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  #1  
Old 03-21-2012, 03:41 PM
terrcolomba terrcolomba is offline
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how do you predict death?

how do you predict death?
Part of Death? the 8th house? the 12th house? Saturn? the Hyleg?

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Old 03-21-2012, 03:47 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Hi Terrcolomba;

No moral astrologer will predict your death; the closest you may get is having one give you some advice on how to prolong your life and reach longevity.

Astrology isnt meant to scare others, but rather to empower...

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Old 03-21-2012, 03:52 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

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Originally Posted by Ixaee View Post
Hi Terrcolomba;

No moral astrologer will predict your death; the closest you may get is having one give you some advice on how to prolong your life and reach longevity.

Astrology isnt meant to scare others, but rather to empower... an astrologer of any worth will not describe your death to you.
i'm sick and i want to know if i am going to die.

i asked this question because i want to know how you predict death and looking for astrologers on the forum to reply with how they predict death
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Old 03-21-2012, 04:54 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

I calculated the life span of all my family members using the hyleg/alcocoden thing. I studied a lot to calculate those and in the end the answer said that my aunt should have died in childhood (and she's alive at sixty - something) and my father was supposed to live and he's been dead for 18 years.

I think to predict death at a certain date is not only unethical but it is inaccurate. I studied this issue and I maybe I will study it some more but so far I've seen that things are not entirely written concerning people's choices. At some point freedom steps in and what people choose modifies the script.

I am answering you because I don't want you to feel alone.

The silence doesn't mean we don't care but that we don't know!

I'm sure many people on this forum would like to help you but they don't answer because it is unethical or maybe because they know that ANY precise answer would be a LIE.

I understand your urge to find the truth but any answer you may find will not be the right one!

I wish you all the best (also on the behalf of those who don't speak because this is a controversial issue).
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Old 03-21-2012, 05:20 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

It is very complicated. The vedic dasa system is the best thing I have seen so far (perhaps 8th house ruler) however if you have certain things denoting longevity, a strong saturn or jupiter in the 8th for instance, then you will have to look another planet's dasa especially if that planet is soon. But again, it is a big complicated thing and I am not well learned in this.
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Old 03-21-2012, 05:42 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

According to Vedik Astrology, 8th house stands for Longevity, and 7th house is 12th to 8th house, means expense of Longevity. 2nd house is 8th of 7th house, means longevity of expense of Age. Hence (i) 7th Lord is lord of death, (ii) 2nd lord is also lord of death, (iii) 8th lord is lord of Age, certainly is also lord of Age, if malefic effect is on Lord of age, will effect accordingly. (iv)Planets placed with these lords of deaths can also act as lord of death. These lords are placed in various houses, their lords can also be lord of death, and their aspect will give malefic effect.
12th lord, because is 12th for Asc. 3rd house and lord because is 8th from 8th.
Now dasha, transit planets will guide us for the results.
These dashas can also impact on various aspects of life- Financially,adverse effect in Society, Mentally, Bed-ridden patients, Insult, finally last breath.
I mean to say these dashas are not good and will give ill health (Physically, Financially, Socially and finally for age)
Since Saturn is the lord of Longevity and Sun is for Self, so these two planets are also key planets to consider Longevity.
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Last edited by anoop.indirapuramghazibad; 03-23-2012 at 04:43 AM.
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Old 03-22-2012, 04:23 PM
terrcolomba terrcolomba is offline
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by anoop.indirapuramghazibad View Post
According to Vedik Astrology, 8th house stands for Longevity, and 7th house is 12th to 8th house, means expense of Longevity. 2nd house is 8th of 7th house, means longevity of expense of Age. Hence (i) 7th Lord is lord of death, (ii) 2nd lord is also lord of death, (iii) 8th lord is lord of Age, certainly is also lord of Age, if malefic effect is on Lord of age, will effect accordingly. (iv)Planets placed with these lords of deaths can also act as lord of death. These lords are placed in various houses, their lords can also be lord of death, and their aspect will give malefic effect.
12th lord, because is 12th for Asc. 3rd house and lord because is 8th from 8th.
Now dasha, transit planets will guide us for the results.
These dashas can also impact on various aspects of life- Financially,adverse effect in Society, Mentally, Bed-ridden patients, Insult, finally last breath.
I mean to say these dashas are not good and will give ill health (Physically, Financially, Socially and finally for age)
thanks.
this is whitney houston natal with transits of the day she died
https://infinitynow.files.wordpress....ston-natal.gif
what caused her death in the chart?

