How Einsteins Theory of Relativity proved the Immortality of the Soul.

[Fifth House Sun]

Originally Posted by retinoid

FIFTH HOUSE remember that most people who do bad things are not necessarily BAD...they are usually stuck in their egos and trapped souls. They are not 'evil'...there are some people who are way too far gone though and may need to reincarnate again starting the cycle over at a common bacterium though...such as people who have no remorse and feel good when people are in pain. But a lake of fire is not how the universe works.

a lake of fire is exactly how the universe works. what is the sun? what are stars? they are big *** lakes of fire? i've thought about this a great deal in terms of energy as well. and i'm just gonna leave it at that.

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by Fifth House Sun

a lake of fire is exactly how the universe works. what is the sun? what are stars? they are big *** lakes of fire? i've thought about this a great deal in terms of energy as well. and i'm just gonna leave it at that.

Stars are mostly plasma. Nuclear fusion at its core creates energy. But it isn't a lake of fire and souls don't burn in lakes of fire.

[piercethevale]

Originally Posted by Fifth House Sun

Sheol and the Lake of Fire. Sheol is a big *** wood pile to the Lake of Fire's big *** burn pile in it's ignited state of a big *** bon fire.


For the longest time I had concluded that there was no eternal damnation by an omnipotent and omniscient Creator.

I have recently changed my opinion that is definitely possible, because if souls are given numerous chances to be decent and never evolve and continue in selfish manners to the expense and pain of others then there may come a time, perhaps when the universe begins to collapse, when they must be converted in the Lake of Fire.

The reason I changed my mind is because of the wickedness of this world most people are truly evil and serve their own interest at the expense and suffering of others without any remorse whatsoever. Many are already stacked in Sheol, maybe the can incarnate again to redeem themselves, or maybe their chances have run out, or maybe there is a set time, maybe that time is soon. I honestly hope it is, because I am ready to live in a world where our senses are wide open and lies are a thing of the past or at least pointless. A society governed by Truth and justice and equality and Love and kindness.



In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

http://bible.cc/john/14-2.htm

the universe is infinite and still expanding

edit woops i just read JUPITERASC's previous post. i need to read the Rigveda

Interesting. Right below me is the American River and right up river a few miles, give or take, is Folsom Prison and until about 1880 [I believe it is, I don't have the facts handy] about 185 prisoners were executed by hanging. Among them were men that had definitely committed some of the most heinous crimes imaginable. Down stream from the prison is an old Cottonwood tree that is apparently well over 150 years old and in the bark of the tree you can see faces ...faces in torment as the tree grows older these faces are torn up by the expansion of the bark and the more they get 'torn up' the more tormented they appear to be.
I showed this to one of the local Wiccan/Druidic oriented citizens and we talked about it that afternoon. He came to a conclusion that such souls are caused to dissolve into the material...a lesser state of being ..so as to be reassembled in some manner...or possibly dissolved for all time...but I personally believe in the "No Soul left behind" theory myself.

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by piercethevale

I showed this to one of the local Wiccan/Druidic oriented citizens and we talked about it that afternoon. He came to a conclusion that such souls are caused to dissolve into the material...a lesser state of being ..so as to be reassembled in some manner...or possibly dissolved for all time...but I personally believe in the "No Soul left behind" theory myself.

I guess it all depends what you believe the soul is exactly. If you adhere to the vedic mystic (Upanishads and Bhagavad Gita), then the Self/Soul/Atman is basically 'god'...the evil doesn't come from god, it comes from the ego and delusion, which also activates Karma when you do with intent for your own gratification (this in itself is considered illusion since why would you harm other sentient beings for illusory, impermanent objects that decay?) However if you do enough evil, I do believe you eventually are very far gone and removed and probably are at a lower vibration and so are then pulled/attracted to such a vibration.

[Fifth House Sun]

Originally Posted by retinoid

Stars are mostly plasma. Nuclear fusion at its core creates energy. But it isn't a lake of fire and souls don't burn in lakes of fire.

Anything is possible. The sun could also be made of boiling OJ, grapefruit juice, cayenne pepper powder, and met AM fetacheese.

The truth is is that we do not know, in the true sence of the word know, what the sun and stars are made of. If you say that you certainly absolutely do know then you are either brainwashed into box or you are an ascended master.

And considering what Astrology is at the core.......



Personally, I don't believe a soul would theoretically spend all of eternity in the lake fire, or a lake of fire, on some other star in some other universe after, going through a black hole, for all of eternity, but a specific perfect divine time required for the necessary conversion and evilution, if the soul was retarded.

