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  #1  
Old 12-28-2011, 05:51 PM
eternal wanderer eternal wanderer is offline
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Prenatal new Moon

In what way is a prenatal new Moon chart helpful and what are the guidelines for interpretation?

Thanks

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  #2  
Old 01-01-2012, 12:03 AM
eternal wanderer eternal wanderer is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Any idea?

Happy 2012!

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  #3  
Old 01-01-2012, 07:49 AM
Ben Ben is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Quote:
Originally Posted by eternal wanderer View Post
In what way is a prenatal new Moon chart helpful and what are the guidelines for interpretation?
As with all prenatal conjunctions, it is the start of a two-planet cycle whose evolutionary purpose is "stamped" permanently on your life - (according to the phase relationship of the two planets in your natal chart).

So,

(from the posted chart at
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=25408&d=1325110673)

Your prenatal Sun/Moon conjunction was at Virgo 25 (in your 2nd house) - and at the time of your birth, these two "lights"/planets were in a disseminating phase relationship.

Hopefully, you might (and piercethevale would*) get some idea of the purpose of the prenatal conjunction by looking at the Sabian Symbol for Virgo 25 - A flag at half mast.

This purpose will be meaningful to you, and played-out in your life according to the disseminating phase relationship - (in which the Moon shows how and where you will demonstrate it to others, and the Sun reveals what it is that is meaningful) - However, with a natal Sun/Moon separation of 129 degrees, your are in the part of the phase where the need to share this meaningful message is so intense that others might feel you are "forcing it upon them".

[Note :- you will find it helpful to discuss the interpretation of Sabian Symbol Virgo 25 with piercethevale, by PM.]

Last edited by Ben; 01-01-2012 at 07:51 AM.
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Old 01-01-2012, 07:19 PM
eternal wanderer eternal wanderer is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Thank you Ben!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
However, with a natal Sun/Moon separation of 129 degrees, your are in the part of the phase where the need to share this meaningful message is so intense that others might feel you are "forcing it upon them".
Correct, although I don't feel this compulsive. Only in later years I learned that most of the people are not interesed in my bulls**t, though it might not be bulls**t to me at all.

I am not clarified with myself about the Sabians. On what ground do they work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
As with all prenatal conjunctions, it is the start of a two-planet cycle whose evolutionary purpose is "stamped" permanently on your life - (according to the phase relationship of the two planets in your natal chart).
I guess the potential shown at the new moon will crystalize in the natal?
If, for example, there is a close aspect to the new moon, the whole cycle will be influenced by the aspecting planet. And if then, in natal is this planet aspecting the Sun or Moon, or is otherwise enhanced, the potential is that it will be more influencing on that person. Am i right? This sounds logical. But if so, how much stronger is this influence in comparison to poeple with the same natal aspect but who were not born with the new moon aspecting that planet?

Also is important where in natal chart falls the newmoon ascendant and the houses and in wich house the new moon falls? And if there are aspects between the newmoon planets and natal planets and angles?

Thanks!
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File Type: jpg Pre-natal new Moon.jpg (82.4 KB, 6 views)
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  #5  
Old 01-07-2012, 08:24 AM
Ben Ben is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Quote:
Originally Posted by eternal wanderer View Post
I am not clarified with myself about the Sabians. On what ground do they work?
Apologies for my late reply, eternal wanderer - I hadn't noticed that you had responded to my post #3.

The Sabian Symbol for your prenatal Moon/Sun conjunction (at Virgo 25) is A flag at half mast.

On page 234 of his book ("The Sabian Symbols in Astrology"), Marc Edmund Jones gives RESPECT as the keyword fot this symbol and says it is a symbol "of the sure rewards that stand ready for whatever proves of worth in the course of effort. - When positive, the degree is achievement in a full transcendence of selfhood, and when negative, superficial self-dramatization."

So, you need to consider how this general description applies specifically to the Moon/Sun phase of this cycle in your natal chart.


Quote:
I guess the potential shown at the new moon will crystalize in the natal?
It is crystalised by the (disseminating) phase relationship between your natal Sun and Moon - and the sign+houses in which they are located.

Sun in Libra/3rd (presumably) has something meaningful to say about (say) "communications in relationships", and Moon in Gemini/10th will "demonstrate-that-message-by-example" to those in your local community"

Quote:
If, for example, there is a close aspect to the new moon, the whole cycle will be influenced by the aspecting planet. And if then, in natal is this planet aspecting the Sun or Moon, or is otherwise enhanced, the potential is that it will be more influencing on that person. Am i right?
No.

