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Old 07-07-2011, 12:01 PM
Valis Valis is offline
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Out of bounds planets

Hi everyone!

I was wondering if anyone has knowledge about the meaning of out of bounds planets in the Natal chart, that is planets with a declination over 23 NorS 27'.
I have an out of bounds venus (27N28'). Any insight would be much appreciated.

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Old 07-08-2011, 01:24 AM
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Re: Out of bounds planets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valis View Post
I was wondering if anyone has knowledge about the meaning of out of bounds planets in the Natal chart.
There is no meaning in and of itself. First, you have delineate the Planet. After that, you can look at its declination. If the Planet is essentially functioning to your benefit, and it is Out-of-Bounds, then you can view that as "exceeding." If the Planet is damaging or harmful, then you can view it as "excessive."

I have an Out-of-Bounds Venus but Venus is in excellent condition in Cancer, being in her own Decan, in trine with Jupiter by Mutual Reception, and in trine with Moon by Mutual Reception, so Venus would be exceeding, rather than excessive.

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Originally Posted by Valis View Post
that is planets with a declination over 23 NorS 27'.
It's actually 23°26' which is the maximum Declination at 0° Cancer or 0° Capricorn.

Do the math.

Declination = Inverse Sine (Sine(Obliquity) * Sine(Celestial Longitude))

Declination = Inverse Sine (Sine (23°26') * Sine (90°))

Declination = Inverse Sine (0.39768 * 1)

Declination = Inverse Sine (0.39768)

Declination = 23.43

Declination = 23 + (0.43 * 60)

Declination = 23°26'

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Originally Posted by Valis View Post
I have an out of bounds venus (27N28'). Any insight would be much appreciated.
Can't know unless we know how Venus is situated in the chart.
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Addressing his pupil, Satyacharya said, "The science of Astrology is a great secret. It should be guarded with care. This sacred science of Astrology should never be taught to bad people. Nor should it be revealed to too many people and very frequently. It should be taught only to a few chosen disciples who really deserve and have the necessary qualifications."
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Old 07-08-2011, 06:20 AM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

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Originally Posted by BobZemco View Post

It's actually 23°26' which is the maximum Declination at 0° Cancer or 0° Capricorn.

Do the math.

Declination = Inverse Sine (Sine(Obliquity) * Sine(Celestial Longitude))

Declination = Inverse Sine (Sine (23°26') * Sine (90°))

Declination = Inverse Sine (0.39768 * 1)

Declination = Inverse Sine (0.39768)

Declination = 23.43

Declination = 23 + (0.43 * 60)

Declination = 23°26'



Can't know unless we know how Venus is situated in the chart.
I see. Thank you for clearing that up. As I said information was a little hard to come by. I was just told I had an out of bounds venus by the local astrology group secretary as an afterthought. Didn't really much pay attention untill the subject popped up again later.
My venus is in the fifth in Placidus houses, the ruler of my sun in the second and moon in the eighth(con pluto) making an aspect to both and also receiving stressful aspects from saturn in the seventh and neptune in the 11th. As it is I've had exceptional talent in drawing as a child which I didn't develop and have been mildly successful in music
I'll post my chart
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Old 07-08-2011, 06:28 AM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

...I mean does not receive an aspect from the sun. Does from my 2nd house mercury. (I swear I shouldn't attempt any communication in the morning before having minimum 2 cups of coffee...)
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Old 07-08-2011, 08:24 AM
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Re: Out of bounds planets

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Originally Posted by Valis View Post
I see. Thank you for clearing that up. As I said information was a little hard to come by.
Would you like know a secret?

You've heard of the Tropic of Cancer and the Tropic of Capricorn right?

Okay, so from Zero Point Aries (0° Aries) Cancer is 90° and Capricorn is opposite Cancer at 180° so it is 270° from Zero Point Aries.

Cancer and Capricorn are the natural Meridian (the polar axis).

About 4.5 Billion years ago, the Earth got clocked by something huge. I don't mean a comet or asteroid, I mean like a moon, but not like our Moon, but bigger than the moons of Mars.

The Earth is still reeling from that collision and it rocks back and forth on its polar axis (the Cancer/Capricorn Axis). It knocked the Earth somewhere from 22° to 24+° off of the Ecliptic. It takes about 14,000 years to go from 22° and something to 24+° and back. No one has actually lived long enough to see this, but we kind of have an idea through archeao-astronomy and the dating of Solstitial Temples (temples and churches that are oriented to the Sun's Northing Point in the Northern Hemisphere or the Sun's Southing Point in the Southern Hemisphere).

Anyway, because Cancer is 90° from 0° Aries and Capricorn is 270° from 0° Aries, the maximum declination will always be equal to the Obliquity of the Ecliptic. It's been 23°26' for a few centuries now. It takes a really long time just to move 1 minute of arc.

