Christopher Hitchens

[Moog]

I don't know if it's a bit ghoulish to go rooting around in the recently dead's astrology. I do intend this to be a respectful study of Mr. Hitchen's astrology.

I have been fascinated for a while with finding astrological symbolism in charts that indicate atheism (or anti-theism, as it may more properly be described). These celebrity atheists fascinate me. The modern brand of atheism given so much space and time in the media (at least here in Britain) seems to also be accompanied by a distinct aversion to and disbelief in astrology, with both Dawkins and Hitchens vehemently expressing their distaste for the art.

I found a birth date and location, no time though. What do you think his rising might be?

[Moog]

I have my own idea now, but would be interested to see if anyone else comes to the same conclusion.

[R.J.]

What is Hitchen's date and place of birth, does anyone know ?

Moog, I think we should stick to the 'astrology' on this site, if you want to squack about politics or religion, fair enough, there are plenty of other sites for those topics...

This is a site about LEARNING and SHARING astrology, not about whether Hitchen's philosophies please you or me ! Who cares about Hitchen, he's six feet under now, (probably because he smoked cigarettes like a chimney?)

I want to know the 'astrology' behind the beast... LOL


RJS


p.s. I found a birth date and location, no time though. What do you think his rising might be?


Undoubtedly, cigarette smoke was rising from him or " Bad Moon rising " ?

LOL

[Moog]

R.J.

I made no comments about whether his ideas please me or not.

You might note that I'm interested in sourcing or creating a good chart. There's charts without times on the internet, and you seem to have been able to use google to find them. So discuss/post if you want. I'm not keen to leap before I look around a little bit.

If you want to stick purely to astrology, then by all means. Bring the astrology.

I am interested in astrology as it relates to matters like religion and politics. I find it strange that you would want to divorce astrology from such things.

I intended to create a discussion or a collective effort, but if that does not interest you, that's not a problem. Skip the 'squacking' if you feel disinclined to read it. Let those who are interested be interested and find something else that does interest you.

[R.J.]

Where is his natal chart, you said that you have his birth data, but I didn't see any chart posted...or his birth data...

[R4VEN]

Last night I watched an interview from 2010 with Christopher Hitchens on ABC1 in Australia. He talked a lot about his relationships with other writers, especially Julian Barnes, Salman Rushdie & Martin Amiss. There were others he mentioned, too, but he seemed very connected with these men. He referred to Martin Amiss as his `great love'. That makes me consider he hay have had Taurus ASC. What also supports that was his saying that any wife he'd had wouldn't have to work because he'd be able to support the family without her needing to work. (The interviewer, Jennifer Byrne, found that comment sexist and shocking, while I found it to be practical and realistic.)

He looks quite Taurus ASC, but his reserved personality (which in part is due to him being English!!) and strong views may be Capricorn rising.

PS: He reminds me in looks and stature - and face shape - of Brit actor Timothy Spall, but there is no birth time for Spall either.

[Birth Details: 13 April 1949 at Portsmouth, England.]

[Moog]

Thank you Raven... that's very useful.

He does look a lot like Mr. Spall doesn't he?

[R4VEN]

I created a chart using birth time unknown.

Jupiter early in Aqua stands out, especially given that it forms the apex of a Yod with Saturn and Uranus.

Also the Chiron in Sag generation often have massive issues with systems of belief. A former friend of mine was born a few weeks prior to Hitchens. She'd been brought up a communist, and had been proud of this until she realised the `religious' nature of this belief system. i.e. despite communism being anti-religion, it operated in the same way as a religion.

[R4VEN]

Just another comment.............(and actually I really dislike guessing ascendant signs, especially when there's no chance of discovering the true ASC - but I find this person interesting, so I let myself indulge a little....)

The eyes look Aquarius ASC.........
but the shape of the face says Cancer or Taurus.........and I'm now leaning towards Cancer over Taurus.

[Moog]

I was thinking Cancer too... I'm dreadful at guessing ascendants too, I'm just really interested in this chap too!



I stared at many paused videos the other day. My feeling is that he has a Cancer rising, but not in the first decan.

Here's the chart I've cast to explore.



I think there's a number of things in this chart that feel right.

1. Such presence in the 10th house... the guy was a celebrity! Sun, Moon, Mercury, Mars, North Node Very well known; infamous; likely loved and hated in equal measure.

2. Virgo on the third house makes sense to me, as he had a very meticulous and precise way of communicating.

3. Jupiter (ruler of the 9th in this chart) is loud but completely dominated by Saturn, in it's fall. He was an atheist, and there was no way anyone would be allowed to not know it. Religious matters loomed large in the man's life even if he was against it. The Part of Fortune is with it there.