[Aspects indicate only the ease or difficulty the Sun and Moon will experience (due to relationships with other planets) in achieveing their evolutionary task.]

Quote:
How much stronger is this ease/difficulty in comparison to people with the same natal aspect but who were not born with the new moon aspecting that planet?
I do not understand what you are "getting at" here - (since everyone born with the same pre-natal Sun/Moon conjunction as you will have the same planets aspecting that New Moon) - Please clarify, giving an example.


Quote:
Also is important where in natal chart falls the newmoon ascendant and the houses and in which house the new moon falls? And if there are aspects between the newmoon planets and natal planets and angles?
Again, I am not sure what you are "getting at" here - Please clarify, with an example.
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  #6  
Old 01-07-2012, 09:34 AM
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JUPITERASC JUPITERASC is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Quote:
Originally Posted by eternal wanderer View Post
In what way is a prenatal new Moon chart helpful and what are the guidelines for interpretation? Thanks
eternal wanderer, The Pre Natal New Moon Eclipse chart is even more important, as is the degree of the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse
The Pre natal New Moon Eclipse is a most important New Moon due to the fact it is also an eclipse.

A New Moon Eclipse is also known as a Solar Eclipse


According to Robert Jansky, Eclipses are a key to identifying areas of one’s life that are brought to the foreground and therefore require extra attention during the time of influence of those eclipses.

(a) The house in which the eclipses occur as well as

(b) close aspects within a one - three degree orb made to natal chart points generally give more information regarding the areas in which a person needs to 'make a decision' or 'take action'.

In the book "Interpreting the Eclipses" http://www.amazon.co.uk/Interpreting.../dp/0917086082 Robert Jansky draws attention to the Pre-Natal Eclipse as a key chart indicator. The Pre-Natal eclipse is the Solar Eclipse or New Moon Eclipse prior to one’s birthday.

Jansky says the house in which the Pre-Natal Eclipse occurs is an area that requires extra attention in one’s life. The sign on the house cusp and its element show how expansion should occur, and on what level: for Jansky, fire corresponds to spiritual, earth corresponds to physical, air corresponds to mental, and water corresponds to emotional.

The house of the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse is continually emphasized throughout one’s life, even if it is not occupied by any other chart factor.

Planets conjunct or opposite the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse degree (using a five-degree orb) are emphasized and therefore important.

(a) closely observe/take note of transits to and from such planets.

(b) Use the principles of any planet conjunct the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse degree to assist you with the expansion of the matters of the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse house.

(c) Watch the conjunctions of transiting planets to the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse degree.

Jansky considers the Pre-Natal Eclipse degree as being as important as a planet and uses only the Solar Eclipse preceding birth for this analysis. The Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse always occurs within six months prior to the birth and is often in the same house as either the North or South Node, but not necessarily.

Jansky says that transiting Eclipses conjunct either the natal Sun or Moon are stronger in their effects than Eclipses conjunct other planets, often signalling important turning points in life. Jansky thinks that aspects other than conjunctions or oppositions are more subtle and therefore pass unnoticed by all but very few people: aspects to chart points other than the natal Sun and Moon may show some importance, but Jansky is of the opinion that those will not be as significant as aspects to the Sun and Moon.

Jansky says that the 1st 'return' of the Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse is of key importance: it occurs approximately every 18 - 19 years, around the time when the transiting Nodes return to their natal positions (approximately every 18 years). Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse Returns often indicate a symbolic crisis representing a break from the past and ushering in new ways of doing things. Jansky points out that the 2nd Pre-Natal New Moon Eclipse Return at 36 years coincides with an age at which most are realizing that life offers alternatives.

Jansky recommends:

(a) creating an Eclipse Journal for noting events and/or crises and/or turning points occurring in your life at the various times of the Pre-Natal Eclipse Returns

(b) - as well as at the times of transiting Eclipses to your Sun and Moon, noting the influence in the affairs of the houses involved.

Everyone experiences a pre-natal New Moon Solar Eclipse as well as a pre-natal Full Moon Eclipse - some people experience several - there is one member of this site who has experienced five pre-natal eclipses - a mix of solar and lunar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall View Post
I hope it's not a crazy coincidence. Ready for "coincidence?" I was born 9/25/1969. In 1969 there were 5 eclipses, two solar, three lunar. The first, a solar eclipse on 3/18/1969 fell at 27*Pisces 51', almost exactly conjunct (within a couple of minutes) my natal moon...7 months before I was born. On 4/2/1969 a lunar eclipse at 12* 51' Libra (again, within minutes) conjunct my natal ASC...before I was born. Another lunar eclipse on 8/27/1969 with Moon at 3* 58' Pisces, and Sun at 3*58' Virgo...conjunct my natal Venus....yup, within minutes.

