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Research and Development This is a forum designed for applying scientific methods and understanding to all approaches of astrology, cooperative formulation and testing of new ideas, re-examination of known methods of delineation and interpretation, and the exploration of new astrological methods of all kinds (e.g. heliocentric models, planetary nodes and apogees, etc.).


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Old 04-09-2012, 01:24 AM
sandstone sandstone is offline
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doctor, or astrologer and client

some questions posed to astrologers by those who appear relatively new to astrology seem to reflect a type of misunderstanding of how astrology works.. i would like to discuss this here.. it came up for me today in a thread that i watched unfold..this is an insight based on an analogy of doctor verses astrologer..

when someone goes to a doctor, the doctor would get nowhere unless the patient revealed information to the doctor on the nature of their problem/sickness.. imagine going to a doctor and you are sick and the doctor asks you - where is your sickness located and you tell them they are the doctor and they ought to know!!!! this attitude appears sometimes by those asking astrologers for input on career direction for example.. instead of providing some insight into interests or talents, the approach seems to be 'well you are the astrologer - you are supposed to know! it also highlights just how little effort or thought the person has really given the question themselves to think that astrology is going to come up with the magical answer..

this seems to be about where the publics perception of astrology is today... astrology as guessing game... no input required other then an anonymous chart from astro.com.. the astrologer is supposed to know everything!!! astrologer = grand wazoo with one of those wizard hats with drawings of stars on it, lol...

i am not sure how astrology is furthered in this type of atmosphere.. the only response i can think of is to avoid getting involved.. that is probably what the smart folks already figured out, lol.. call me slow, lol.. thoughts from any of the regulars, or anyone welcome.. thanks.. maybe this should be posted in the chat section.. if a moderator thinks so - move it. that is cool..

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Old 04-09-2012, 01:50 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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imagine going to a doctor and you are sick and the doctor asks you - where is your sickness located and you tell them they are the doctor and they ought to know!!!!
I blame the commercial astrology industry mixing up psychics and astrologers.
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Old 04-09-2012, 02:08 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

hi moog,
that certainly doesn't help.. another cross over area that creates more muddle to my mind anyway, is tarot and astrology.. i wish the 2 were completely separate, but there are those who mix both and this will not stop.
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Old 04-09-2012, 02:16 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

I don't mind tarot. I got into astrology through tarot. But again, tarot gets mixed up with psychic reading. Tarot is about reading cards, not minds, otherwise why would you need the cards? I see it a lot like horary reading. I don't know horary very well so I'm more inclined to pull cards for that sort of inquiry.
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Old 04-09-2012, 02:29 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

i don't mind tarot either.. i just think it adds to the muddled impression that many have of astrology..
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Old 04-09-2012, 03:22 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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the only response i can think of is to avoid getting involved.. that is probably what the smart folks already figured out, lol.. call me slow, lol..
Discernment is your friend otherwise you're wasting precious time. This, of course, also relates to what your objective is regarding being on the forum. As I'm sure you've noticed, many of the seasoned vets don't spend much time on the RMC forum, for example. That is, unless, it becomes a hotter thread (whats-her-name... Lena comes to mind with the interesting crossed yods and grand trines etc.) or it's a very interesting/educational situation. There's just too many people coming in for quick answers who don't want to participate or do any work. I suppose that's part of the nature of a forum anyway...

I know the thread you are referring to, and in all fairness, this thread was titled with the word "guess" in it. Possibly this is the thread that broke the camels back though, as I do notice quite a few people who are asking for vocational advice without giving any background information.

Having been to a doctor recently and a pro astrologer before, I know that background questions are part of the visit! Sandstone, you are fully right in your assessment, but as it stands in a forum, it's very difficult to emphasize. I'd say open your own clinic!!

Last edited by StillOne; 04-09-2012 at 04:37 AM.
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Old 04-09-2012, 03:47 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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Discernment is your friend otherwise you're wasting precious time. This, of course, also relates to what your objective is regarding being on the forum. As I'm sure you've noticed, many of the seasoned vets don't spend much time on the RMC forum, for example. That is, unless, it becomes a hotter thread (whats-her-name... Lena comes to mind with the interesting crossed yods and grand trines etc.). There's just too many people coming in for quick answers who don't want to participate or do any work. I suppose that's part of the nature of a forum anyway...
People come in for the quick answers are the one forever will stay as clients. For those come to participate one day will become the doctor of his/her own but then some refused to help clients and some will help. All these are just parts of human nature.
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Old 04-09-2012, 03:56 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

Haha, this is kind of funny. I wrote an article about this awhile ago asking that astrologers be given the same chances and understandings as doctors. Glad to know there are others out there who agree!
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Old 04-09-2012, 04:00 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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Haha, this is kind of funny. I wrote an article about this awhile ago asking that astrologers be given the same chances and understandings as doctors. Glad to know there are others out there who agree!
Exactly right! There are good clients and bad clients. There are also good doctors and bad doctors. When good client met bad doctors then she decided to study medicines (astrology) herself!
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Old 04-09-2012, 04:10 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