I'll return to this when time is better on my side.

[Anachiel]

Why not LIbra rising with the Moon ascending...?

[dr. farr]

In the noon chart (Rrven) that packed first house under the matrial Aries, seems to match the subject's character and mode of expression extremely well; that exalted Sun just absorbs everything in the first house (whole sign house of Aries) and excess Fire certainly seems to have marked the subject's life; note that Mars/Venus are "toegether" inside the Sun (combusted and absorbed by the Sun), and that Venus disposits Taurus, this sign connected with the throat: so, inflammation of throat (Venus/Mars, and Sun) and even a cancerous condition in the throat (Sun's connection with cancer processes + Venus, dispositor of Taurus, absorbed by the Sun) might well be indicated in this hypothetical natal chart.
Certainly Mars is the ultimate dispositor of all elements in this chart; and then Mars is absorbed (combust) the Sun, so-the Sun is defactor grand dispositor of this chart. Yet, the Sun is in a pitted degree-neutralized!!
SO, I would have to say that Mars-elevated above the Sun, and NOT blocked (not in a pitted degree), MUST perforce be the dominating planetary influence in this natal chart.

[Moog]

Originally Posted by Anachiel

Why not LIbra rising with the Moon ascending...?

Could be. I experimentally applied some of Kannon's ideas in an attempt to determine his ascendant by appearance, and by that I think he might have a Cardinal Ascendant. So Libra could makes sense in that regard.

[Kannon]

Originally Posted by Moog

I don't know if it's a bit ghoulish to go rooting around in the recently dead's astrology. I do intend this to be a respectful study of Mr. Hitchen's astrology.

I have been fascinated for a while with finding astrological symbolism in charts that indicate atheism (or anti-theism, as it may more properly be described). These celebrity atheists fascinate me. The modern brand of atheism given so much space and time in the media (at least here in Britain) seems to also be accompanied by a distinct aversion to and disbelief in astrology, with both Dawkins and Hitchens vehemently expressing their distaste for the art.

I found a birth date and location, no time though. What do you think his rising might be?

Cancer rising.

The top pic that Moog posted is very clear and shows very well the water element in his eyes and mouth. I also saw Neptune. Also there is enough roundedness to his head to expect a Cardinal sign, which is Cancer. The nature of his death also gives clues to this since Cancer/Moon are the rulers of the esophagus (The Rulership Book, by Rex Bills - p 45).

The chart I was able to validate for him last night: Asc 20CAN08. See the write up on my blog: http://kannonmcafee.wordpress.com/

[Erickaf]

Originally Posted by R4VEN

Last night I watched an interview from 2010 with Christopher Hitchens on ABC1 in Australia. He talked a lot about his relationships with other writers, especially Julian Barnes, Salman Rushdie & Martin Amiss. There were others he mentioned, too, but he seemed very connected with these men. He referred to Martin Amiss as his `great love'. That makes me consider he hay have had Taurus ASC. What also supports that was his saying that any wife he'd had wouldn't have to work because he'd be able to support the family without her needing to work. (The interviewer, Jennifer Byrne, found that comment sexist and shocking, while I found it to be practical and realistic.)

He looks quite Taurus ASC, but his reserved personality (which in part is due to him being English!!) and strong views may be Capricorn rising.

PS: He reminds me in looks and stature - and face shape - of Brit actor Timothy Spall, but there is no birth time for Spall either.

[Birth Details: 13 April 1949 at Portsmouth, England.]

I also found that interview with Jennifer Bryne quite practical too, I was not offended, I am a woman. He said if she wants to work that is fine but she doesn't have to!!! Which is what I think Jennifer missed in that interview.
I am so glad someone brought this thread up, I always been a 'fan' of his for sometime, read many of his books. And I know he loathed astrology. He left his first wife for Carol Blue while his wife was pregnant, I always wondered what his chart looks like, what kind of man does this I always wondered. But I respect him all the same as a writer, absolutely brilliant!
I always been playing around on what his rising sign could be.

[Erickaf]

I think you guys are right with Cancer ascendant.

[R4VEN]

Originally Posted by Erickaf

I think you guys are right with Cancer ascendant.

Yes, I'm quite happy with Kannon's assessment.

[dr. farr]

I too can go along with Kannon's rising sign determination, which puts the power packed Aries in the whole sign 10th house of the subject and that seems to make a good deal of sense (to me)

[Claire19]

Originally Posted by Moog

I don't know if it's a bit ghoulish to go rooting around in the recently dead's astrology. I do intend this to be a respectful study of Mr. Hitchen's astrology.