natal 7th , 12th to 8th is mercury and square south node in 4th and 2nd mars 8th to 8th square pluto
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:22 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by terrcolomba View Post
how do you predict death?
Part of Death? the 8th house? the 12th house? Saturn? the Hyleg?
No ethical astrologer will address that issue. There are many scenarios for death and really who wants to know???. IF it cannot be prevented it is futile. Transits and progressions will give indications but it is advisable only for those who we are know are dying and may give timing.
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:25 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by terrcolomba View Post
thanks.
this is whitney houston natal with transits of the day she died
https://infinitynow.files.wordpress....ston-natal.gif
what caused her death in the chart?

natal 7th , 12th to 8th is mercury and square south node in 4th and 2nd mars 8th to 8th square pluto
This has been addressed in other posts. No squares to south node involved. The 8th house was involved as was the 6th house. Although her death was accidental, it was almost inevitable she would die of drug overdose, given her history. She was in rehab but had been many times before. Her addiction was intense and deep and very hard to overcome.
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:45 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by terrcolomba View Post
thanks.
this is whitney houston natal with transits of the day she died
https://infinitynow.files.wordpress....ston-natal.gif
what caused her death in the chart?

natal 7th , 12th to 8th is mercury and square south node in 4th and 2nd mars 8th to 8th square pluto
There is some discussion specifically of Whitney Houston's recent passing at this link http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=46808
and
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47191
02-19-2012, 03:11 AM
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Re: Hyleg and Alcocoden
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandstone
here is my simple thesis :
if you want to learn about the hyleg and alcocoden( or any other interesting technique to astrology), use an astrology chart that is rated AA.. you stand a better chance of learning the technique you are trying to figure out, as opposed to getting bogged down with a chart that has question marks around it.. as much as it might be fun to focus on someone who you really want to know better that is also famous - pick someone with a chart that is rated AA.. you will get further... go with whitney houstons chart, not because i like her, but because you can try the technique out on a chart that is rated AA.. cheers -


Reminder to all: Omnisphericus commenced this thread with a traditional analysis of Whitney Houston's AA rated chart and IMO has delivered convincing results!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus
I will try firstly to give the example of the Hyleg and Alcocoden in the chart of the recently died pop diva Whitney Houston.

Lets take the example of Whitney Houston.

Attachment 26865

Her chart is a night chart so we first look for a potential Hyleg in the Moon.
Moon is under the Horizon in a night chart, so it can not be Hyleg.
Then we go to the Sun (in a day chart we first go with the Sun), the Sun is in cadent 6th house so it can not be Hyleg too.
Than we look at the Syzygy, or the last lunation prior the birth. In the Whitney's chart it was a Full Moon prior the birth so the chart is so called Preventional and we take the Pars Fortuna as potential Hyleg.
It is in 4th in Cancer.
We now look at the dispositors to see which dispositor takes the most dignity points at the degree in which the PoF is.
For that reason we take the dignity table, I will use here a table with triplicities according to Dorotheus and terms according to the Egyptians.
Domicileruler takes 5 points, exaltation ruler 4, triplicity ruler 3, term ruler 2 and face ruler 1 point.
Moon, domicile ruler = 5 points
Jupiter exaltation ruler 4 points
Mars, triplicity ruler 3 points
Venus, term ruler 2 points
Venus, face ruler 1 point.

Next we look if the Moon (as having the most points in that degree in which PoF is) is making some classical (conjunction, sextile, square, trine, opposition) aspect to the PoF. She is making a square to the Fortuna but it is in wide orbs (although in the moiety). Jupiter is out of orb. Venus is not in aspect. Mars is making a partile (exact) aspect to the PoF and we will take him instead of the Moon (because it is in partile aspect).


