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  #1  
Old 02-13-2012, 02:13 PM
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Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Hello people,
I don't know if I should write:

Opened minds preferred!

like the member "Pallas-trine-Mars" did in previous research threads. Anyway I think that if such a category of threads exist, there are relevant people to read it.

The level of the conversation in the threads "Is it time for an astro redesign thanks to astronomy?" and "Method of Applying 13 Sign Zodiac" is really high that encourages me to make this thread.

My new Astrological theory aspires to make scientists deal with Astrology again. As their colleagues did some hundreds of years ago.

After my studies in Physics and Astronomy, I started my project to redesign Tropical (and lesser Vedic) Astrology in order to comply with Astronomy' s data. It was not simple and I was forced to propose many changes in the fields of:
1. Zodiac classification,
2. 4 elements Assumption,
3. Ascendant
4. Houses of the planets
5. Dates and length of the Zodiac Signs
And last but most important the addition of Ophiuchus between Scorpio and Sagittarius.
The precession of the equinoxes is very well computed by my new theory and all Zodiac Signs are annually adapting to their new dates..
As you may well understand all the elements that were contradicting with Astronomy had to be conformed without changing the charm and internal consistency of Astrology.
So the new Ascendant of "Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac" is represented by the Moon's Sign.
Lastly, Sunspots take an important role in the new Astrology.
I can't wait for the dialog to begin..

  #2  
Old 02-13-2012, 03:13 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Making your own astrological system must be an incredibly tall order. Interesting though.

Can we see it an action? How about a delineation or several.

I don't think making astrology conform to astronomy is going to persuade many scientists.

Good luck though.
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  #3  
Old 02-13-2012, 10:02 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Do you mean by making a Birth Horoscope? In this case, I need someone to give me his/her birthday, hour and time zone (I don't need exact place, only time zone)

For the second part of your reply concerning scientists, you are forgetting that in the beginning only scientists were dealing with Astrology. Mostly Astronomers.

Last edited by vasilis; 02-13-2012 at 10:07 PM.
  #4  
Old 02-13-2012, 10:57 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

How about Hitler?

http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Hitler,_Adolf

What sort of dialogue are you interested in? You haven't told us much about your system. Perhaps you could go into specifics.

Yes, I know that astrologer/scientist used to be synonymous, but I don't see how that changes anything about current conditions.
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  #5  
Old 02-14-2012, 07:58 AM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Dear Moog,

Please allow me to change the person from Hitler to Angelina Jolie. She's far more interesting and inside my programe's date limits.

"Angelina Jolie was born on the 4th of June 1975 at 9:09 LA California.
She 's Taurus with Pisces as Ascendant. The date she was born the Sun was is Taurus and the Moon in Pisces. Her Natal Chart below is confirming the planet's place on the ecliptic the date she was born.
As Taurian she expresses dualism which is obvious from her professional evolution. Her negative points are her stubbornness and slow pace.
The Moon in Pisces means primacy in life but also recklessness and egoism.
The conjunction of Jupiter with Mars in Pisces brings concern for the family and children in equilibrium with her psychological pursuits.
The opposition of the Sun with Neptune mean balance in working and economical health.
The presence of planet Neptune in the Zodiac Constellation of Ophiuchus brings philosophical quest and action in her life.
When Angelina Jolie was born the Sun had 7 Sunspots. According to the Sunspot number she's an α (greek letter "alpha") character. It means that she's mild natured."

Natal Chart image

I really don't know what sort of dialog I am interested in! I thought that a new theory would make Astrologers and fans make questions anyway!

I can write some more things about the theory:
The symbol of Ophiuchus is the Greek letter Phi "Φ"
The small line at the top of the drawing is "γ" point which is placed inside the Constellation of Pisces.

You may find the prologue and introduction of my book at Smashwords of Google books in order to get a wider view of the theory.

Last edited by vasilis; 02-14-2012 at 08:04 AM. Reason: place the graph
  #6  
Old 02-14-2012, 10:01 AM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

I reckon change is a good idea, however, expect your infantile theory to meet with much resistance, like a new born baby into the world of disease there is much the current astrologcal society will have to adapt to from your work. Don't be fooled, babies ALWAYS get alot of attention, gift & curse.

On a lighter note, i'm intrigued, since i too have been looking for a way out of my predominantly cadent chart, i reckon i might like to see my chart presented through your theory. perhaps it'll put me off astrology alltogether and i can begin living my life actually.

