how to read this horary chart?

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Anachiel

Well-known member
The horary chart has an early ASC. There is something about this matter that is premature or a bit off. The ASC ruler also retrograde supports this, particularly since it is Mercury. But, if I may say so, if you don't trust this person you are asking about, why are you with them?

With all good intention I say this; if you are going to have a relationship where you distrust or have reason to distrust the person then, that is not a healthy relationship, unless you have agreements to have a polyamorous or open relationship and can deal with that.

You simply can't go on asking horary chart after horary chart about a person or situation that will not change and/or is not healthy for you. Horary also cannot take the place of someone else's honesty. There is too much room for error to accuse someone of something with a horary.

I think there are other, deeper issues that need to be addressed in this relationship you have sans horary. Perhaps your own feelings need to be acknowledged and addressed regarding what you are sensing. Perhaps what you need is to take more constructive action regarding the matter and move into a more stable and healthy environment or be with more supportive and trustworthy individuals, even if they are simply platonic.
 
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burlinvermon

Well-known member
Anachiel said:
The horary chart has an early ASC. There is something about this matter that is premature or a bit off. The ASC ruler also retrograde supports this, particularly since it is Mercury. But, if I may say so, if you don't trust this person you are asking about, why are you with them?

With all good intention I say this; if you are going to have a relationship where you distrust or have reason to distrust the person then, that is not a healthy relationship, unless you have agreements to have a polyamorous or open relationship and can deal with that.

You simply can't go on asking horary chart after horary chart about a person or situation that will not change and/or is not healthy for you. Horary also cannot take the place of someone else's honesty. There is too much room for error to accuse someone of something with a horary.

I think there are other, deeper issues that need to be addressed in this relationship you have sans horary. Perhaps your own feelings need to be acknowledged and addressed regarding what you are sensing. Perhaps what you need is to take more constructive action regarding the matter and move into a more stable and healthy environment or be with more supportive and trustworthy individuals, even if they are simply platonic.
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i asked the horary to know if he will tell me the truth because i'd want to be with more supportive and truthworthy individuals if he isn't.

do you think he will tell me the truth from the horary chart?
 
A

Anachiel

Well-known member
burlinvermon said:
i asked the horary to know if he will tell me the truth because i'd want to be with more supportive and truthworthy individuals if he isn't.

do you think he will tell me the truth from the horary chart?
Click to expand...


This has been answered to the best of ability as aforementioned above.
 
Culpeper

Culpeper

Premium Member
This is the horary technique board. It is not for interpretation of specific charts. So here is some technique.

First you have only one chance to ask a horary question. The early ascendant indicates that this question may have been asked more than once.

In the chart I am looking at, you are Mercury retrograde and the other party is Jupiter. The condition of both significators is very weak. Look for a traditional aspect between the significators. In this case there is no aspect. Thus the answer to the question is no.
 
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burlinvermon

Well-known member
i found these methods and used them:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41874
Hi - I would look at 3 ruler to test whether the info/promise you've been made is true or false.
It's preferable to have the angles of the chart in Fixed signs and for 1st, 3rd and Moon and Moon's dispositor in Fixed signs too. If these rulers are in angles and in fixed signs they will show solidity.
[You wouldn't take Mercury as a general ruler as you might when asking about documents or papers or letters or emails etc because Mercury is a bit of trickster by nature ... ]

Here, you've got the Moon in Libra, not Fixed. Nor are the angles in Fixed signs - so that's two negatives.
Moon's dispositor is Venus - in Fixed Scorpio - so a 'yes'.
3 ruler is the Sun and has just moved into Scorpio - so this is Fixed and would be a 'yes'.

Another way you could look at it is to see how well dignified the other person is. Saturn, 7 ruler, is exalted so that would seem to be another positive. That would be a total of 3 positives against 2 negatives using the method above. Can I say, you'd rarely get everything positive anyway!

In case you were wondering if you'd use his 3rd, no, you wouldn't - it's your 3rd that is used because it's YOUR info that you're testing - the info that's been given to YOU, not his.

Another planet that could be used is 9 ruler, an indicator of truth or not because there's a kind of prediction in his 'Maybe one day ...' and you can test predictions with 9 ruler or 9th House planets etc. plus the fixity applies again. Here, there's no malefics in the 9th House - so, again, all would seem to be positive. 9 ruler is Saturn disposed by Venus which is in a Fixed sign. We've already established Saturn is in his Exaltation - so positive again. I would judge that when he made you the promise, he was telling the truth.___
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Here, you've got the Moon in aries, not Fixed. Nor are the angles in Fixed signs - so that's two negatives.
Moon's dispositor is mars - not Fixed virgo - so a 'no'.
3 ruler is Fixed and would be a 'yes'.

Another way you could look at it is to see how well dignified the other person is. Saturn, 7 ruler, is exalted so that would seem to be another positive. That would be a total of 2 positives against 3 negatives using the method above.

