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  #1  
Old 03-08-2006, 12:55 PM
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Radu Radu is offline
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Do you believe in God?

Just trying to test the waters here. I wonder how people here relate to God and Astrology.
Please answer honestly. Nobody but you knows the answer you gave.

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  #2  
Old 05-02-2006, 05:41 AM
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Hi,

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I believe in astrology but I don't believe God exists
Whoever answers with this response really astonishes me quite a lot.

This is like saying, 'I believe that I am breathing but I don't believe that oxygen exists'.

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  #3  
Old 05-02-2006, 04:49 PM
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Draco

At least with astrology we have proof it works. And to continue with the breathing analogy - we have proof oxygen exits. We have proof in infinite amounts of energy (in all its different manifestations), but we have no proof god (or any other so called supreme deity) exits.

Why is it necesssary to believe in the one without the other?





hel

let the games begin??
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  #4  
Old 05-05-2006, 02:13 AM
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I believe in the Westernized concept of God to a certain extent, but I hate to use the word "God" to describe it because it's so Judeo-Christian (no offense of course). I grew up with all these ideas of God and what was right and wrong, and lately I think I relate to a "Higher Concsciousness" more than anything.

For a while, astrology replaced God for me. People say "God did all of these good things for me", but really they're having a Jupiter return. Having been so immersed in astrology and seen the effects of certain transits in my own and others' lives, I guess I've changed my concept of God.
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Old 05-05-2006, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sam
People say "God did all of these good things for me", but really they're having a Jupiter return.
This is a good idea, I like it, but also I think that it may be just another level of the reality veil. I mean, understanding astrological influences is already a big leap ahead on the path of getting a grasp on how this universe works, but planets are themselves just a part of Maya, the Hindu term for the divine game of life and illusion. Astrologers are, like all scientists, specialists in one field of knowledge. But this doesn't mean that beyond our craft, there isn't a Higher Consciousness, by any name called.

Also, as it happens to all true scientists, astrologers get closer to this Higher Consciousness as they grow wiser in their science/craft, the more they learn, the more they discover that there is something escaping common understanding, which are divine forces/influences at work.
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Old 05-05-2006, 08:25 PM
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Also, as it happens to all true scientists, astrologers get closer to this Higher Consciousness as they grow wiser in their science/craft, the more they learn, the more they discover that there is something escaping common understanding, which are divine forces/influences at work
.

Sorry. I can't agree with this. ops: the 'divine forces' were only invented to explain the inexplainable in the first place. It rained, so they invented a god of rain to explain it. It thundered, so the gods were angry! I feel its all so much bigger than this. And so much simpler. Its energy. Transmutation/transformation of energy. Physics? Science has only become difficult as scientists have gone smaller and smaller in their identification of energy movement, because 'divine forces' have narrowed our outlook down through the ages.

Energy is natural, it drifts aroound the universe, some of it decides to stay in one place, a bit more comes along and whoops we have a sun. It stays, it changes, it will move on someday. We are all just a mass of energy which decided to hang around. We have changed as it has changed. Look what happened when it got a bit over excited and formed the dinosaurs. ops: It took a cold shower, disbanded and reformed. Eventually. The same as we are doing. This time we'll go out with a bang when our energy gets use dup (or rather, too polarized to us and not our habitat), only to regroup and reform somewhere else as something else.


Astrology shows us where the energy is going, where it has come from and the most balanced way to use the energy within us. Afterall, energy likes to be balanced. Deitys don't come into it.

Rant over for today.

take care

hel
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Old 05-05-2006, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Radu
Quote:
Originally Posted by sam
People say "God did all of these good things for me", but really they're having a Jupiter return.
This is a good idea, I like it, but also I think that it may be just another level of the reality veil. I mean, understanding astrological influences is already a big leap ahead on the path of getting a grasp on how this universe works, but planets are themselves just a part of Maya, the Hindu term for the divine game of life and illusion. Astrologers are, like all scientists, specialists in one field of knowledge. But this doesn't mean that beyond our craft, there isn't a Higher Consciousness, by any name called.