So, Part Of Fortune is a Hyleg in Whitney's chart and Mars is Alcocoden.


Next we look at the years table of the planets potential Alcocodens:

Attachment 26866

We see that the minor years of Mars are 15, Middle Years 40,5 and major years 66.

Mars is angular but in very week sign position (in Exile) so we will take its Middle years (40.5).
Next, we look at the aspects which Mars receives from the benefics and malefics.
If benefic aspects the Alcocoden with Con, sextile or trine adds its minor years as years and its middle years as months, weeks or days (according to the position in which lies).
If Malefic aspects the Alcocoden, subtract from the Alcocoden with its minor years and middle years as months, weeks or days.

Mars is aspecting the other malefic Saturn, but with trine (so this not subtract years because it is benevolent aspect).

Mars is making opposition with Jupiter but out of orb, and with opposition so this does not add to the years.
Mars is making a sextile to Venus and she can add her minor years.
So we add Venus' minor years (8), and her middle years as days (45), because she is cadent and combust. If she was in good position we would add her middle years as months.

So we have,

40.5years + 8years + 45 days = 48 years 7 months and 15 days.
Whitney lived 48 years 6 months and 2 days
.



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Old 03-23-2012, 03:46 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

02-16-2012, 07:34 AM
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Re: Hyleg and Alcocoden
IMO we are all agreed that Omnisphericus thread is intended for the purpose of exploring the idea that the Hyleg and Alcocoden are an indication regarding the Vital Life Force of the native - meaning the potential Vital Life Force in the absence of any form of intervention
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus
So, Hyleg and Alcocoden are showing the Vital Life Force of the native. They show how much years in life do you have according to the 'Esse' or the condition of your body and soul. With the modern medicine it seems out that this Esse is prolonged,

If the nativity dies from a serial killer, or a car accident H & A does not count, they do not show the accidents, they show the condition of the body and soul and accordingly how much years one have
.


dr. farr has underlined the value of this approach of assessing potential Vital Life Force of the native for simply therapeutic purposes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr. farr
However, I do think that many use this kind of thing for indications of potential critical years rather than fatalistic death clock predicting

-I KNOW that most reputable jyotish use "longevity" evaluations for just that purpose (indications of critical years), and in astro-therapeutics these "red flag" indications, derived from such methods, are of value in preventive therapeutics.


For example - and completely different from the technique described in this thread - use of simple symbolic progression (1 year = 1 degree, first mentioned in the 12th century by Ibn Ezra in his "Beginning of Wisdom") can be quite valuable in pointing out potentially critical times: use of the progressed SN to various natal points is one of these valuable methods:

in the case of Whitney Houston, her progressed SN conjuncted her ascending degree (8 Pisces) at her 48th birthday (natal SN @ 20 Capricorn): astro-therapeutically, this would have been a red flag that her 48th year was a definite critical period,

and preventive measures (low stress, much care about drugs and medication, tonification for her heart -which her natal indicated as a potential weak area in her health, etc) would have been prescribed for her by a knowledgeable practitioner;

the fact that classical hyleg/alcohedron analysis (which I myself do not use) also indicated her 48th year as possibly anaretic (as one of 3 such possible critical years using the analysis given in this thread) would have decidedly underscored the critical-ness of the 48th year and the importance of undertaking natural (non-drug) preventive and corrective measures, during that time...


IMO dr. farr has highlighted the importance of these techniques in SUPPORTING the native at critical times during the life

dr. farr thank you for encapsulating the historical rationale highlighting the unambiguous clarity of whole sign houses

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr. farr
TSMALL
In whole sign, Sun in same sign as ascendant and above the ascending degree CANNOT be cadent - it must be in the first house;

Liber Hermetis (earlier than the 6th century AD) made a big deal about this, and gave quite different indications for the Sun IN THE FIRST HOUSE, being above the ascending degree (therefore diurnal) vs being below the ascending degree (and therefore being nocturnal)

Only in Equal house and all the quadrant systems, can the diurnal Sun in the same sign as the ascending degree, become "cadent" by being placed (by these methods) in the 12th

...I consider this evidence of the unnatural ramifications which various theoretical house division systems, can produce...(my opinion)



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Old 03-23-2012, 05:04 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Death is unpredictable. There are a variety of variables that go into it and you just can't account for them all with something as vague as astrology.