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  #7  
Old 02-14-2012, 11:09 AM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Dear Sebastien,
I understand very well the meaning of your words.
Anyway a new theory is not a mature theory. When Claudius Ptolemy wrote the "Tetravivlos" (or "Tetrabiblos") the theory was already 200 years old and applied from many ancient Astrologers like Vettius Valens and others..
Critique is welcome and I hope it will stay on an affordable level.
-----------
Your Natal Chart is really fantastic. I suppose that you have already seen the Tropical Astrology version of it. The main aspects of the 7 planets + the Moon + the Sun are drawn in the same way.
The Natal Charts of "Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac" are dynamically adapting to "γ" point (which is the point of intersection of the Ecliptic with the Celestial Equator, changing by 0,52" every year). This is the small line at the top of the Chart (the place of the Moon in your chart).

"When you were born the Sun was in Cancer. Your are Cancerian.
Cancerians are enthusiastic people. You have many virtues, such as pride (in the positive sense), generosity and kindness. You inspire and have a positive effect on those around you. Your main trait is the capacity to enjoy life. You have great confidence in your beliefs. You are ambitious and creative. Your strong personality is a passport to the success of your ambitions.
The Moon is your new Ascendant. In Pisces it means dynamic mood but also recklessness and egoism. Moon in Pisces gives power of expression.
Mercury in Leo predisposes you to find people with similar purposes and ideas.
The big triangular (trine) aspects of Moon - Sun - Jupiter are very important for the forming of your character. In a few words they Shape radical characters with optimism features.
The also big triangular aspects of Moon - Sun - Uranus are also significant for your social life. They give hope, evolution and good chemistry with your fliends.
..........."
Sebastien Cheritte Natal Chart of "13 Zodiac Astrology"
  #8  
Old 02-14-2012, 01:07 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

did i get this right... in your theory, saturn falls into Virgo, loses his exaltation the (******* doesn't deserve any exaltation in any case)
Jupiter moves out of strength into Libra
Uranus falls into Scorpio - becomes exhalted!
the window is so tiny, what are the chances??..
anyway...
Neptune moves to the cusp of Ophiuchus & Sagittarius - correct? So which is it exactly???
Mars moves to Gemini, (out of fall)
venus moves to Leo (out of fall into joy)
hmmm... what can be explained
how much of thye descriptions of the signs as they stand, also apply to your theory??
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..Her hands feel the embrace of heavy tools, red cloth wraps her wet body, she's changing. her hair curves out into thick locks. her tear-shaped breasts now armoured, body fit. Aware of her quick perception as eagles pass on the vast plains, her breathing deepens. Feet stabilize, muscles tighten, head tilted forward. Fire fills dreamy Luna's heart, sharpening her senses. Now enriched by her freedom to act again, she turns away from the water "the answers are here, i'll have to fight for them.."
  #9  
Old 02-14-2012, 02:04 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasilis View Post
Hello people,
I don't know if I should write:

Opened minds preferred!

like the member "Pallas-trine-Mars" did in previous research threads. Anyway I think that if such a category of threads exist, there are relevant people to read it.

The level of the conversation in the threads "Is it time for an astro redesign thanks to astronomy?" and "Method of Applying 13 Sign Zodiac" is really high that encourages me to make this thread.

My new Astrological theory aspires to make scientists deal with Astrology again. As their colleagues did some hundreds of years ago.

After my studies in Physics and Astronomy, I started my project to redesign Tropical (and lesser Vedic) Astrology in order to comply with Astronomy' s data. It was not simple and I was forced to propose many changes in the fields of:
1. Zodiac classification,
2. 4 elements Assumption,
3. Ascendant
4. Houses of the planets
5. Dates and length of the Zodiac Signs
And last but most important the addition of Ophiuchus between Scorpio and Sagittarius.
The precession of the equinoxes is very well computed by my new theory and all Zodiac Signs are annually adapting to their new dates..
As you may well understand all the elements that were contradicting with Astronomy had to be conformed without changing the charm and internal consistency of Astrology.
So the new Ascendant of "Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac" is represented by the Moon's Sign.
Lastly, Sunspots take an important role in the new Astrology.
I can't wait for the dialog to begin..
very interesting
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Last edited by Raquel; 02-14-2012 at 02:10 PM.
  #10  
Old 02-14-2012, 02:13 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasilis View Post
Do you mean by making a Birth Horoscope? In this case, I need someone to give me his/her birthday, hour and time zone (I don't need exact place, only time zone)

For the second part of your reply concerning scientists, you are forgetting that in the beginning only scientists were dealing with Astrology. Mostly Astronomers.
I give you, do it for me please,

13th October 1989 at 1.35

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  #11  
Old 02-14-2012, 06:10 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

@everybody

I will post no more Natal Charts except for research reasons in this thread. I hope that you understand that this is a conversation about a New theory and not a personal Astrological analysis thread.