The Sun is never Out-of-Bounds, because it's Northing (the Summer Solstice) and Southing (Winter Solstice) Points are between the Tropics of Cancer and Capricorn.

The Moon can be Out-of-Bounds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valis View Post
I was just told I had an out of bounds venus by the local astrology group secretary as an afterthought. Didn't really much pay attention untill the subject popped up again later.
If you look at people's charts, the Planet Out-of-Bounds that is well-placed often indicates an extraordinary ability or talent. Einstein had an Out-of-Bounds Moon that ruled his Ascendant. His Mercury is elevated in the 11th House while Moon is Below Horizon, so you know his intellect ruled instead of his emotions. Cher, the entertainer of Sonny & Cher fame has an OOB Moon & Venus.

I'm just grabbing charts to look at. They can be kind of eccentric I suppose.

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Originally Posted by Valis View Post
My venus is in the fifth in Placidus houses, the ruler of my sun in the second and moon in the eighth(con pluto) making an aspect to both and also receiving stressful aspects from saturn in the seventh and neptune in the 11th. As it is I've had exceptional talent in drawing as a child which I didn't develop and have been mildly successful in music
Mercury is your Almuten of Employment and it is conjunct your Lot of Wealth. Mercury sextiles Venus in Gemini and receives Venus by Sign and Triplicity. Venus is in the Decan of Mercury, so there is weak Mutual Reception. Your Lot of Labor sextiles Mercury and trines Venus. You should be able to make some money with your talent. You're not going to be rich, but there's no reason why you can't to very well.

Mercury is also your Almuten of Travel and there is a possibility you can or can relocate with Mercury ruling the 9th House (Sign). Mercury is Peregrine and opposing the Moon, but as the Night Triplicity Ruler of Air, Mercury receives Moon.

Just a word of caution. Saturn rules both your 12th and 1st Houses. Venus squares Saturn. Venus is Out-of-Bounds. Moon is your Chart Ruler. Moon is elevated over Mercury. Jupiter is 1st Triplicity Ruler of your 4th House and Mars the 4th House ruler is in the 8th House.

Be very careful who you hang with.
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Addressing his pupil, Satyacharya said, "The science of Astrology is a great secret. It should be guarded with care. This sacred science of Astrology should never be taught to bad people. Nor should it be revealed to too many people and very frequently. It should be taught only to a few chosen disciples who really deserve and have the necessary qualifications."
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Old 07-08-2011, 02:16 PM
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Re: Out of bounds planets

Out of bounds
http://www.astrology21.co.uk/b1outofbounds.html
“Out-of-bounds planets can take us beyond the established limits of thought and action. They can signify extraordinary genius or point to volatile and aberrant behavior.”
http://www.mandala.be/declination/pamela.htm
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrological-information/out-of-bounds.php
“Certain planets travel out of bounds periodically (no matter where the Sun is positioned at the time) and when and if they do their energies are more extreme. They become wilder and their forces more magnified, either for good or ill. As they are beyond the limits imposed by the boss (the Sun), they can operate independently and without restraint. However by progression a natal planet may move out of bounds during the course of a person’s life and during that time the planet could operate more independently and freely”
http://www.astrologer.com/aanet/pub/journal/declination-for-beginners.htm
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrological-information/out-of-bounds.php
http://aliceportman.com/?p=24
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Old 07-08-2011, 05:39 PM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco View Post
If you look at people's charts, the Planet Out-of-Bounds that is well-placed often indicates an extraordinary ability or talent. Einstein had an Out-of-Bounds Moon that ruled his Ascendant. His Mercury is elevated in the 11th House while Moon is Below Horizon, so you know his intellect ruled instead of his emotions. Cher, the entertainer of Sonny & Cher fame has an OOB Moon & Venus.

I'm just grabbing charts to look at. They can be kind of eccentric I suppose.
I am pretty eccentric.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco View Post
Mercury is your Almuten of Employment and it is conjunct your Lot of Wealth. Mercury sextiles Venus in Gemini and receives Venus by Sign and Triplicity. Venus is in the Decan of Mercury, so there is weak Mutual Reception. Your Lot of Labor sextiles Mercury and trines Venus. You should be able to make some money with your talent. You're not going to be rich, but there's no reason why you can't to very well.
I actually got into astrology to figure out what you just said. It took me two years and I got nowhere near a concise answer. ...I did l learn that I have very little talent in astrology and could make a record faster than figure it out... I'm glad there are people with talent in astrology who help out people like me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco View Post
Just a word of caution. Saturn rules both your 12th and 1st Houses. Venus squares Saturn. Venus is Out-of-Bounds. Moon is your Chart Ruler. Moon is elevated over Mercury. Jupiter is 1st Triplicity Ruler of your 4th House and Mars the 4th House ruler is in the 8th House.