The last eclipse before I was born was, of course, solar, on 9/11/1969 (no, I read nothing into the date, lol....though, hmmmm) and doesn't falll near anything in my natal chart except for the nodes, which are the same as at my birth, on the next lunar eclipse, as we might have guessed, 9/25/1969. But...my oldest daughter has that solar eclipse within 3* of her natal ASC. Finally, on my birthday, there was a lunar eclipse roughly 6 hours after I was born.

I have absolutely no idea what to make of any of it, but, wow...
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=37840
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let your food be your medicine: let your medicine be your food. Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY red cabbage sliced Equatorially illustrates the Golden Mean Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf

Last edited by JUPITERASC; 01-07-2012 at 09:42 AM.
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Old 01-07-2012, 09:38 AM
eternal wanderer eternal wanderer is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Thank you Ben,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
I do not understand what you are "getting at" here - (since everyone born with the same pre-natal Sun/Moon conjunction as you will have the same planets aspecting that New Moon) - Please clarify, giving an example.
Here you misquoted me and since you answered no to the previous question, this question loses its meaning. However, what I meant, assuming the answer would be a yes, was that... here is the example: in my chart the prenatal newmoon is sqauring Neptune. My natal Moon is not in aspect with Neptune, but those born 1 and a half days later have their natal Moon in opposition to Neptune. So, that Neptune influences firstly the whole cycle and then again influencing the moon through the natal opposition. Is thus this opposition enhanced in this way? Because the cycle was already influenced by Neptune? Thus twicly influenced?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben View Post
Again, I am not sure what you are "getting at" here - Please clarify, with an example.
Again, if you look at my newmoon chart, you'll see that the newmoon ascendant for my birthplace falls at 18 Sagittarus, thus widely conjuncting my natal Neptune (24Sag), and my natal Mars at 12 sag would be in the 12th newmoon chart house. Is this making any sense? Also the newmoon is in my 2nd natal house, which probably is not the same as having it in any other house?

Thanks, and I hope i've been clear enough.
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Old 01-07-2012, 10:10 AM
eternal wanderer eternal wanderer is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Thanks Jupiterasc,

i got new insight. My pre-natal solar eclipse is in my 12th house squaring Pluto. So, is this making me a more 12th house person? Interesting.

So, as i understood the things of the 12th house will be in the foreground in my life?

thanks
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Old 01-07-2012, 11:03 AM
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JUPITERASC JUPITERASC is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

Quote:
Originally Posted by eternal wanderer View Post
Thanks Jupiterasc,
i got new insight. My pre-natal solar eclipse is in my 12th house squaring Pluto. So, is this making me a more 12th house person? Interesting.
So, as i understood the things of the 12th house will be in the foreground in my life?
thanks
that's ok eternal wanderer. According to Jansky then 12th house matters are of great influence in your life: however, paradoxically, 12th house matters are considered 'hidden' in some way.

Regarding the location of your pre-natal New Moon Solar Eclipse, I have not viewed your natal chart as yet so I have no idea as to important matters such as (a) the sign on the cusp of your 12th house (b)
the location of the planet that rules the sign on the cusp of your 12 house and whether or not that planet aspects the eclipse in question (c) as well as which is your preferred house system. Other interesting considerations are the role of Pluto which has been much discussed on this forum such as on this thread http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=39021

attachments of images illustrating total Solar New Moon Eclipse
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Total_Solar_Eclipse.jpg (28.8 KB, 2 views)
File Type: jpg SOLAReclipse.jpg (15.9 KB, 1 views)
__________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let your food be your medicine: let your medicine be your food. Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY red cabbage sliced Equatorially illustrates the Golden Mean Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf

Last edited by JUPITERASC; 01-07-2012 at 11:18 AM.
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  #10  
Old 01-07-2012, 02:14 PM
eternal wanderer eternal wanderer is offline
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Re: Prenatal new Moon

the eclipse is at 27 degrees Cancer, 12th house. My chart is attached above, in one of thr previous posts in this thread.

I find seclusion of great importance to me. Sometimes i would just like to leave everything and become a monk.

The Moon, ruler of my 12th is not in aspect to the eclipse point. But if it were, what would that suggest?

thanks
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