Self-hatred and self-negation

[waybread]

Originally Posted by Nate of the 12th

I don't think that all that said I am going to be able to let these issues go. I think that ultimately it arises from things in my past that I did (Sun-Mars can be a real scoundrel), and these I cannot forget or forgive. I also believe in self-transcendence, and the self-hatred gives a good platform for it. There is only one thing I care about - as I believe we come here to grow in our soul so that we are accepted into "the beyond", without necessitating reincarnation in the world to work on our ego issues, I only want to reach such a state of egolessness that he who decides does not have grounds to send me back here anymore.

Nate, then it sounds like you might gravitate towards the spiritual potential of your "loaded" 12th house. You might seek out the charts of spiritual leaders who shared this chart emphasis with you and read their work or biographies. But then you might focus on the universal love dimension, or on the discipline required for a productive more solo contemplative life. Meditation may be helpful.

[holly]

Nate, I'm 23 and experienced those same feelings since I was a child. I had this intense self-hatred and self-loathing that went deep down to my core, and the tricky thing was I couldn't find any reason for it. The good news is, I am now completely "cured" of this.

It might sound crazy at first, but I read a book called "Family Secrets" by John Bradshaw and what I discovered through reading that book, is that I was unconciously carrying the negative emotions my father felt towards my mother. I was the carrier of dark family emotions that were never expressed. As a child, you pick up on these vibes even if nothing overt is said or done.

It was pretty traumatic to confront the truth that my father found my mother loathsome. Because these emotions were never expressed by my father, I ended up carrying them myself, and turning these foreign emotions of loathing against myself. I couldn't cure them, because these feelings didn't originate in me - they were my fathers!

As soon as I uncovered the truth of the deep pain I was carrying, I was released from it, and I am now a different person. My medical symptoms completely vanished and I am so much lighter and I am free!

It's such a cliche these days, but my suggestion is to look into your family and your past. It might not help you at all, but because it helped me turn my life around, I felt I had to share it with you. Good luck.

[Modcleopatra]

Holly, I couldn't agree with you more. Thanks for the advice!

[Caprising]

Nate, you are going through your moon return. Every 28 or so years our progressed moon returns to it's natal position. I just progressed your chart to now and guess what? your progressed moon is right on your natal moon. This is a time for sorting out emotional issues. It can be a real suprise to find that your thoughts are now accompanied by strong emotions. It's quite easy to glide through the first part of your life with a shallow emotional input into the decisions that we make, only to find out later that we have a stronger conscience than we ever realised. I remember times in my past where I had to get drunk to admit to myself that I had been cruel, unjust uncaring, selfish etc. This hurt emotionally, going through my past decisions with a fine tooth comb. It's part of growing up, if you think that the teenage years is all the growing that we do well think again, we never stop learning and I believe that one can see this "growth process" in older people (they are more mellowed out and understanding of the human condition) . If your shocked at some of your past deeds well most people are at some stage or stages of their life, even if they can't admit it to you (or themselves). This is the earth plane, your not born perfect so don't expect to lead a perfect life, no one is or does. Stop judging yourself so harshly, your a good person as "bad" people don't feel guilt or remorse about the evil things that they do.If you want to atone for your previous "sins" then go feed the hungry,. expose the tyrants, make a difference, we spiritual warriors need all the help that we can get!....Oh, I nearly forgot the good news...Your feelings of being responsible for all of the bad things that have happened in your life will ease off a bit very soon as your progressed moon passes your natal placing, so relax and rest assured that what your going through is at it's strongest right now, and will ease off.

[wintersprite1]

Hi Nate,

I "spoke" with EJ53 and got some instructions on how to work with your interception of the Taurus Stellium in the 12th. (Now EJ, bail me out if I get to lost in the weeds)

We are going to look at the houses that have a duplicate sign at the cusp. In this case it is the 1/7th axis and the 2/8 axis. We start with the lower number houses to unlock the next set of houses, which will give you a chance to actively work with the 6/12 houses. Sounds complicated, but really makes sense.

Your first house is in Gemini and the seventh in Sagittarius. An easy way to see this combination will be in the Me/Them set. There will be issues surrounding these houses that should be tended to. I imagine you feel that you are in odds with who you are and who you believe others think you should be. With the Gemini, there is probably much debating (arguing) and going back and forth. There needs to be clear boundaries set up by you on where you start and they stop. Not just assumptions that they should know, you need to clearly state "this is me... no I am not that" And it goes the other way, you need to respect the others to be who they are, not who you want to project on them they should be. Once that has been established, the next step is to look at the 2nd and 8th. I suspect that there has been a problem with sharing space and possessions. Again clear boundaries need to be made. This is my private space (2nd house) and this is yours (8th). You need to find a corner that is all yours to express yourself. Again noting the interception is in Taurus, sensation and perception are everything to you. Make your space your own! Paint the walls, have music YOU want playing, collect trinkets that are special to you... indulge in yourself and make your space an extension of you. Once you have established who you are (1st house) and made a physical representation (2nd) you will be able to deal with the planets in your intercepted 12th.

If you need more clarification, just holler.

TK

[Nate of the 12th]

Come on now, I know what I am, I know what my mother is and what my father is. I'd say fundamentally, this is an issue between my Sun-Marsian side and my Sun-Venusian side (which really does not like the former), and then the 12th house (and 8th house moon in equal-houses) exacerbates this through excessive inner focus, imaginative dramatization and self-crucification. I recently returned from a visit to my family in France, and I got to spend time with my Sun-Venus twin cousins. It was an interesting learning experience, learning where my own Venusian side ends and where Mars, the hooligan takes over.

[Nate of the 12th]

Vichy can you post your birth data (date, time, place) so that we can get a look at the entire chart?

[Nate of the 12th]

Just what I thought. I work mainly with equal-houses and I'm getting the Sun conj Jupiter in the 12th house. Leos are social creatures and do not normally fair very well in the introvert, out of the limelight 12th. Jupiter also expands the Leo Sun's natural ego, but this works badly in the self-transcending and ego-destroying 12th, which creates a horrible conflict. Even without considering the 12th house Sun, Leo will have difficulty with a Mercury that is as introvert as Virgo Mercury in the 12th. Leos want to enjoy life, have fun, socialise and "party", but having anemic communicational skills makes it that much more difficult.

[Nate of the 12th]

Vichy, the 11th house is not supposed to be lonely with an enthusiastic planet such as Jupiter. The actual issue in your chart is that Communicational Mercury and Partnering Venus are in the 12th, that's the main thing that makes you feel lonely and misunderstood. The sun reflects what we value and how we want to be seen. Mercury shows how we communicate that. The 11th house is the house of adventure, the 12th a house of dreams but often complicated in the echoes of the past, true to it being a reflective water house.