Be very careful who you hang with.
Mars in the eighth? Are you using equal house? So saturn rules the house of my earthly dusthutt, or being and the house of secret enemies...then you lost me.
House of foundations ruler in the house of death and that triplicity ruler in the house of death. Should I be concerned and for what?
I'm afraid my inferior astrology skills aren't helping much...

I've been retired from the music business for a few years thanks to some sordid things people I trusted and worked with did to me personally and professionally... so far no one's made threats to my life though you know...
Maybe I'll just move to the woods to grow toads or something. Nicer than musicians sometimes.
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Old 07-08-2011, 05:43 PM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

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Originally Posted by astrologer50 View Post
Out of bounds
http://www.astrology21.co.uk/b1outofbounds.html
“Out-of-bounds planets can take us beyond the established limits of thought and action. They can signify extraordinary genius or point to volatile and aberrant behavior.”
Which often go hand in hand....
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Old 07-08-2011, 10:55 PM
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Re: Out of bounds planets

[deleted attacking comment - Moderator]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valis View Post
I actually got into astrology to figure out what you just said. It took me two years and I got nowhere near a concise answer. ...I did l learn that I have very little talent in astrology and could make a record faster than figure it out... I'm glad there are people with talent in astrology who help out people like me.
This is your chart as I see it.



Your Lot of Debt (aka Usury) is in Leo ruled by Sun and neither the Lot nor Sun are impeded. What you can take from that is you won't end up squandering all of your wealth paying interest or get so heavily into debt there is no light at the end of the tunnel.

Your Lot of Work is conjunct Saturn. That should make you a diligent and conscientious worker who also probably works with their hands (that's one signification of Saturn).

Your Lot of Wealth is conjunct Mercury (your Almuten of Employment and trine Mars who receives both Mercury and the Lot by Sign.

Normally, something like that would propel you into the ranks of the über-rich, but you have two impediments. The first is Jupiter, the general significator of wealth being in bad condition Cadent, Slow, Out-of-Sect (he's Nocturnal too) and in Detriment in Virgo.

The other is Moon in opposition. That's like the glass-ceiling/brick wall. Fortunately Mercury as Night Air Sign Ruler receives Moon and mitigates that a bit and Mercury rising before Sun is Hot & Dry, same Nature as Libra helps too.

That's also the 3rd/4th Quarter of the chart (Aries is actually the 4th Sign), so figure you'll acquire most of your wealth in the last part of the 3rd Quarter of your life, so at least you'll have time to spend it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valis View Post
Mars in the eighth? Are you using equal house? So saturn rules the house of my earthly dusthutt, or being and the house of secret enemies...then you lost me.
House of foundations ruler in the house of death and that triplicity ruler in the house of death. Should I be concerned and for what?
I'm afraid my inferior astrology skills aren't helping much...

I've been retired from the music business for a few years thanks to some sordid things people I trusted and worked with did to me personally and professionally... so far no one's made threats to my life though you know...
Maybe I'll just move to the woods to grow toads or something. Nicer than musicians sometimes.
Well, when the same Planet rules the 12th and 1st Houses, it's an indicator of self-undoing. And your enemies (the 12th House) are Saturn here. Saturn is Out-of-Sect, so your enemies are doing things that are inappropriate and they are contrary to their nature, so they'll appear to you as Romulans bearing gifts, or wolves in sheep's clothing or ax-murderers in clown suits. And worse than that, Virgo is the 9th Sign from Capricorn, so they're hypocrites, preaching one thing, telling you one thing then doing another. I suppose it could be worse, Saturn could be in the 10th Sign from Capricorn so they'd appear to you as authority or quasi-authority figures and you'd put your trust and faith in them precisely because they were authority/quasi-authority figures and then they'd stab you in the back.

I use Alcabitius House System but usually read the chart in a faux-Whole Sign style because of the nature of the Signs. Virgo trines your Capricorn Ascendant, but Leo does not, because Leo is the 8th Sign from the Ascendant.

Going back to your Lot of Wealth, Mars trines the Lot, but if Mars would be in Virgo, then Mars is inconjucnt the Lot. As it stands, Mars can influence the Lot and you have control over you wealth, but if Mars were in a Sign Inconjunct to Aries, like Pisces, Taurus, Virgo or Scorpio, then Mars would have no influence, ie you have no control over your wealth. Best you could do is put yourself in a situation to gain a lot of wealth and then maybe you, maybe you don't. It would depend on other people and other things to make that happen.

