Rulership Of Libra. Eris/Lilith/Persephone?

[Mercurius]

Does anyone think Eris will be given rulership of Libra? I think naming this new planet Eris the goddess of discord was unfortunate. It really should've been Persephone.
Persephone is one of many archetypes Demetria George mentions for the dark moon phase along with ofcourse Lilith, Hekate, Kali, Nyx etc, etc. So they are really all the same archetype.

I have been making a case for Lilith to have rulership of Libra on my Blog Lilith, Persephone and Rulership of Libra. But realistically no one is going to give rulership to a hypothetical moon or a minor asteroid. Therefore I guess the logical step would be to give it to the next planet out from Pluto, Eris/Persephone.
I just been googling trans-pluto and there are quite a few people out there who feel the same way about Libra rulership regarding Persephone.
Taurus is a feminine element earth, Libra is in masculine air. It makes sense Libra should be ruled by a more emancipated archetype like Lilith.

There are some accounts of Persephone as exclusively Queen Of the Underworld and she rules the cycle of death & rebirth. Libra in northern hemispheres begins the season of Autumn contains and Haloween. A very spooky time.. Very suited to witchy Lilith.
Lilith/Persephone/Eris archetype is far more suited to Libra than Venus. Venus places emphasis on love, fertility, pleasuring herself and sex with her lovers. Arts, beauty and vanity. Much more Taurean. Much more traditionally female.

And I think having a Goddess as outer planet AND ruling a sign will be important for women's rights. The west has come a long way, but this is not so in other parts of the world. As above, so below?

[AutumnRain]

I don't agree.
While your point about Libra being a masculine Air sign makes sense , I can see that, I admit, I am a Libra and I definitely feel Libra being ruled by Venus.Venus/Aphrodite wasn't a beaten down woman or a mindless girly.
After all she is a goddess. She is strong and uses her beauty and feminine strengths as someone else would create.
I like Persephone, always have and even normally use her name or its Roman version as a username.Chose not to here, since I'm replying to your thoughts on Venus Libra, Persephone and Lillith..
While I've heard others say Persephone is Virgo- like, I see her as rather Scorpio- like as she's the wife of Hades and--as it happens, Persephone as an archetype indicates soulsearching or, to hell and back---which is why I identify with her myself.
She herself though isn't as Scorpionic as Hades himself admittedly.
Anyway--odd (to me) that you say Taurus fits with Venus as ruler as I definitely see the Libra as connected to Venus--clear as day.
Libras love beauty and beatiful things--art work, jewelry clothes make-up --and yet are smart and very capable women --it's the men that while just as smart, are usually a little more laid back.
Libras of both sexes love harmony and love love itself and especially romance--what could be more Venusian?
While Taurus seems more heavy and earthy--not Venus- like.
If anything I could se Taurus being ruled by smething else.
It's true that Libra is a "masculine"sign, but as you know--that only means the sign is more direct in it's demeanor, not passive.
However when you think about it--Taurus while a "feminine" sign, is a Bull, not a Cow--so it is definitely masculine in that sense.
While I have identified myself with the Lillith archetype at times, in my chart Lillith is conjunct my Venus in Libra in the 8th HSE...so that may have more to do with it.:-)

[Mercurius]

Hi Autumn Rain. Thanks for your input.

I am still working this out, so it's good to speak to someone who has Lilith conjunct Venus no less AND in the 8th.
You know who else has Lilith & Venus in close aspect? Hitler & Margaret Thatcher! Yes you are quite right that Venus is not a beaten down woman or mindlessly girlie.
But I think, like her male equivelant Mars she is a very basic expression of human nature. It's more personal, dare I say, self obsessed? I see Libra as a sign that DOES consider other people, she is not that vain, its all about harmony in beauty and art. Venus IS vain. The mirror is one of her symbols. She loves herself. There is nothing wrong with that, its good to have strong self esteem. (And this goes with 2nd house too which Taurus corresponds to)

I used to think that Venus was wrong for Taurus and that Ceres suited it more. But you know what? My mother and my ex had huge Taurean stelliums and I can really see the Venus working in them. The charisma, the indulgence, the obsession with beauty etc etc.

I now think Venus has two sides to her rather like Mercury has for Gemini & Virgo.
She is Earth Venus with Taurus and Air Venus with Libra. This also corresponds to the Persephone myth. Venus/Ceres (as Demeter) for Taurus and Venus/Percephone for Libra.

As for Venus with Lilith, Wooo that can be deadly charming. I don't know how you use yours, but my best friend has this and she can get men to do ANYTHING for her. She is lovely, but boy am I stunned by the amount of free stuff she gets....

I have Lilith conjunct Mars in the 10th. I just scare them....!

[Bjorkstrand]

Eris is an upper octave of pluto and mars. They all rule aries and scorpio.
Eris should have been named Zena but that's another matter.
Bobby orr, Gordie howe and roger bannister have it conjunct the sun.
Eris = the first chakra and the first layer of your aura, very important.
Pluto is the beginning of the hormone layer and eris is the beginning of the aura layer.

Jim

[Mercurius]

Hi Bjorkstrand,

Neptune is the higher Octave of Venus, but it rules Pisces. Taurus is earth, Libra Air, Pisces is water
Uranus is said the be the higher octave of Mercury and it rules Aquarius.
Aquarius and Gemini Air. Virgo Earth.
There's no connection between higher octaves and what they should rule.