@ Raquel,

thank you for your nice words.
You can see your "13 Zodiac Astrology" Birth Horoscope here

I'm making a small analysis for your Natal data:

"When you were born the Sun had about 48 Sunspots. According to the Sunspot number you are an "epsilon" (greek letter ε) character. It means that you are animated but you seek harmony.
When you were born Sun was in Virgo. Virgos, above all, look for harmony in their lives. You are cooperative and seek peaceful relationships with those around you. You are highly perceptive and seek consensus. You know the importance of shared values and the sharing of material things.
The Moon is your new Ascendant. In Pisces it means dominance in the game
but also spirit of contradiction to friends. Moon in Pisces gives capacity in management.
Your Natal Chart is full of positive aspects between planets. In 13 Zodiac Astrology most aspects have positive effect. But Conjunctions are generally negative for your life.
The Moon is in opposition with Mercury which edows you in the communication field.
Venus in Scorpio means periods of nervousness in your life"

There is much more to say and you may discover it on your own if you read my theory. I think that this is a good motive for you to go on..

I also think that with this natal chart we have enough samples to talk more about my theory. Anyone who wants can find more information on my website and the internet.

Last edited by vasilis; 02-14-2012 at 06:12 PM. Reason: misspellings
  #12  
Old 02-14-2012, 08:48 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasilis View Post
@everybody

I will post no more Natal Charts except for research reasons in this thread. I hope that you understand that this is a conversation about a New theory and not a personal Astrological analysis thread.


@ Raquel,

thank you for your nice words.
You can see your "13 Zodiac Astrology" Birth Horoscope here

I'm making a small analysis for your Natal data:

"When you were born the Sun had about 48 Sunspots. According to the Sunspot number you are an "epsilon" (greek letter ε) character. It means that you are animated but you seek harmony.
When you were born Sun was in Virgo. Virgos, above all, look for harmony in their lives. You are cooperative and seek peaceful relationships with those around you. You are highly perceptive and seek consensus. You know the importance of shared values and the sharing of material things.
The Moon is your new Ascendant. In Pisces it means dominance in the game
but also spirit of contradiction to friends. Moon in Pisces gives capacity in management.
Your Natal Chart is full of positive aspects between planets. In 13 Zodiac Astrology most aspects have positive effect. But Conjunctions are generally negative for your life.
The Moon is in opposition with Mercury which edows you in the communication field.
Venus in Scorpio means periods of nervousness in your life"

There is much more to say and you may discover it on your own if you read my theory. I think that this is a good motive for you to go on..

I also think that with this natal chart we have enough samples to talk more about my theory. Anyone who wants can find more information on my website and the internet.
So it means, The ascendant and the moon are always the same in this method?

Thank you
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  #13  
Old 02-14-2012, 09:30 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

The trace of the Moon on the ecliptic is placed in the constellation that represents the New Ascendant.
Ascendant is not relevant with the word that Claudius Ptolemy used for it which was "Horoscopos".
But Horoscopos comes from the ancient Greek words Hora + Scopo (hour + observe) and means to observe something significant the time that a baby is born.
For the ancient Greeks something significant was the Ascending Constellation.
Today, "13 Zodiac Astrology" assumes that the second most significant phenomenon at the hour of birth is the place of the Moon. That's why the Moon is the new Horoscopos (or improperly "Ascendant").
The Moon that is so much affecting us and concurrently so much underestimated by tropical Astrology.
The Moon finds its dominant position in New Astrology of the 13 Zodiac Signs.
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Old 02-14-2012, 10:54 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasilis View Post
The trace of the Moon on the ecliptic is placed in the constellation that represents the New Ascendant.
Ascendant is not relevant with the word that Claudius Ptolemy used for it which was "Horoscopos".
But Horoscopos comes from the ancient Greek words Hora + Scopo (hour + observe) and means to observe something significant the time that a baby is born.
For the ancient Greeks something significant was the Ascending Constellation.
Today, "13 Zodiac Astrology" assumes that the second most significant phenomenon at the hour of birth is the place of the Moon. That's why the Moon is the new Horoscopos (or improperly "Ascendant").
The Moon that is so much affecting us and concurrently so much underestimated by tropical Astrology.
The Moon finds its dominant position in New Astrology of the 13 Zodiac Signs.
you know... I agree with that. I have allready posted a thread asking "why I seem so Pisces??" because to me, I can almost resume myself in Pisces personality
So this is kind of where astrology and astronomy meet, right?