Anyway, I wasn't implying that you would die or anything, but that combination produces a lot of unhappy endings to many things, and it's usually because other people will set you up for a fall, and then you buy into it because of whatever weakness you have in your chart, be it money, sex, friends, love, drugs, material things, ideology and beliefs and so on and then you crash and burn.
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__________________
Addressing his pupil, Satyacharya said, "The science of Astrology is a great secret. It should be guarded with care. This sacred science of Astrology should never be taught to bad people. Nor should it be revealed to too many people and very frequently. It should be taught only to a few chosen disciples who really deserve and have the necessary qualifications."

Last edited by wilsontc; 07-09-2011 at 03:09 PM.
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  #10  
Old 07-13-2011, 06:09 AM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

I removed my original post. Shortened version:
According to Tarja Enoranta (Astro Logos, march 2010, the Suomen astrologinen seura members magazine)
OOB moon: Unusual public attention, powers of intuition
OBB venus: unusual concept of love, love life
OBB mars: Sports ability, courage, and gives desire to make numerous romantic conquests

Last edited by Valis; 07-14-2011 at 09:20 AM. Reason: copyright
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Old 07-15-2011, 07:36 AM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

Here's a link to forrestastrology.com where there was an very interesting article about OOB moon, linking it to on one hand creative geniuses, outlaws and zany characters as well as sociopaths and criminals in it's negative manifestation.

http://www.forrestastrology.com/Gene...of-bounds-moon
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Old 12-28-2011, 04:48 AM
Valis Valis is offline
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Re: Out of bounds planets

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco View Post
[deleted attacking comment - Moderator]



This is your chart as I see it.



Your Lot of Debt (aka Usury) is in Leo ruled by Sun and neither the Lot nor Sun are impeded. What you can take from that is you won't end up squandering all of your wealth paying interest or get so heavily into debt there is no light at the end of the tunnel.

Your Lot of Work is conjunct Saturn. That should make you a diligent and conscientious worker who also probably works with their hands (that's one signification of Saturn).

Your Lot of Wealth is conjunct Mercury (your Almuten of Employment and trine Mars who receives both Mercury and the Lot by Sign.

Normally, something like that would propel you into the ranks of the über-rich, but you have two impediments. The first is Jupiter, the general significator of wealth being in bad condition Cadent, Slow, Out-of-Sect (he's Nocturnal too) and in Detriment in Virgo.

The other is Moon in opposition. That's like the glass-ceiling/brick wall. Fortunately Mercury as Night Air Sign Ruler receives Moon and mitigates that a bit and Mercury rising before Sun is Hot & Dry, same Nature as Libra helps too.

That's also the 3rd/4th Quarter of the chart (Aries is actually the 4th Sign), so figure you'll acquire most of your wealth in the last part of the 3rd Quarter of your life, so at least you'll have time to spend it.



Well, when the same Planet rules the 12th and 1st Houses, it's an indicator of self-undoing. And your enemies (the 12th House) are Saturn here. Saturn is Out-of-Sect, so your enemies are doing things that are inappropriate and they are contrary to their nature, so they'll appear to you as Romulans bearing gifts, or wolves in sheep's clothing or ax-murderers in clown suits. And worse than that, Virgo is the 9th Sign from Capricorn, so they're hypocrites, preaching one thing, telling you one thing then doing another. I suppose it could be worse, Saturn could be in the 10th Sign from Capricorn so they'd appear to you as authority or quasi-authority figures and you'd put your trust and faith in them precisely because they were authority/quasi-authority figures and then they'd stab you in the back.

I use Alcabitius House System but usually read the chart in a faux-Whole Sign style because of the nature of the Signs. Virgo trines your Capricorn Ascendant, but Leo does not, because Leo is the 8th Sign from the Ascendant.

Going back to your Lot of Wealth, Mars trines the Lot, but if Mars would be in Virgo, then Mars is inconjucnt the Lot. As it stands, Mars can influence the Lot and you have control over you wealth, but if Mars were in a Sign Inconjunct to Aries, like Pisces, Taurus, Virgo or Scorpio, then Mars would have no influence, ie you have no control over your wealth. Best you could do is put yourself in a situation to gain a lot of wealth and then maybe you, maybe you don't. It would depend on other people and other things to make that happen.

Anyway, I wasn't implying that you would die or anything, but that combination produces a lot of unhappy endings to many things, and it's usually because other people will set you up for a fall, and then you buy into it because of whatever weakness you have in your chart, be it money, sex, friends, love, drugs, material things, ideology and beliefs and so on and then you crash and burn.
Thank you very much for all this. It's much appreciated!
I'm actually getting back to my chosen profession. If this forum is still up when I'm an old coot I'll let you know if it panned out.
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