Learned that the Composite ASC is the most "telling" aspect of SYN or Composite chart

Raindrops · #1 02-04-2009, 07:02 PM

After years of doing synastry and composite charts, I've learned that the easiest way to see if the relationship SERIOUSLY won't work is by looking at the composite chart and seeing if the Ascendant is square/opposite Pluto or Saturn or Uranus.

I've learned that for severely negative relationships, the composite chart's ASC was either square Saturn by 0 degrees or square Pluto.

I would say to avoid relationships like these by all costs =P. The pluto aspect changes your life forever.

AquariusT · #2 02-04-2009, 07:35 PM

Yes it does. However, welcome Pluto and it's doings since it is karma you need to work thorugh anyway.

NicholasH · #3 02-04-2009, 09:02 PM

what do u know about pluto conjunct asc. in composite? how does it differ from the square/opposition of pluto to the asc. in composote?
i have that with a few people ive had relationships with.

FleetingDasein · #4 02-04-2009, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raindrops

After years of doing synastry and composite charts, I've learned that the easiest way to see if the relationship SERIOUSLY won't work is by looking at the composite chart and seeing if the Ascendant is square/opposite Pluto or Saturn or Uranus.

Uh oh. The composite chart with my loved one has the Ascendant opposite both Saturn and Uranus, while Pluto opposes the Moon.

Yikes. This is my self declared soulmate composite we're talking about.

I have never really taken into account the composite, as we are not married or living together. The composite is more about how other people see the relationship, and not what the relationship is really about.

allie_b · #5 02-05-2009, 01:30 AM

Wow. Thanks for this post! I looked up the composite of my (soon to be ex)husband and myself and yes, we have Saturn opposing the Asc....and yes, he did make my life a living hell. The marriage only lasted less than 5 years.

Very interesting.

waybread · #6 02-05-2009, 02:13 AM

Interesting!

Just a reminder that you need the correct birth time for both parties, or the AS and other house cusps will probably be way off.

allie_b · #7 02-05-2009, 02:24 AM

Thanks for the reminder. But in my case, it's not at all needed (as both times are exact, taken from birth certificates).

Quote:

Originally Posted by waybread

Interesting!

Just a reminder that you need the correct birth time for both parties, or the AS and other house cusps will probably be way off.

wildflowers · #8 02-05-2009, 02:40 AM

I just looked up the Composite of someone who made my life hell,
off-and-on, for a number of years (he shared the misery)---

Interestingly, Saturn is opposed the ASC.

This relationship, seriously, could never have worked out.

Even though you stipulated oppositions and squares,
I too am curious about thoughts on conjunctions to the ASC,
as in the composite with this fellow, Uranus is conjunct.

FleetingDasein · #9 02-05-2009, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildflowers

Interestingly, Saturn is opposed the ASC.

This relationship, seriously, could never have worked out.

am I the only one whose life hasn't been made hell by this placement?

Raindrops · #10 02-05-2009, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildflowers

I just looked up the Composite of someone who made my life hell,
off-and-on, for a number of years (he shared the misery)---

Interestingly, Saturn is opposed the ASC.

This relationship, seriously, could never have worked out.

Even though you stipulated oppositions and squares,
I too am curious about thoughts on conjunctions to the ASC,
as in the composite with this fellow, Uranus is conjunct.

Was the relationship itself on and off? Was the need to be together on and off? If so, that sounds like a Uranus on the ASC Aspect -- the need for independence resurfacing.

It could also indicate an extremely unusual couple. Or a couple that creates a bit of excitement/chaos everywhere they go (depending on how it is aspected).

Raindrops · #11 02-05-2009, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FleetingDasein

am I the only one whose life hasn't been made hell by this placement?

Yes.

Is it well aspected? How close is it to the descendant?

Raindrops · #12 02-05-2009, 10:16 PM

I use natal chart interpretations to interpret my composite chart aspects.
I also bought Robert Hand's Planets in Composite.