I have been fascinated for a while with finding astrological symbolism in charts that indicate atheism (or anti-theism, as it may more properly be described). These celebrity atheists fascinate me. The modern brand of atheism given so much space and time in the media (at least here in Britain) seems to also be accompanied by a distinct aversion to and disbelief in astrology, with both Dawkins and Hitchens vehemently expressing their distaste for the art.

I found a birth date and location, no time though. What do you think his rising might be?

It is hard to discern what his ascendant would be without knowledge of his background and birth conditions. Anyone who expresses an opinion on astrology without thoroughly reading the textbooks on the subject, examining birth charts and finding them inaccurate is simply prejudiced and narrow minded which is the hallmark of an atheist I would suspect.
I think atheism is a lack of faith and not recognising the godforce behind the universal workings and it would mean badly aspected Jupiter and perhaps Saturn involved...The 9th and 12th houses also afflicted. It would be a different scenario in every case. Most atheists are really agnostics as they cant prove the non existence of God..

[Claire19]

I agree he could have Cancer rising and with his Moon in Libra that seems to kind of fit...His Jupiter is badly aspected with many squares and his Neptune has many oppositions. Regardless of the houses they may fall in, this is classic for atheism. Neither planet which both deal with faith and religion has any redeeming aspects....Does anyone else see the irony in him having CHRIST in his name. He may well have believed in him as a religious figure but not as God. I dont know..

[Serendipity]

Difficult to find signatures for atheism in a chart if you're just guessing at what rising sign Hitchens may have had in order to determine house placement.
Maybe look at aspects between planets and then compare the chart to other prominent atheists....Dawkins, Sam Harris, Daniel Dennett to see if there's a common denominator *shrug*
Hitchens was a brilliant writer and debater. Where in his chart it indicates that might be an equally interesting topic

[Claire19]

Originally Posted by Erickaf

I also found that interview with Jennifer Bryne quite practical too, I was not offended, I am a woman. He said if she wants to work that is fine but she doesn't have to!!! Which is what I think Jennifer missed in that interview.
I am so glad someone brought this thread up, I always been a 'fan' of his for sometime, read many of his books. And I know he loathed astrology. He left his first wife for Carol Blue while his wife was pregnant, I always wondered what his chart looks like, what kind of man does this I always wondered. But I respect him all the same as a writer, absolutely brilliant!
I always been playing around on what his rising sign could be.

A man with no sense of responsibility would leave a pregnant wife i.e. the poorly aspected Jupiter... unless he felt the baby was not his... perhaps.... I dont really respect such a narrow minded man who dismisses a science without any knowledge of it, let alone has strong aversion to it....

[Claire19]

Originally Posted by Serendipity

Difficult to find signatures for atheism in a chart if you're just guessing at what rising sign Hitchens may have had in order to determine house placement.
Maybe look at aspects between planets and then compare the chart to other prominent atheists....Dawkins, Sam Harris, Daniel Dennett to see if there's a common denominator *shrug*
Hitchens was a brilliant writer and debater. Where in his chart it indicates that might be an equally interesting topic

As I have just done his chart I can see it is classic for atheism...
I was amazed....I dont compare with other charts, that is a mistake. Even those born on the same day etc...

The rising sign is important as chart ruler is very important..... but even without a fix on it the badly aspected Jupiter and Neptune is just so strong an indication!!!!!.My God... pardon the pun.....

[Erickaf]

Originally Posted by Claire19

It is hard to discern what his ascendant would be without knowledge of his background and birth conditions. Anyone who expresses an opinion on astrology without thoroughly reading the textbooks on the subject, examining birth charts and finding them inaccurate is simply prejudiced and narrow minded which is the hallmark of an atheist I would suspect.
I think atheism is a lack of faith and not recognising the godforce behind the universal workings and it would mean badly aspected Jupiter and perhaps Saturn involved...The 9th and 12th houses also afflicted. It would be a different scenario in every case. Most atheists are really agnostics as they cant prove the non existence of God..

christopher was a believer of sciences; physics, mathematics, biology, astrology doesn't always work. they are reliable sciences, astrology is not always reliable.
no one can prove god.

[Anachiel]

Originally Posted by Erickaf

christopher was a believer of sciences; physics, mathematics, biology, astrology doesn't always work. they are reliable sciences, astrology is not always reliable.
no one can prove god.

Eh, I just have to say; science hasn't always been reliable either. Neither has medicine or biology. A little reading around will prove the foibles of science and medicine. Math and physics were only as good as the people who understood them as well. Science is constantly "updated" with new "discoveres" that make its previous notions obsolete. And, what science thinks of the universe and life now will be dark-age material in 100 years, like it always has been

However, astrology has never tried to compete with science or to be a science. Astrology is an Art which is an enitely different beast to begin with so, there is no comparison.