I sometimes joke that I am an (amateur) astrologer, not a mind-reader.
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Old 04-09-2012, 04:16 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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Originally Posted by poyi View Post
People come in for the quick answers are the one forever will stay as clients. For those come to participate one day will become the doctor of his/her own but then some refused to help clients and some will help. All these are just parts of human nature.
Indeed, that's why you have to just give freely with no expectations of anything in return... sometimes
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Old 04-09-2012, 05:39 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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Originally Posted by sandstone View Post
some questions posed to astrologers by those who appear relatively new to astrology seem to reflect a type of misunderstanding of how astrology works.. i would like to discuss this here.. it came up for me today in a thread that i watched unfold..this is an insight based on an analogy of doctor verses astrologer..

when someone goes to a doctor, the doctor would get nowhere unless the patient revealed information to the doctor on the nature of their problem/sickness.. imagine going to a doctor and you are sick and the doctor asks you - where is your sickness located and you tell them they are the doctor and they ought to know!!!! this attitude appears sometimes by those asking astrologers for input on career direction for example.. instead of providing some insight into interests or talents, the approach seems to be 'well you are the astrologer - you are supposed to know! it also highlights just how little effort or thought the person has really given the question themselves to think that astrology is going to come up with the magical answer..

this seems to be about where the publics perception of astrology is today... astrology as guessing game... no input required other then an anonymous chart from astro.com.. the astrologer is supposed to know everything!!! astrologer = grand wazoo with one of those wizard hats with drawings of stars on it, lol...

i am not sure how astrology is furthered in this type of atmosphere.. the only response i can think of is to avoid getting involved.. that is probably what the smart folks already figured out, lol.. call me slow, lol.. thoughts from any of the regulars, or anyone welcome.. thanks.. maybe this should be posted in the chat section.. if a moderator thinks so - move it. that is cool..
An expert Ayurvedic doctor can precisely prescribe based on "nadhi gyan", some information is here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_diagnosis. (S)he need not ask any question about disease.
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Old 04-09-2012, 05:47 AM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

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An expert Ayurvedic doctor can precisely prescribe based on "nadhi gyan", some information is here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_diagnosis. (S)he need not ask any question about disease.

It is true that Traditional Chinese medicine also has this assessment technique. When I go to see a Chinese medicine doctor (obviously a good one), I do not need to tell him what I concern about. Generally, s/he already knew what I am going to ask.
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Old 04-09-2012, 05:23 PM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

thanks for all the responses here! some were funny(waybread), some were informative(dhundhun/poyi) some were a positive re-inforcement (moog/senshi/stillone) so thanks everyone! my mom when i was young and my wife as i have gotten older have always said to me 'pick your battles'.. this is a good saying for someone with sun in aries, moon in scorpio! i won't bore you with the rest of my chart...

stillone - i like what you said about giving freely without thought of anything in return.. that is really the ultimate way to be in life and while i am not perfect, i remind myself of this fairly often.. some of us like to give.. the happiness and reward is in the giving. thanks everyone.
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Old 04-09-2012, 06:45 PM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

here is a judith hill interview i read last night that some might enjoy reading.. she discusses a number of things, but i will highlight some of what i thought was relevant to this conversation here...it is an interview format

"
TH: How do you feel about the current state of astrology as a profession? Do you see the profession as being in a growth phase? Do you see astrology one day gaining enough respect that it will again be taught and studied in our universities?
JH: I am concerned about what may be a decline in interest. And of course, with all the easy fast-food astrology, I wonder how the skill level is out there. I don't know, but I suspect its slipping.

http://www.findanastrologer.com/Inte...hill-interview

following the 100 word limit here..
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Old 04-09-2012, 06:59 PM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

I think I'm a pretty rubbish astrologer, just getting into it really. I wouldn't charge for what I can do right now, because I know my limitations.

But that doesn't seem to stop other people; I've payed for services from 'pro' astrologers who, I'm sorry to say, know next to bugger all about astrology.

I had an aquaintance who admitted to me that he used to take people's money and simply reel off the text from some psychological development book he'd read, as his form of 'astrological counselling'. He also thought that his doing that was proof that astrology is nonsense, and that all astrologers are charlatans. He doesn't believe in it. I've offered to do his chart, but I haven't heard from him in ages.

It's no wonder astrology has a dreadful reputation, really.

Maybe this isn't entirely appropriate for this thread, maybe it is. Anyway.
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Old 04-09-2012, 08:36 PM
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Re: doctor, or astrologer and client

moog - i think this happens and is one reason why some in the astrology community want to have some system in place for making a distinction between non professionals and professionals.. i am not a professional astrologer, but i have been doing it a long time.. does it matter? i think it does.. since i continue to play/teach music for a living i am always making direct parallels thru my knowledge of music.. the same thing happens in music.. actually in some respects those who study music and come out with a degree would seem better suited to pursuing music on a professional level, but so much of music is based parallels that i see in astrology.. people like jimi hendrix didn't study music in an accredited manner and so many others didn't either.. on one level i don't think it matters whether someone has a degree or badge from a school, but i see the problems with this too.. there is no barrier to entry and everyone from justin beiber to pavarotti can be found in between.. same thing in astrology happens.. i don't think it will ever stop and i don't see this as a bad thing necessarily.. it is like going to the doctor where one is wise to sometimes get a 2nd viewpoint and to take no ones word in a gospel like way.. then there are the charlatans which will always be attracted to using outlets like astrology to hawk their wares..
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