---

Saturn Conjunct ASC: On the positive level, it can signify a relationship bound so together so closely that almost nothing can break it up. This is not so much that there is a positive attraction between you as because you are intesely involved with each other in a way that seems fated. It is almost imposible to break out of this relationship, perhabs because of material circumstances or psychological needs, etc.

On the negative level, this relationship could feel as if it is a trap from which you cannot escape.

Or, the two of you may not have very much intereaction with each other. Even under the best of circumstances, this aspect is likely to mean that emotional contact between you is limited.

Saturn Opposite ASC: This is a difficult aspect for two people. The two of you may feel as if you are unable tor elate as a team. You both feel there are great barriers between you that make it difficult to relate to each other.

External circumstances may make the relationship impossible. Or perhaps there is a great age gap between you.

But it is also possible that both of you do not have a basic affinity for each other. Mutual alienation.

Pluto Conjunct ASC: A profound relationship. This relationship can be either very positive or very negative or a combination of both. This relationship can conjure up energies that you never knew existed. Positive: You can transform your lives and set a totally new path. The relationship will affect every area of your life. A tremendous fascination with each other that pushes aside all other considerations.

Negative: Intense power struggles between the two of you. Such a relationship will be destroyed by the efforts of one person deprives the other of freedom and will. Great bitterness and resent after a breakup. Be careful with this energy. You may enjoy a relationship that can change your entire life.

jjj · #13 02-05-2009, 10:16 PM

Raindrops,

can I ask a favour

? Could you please quote Robert Hand on Neptune on the composite DC (or in the seventh house). Our comp Neptune is opposite Saturn on the AC (or in the 1 house). His birthtime may vary 2 hours, hence those differences.

thaaaankss

Raindrops · #14 02-05-2009, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FleetingDasein

The composite is more about how other people see the relationship, and not what the relationship is really about.

I have found that two people can FEEL the composite chart aspects just as much as other people viewing the relationship. It is almost like a second synastry chart. =O.

Raindrops · #15 02-05-2009, 10:48 PM

My bf and I have this this (Nep opposite Asc).

Neptune opposite ASC: It can be difficult to deal with it. It implies that something is preventing this from being a true relationship between equals. It is very often the case that one of you has entered the relationship with the idea of sacrificing yourself in order to "help" the other.

Somtimes the effect of this aspect is simply to make a relationship very unrealistic. YOu two may not be relating to the other but to some ideal image you have created in your minds.

Another possibility: You two may be quite realistic about each other but not terribly realistic as a couple about others outside of your relationship. Others might give you misleading advice. Be critical. You may also experience difficulties with people who oppose your relationship, not openly, but by secretive acts.

jjj · #16 02-05-2009, 10:50 PM

Thanks Raindrops,

in your case, does it work? The quotation doesn t seem very promising hehe.

Raindrops · #17 02-05-2009, 10:54 PM

Saturn opposite Neptune: You two may not have compatible ideals. You two may constantly challenge each other's notions of reality. You might systematically weaken each other's self-confidence.
Negatively, this can lead to fear, depression, sadness and a sense of futility, material want and deprivation. You both must learn to recognize that you are probably making your relationship seem worse than it is. Be careful to not make mountains out of molehills. This is a chief danger of this aspect.

Also be honest with each other or else suspicion will weaken the relationship until there is nothing left of it.

Raindrops · #18 02-05-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjj

Thanks Raindrops,

in your case, does it work? The quotation doesn t seem very promising hehe.

Nothing applied to me until the LAST sentence, and I had a OH MY moment, LOL. "People secretly oppose the two of you being together." That is very true. We have an entire group of people who do not want us together. And it was very secret. =P

Also, it can mean that the two of you come from VERY different cultures or backgrounds. Both of you may have come from completely different parts of the country/world.

Tell me what you think.

jjj · #19 02-05-2009, 11:13 PM

2 things hold true.... We come from different countries, speak different languages, his family was opposed to me (an east-european girl, a goldminer ooooh

. We dont see each other very often, every 2 weeks. Im accepted now by his family, but I still think they dont see us like a match.