Just one more question... being opphiucius between Scorpio and Sag, are you sure my venus is in Scorpio in this method?
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Last edited by Raquel; 02-14-2012 at 10:59 PM.
  #15  
Old 02-15-2012, 07:27 AM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Quote:
you know... I agree with that. I have allready posted a thread asking "why I seem so Pisces??" because to me, I can almost resume myself in Pisces personality
So this is kind of where astrology and astronomy meet, right?

Just one more question... being opphiucius between Scorpio and Sag, are you sure my venus is in Scorpio in this method?
13 Zodiac Signs do not have the same characteristics as in tropical Astrology because their place on the ecliptic has changed. They keep a few of their features if they have common contact points with the old signs. For example in Leo. New Leo is taking place from the 10th of August to the 16th of September. He has many common points with old Leo from the 10th until the 23 of August. Therefor many features of New Leos are common with old Leo!

In Pisces there is an analogous situation from the 12 until the 20 of March.
---------------
Yes Venus is in Scorpio as you may verify in your Natal Chart.
  #16  
Old 02-15-2012, 07:04 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

i reckon the only audience worth capturing with this one will be the youth.
they are more open to new things and less resistant to new information.

You had me on the scale looking both ways, alla, signomi re file, den sinfono, mexri 1980 den mas epiases, ise poli proxorimenos, na ksereis
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  #17  
Old 02-17-2012, 03:35 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

I think that Astrologers should compare the two theories to see which one is closer to reality.
"Tropical Astrology" was based in scientific data of 1900 years ago. This is the reason why everyone was respecting its predictions.
"Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac" is based on today's scientific data. It is a way out for Astrology from the deadlock of the "precession of the equinoxes".
Only "13 Zodiac Astrology" can answer to the accusations of the Astronomers and challenge them to deal with it since every aspect of the theory is based on science.
Astrology is not a religion to remain stuck in the year 100 B.C.
Astrology evolves and adapts to Astronomy and other sciences of today.
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Old 02-17-2012, 04:09 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasilis View Post
I think that Astrologers should compare the two theories to see which one is closer to reality.
"Tropical Astrology" was based in scientific data of 1900 years ago. This is the reason why everyone was respecting its predictions.
"Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac" is based on today's scientific data. It is a way out for Astrology from the deadlock of the "precession of the equinoxes".
Only "13 Zodiac Astrology" can answer to the accusations of the Astronomers and challenge them to deal with it since every aspect of the theory is based on science.
Astrology is not a religion to remain stuck in the year 100 B.C.
Astrology evolves and adapts to Astronomy and other sciences of today.

I respect, I just don't understand the idea of the moon sign being the new Ascendant. Planets will always have their esoteric simbology, and to me the moon is very important and expresses the inner feelings and not the surface (ascendant sign)...
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Old 02-17-2012, 09:43 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

I'll try to explain the idea of the Moon as Ascendant.

For Tropical Astrology the Ascendant is just a point in the sky which happens to be found inside a Zodiac Constellation. From that Constellation the Ascendant takes its properties. It is still a point in the sky with nothing but some stars, at very far distances, around it.

In 13 Zodiac Astrology, the "Ascendant" is transformed into something tangible. The New Ascendant is a celestial body that tropical Astrology underestimated all these years. Actually it is the second most important celestial object after the SUN (for the Earth). It is the Moon. The effect of this body on birth and life of humans is undeniable.

The logic of 13 Zodiac Astrology has escaped from the era of Claudius Ptolemy. New Astrology has to convince people that something material affect their life. There is no other celestial body so close to the Earth and so fast changing like the Moon. Our life is bound with the Moon far more than you may imagine.

We'll talk further about it in a new thread..
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Old 02-18-2012, 08:42 AM
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Exclamation Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

[QUOTE=vasilis]It is still a point in the sky with nothing but some stars, at very far distances, around it.[/QUOTE=vasilis]

Re Vasili, you've gone a little too far now, (me'xases!), you have to start paying attention to the things you're writing, every star omits energy, every star has a meaning and all stars bestow energy, when you start refering to them as "nothing but some stars" then you start losing our attention.
[attacking comment deleted by moderator]. elleos!
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..Her hands feel the embrace of heavy tools, red cloth wraps her wet body, she's changing. her hair curves out into thick locks. her tear-shaped breasts now armoured, body fit. Aware of her quick perception as eagles pass on the vast plains, her breathing deepens. Feet stabilize, muscles tighten, head tilted forward. Fire fills dreamy Luna's heart, sharpening her senses. Now enriched by her freedom to act again, she turns away from the water "the answers are here, i'll have to fight for them.."

