Hi Bizquit!!!
I don`t used Horary Chart, i work with the Team Chart, Coach Chart, Captain and others chart in sinastry with the Event Chart!!!
Regards
Mario

Hi Mario,

I'm afraid your system is too complicated for me.

I'd like to learn about synastry too. But are you really working with the two teams' charts, the two coaches' charts, the two captains' charts AND the event chart? Where do you get all the data for those charts?

Un abrazo,

Bizquit · #12 10-15-2007, 08:22 PM

Tata,

What time zone are you using?
I have just entered your data for the football match, and the chart shows an ASC in Taurus. Is this the same chart you are working on?

Tata · #13 10-17-2007, 01:19 PM

William Lilly's, horrary astrology, "Christian Astrology"

hello Bizquit,
when i attended classes on horary astrology, i was taught that it is possible to apply the rules of the midieval horary astrology by William Lilly. There is a section in his book "beseiged castle". this set of rules help to estimate which army will win the battle (we projected it onto the playing teams and it worked).
as for the roles. try to see which type of a player can be guided by which planet. for example, forwards - may be mercury (or mars)? hence they can be rules by the 3rd house (for the team which hosts the game) and 3rd from the 7th (for the guest team). etc.

Tata · #14 10-17-2007, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bizquit

Tata,

What time zone are you using?
I have just entered your data for the football match, and the chart shows an ASC in Taurus. Is this the same chart you are working on?

Set the chart for Moscow time (Greenwich difference - 3 hours). In moscow 19.00, (for Greenwich 16.00). Gemini rising.

Bizquit · #15 10-17-2007, 04:28 PM

OK, thank you. I had -4 hours difference, and hence the Taurus ASC.

Bizquit · #16 10-17-2007, 05:14 PM

Oh, dear! We lost... 2 -1

Tata, was Russia your team? If so, well done.

I did not watch this game, as I was busy online. But I have just read there was a penalty that was not such. That's why I wonder whether we should consider a significator for the referee in the future!