[Fifth House Sun]

According to these one people(Yezidi(sp?)) name slipping my mind we were created by the Peacock Angel, Tawsi Melek(sp?), some say that the Peacock Angel is Lucifer or Satan. I am not certain that Lucifer is evil. My reasoning is the lies of the Church and the contradictions in the Bible, and the obvious evil of enormous proportion dealt out by the Christian Church, and it's complete whacked out history and mainly origin. So ....

Anyway I have theorized that we are in "Hell" now, and we are all the devil(not Lucifer or Satan) and fleshly incarnated Life is sort of a straining process.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Fifth House Sun

According to these one people(Yezidi(sp?)) name slipping my mind we were created by the Peacock Angel, Tawsi Melek(sp?), some say that the Peacock Angel is Lucifer or Satan. I am not certain that Lucifer is evil. My reasoning is the lies of the Church and the contradictions in the Bible, and the obvious evil of enormous proportion dealt out by the Christian Church, and it's complete whacked out history and mainly origin. So ....

Anyway I have theorized that we are in "Hell" now, and we are all the devil(not Lucifer or Satan) and fleshly incarnated Life is sort of a straining process.

Lucifer aka The 'Morning Star' aka the planet Venus http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

[piercethevale]

From the movie 'The Usual Suspects' came one of the greatest lines I've ever heard in a film.
It was spoken by Kevin Spacey whom played the lead role in the movie.
As he was being interrogated by the police he told them.
"You know, the greatest trick the Devil ever pulled is convincing the world that he doesn't exist."

[Fifth House Sun]

I 2012% certain that there is evil and a devil. but think about how the you were never supposed to say the name of the lord or write it or make pictures or images or forms of anything in some decrees. and it is obvious that the Roman Catholic Church is evil in my opinion. They admit themselves that they have more power than "God" i don't call the Almighty Creator "god" because i believe it is not accurate. or somehow an insult put forth by the wicked, those who worship the devil. the Bible has massive contradictions. The Bible itself says that the evil one will do EVERYTHING his power to hide the truth. and the Bible also states many times that changing it's contents is something that people should be aware of.

[Prominent]

evil is what you make of it.. good is what you make of it.. The moment you have good, you also have it's opposite because you must have a background that can produce awareness of a foreground- a sense of relativity and space. The space is what connects sides and creates understanding for without space there would be no way to sense anything.

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by Prominent

evil is what you make of it.. good is what you make of it.. The moment you have good, you also have it's opposite because you must have a background that can produce awareness of a foreground- a sense of relativity and space. The space is what connects sides and creates understanding for without space there would be no way to sense anything.

I agree with you that evil came about due emanation. The truest reality does not have good or evil. The Supreme is not good or evil...though good/love/etc. is closest to the supreme because it aligns more with being one than evil does (which is pure delusion)...though evil still has its PLACE/PURPOSE but it is not PERMISSIBLE and should never be excused. Being good and loving is much closer to the supreme reality but is not the supreme reality.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by piercethevale

From the movie 'The Usual Suspects' came one of the greatest lines I've ever heard in a film.
It was spoken by Kevin Spacey whom played the lead role in the movie.
As he was being interrogated by the police he told them.
"You know, the greatest trick the Devil ever pulled is convincing the world that he doesn't exist."

There are many great lines from films - here are a few more


100 word extract sourced from The Matrix - Tumbling Down The Rabbit Holehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbYirSi08m4
QUOTE of dialogue between MORPHEUS AND NEO:



"You have the look of a man who accepts what he sees because he's expecting to wake up. Ironically, this is not far from the truth. Do you believe in fate, Neo?

No.

Why not?

'Cause I don't like the idea that I'm not in control of my life.

I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why you're here. You're here because you know something. What you know, you can't explain. But you feel it. You felt it your entire life. That there's something wrong with the world. You don't know what it is, but it's there"....



attached: Photo of Einstein sitting on the front steps of his home in Princeton, wearing his fuzzy slippers.
Photo Credit: Photo courtesy of Gillett Griffin.

[Prominent]

Originally Posted by retinoid

I agree with you that evil came about due emanation. The truest reality does not have good or evil.

Of course it has 'good' or 'evil', if it had nothing between right or wrong then nothing would be true.. Nothing would be true, but truth it is not. To 'have'(halve) anything creates truth.

The Supreme is not good or evil...though good/love/etc. is closest to the supreme because it aligns more with being one than evil does (which is pure delusion)

Being one? one of what?.. One half of the whole, in which case evil is also one half and likewise equally close or equally distant. Pure love is equally delusional than pure evil because to love purely is to cast away your opposite and suppress it within yourself- an act that isn't pure at all because it create blindness rather than clarity regardless of which side you're on.