Pluto is said to be the higher octave of Mars. But I'm not sure what point you are making here.

I think Eris resonates with Pluto and Mars but I don't see why it still can't rule Libra. If it's about fighting for justice and healthy debate.

[Bjorkstrand]

There is no way that eris the warrior will ever rule libra.
You should really STUDY eris. Check out all the people who have it conjunct the sun. I've done it. You haven't.

And neptune is not an upper octave of venus. They are 2 different chakras.2nd and 6th.

Jim

[AutumnRain]

Jim, hi.
I agree with your first statement-I don't see Eris as ruler of Libra either.
But actually, Neptune is
considered the higher octave of Venus.
This is not at all a new concept as I learned that about 40 yrs ago, and I still see it referred to here and there.

[AutumnRain]

Mercurius, thank you for answering me.I do think Venus has 2 sides.I agree that there is the earthier Taurus side and the Airy Venus side.I can see Taurus and Ceres/Demeter, but still unsure about Libra and Persephone or Lillith.
I can see both sides to whether Persephone is Scorpio or Virgo but I still have difficulty seeing anything but Venus ruling Lira.:-)
I know :-)--I appreciate that you understand about my Lillith conjunct Venus.
It's been both good and bad for me--as Lillith is.
I don't care about getting "things" or $ from men but I spent a great deal of my life with men and it took me years to form close relationships with women--men were my friends, lovers and nurturers for years--so in that sense I benefited.
I felt very misunderstood by other women for years.
I would tell you more but I think it is not the place to do so as I read that there are very young people here, but suffice to say my young day's lifestyle and liveliehood wasn't typical in many ways.
I'm much closer to women now as I've aged though, I'm happy to say.:-)

[AutumnRain]

BTW Mercurius--Hitler and Margaret Thatcher? My God.Well, no I wasn't in either of their positions ever--thank goodness.
You must be a powerful lady with Lillith conjunct Mars in the *10th* Are you head of a militant organization or a colonel in the army?

[Mercurius]

Originally Posted by Bjorkstrand

There is no way that eris the warrior will ever rule libra.
You should really STUDY eris. Check out all the people who have it conjunct the sun. I've done it. You haven't.

And neptune is not an upper octave of venus. They are 2 different chakras.2nd and 6th.

Jim

How do you know I haven't?
How presumptious sir!

I am not making statements here. I am asking questions. The clue is in the thread title.
But if you are going the answer my questions, please do give something to back up your answers. You can say what you like, it's just your opinion as mine is. It's not a statement of fact.
It's not the law

On researching I have ruled out Lilith totally. But she was the messenger and she is an aspect of this whole Percephone thing.

It also depends where you are coming from. If you believe in traditional rulerships then Eris would really be a no-no.

Wether Eris becomes ruler is by the by. But whole debate it triggers is an interesting one for feminists like myself. And rather fits with her myth too.

I'm of the belief that there are no rules in Astrology and there are quite a few systems. They are all right if they work for individual.
Like religion, there is no one true god!

I'm saying Eris looks good for me so far. There is still more work to do. It took a long while before the outers were understood.

[Mercurius]

Originally Posted by AutumnRain

BTW Mercurius--Hitler and Margaret Thatcher? My God.Well, no I wasn't in either of their positions ever--thank goodness.
You must be a powerful lady with Lillith conjunct Mars in the *10th* Are you head of a militant organization or a colonel in the army?

Ha ha ha ha!!!
Yes I am head of a military Junta that has taken over a small borough of London known as Hanwell. I run it from a shed behind the childrens zoo in Bunny Park.
People scream and run indoors when my banditos go into the local shops to buy my sweets. I get mad if I don't get my sweets. MAD!!

Your chart and life sound most interesting.
Maybe it's my Mars/lilith that finds Venus/Lilith so fascinating. I think its just as powerful as Mars

I wouldn't mind looking at your chart. Would you mind PM-ing me with what you couldn't write here?

[AutumnRain]

Sure, I *will* pm you then if you like--Hope later is OK--haven't slept yet and need to rest a bit.

[theM]

@Mercurius

I think you're definitely right.
For me Eris is ruler of Libra and in my eyes Ceres is the ruler of Virgo as the constellation of the Maid shows Ceres according to many legends.
Venus is sensual and Libra intellectual.So there is a discrepancy.
Libra fits better to strategist Eris.

These two articles have show a similar view.
http://astrologyandpsychicpredictions.wordpress.com/2010/08/09/eris-rulership-and-rehabilitation/

http://starcraftseast.com/html/astrology/IAU-goddesses.html


You also see it clearly with the Rising Signs:

Women with Taurus Rising in general look more tradional feminine.Definitely Aphrodite.
Watch Mariah Carey's "Touch My Body" music video and you see that she got Taurus Rising.

In general the image of Libra Rising is more androgynous, airy, smart as Air is a masculine element.
Look at the chart of Birthe Kirk.She got lots of Libra.
Anne Heche and Nena got Libra rising,too.

That's of course speaking about archetypes.

[Bjorkstrand]

Eris, pluto and mars all rule aries and scorpio.

Jim

[theM]

Originally Posted by Bjorkstrand

Eris, pluto and mars all rule aries and scorpio.

Jim

But if you look at the story with the golden apple.Eris doesn't act like Aries or Scorpio.
She uses her intellect and acts like strategist.
That's definitely Air.
She is the sister of Ares like Libra is the other side of the coin to Aries.