For example, some people have charts that show they should've died in childhood. And this would be 100% true... 500 years ago when we didn't have vaccines for smallpox. Or maybe you'll get shot and die, except the hospital you were sent to has the most advanced trauma center in the world and they manage to perform a miracle and save you. You never know, with all the advances we have it's hard to say how or why someone will die.

Furthermore, as someone stated above, it's immoral for an astrologer to tell you of your time of death. The reason being is similar to an effect researchers observe when they're studying people. The presence of the researcher invariably changes the subject. The same is true for the astrologer; the knowledge of your death changes how you respond to it, leading to a strong possibility the initial outcome was changed.
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Old 03-23-2012, 05:10 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Closest we can come is the identification of possible critical periods and a determi9nation of the quality of influences operating during those periods. And even this can really only be done with substantial accuracy by experts in the field of predictive astrology.
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Old 03-23-2012, 09:26 AM
anoop.indirapuramghazibad anoop.indirapuramghazibad is offline
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Re: how do you predict death?

I had seen this chart according to Vedik Astrology. At the time of Death Mahadasha - Moon, Antar dasha- Venus, Pratyantar Dasha - Moon, Sukshm Dasha - Merc., and Pran Dasha- Sat.
Now Moon- 5L, placed in Asc, Venus 8L and 3L(8th from 8th) placed with Sun6L (Aspect from Sat - malefic impact on Venus), again Moon - 5L, Merc- 7L and 4th lord, and finally sat. 11L and 12L (aspect from Venus-8L and Sun, malefic impact).
Out of these dashas- Mahadasha Placed in Asc, and 5th house (10th from 8th lord) placed in self effecting self, Ven. - for 8 L (8L is the lord of age) and 8th from 8th (3rd L), Moon -self, Merc. (7th Lord- Lord of death), then Sat. (Effective from 10-2-2012 mid night to 13-2-2012) 12 L (Expense of Self)
Now Transit Sat, in 8th house, Jup. in 2nd house Aspects- Merc., Sat. Aspects- Sat in 11 house, Venus in 5th house and 2nd house. Mars - placed in 6th house, aspects-12 house and Moon self. Moon in 6th house aspects 12H.
Now if we see Divisional charts D-3, Sat is 8Land 7L (Lord of Age and death) Marc. Lord of 12 house (Expense of self), Moon Asc. , Now D-12, Sat.- 8L and 7th L, Mer and Ven placed in 8th house, Moon Asc.
D-30 , Ven 2nd L and 7L,Sat 3rd house (8th from 8thhouse)
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Old 03-23-2012, 11:21 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MSO View Post
Death is unpredictable. There are a variety of variables that go into it and you just can't account for them all with something as vague as astrology.

For example, some people have charts that show they should've died in childhood. And this would be 100% true... 500 years ago when we didn't have vaccines for smallpox. Or maybe you'll get shot and die, except the hospital you were sent to has the most advanced trauma center in the world and they manage to perform a miracle and save you. You never know, with all the advances we have it's hard to say how or why someone will die.