...though evil still has its PLACE/PURPOSE but it is not PERMISSIBLE and should never be excused. Being good and loving is much closer to the supreme reality but is not the supreme reality.

The closer you take love or hate towards their extremes, the more you separate yourself from truth. You become suppressive to a point where this is forced upon your other side, and from this stance they are both impressible and forceful, powerful.. but neither good nor evil. Their struggle is expressed unto all as both where both can be felt.

[piercethevale]

If you'll all notice I did replace what I had originally ascribed to be symbolic of the 'Energy" in the equation. Replacing "Love" with the symbol known as the "Yin-Yang" [I am assuming it is the correct name...but there is probably one that I'm unaware of.]
As the symbol is of 'Dualism' but in a unified sense it does make sense to me that the "Word of Creation and Light" had to divide it in order to create "Matter" in this Universe.
I do want to mention that my 'Part of Self Undoing', i.e. Asc. + Cusp 12th - Neptune, [An 'Astrological Part' which I only became somewhat convinced of last night while analyzing Richard Nixon's natal chart] is 19* Scorpio 27'...that is the 20th degree of Scorpio and for which the Sabian symbol is: [from Rudhyar's book]

Scorpio 20* "A WOMAN DRAWS AWAY TWO DARK CURTAINS CLOSING THE ENTRANCE TO A SACRED PATHWAY.

KEYNOTE: The revelation to the human consciousness of what lies beyond dualistic knowledge.

The [Feminine half of eachs' nature] — the faith that is rooted in the deepest intuitions of the soul — is seen here as the hierophant unveiling the realities which the... [everything is 'Black' or 'White', 'Negative or Positive', 'Good or Evil', 'Darkness or Light'] mind of man alone cannot perceive. The path to the mystic's "unitive life" is opened up once the darkness of fear, egocentricity and dualistic morality is removed. ...

... [It demonstrates what a 'Spiritual, or Cosmic' optimism has] upon faith and intuition [and] can bring about. Courage is needed to go through the veiling darkness — the courage to venture beyond the familiar and the traditionally known, to PLUNGE AHEAD INTO THE UNKNOWN"

...and as I have now pointed that out... hopefully you all will understand if I avoid, any further, this particular matter of the overall topic here.

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by Prominent

Of course it has 'good' or 'evil', if it had nothing between right or wrong then nothing would be true.. Nothing would be true, but truth it is not. To 'have'(halve) anything creates truth.

Being one? one of what?.. One half of the whole, in which case evil is also one half and likewise equally close or equally distant. Pure love is equally delusional than pure evil because to love purely is to cast away your opposite and suppress it within yourself- an act that isn't pure at all because it create blindness rather than clarity regardless of which side you're on.

The closer you take love or hate towards their extremes, the more you separate yourself from truth. You become suppressive to a point where this is forced upon your other side, and from this stance they are both impressible and forceful, powerful.. but neither good nor evil. Their struggle is expressed unto all as both where both can be felt.

Prominent I think you have to feel it to know it. That is all I have to say on the subject. It cannot be philosophized or proven. The ultimate is beyond good or evil and is very unlike the physical realm.

[Fifth House Sun]

Originally Posted by piercethevale

E = MC2. In this brief equation Einstein said that Matter, M, is composed of essentially Light and Energy.
This equation also led to the theory and development of the Atomic Bomb and the theory of time travel.
By the above formula it is extrapolated somehow that if you could take off from this Planet in a space ship and achieve the Speed of Light then for every 'X' amount of years you travelled you would travel 'X' x 'Y' number of years into the future. I can't recall what the ratio is or if any Scientist can give one but it was something like 20 or 200 to 1 when I first heard this stuff.
So if you travel the 'Speed of Light' and you go FORWARD in time then how would one go backwards into time.
The answer is: "as all actions have an opposite and equal re-action",You slow Light down to your speed.
Did anyone notice the page 10 news item, back around Feb. 2003, that announced that American Gov't scientists were excited to have finally achieved slowing light down in a specially constructed chamber filled with exotic gases.
Apparently this experiment had been attempted for a number of years without success at no little expense....[yeah, I wondered ,"What the Hell could THEY be up to now"??!!].
[Also, THEY are presently attempting to create 'Black Holes' in tunnnels beneath the Swiss Alps presently...Man, you got to keep an eye on THEM!...they think THEY can control these things...the key work here is ''THINK" as in "SURMISE" or "HYPOTHESIZE"].
Now I'd like to bring up the concept of what happens at the speed of light squared...the C2 of E = MC2.
At that Speed Light Laps itself...that is light will eventually catch up to the first ray of light ever emitted and thus laps itself or loops...yep, just like NASCAR... [See Mobius strip and/or the icon for infinity].