Also, as it happens to all true scientists, astrologers get closer to this Higher Consciousness as they grow wiser in their science/craft, the more they learn, the more they discover that there is something escaping common understanding, which are divine forces/influences at work.
Yeah, I see what you mean. Astrology has become my primary focus and as much as it has enlightened me, it also has restricted my thinking to only consider astrology in a lot of ways.
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  #8  
Old 05-06-2006, 12:08 AM
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Most excellent rant hel141! 8)
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  #9  
Old 05-06-2006, 12:19 PM
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Hi Hel,

Quote:
At least with astrology we have proof it works.
No we do not. You would not be able to prove astrology in a court of law, as far as acceptable evidence is concerned, any more than you could prove the existence of 'God'. The very idea of attempting to do such a thing as prove God, or even astrology seems to me most absurd. The idea of proving 'God' would be as preposterous as attempting to 'prove' that I have a nose in the middle of my face, when all I need do is look in the mirror, or at least feel for it.

Astrology is only 'proved' to an individual according to the experiences of that person in relation to the subject. This is the difference between knowledge and understanding. Knowledge is always theoretical, because it is always given second hand via a book or a person for example. Knowledge depends on trust. Understanding, on the other hand is superior to mere knowledge, because in order to understand something you need to have experienced it at first hand.

So if I say that I know that the omniscient intelligence commonly reffered to as 'God' exists, then I only know because I have been told so, and knowledge is not proof. Neither God nor astrology can be proved this way. If however, I say that I understand that God exists, then I understand this through direct personal experience, this is proof, at least to myself, which is the only proof available for such things.

So when you speak of proof that astrology exists, then you refer to the solid resonance that confirms the validity of astrology to you according to the understanding you have gleaned from your experience with it.

Therefore it is my understanding that there is an all pervading omniscient intelligence in operation behind all things. There would be no point even scratching the surface of astrology without this understanding! I should not need to explain why to an astrologist, it should be as plain as the nose on my face!

Quote:
And to continue with the breathing analogy - we have proof oxygen exits
Yes we do have proof that oxygen exists, but what is the nature of that proof? It is proved to us through our own understanding which we glean through direct experience. I am breathing - therefore oxygen exists.

We could conduct all manner of scientific experiments in order to prove the existence of oxygen in a court of law, such as producing lists of scientific formulae, to detemine oxygen's composition or mass. However, wouldn't doing this be quite ridiculous when we already understand that oxygen exists? If it didn't we wouldn't be here. The same can be said for 'God', or what I prefer to refer to as 'It'.

I used the breathing analogy to express how grossly absurd the statement 'I believe in astrology, but don't believe that God exists' is to my own understanding.

Quote:
We have proof in infinite amounts of energy...but we have no proof god...exists.
This comment is interesting because it is most paradoxical, and confuses me no end. You say that we 'have proof in infinate amounts of energy' but then say, 'we have no proof of God'. This strikes me as most bizarre in it's contradiction, for what is 'God' if not an infinate amount of energy?!

I have stockpiles of ammunition on standby in preparation for the counter-attack. :P

Draco
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  #10  
Old 05-06-2006, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
This comment is interesting because it is most paradoxical, and confuses me no end. You say that we 'have proof in infinate amounts of energy' but then say, 'we have no proof of God'. This strikes me as most bizarre in it's contradiction, for what is 'God' if not an infinate amount of energy?!
Thus is the nature of duality...

I suppose an individual could make a similar argument against one who wishes to categorize or differentiate between any "two" things, as the One is all that exists

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  #11  
Old 05-06-2006, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
the One is all that exists
Ultimately, yes. That is what 'God' is, and as the One obviously exists, then how can the existence of the Ultimate, commonly referred to as 'God' be in dispute?

Draco
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  #12  
Old 06-05-2006, 06:36 PM
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Thumbs down Re: Do you believe in God?

I UNDERSTAND that there is no God.

I believe that religion is a natural phenomena, like astrology, and should be studied and evaluated as such.
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  #13  
Old 06-06-2006, 02:05 AM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

I believe there is a source from which the multidimensional multiverse developed. I believe the various God concepts that humans have developed throughout the millennia are just fractal impressions of the energy from which all have been created. Each of those fractal impressions need to be put together into a mosaic that represents the human approach to the immortal energy that is ever present. As humans ascend in their evolutionary process, ideas of God will grow and change to become more expansive and less limiting than they are now.

Do I believe in the current concepts of God? No, they are too limiting. Do I think there is something greater than humankind? Yes. Can I conceptualize it for others to understand? At this point, probably not.

Elianah
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Last edited by Elianah; 06-09-2006 at 02:57 AM.
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  #14  
Old 06-07-2006, 09:45 PM
Draco Draco is offline
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Re: Do you believe in God?

Quote:
I UNDERSTAND that there is no God.
Utterly ludicrous! In which case there is no-thing, and certainly no astrology.
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Old 06-08-2006, 05:44 PM
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Smile Re: Do you believe in God?