Furthermore, as someone stated above, it's immoral for an astrologer to tell you of your time of death. The reason being is similar to an effect researchers observe when they're studying people. The presence of the researcher invariably changes the subject. The same is true for the astrologer; the knowledge of your death changes how you respond to it, leading to a strong possibility the initial outcome was changed.
Was going to post something like the above until I saw your post. Although it would've been less constructive (since I can never offer a proper analyzation without loosing my train of thought).
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:25 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by anoop.indirapuramghazibad View Post
According to Vedik Astrology, 8th house stands for Longevity, and 7th house is 12th to 8th house, means expense of Longevity. 2nd house is 8th of 7th house, means longevity of expense of Age. Hence (i) 7th Lord is lord of death, (ii) 2nd lord is also lord of death, (iii) 8th lord is lord of Age, certainly is also lord of Age, if malefic effect is on Lord of age, will effect accordingly. (iv)Planets placed with these lords of deaths can also act as lord of death. These lords are placed in various houses, their lords can also be lord of death, and their aspect will give malefic effect.
12th lord, because is 12th for Asc. 3rd house and lord because is 8th from 8th.
Now dasha, transit planets will guide us for the results.
These dashas can also impact on various aspects of life- Financially,adverse effect in Society, Mentally, Bed-ridden patients, Insult, finally last breath.
I mean to say these dashas are not good and will give ill health (Physically, Financially, Socially and finally for age)
Since Saturn is the lord of Longevity and Sun is for Self, so these two planets are also key planets to consider Longevity.
In that case, what will it means when your Mars is superlative planet and 8th house cusp in Aries ruler is Mars?
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Old 03-23-2012, 03:28 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MSO View Post
Death is unpredictable. There are a variety of variables that go into it and you just can't account for them all with something as vague as astrology.

For example, some people have charts that show they should've died in childhood. And this would be 100% true... 500 years ago when we didn't have vaccines for smallpox. Or maybe you'll get shot and die, except the hospital you were sent to has the most advanced trauma center in the world and they manage to perform a miracle and save you. You never know, with all the advances we have it's hard to say how or why someone will die.

Furthermore, as someone stated above, it's immoral for an astrologer to tell you of your time of death. The reason being is similar to an effect researchers observe when they're studying people. The presence of the researcher invariably changes the subject. The same is true for the astrologer; the knowledge of your death changes how you respond to it, leading to a strong possibility the initial outcome was changed.
Hahaha I like what you said "the knowledge of your death changes how you respond to it"

I guess end of discussion then
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Old 03-23-2012, 05:07 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr. farr View Post
Closest we can come is the identification of possible critical periods and a determi9nation of the quality of influences operating during those periods. And even this can really only be done with substantial accuracy by experts in the field of predictive astrology.
how can someone identify possible critical periods and determine the quality of their influences? what's the method? thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by anoop.indirapuramghazibad View Post
I had seen this chart according to Vedik Astrology. At the time of Death Mahadasha - Moon, Antar dasha- Venus, Pratyantar Dasha - Moon, Sukshm Dasha - Merc., and Pran Dasha- Sat.
Now Moon- 5L, placed in Asc, Venus 8L and 3L(8th from 8th) placed with Sun6L (Aspect from Sat - malefic impact on Venus), again Moon - 5L, Merc- 7L and 4th lord, and finally sat. 11L and 12L (aspect from Venus-8L and Sun, malefic impact).
Out of these dashas- Mahadasha Placed in Asc, and 5th house (10th from 8th lord) placed in self effecting self, Ven. - for 8 L (8L is the lord of age) and 8th from 8th (3rd L), Moon -self, Merc. (7th Lord- Lord of death), then Sat. (Effective from 10-2-2012 mid night to 13-2-2012) 12 L (Expense of Self)
Now Transit Sat, in 8th house, Jup. in 2nd house Aspects- Merc., Sat. Aspects- Sat in 11 house, Venus in 5th house and 2nd house. Mars - placed in 6th house, aspects-12 house and Moon self. Moon in 6th house aspects 12H.
Now if we see Divisional charts D-3, Sat is 8Land 7L (Lord of Age and death) Marc. Lord of 12 house (Expense of self), Moon Asc. , Now D-12, Sat.- 8L and 7th L, Mer and Ven placed in 8th house, Moon Asc.
D-30 , Ven 2nd L and 7L,Sat 3rd house (8th from 8thhouse)
what's divisional charts? what did you mean(the underlined part)?
thanks