At that point the past, present and future become ONE in that light. That is the speed of thought... the Speed one achieves in Astral projection into the Eternal Light that is one with the Holy Word...the OM.
This is the Light that cannont exist in our Universe and thus the Creator gave us two lesser forms of Light that can exist in our physical universe...the Sun and the Moon...his two Luminaries to rule side by side. [You see?...time is an illusion, that is a phenomena, created by the speed of light]
Anyways,back to Einsteins equation: ...If physical life is Matter, 'M'...then it, Life, is equal to...by algebraic equation; ... M = E/C2...i.e. Life is equal to Energy divided by the Speed of Light squared...or i.e. Life = Energy / OM [I'd like to use the icon for the Anhk and the OM in Sanskrit here but can't].
So, if Life is composed of Gods Eternal Light and Word...then what is the Energy???

Answer...LOVE is the Energy... God took his Love and divided it by his Eternal Light and created Life....a very simplistic analogy but nonetheless accurate and true.

Thus as Einstein said Matter cannot be destroyed only converted to Light and Energy...then the reverse is true for both Light and Energy...they cannot be destroyed...thus as you are 'Conscious' Light & Energy you cannot be destroyed...you are eternal in essence...only impermeable and changable in form.

...ps, I usually try to refer to God in the neutral gender but it is rather impossible to when utilizing such analogies as the above...I apologize to anyone who may be offended.

I just wanted to clarify that I am talking about the Lake of Fire, and of course there are many, perhaps an infinite number, of lakes of fire, in direct relation to the way Piercethevale is talking about Light and Energy and conscious souls/spirits. and in a manner according to my understanding of what Astrology actually is. This is something I first thought of long ago, but I never thought about Einstiens theory or the way Piercethevale and maybe Prominent have described, at least not that I can recall. For I have forgotten a fair amount.

Then you could also include Retinoid's perspective on plasmic nuclear fusion is what is going on, and it fits the theory perfectly. whether it is difusion or a combination of both. i would suspect that it is difusion until a sun spot erupts and that is fusion. or maybe i have it backwards. yea maybe opposite what i originally said makes more sense. who knows?

[Fifth House Sun]

Originally Posted by retinoid

Prominent I think you have to feel it to know it. That is all I have to say on the subject. It cannot be philosophized or proven. The ultimate is beyond good or evil and is very unlike the physical realm.

My personal belief is that there can be a society, and that one will exist, and one has supposedly existed in South America according to a Spanish explorer, where evil is not present, or perhaps somehow it is only contained, and I believe the Bible mentions this type of containment.

or perhaps it is simply truly identified without lies and deception of any kind allowing it to be put to rest.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Fifth House Sun

I 2012% certain that there is evil and a devil. but think about how the you were never supposed to say the name of the lord or write it or make pictures or images or forms of anything in some decrees. and it is obvious that the Roman Catholic Church is evil in my opinion. They admit themselves that they have more power than "God" i don't call the Almighty Creator "god" because i believe it is not accurate. or somehow an insult put forth by the wicked, those who worship the devil. the Bible has massive contradictions. The Bible itself says that the evil one will do EVERYTHING his power to hide the truth. and the Bible also states many times that changing it's contents is something that people should be aware of.

Originally Posted by Prominent

evil is what you make of it.. good is what you make of it.. The moment you have good, you also have it's opposite because you must have a background that can produce awareness of a foreground- a sense of relativity and space. The space is what connects sides and creates understanding for without space there would be no way to sense anything.

Originally Posted by retinoid

I agree with you that evil came about due emanation. The truest reality does not have good or evil. The Supreme is not good or evil...though good/love/etc. is closest to the supreme because it aligns more with being one than evil does (which is pure delusion)...though evil still has its PLACE/PURPOSE but it is not PERMISSIBLE and should never be excused. Being good and loving is much closer to the supreme reality but is not the supreme reality.