Last edited by wintersprite1; 02-18-2012 at 08:47 AM. Reason: attacking
  #21  
Old 02-18-2012, 12:29 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

I believe that each region of the sky perceives properties of the planets and the Sun and not from the stars.
13 Zodiac Astrology is mainly our planetary system' s Astrology. I respect ancient Astrology and Vedic Astrology but I'm talking about my new theory. I know very well what ancient people used to believe about the stars.
There might be an affection of the surrounding stars but it would be really small in relation with the planets, the Moon and the Sun.
If you want to have a better idea of my theory please read my book and do not judge 13 Zodiac Astrology with another theory's tools.

"Ο ήλιος καταλήπται το ποιητικόν έχων της ουσίας εν τω θερμαίνειν και ήρεμα ξηραίνειν"
the Sun' s creative power has be found to be its ability to warm and dry.
(Claudius Ptolemy, Tetrabiblos Book A 4.1)
  #22  
Old 02-29-2012, 07:47 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

vasilis,

Might I inquire of your experience as an astrologer? Have you worked with clients at all or are you merely theorizing?

It seems to me as if you are a bit confused about a few things that astrologers do today, as well as the difference between Signs and Constellations.
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  #23  
Old 02-29-2012, 09:06 PM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

Dear Mark,
thank you for your interest.

I don' t feel like an astrologer. As you have already read, I 'm proposing a new Astrological theory which is adapting Astrology to scientific data. The Zodiac Constellations as well as the Zodiac Signs are 13.
I'm making my daily and annual predictions not on a futurology basis. You may read my daily Zodiac sayings in my web page.
I know very well what you mean when you say that I'm confused about what (tropical) Astrologers say today. I don' t want to accuse tropical Astrologers for not developing their discipline. It is actually Astronomers work to change Astrology. Even though you are dealing with Astrology every single day of your life you need much more general scientific knowledge in order to come into rupture with your anachronistic ideas.
This does not make you totally wrong. You are consistent with your beliefs. This is honest. But science is not about honesty, it is about continuing research and adaption to new realities.
And Astrology should return to the arms of science once again!!

All the best
Vasilis Kanatas
  #24  
Old 03-01-2012, 12:57 AM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

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Originally Posted by Frank View Post
vasilis,

Might I inquire of your experience as an astrologer? Have you worked with clients at all or are you merely theorizing?

It seems to me as if you are a bit confused about a few things that astrologers do today, as well as the difference between Signs and Constellations.
Yes, indeed. I hope everyone here realizes that the stars, and our own solar system have been, and continue to move, constantly since astrology's conception? I've only studied western Astrology for 6 years but as I understand it:

The 12 signs have remained as such, even in terms of Vedic and Chinese, for thousands of years. Even the other constellations are not at ALL perfect 30 degree sections nor are they evenly spaced, and they never were I'm pretty sure (feel free to correct this).

It seems to me that Astrology is about several universal principles I wont get into in detail (refer to Hermeticism and the Kybalion). Essentially, there are the beginning and progression of seasons, which give the qualities, and the progression of elements into masculine and feminine. Each sign reacts against the preceding sign's energy, following a cycle from Aries through to Pisces symbolic of spiritual evolution. If this assumption is so, the movement of stars in astronomy is irrelevant to the signs themselves.

A 13th sign throws off the entire practice, in my understanding of Astrology. The aspects would no longer fit mathematically as perfect sections of the zodiac. For example, there would not be oppositions (180 degrees) in the correct energy polarity (which is what an opposition is, the same energy at the opposite degree).

On a side note:

Astrology will never be reliable enough to be a true science. Even Psychology is not a "hard" science simply because people are not all that reliable. The "Barnum Effect" and simple priming also undermines most any divination's validity. Accepting a new system would, in my opinion, even further discredit Astrology. I have already had to explain the "new sign" to way too many laughing skeptics. "Scientifically valid" is so overrated these days...
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Last edited by Pisceanfool; 03-01-2012 at 01:02 AM.
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Old 03-01-2012, 01:01 AM
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Re: Astrology of the 13 Signs of the Zodiac

A bit out there for most people, but as I mentioned these universal principles, as exemplified in the zodiac, do not change with the science of the times or whatever the zietgeist may be.
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