MSO,if an astrologer predict death to someone that isn't already dying,they can try to prevent their death if they know the quality of the influences(dr. farr said that you can know that.) and that could be why there are critical times because if you know the method to find the critical times and the quality of their influences(dr. farr could tell us) you may be able to prevent it.
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Old 03-23-2012, 07:16 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

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Originally Posted by terrcolomba View Post
how can someone identify possible critical periods and determine the quality of their influences? what's the method? thanks

MSO,if an astrologer predict death to someone that isn't already dying,they can try to prevent their death if they know the quality of the influences(dr. farr said that you can know that.) and that could be why there are critical times because if you know the method to find the critical times and the quality of their influences(dr. farr could tell us) you may be able to prevent it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus
So, Hyleg and Alcocoden are showing the Vital Life Force of the native. They show how much years in life do you have according to the 'Esse' or the condition of your body and soul. With the modern medicine it seems out that this Esse is prolonged,

If the nativity dies from a serial killer, or a car accident H & A does not count, they do not show the accidents, they show the condition of the body and soul and accordingly how much years one have.

dr. farr has indicated the value of this approach of assessing potential Vital Life Force of the native for simply therapeutic purposes: http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46808
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Last edited by JUPITERASC; 05-04-2012 at 03:19 AM. Reason: spelling
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Old 03-23-2012, 09:42 PM
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Re: how do you predict death?

terrcolomba take a look here http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=36454, bobzemco shows how to do the math. But first you have to know your Hyleg. Unfortunately bobzemco seems not to be an active member for many months.

My wishes to get well soon.
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Old 03-24-2012, 12:08 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Well, I would not be inclined to think there is any mathematic table or relationship between Lords of house or Planet Rulers that would accurately pinpoint death. How can it? We all to often die from similiar illnesses or in certain situations.

I'd be more inclined to believe Natal Aspects, Planetary placements would give us a tendency to practice unsafe/ bad habits and in the case of Whitney Houston or anyone with Sun squaring Neptune as she has lack an inherent ability to get honest with themselves when they surround themselves with like minded people in her case drug addictions. Her Mercury opposing the ascendant makes for a people pleaser. Early in life a Sun in a weaker house such as a cadent house (6th) like her's can make for a person who's Will may not be strong enough to break out of the people pleaser mold. A less fortunate combination. Any one can laugh all they want when they look at my chart and see I have those two same aspects with my Sun less than a degree squaring Neptune. I promise you that most angular house Sun natives have stronger wills than they appear be they fire signs or other signs placed in the angular house, even if ill aspected or in western hemisphere houses. I never had a drug or alcohol issue. My "drug" of choice was food and it near killed me. I had terminal liver disease for years and I over came by learning my lessons and becoming less rigid and more accepting of alternative medical choices since traditional had no hope at the time. As transiting Saturn came nearer my Natal Sun.. and if you look at Ms. Houston Chart.. She failed to get past the transit only in reverse Transiting Sun (vitality) passed Natal Saturn (lessons in life) an equally dangerous time. She was under double threat because her natal Sun opposing the Saturn transiting Sun aspect was. One can never say any of these aspects indicated WHEN she would die because of this or any particular transit but I would say it is a time of greatest threat from death concerning not learning from any particular life lesson that is not getting through to us. Her stronger square between Venus and Neptune can point to difficult relationships I never had heard she had a drug issue till her and Bobby got together. Incidently, I learned of my serious illness quite a while before another even more critical disease developed that got my attention.. Saturn was near four degrees my natal Sun and also opposing my natal sun less than 4 degrees. Her death being ruled an accident is no surprised when you see she has an unaspected mars which some think such an aspect could equal Sun squaring mars and person with a higher tendency for accidents or recklessness. Even with a part time user of coke it might be reckless to be getting in water much. Further, Saturn in any Classic hard aspect including conjunction to your Natal Sun are critical times in mine and others opinions I have seen it work in my life so many times. They are either a time of final pay off if have been ignoring a situation in your life or in my case they have always been wakeup calls. It may be just myself, but I believe there are not certain aspects of calculations that indicate death exactly and so most are better at looking death in retrospect. Ability to adjust in most every aspect of life is a main key to life. Particularly in our own attitudes about black and white thinking in particular.