Einsteins scene basically is 'everything is relative'

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

Einsteins scene basically is 'everything is relative'

If you are referring to relativity it is based on the inverse relationship between time and speed (faster you travel the slower time is hence 'relativity')...if you want to extrapolate it to everything else that is something different. Overall it doesn't matter much which is right or wrong or closest to correct...I think we can all agree evil is not ideal. And that is the main conclusion we should come to.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by retinoid

If you are referring to relativity it is based on the inverse relationship between time and speed (faster you travel the slower time is hence 'relativity')...if you want to extrapolate it to everything else that is something different. Overall it doesn't matter much which is right or wrong or closest to correct...I think we can all agree evil is not ideal. And that is the main conclusion we should come to.

fwiw IMO any 'agreement' is necessarily relative, since most of us have our own opinions

- and that's no problem IMO because we are all entitled to our own opinions -

the 'Einsteinian' scene is one that accepts that others have opinions that may differ from our own because simply - it's all relative

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

fwiw IMO any 'agreement' is necessarily relative, since most of us have our own opinions

- and that's no problem IMO because we are all entitled to our own opinions -

the 'Einsteinian' scene is one that accepts that others have opinions that may differ from our own because simply - it's all relative

Yes I agree in the world of the 'mind' and 'multiplicity' we have many different views and opinions. Sort of like religions...but I think if we find the commonality in everything then that is most important. It doesn't matter HOW you rise above the trees to look at the light...so it doesn't quite matter what exactly you think the nature of evil is or if there is a devil, it just matters what the commonality is (I think it is we all think evil is bad). Just as if someone is traveling at the speed of light (time didn't move) while someone at rest would have aged a million years. The conclusion? Not who was 'right' about time, but the conclusion would be that time varies and is an illusion. You would find that to be true if you analyzed each person's perspective and compared it.

[Prominent]

Originally Posted by retinoid

Prominent I think you have to feel it to know it. That is all I have to say on the subject. It cannot be philosophized or proven. The ultimate is beyond good or evil and is very unlike the physical realm.

You're wrong, because you're ignoring what makes sense. If philosophizing helps a person understand, then this knowledge can help a person feel things about themselves they may not have felt before.
retinoid, You don't seem to understand what Feeling IS..
Why do you try to separate yourself from what is real? Separating evil from good would be heartless on your part- it would only serve to suppress those who have been left behind within neither a black or white state of mind. They would never be able to find truth in your favored way.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by retinoid

Yes I agree in the world of the 'mind' and 'multiplicity' we have many different views and opinions. Sort of like religions...but I think if we find the commonality in everything then that is most important. It doesn't matter HOW you rise above the trees to look at the light...

You agree that we all have different views and opinions and that fact in itself implies that there is no UNIVERSAL commonality...

Originally Posted by retinoid

...so it doesn't quite matter what exactly you think the nature of evil is or if there is a devil, it just matters what the commonality is (I think it is we all think evil is bad).

That is clearly your personal opinion, however there is a flaw within your contention...

i.e. although obviously 'evil' = 'bad' there is nevertheless no commonality as to the specifics of 'evil' aka 'badness'...

HENCE what is considered 'evil' by one person or group of people may frequently be observed as being considered 'good' by another group of people

Originally Posted by retinoid

....Just as if someone is traveling at the speed of light (time didn't move)

Obviously only light travels at the speed of light so your theory is theoretically unstable

- any physical object approaching the speed of light gains infinite mass.

Originally Posted by retinoid

...while someone at rest would have aged a million years. The conclusion? Not who was 'right' about time, but the conclusion would be that time varies and is an illusion. You would find that to be true if you analyzed each person's perspective and compared it.

There is no way of proving your contention therefore it remains in the category of "how many angels can dance on the end of a pin"

In any event there are those who would consider your comments as simply a personal conclusion aka opinion that you have reached based on your own relative experiences.

Since we all have different experiences as well as different reactions to similar experiences then there is no commonality - that's just my two cents worth

[retinoid]

Originally Posted by Prominent

You're wrong, because you're ignoring what makes sense. If philosophizing helps a person understand, then this knowledge can help a person feel things about themselves they may not have felt before.
retinoid, You don't seem to understand what Feeling IS..
Why do you try to separate yourself from what is real? Separating evil from good would be heartless on your part- it would only serve to suppress those who have been left behind within neither a black or white state of mind. They would never be able to find truth in your favored way.

You don't understand feeling. Some things are beyond your capability to reason.

[Prominent]

Originally Posted by retinoid

You don't understand feeling. Some things are beyond your capability to reason.

What is reason?
How can you reason if you believe that reason itself does not produce any form of sense that you can feel. You assume that your thought lacks feeling in and of itself but if it lacked any form of feeling that is perceptible then you would not be thinking at all.
Reason consists of feeling. This feeling is just of a different kind, similar to how we have various senses.. touch, taste, hearing, etc... science shows that there are countless more senses, and thought and reason are senses too.