The second thing... Saturn opp Neptune... the trust. We live 300 km apart. I have children and responsabilities, he is 4 yrs younger and single. We dont talk much about what he does when Im not there... it s normal that he hangs sometimes out with his friends and colleagues... but thinking about it still makes me jealous. Maybe I make mountains out of molehills... we communicate poorly when we are not together. This lack of trust and intimate communication eats me. On the other side I know that he would not cheat on me, he would tell me if he found another girl. I lack of self-confidence, too. I ask myself why would he prefer me with 2 kids if he has younger girls in his town.

We have a connection though and a good chemistry, but this lack of trust or secrecy is undermining it. On the other hand it s difficult to talk about it honestly cos we met by internet and have not had "madly in love, butterflies in the stomach" thing. The conversation about our feelings ends always badly. But if we keep seeing each other, there must be something.

Plus he has pisces venus in the 12th house. Secretive and evasive by nature.

uhhh.... dont know where it goes...

Raindrops · #20 02-05-2009, 11:24 PM

Wow, the Neptune in the 7th seems very accurate (foreign cultures). Are there any squares or oppositions by 0 or 1 degrees in the composite chart?

jjj · #21 02-06-2009, 12:03 AM

well the composite is one big square LOL

http://s671.photobucket.com/albums/v...rrent=comp.gif

Raindrops · #22 02-06-2009, 12:18 AM

Oh my goodness, LOL, I've never seen a composite like this. This is cute.
How long have you two been "together" or "dating" ?

Raindrops · #23 02-06-2009, 12:39 AM

I've never seen a composite quite this. I've heard that grand squares, although difficult, can be a reason why people stay in the relationship. Of course, that is in synastry, not in the composite chart =P.

Aside from all the squares and oppositions, I can see the glue of this relationship: Venus conjunct Jupiter, North node conjunct Venus/Jupiter (wow!), Moon opposite mercury, moon opposite sun and sun conjunct mercury.

At the same time, I can see the very challenging squares: Saturn square sun, moon, mercury & mars. Neptune square sun, moon, mercury, mars and saturn. Mars opposite the sun and mercury. Uranus square venus.

I've never seen anything like this! LOL
I'm going to make a wild guess: The two of you have more than your share of "challenges" to work through?

I could be completely mistaken though =P.

FleetingDasein · #24 02-06-2009, 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raindrops

Yes.

Is it well aspected? How close is it to the descendant?

Saturn trines Jupiter and conjunct Uranus. The orb for the opposition to the ascedant is 4°45.

jjj · #25 02-06-2009, 09:08 AM

Thank you for your analysis Raindrops,

I do not want to hijack this thread with my chart, so please continue with your discussion about the ascendant.

Me neither, I had never seen a composite like this. It s not working very well. We have been seeing each other for 8 months, but the relationship is progressing very slowly. Between meetings we communicate poorly. The physical chemistry is the best I ve ever had, that is one of the reasons why we keep seeing each other, I guess.

On the other hand there is a strong feeling of obligation toward each other that prevents us from the break up... because being together is not always fun. There are blockages in the air... we do not express freely our feelings and thoughts, there are subconscious fears (past love hurts, lonely childhood) for both parts... our past prevents us from being 100% emotionally intimate and open; on the other hand the relationship offers a tremendous possibility of healing.

Honestly, I dont know if it will continue and how it will continue (Venus-Uranus aspect maybe). We both feel that it is a challenge... if he will find someone with whom he has less challenges and more fun, he may leave me. Or if I meet someone who gives me more emotional closeness, I may leave him. But I dont want to leave him... I feel bounded to him. NN-venus-jupiter conjunction I guess

Rahu told me that Saturn-Neptun may mean that he is not honest. I think the interpretation Raindrops gave fits better:

Saturn opposite Neptune: You two may not have compatible ideals. You two may constantly challenge each other's notions of reality. You might systematically weaken each other's self-confidence.
Negatively, this can lead to fear, depression, sadness and a sense of futility, material want and deprivation. You both must learn to recognize that you are probably making your relationship seem worse than it is. Be careful to not make mountains out of molehills. This is a chief danger of this aspect.

You hit the nail. That´s it.

thanks!