Also we are all affected by someone else's whacked out "nervous" and/or "inattentive periods" transits that bring about our death or why are there groups of people dying at once who all have different charts? Only on a personal basis can the Saturn and Sun correlations be at best, vague indicators, of times to be careful or times to readjust our lives. Too many variables. The most visible Solar Eclipse ever to be seen in recorded time here in the central United States is predicted to occur on my birthday (12 August) in 2045...if I and this planet as we know it survives the collision of a particular astroid in the mid 2030s I hope to live to see that eclipse. LOL If not ...whatever ...when you at least have a time of facing your own mortality.. death becomes less important and fearful. I accepted a lot of the ugliness in my life, how I was causing most of it, worked proactively to get through it, went through several of the stages of dealing with death, and then I was given another chance. I inadvertently followed an old adage unknown to me at the time.. "Yield that you may have a victory".
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Old 03-24-2012, 12:29 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by franklin taylor View Post
I'd be more inclined to believe Natal Aspects, Planetary placements would give us a tendency to practice unsafe/ bad habits and in the case of Whitney Houston or anyone with Sun squaring Neptune as she has lack an inherent ability to get honest with themselves when they surround themselves with like minded people in her case drug addictions. Her Mercury opposing the ascendant makes for a people pleaser. Early in life a Sun in a weaker house such as a cadent house (6th) like her's can make for a person who's Will may not be strong enough to break out of the people pleaser mold. A less fortunate combination.

..... and if you look at Ms. Houston Chart.. She failed to get past the transit only in reverse Transiting Sun (vitality) passed Natal Saturn (lessons in life) an equally dangerous time. She was under double threat because her natal Sun opposing the Saturn transiting Sun aspect was. One can never say any of these aspects indicated WHEN she would die because of this or any particular transit but I would say it is a time of greatest threat from death concerning not learning from any particular life lesson that is not getting through to us. Her stronger square between Venus and Neptune can point to difficult relationships I never had heard she had a drug issue till her and Bobby got together.

Her death being ruled an accident is no surprised when you see she has an unaspected mars which some think such an aspect could equal Sun squaring mars and person with a higher tendency for accidents or recklessness. Even with a part time user of coke it might be reckless to be getting in water much. Further, Saturn in any Classic hard aspect including conjunction to your Natal Sun are critical times in mine and others opinions I have seen it work in my life so many times. They are either a time of final pay off if have been ignoring a situation in your life or in my case they have always been wakeup calls. It may be just myself, but I believe there are not certain aspects of calculations that indicate death exactly and so most are better at looking death in retrospect. Ability to adjust in most every aspect of life is a main key to life. Particularly in our own attitudes about black and white thinking in particular.
QUOTE FROM NEWS REPORTS FRIDAY


Houston's caused of death explained

Tragic star accidentally drowned; cocaine a contributing factor

Singer Whitney Houston died as a result of accidental drowning, a coroner has ruled.

Cocaine use and heart disease were also named as contributing factors in the star's death. Other drugs found in her blood included marijuana, an anti-anxiety drug, a muscle relaxant and allergy medication.

A spokesman for the coroner said tests showed Houston was a chronic cocaine user, but added that "no trauma or foul play" was suspected in her death.

Houston was found underwater in the bath of her Los Angeles hotel room on February 11.
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Old 03-24-2012, 02:34 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

@ JUPITERASC

QUOTE FROM NEWS REPORTS FRIDAY


Houston's caused of death explained
Tragic star accidentally drowned; cocaine a contributing factor

Singer Whitney Houston died as a result of accidental drowning, a coroner has ruled.

Cocaine use and heart disease were also named as contributing factors in the star's death. Other drugs found in her blood included marijuana, an anti-anxiety drug, a muscle relaxant and allergy medication.

A spokesman for the coroner said tests showed Houston was a chronic cocaine user, but added that "no trauma or foul play" was suspected in her death.