Utterly Ludicrous back at ya!
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  #16  
Old 06-08-2006, 07:43 PM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

Perhaps the true argument here lies within one's definition of God:

Is God an actual entity or humanity's futile attempt to structure the unstructured?

Is God one thing or all things--or both?

Is God within or without?

The questions are limitless...

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Old 06-09-2006, 09:46 PM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

Now I can get back on here properly..

Everyone here seems to be saying the same thing, there is something....


why is it necessary to label it? Why then, is one persons label necessarily better than anothers? Why must it be personified, or anthropormophised (! ) (Use your own spellchecker - mine's not working - like predictive text, you need to be able to spell in the first place) Why project it outward, when its within?

enough musings for now

take care

hel
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Old 06-10-2006, 01:10 AM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

Wow, that's some word!

Anthropomorphized- (v. tr.) To ascribe human characteristics to; (v. intr.) To ascribe human characteristics to things not human.

You bring up a very good point, though, one I believe is the core of all religious conflict--humankind tends to relate more with their limited definitions and perceptions than with the energy of the infinite, which can neither be categorized nor described.

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Old 06-10-2006, 09:16 PM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

AriMav

Quote:
Wow, that's some word!

Anthropomorphized- (v. tr.) To ascribe human characteristics to; (v. intr.) To ascribe human characteristics to things not human.
Nah, I just read a lot of Terry Pratchett - Death just has to be about the best

Quote:
one I believe is the core of all religious conflict--humankind tends to relate more with their limited definitions and perceptions
I agree, a sort of my dad's bigger than your dad on a global scale.


hel
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Old 06-30-2006, 01:36 PM
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Wink Re: Do you believe in God?

Hi folks,

I do believe in G-d, there were already enough situations in my life when the only help and guidance came from G-d (through some righteous people) and sometimes I have prayed for his help and got my prayers answered.

Wave.
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Old 06-30-2006, 08:37 PM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

Yes, I believe in God, but I am not sure anyone can define what God really is. I think of God as something like the totality of nature, the ground of being, or all that is, kind of like what the philosopher Spinoza said, if anyone has read The Ethics.

Devalight
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Old 05-02-2007, 02:21 PM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

Yes I believe in God

As a small child I gave my life to Jesus in a traditional Pentecostal church, and for the last 3 decades served in worship, leadership etc.

I became disillusioned with the concept of church and saw how the church became stagnated. Being in church however does not make yo a christian, just as going to MacDonalds does not make you a hamburger. The emphasis of all their teaching was to prompt you in having a personal relationship with God, and using prayer, meditation and Bible study as a means to grow this relationship.

Over the last 5 years, I came out as gay, and could no longer form part of this Pentecostal /Charismatic movement. I discovered a somewhat flawed theology. I also kept on seeking Truth and God directed me to discover some ancient paths. I discovered that church today is the result of human interferace with the teachings of Jesus, and the Nicean council and Roman church left the world with a distorted and watered down flavour of who God is.

I felt there had to be more to God than what we read in the Bible. So I discovered the nag Hammadi scrolls, Gnostic writings, Dead Sea Scrolls, the Book of Enoch and Sepher Yetzirah. And my life was changed. These added to my growth and view of God, rather than diminishing it. God is so much more we could even try to conceive or imagine. But we need to break out of the moulds and limitations forced upon us by a stagnant church.

I can no longer call myself a christian by the standards of the Charismatic / Pentecostal church. But hey! Do I look bothered? I love God. If the Books I mentioned above were good enough for Jesus, they are good enough for me, and no pastor will persuade me otherwise.

The Bible says "My people perish for lack of revelation."

In years to come many others will find the revelation I did and be persuaded to believe. I will help as many as possible to break free from their traditional thinking. I post articles to help people like them see that there is so much more, on my website www.godsfriends.co.uk

It helps to know their teachings and doctrines. I know where they come from, and I can understand their thinking. I have been there too. But God in His wisdom saw fit to show me the way out.

Blessings and peace

Len
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  #23  
Old 05-24-2007, 12:22 PM
Neha Rohra Neha Rohra is offline
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Re: Do you believe in God?

The lord is my true Sheperd.

I believe in God and his eternal goodness.
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Old 05-24-2007, 05:30 PM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

I believe in a higher power.
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Old 05-30-2007, 09:43 AM
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Re: Do you believe in God?

i believe in Gravity!
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