Houston was found underwater in the bath of her Los Angeles hotel room on February 11

I heard that about an hour ago

That so called muscle relaxant medication Flexiril ( generically named cyclobenzaphrine) many people cannot handle it alone. Initially has same effects as the drug Demerol then a tolerance over time brings it to nothing I stopped it because I no longer could not go to sleep with out and no relaxing was occuring with it so I knew that is a bad sign. Needless to say all that other items in her blood. I had extented therapy on it for generalized dystonia for years and it was a horror. It is not actually a muscle relaxant but popularly prescribed as such it is too small dose to relax any muscle group of significance rather it cuts off brain signal sensing full muscle spasming.. Its a "Brain signal suppressant" Too bad about Whitney. She failed to learn transit lessons too long. All that Rehab therapy means nothing if you fail to get honest with yourself and get proactive about change. Never having to face serious life altering consequences of our habits, behaviors is the worst medicine oneself and our society at large as well can go through. Sometimes death is the only life altering consequence for some. When we lie to ourselves so long (Sun square Neptune's native's exaggerated affliction) Saturn lessons are trully symbolic concerning our health and relationship lessons. Her Sun in 6th house accentuates that issue of health.
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Your Natal Chart is a fated foundation in which, by and large, the house (called your life) you build upon it is strictly up to you. Fate and freewill. Do the best with what you have been given. "That which we do not confront in ourselves we will meet as fate"...Carl Jung
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Old 03-24-2012, 02:49 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

Quote:
Originally Posted by franklin taylor View Post
I heard that about an hour ago

That so called muscle relaxant medication Flexiril ( generically named cyclobenzaphrine) many people cannot handle it alone. Initially has same effects as the drug Demerol then a tolerance over time brings it to nothing I stopped it because I no longer could not go to sleep with out and no relaxing was occuring with it so I knew that is a bad sign.
Needless to say all that other items in her blood. I had extended therapy on it for generalized dystonia for years and it was a horror. It is not actually a muscle relaxant but popularly prescribed as such it is too small dose to relax any muscle group of significance rather it cuts off brain signal sensing full muscle spasming.. Its a "Brain signal suppressant" Too bad about Whitney. She failed to learn transit lessons too long. All that Rehab therapy means nothing if you fail to get honest with yourself and get proactive about change. Never having to face serious life altering consequences of our habits, behaviors is the worst medicine oneself and our society at large as well can go through. Sometimes death is the only life altering consequence for some. When we lie to ourselves so long (Sun square Neptune's native's exaggerated affliction) Saturn lessons are trully symbolic concerning our health and relationship lessons. Her Sun in 6th house accentuates that issue of health.
It seems that 'Fixing behavior with a magic pill' is widely accepted and it is a matter for serious concern that - due to clever marketing/advertising - many do not question how pills with horrendous side-effects can be of any possible value to anyone other than those who yearly make billions of dollars of profits from their sale! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDlH9...eature=related

A Documentary on Psychiatry
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qs9T...eature=related
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let your food be your medicine: let your medicine be your food. Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY red cabbage sliced Equatorially illustrates the Golden Mean Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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Old 03-24-2012, 02:51 AM
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Re: how do you predict death?

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Originally Posted by terrcolomba View Post
an astrologer predict death to someone that isn't already dying,they can try to prevent their death if they know the quality of the influences(dr. farr said that you can know that.) and that could be why there are critical times because if you know the method to find the critical times and the quality of their influences(dr. farr could tell us) you may be able to prevent it.

That is the value (the ONLY value, to my way of thinking) in identifying possible critical periods of life-so that measures can be taken, and certain risks avoided, during that period of time, to strengthen the life force of the individual involved. Other than for such preventive/supportive purposes, longevity estimations and death-period predictions are nothing but vain curiosity; however, retrospective (post mortem) chart investigations are of value, in identifying likely casual astrological trends and indications in the chart, but only as instructional for us, in future evaluations of living persons' charts, for estimating critical periods so that SOMETHING CAN BE DONE to support the individual during those critical periods.
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