Another planet that could be used is 9 ruler, an indicator of truth or not because there's a kind of prediction in his 'Maybe one day ...' and you can test predictions with 9 ruler or 9th House planets etc. plus the fixity applies again. Here, there's no malefics in the 9th House - so, again, all would seem to be positive. 9 ruler is Saturn disposed by Venus which is not in a Fixed sign. We've already established Saturn is in his Exaltation - so positive again.

maybe he was being truthful?


If I used "is the rumour true" method.

Look at lord of ascendant = Mercury succadent and fixed
Moon = cadent and in 12th house and mutable sign
depositor of Moon, Mercury
Lot of truth cadent
Ah though, all angles are mutable! Not a good sign for truth.
Click to expand...
Look at lord of ascendant = moon angle and not fixed
Moon = angle and in 10th house and mutable sign
depositor of Moon, mars
Lot of truth cadent
Ah though, all angles are mutable! Not a good sign for truth.

tikana said:
here is an example of rumors

take rumor as 3rd house .. because it is news sort of

Lord of 3rd is the rumor itself.
If lord of 6th house *4th from 3rd* is not aspecting Lord of 3rd - the rumor is false.

Here is 2nd method

In your chart
Mars ruler of 3rd
is NOT aspecting to Jupiter
The rumor is FALSE


GL
T
Click to expand...

take rumor as 3rd house .. because it is news sort of

Lord of 3rd is the rumor itself.
If lord of 6th house *4th from 3rd* is not aspecting Lord of 3rd - the rumor is false.

Here is 2nd method

In your chart
sun ruler of 3rd
is aspecting to Jupiter
The rumor is true


http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35932

To me, the question is a straightforward "is he telling the truth?" matter, so I shall use the Lot of Truth & Falsity as primary significator for delineation of the question:

-HIS Lot of Truth/Falsity (using the sensitive degree of the 7th rather than the ascending degree, because we want to know if HE is telling the truth) = 7th (in this case)+moon-mercury, falls @ 3 Pisces
-his significator (7th house under Aries) = Mars
: Mars flows away from the LOTF = - testimony
: Sun-universal significator of TRUTH-flows away from the LOTF = - testimony
: LOTF posited in chart's cadent 6th house and in HIS cadent 12th house = - testimony

All testimonies regarding the LOTF are -: my delineation is that he was not being truthful in his statement to the querent.
Click to expand...
-his lot of truth/falsity falls @ 5 pisces
-his significator = saturn
saturn flows to the lotf = + testimony
-sun-universal significator of truth flows to the lotf = + testimony
lotf posied in the chart's cadent 9th and in his 3rd(my 9th of truth) = + testimony

he was being truthful?


http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38973

-you = 1st house = Leo = Sun
-he = 7th house = Aquarius = Saturn
Now this question is about his honesty, and how he thinks of you, so we'll center on the signifying houses from HIS (ie the chart's 7th house) perspective:
-you (Sun) are in HIS 7th house of relationships and the SUn is dignified here in its rulership of Leo = + testimony (+ = indication of his honesty)
-you (Sun) flow toward his significator, Saturn
-HIS co-significator, the Moon (following Ibn Ezra here) flows toward you (the Sun) which = + testimony
-his significator, Saturn is posited in HIS 9th house (house of truth and falsity) in its exaltation in Libra = + testimony
-the lord of HIS house of honesty (his 9th house) is Venus; Venus flows toward you (the Sun) and is not combusted (by the combustion degree area I follow) which = + testimony; notice further that Venus is only 9 minutes away from your house (the first house and sign, Leo)
-however, Venus is in a pitted degree (blocked degree) of Cancer which = - testimony, but is within 9 minutes of leaving this pit (notice that you, the Sun, are also in a pitted degree of Leo-this I think shows your doubts, and further I think he realizes your doubts about him-that's his 9th house lord, Venus, in its pitted degree, and it could be that this doubting situation might be a somewhat blocking influence in this developing relationship)
-his "ascending degree" (26 Aquarius) is in a Bright Degree of that sign which = + testimony
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-me = 1st house = moon
-he = 7th house = saturn
-HIS co-significator, the Moon (following Ibn Ezra here) flows away from me (the Sun) which = - testimony
-his significator, Saturn is posited in HIS 10th house and in its exaltation in Libra = + testimony
-the lord of HIS house of honesty (his 9th house) is mercury; mercury flows toward me (the moon) and is combusted = + testimony
-however, mercury is in a pitted degree (blocked degree) which = - testimony
notice that he,saturn, are also in a pitted degree of Libra-this I think shows his doubts, and further I think you realizes his doubts about you-that's his 9th house lord, mercury, in its pitted degree, and it could be that this doubting situation might be a somewhat blocking influence in this developing relationship)

+2 testimonies -2 testimonies maybe he was being truthful?




when will he tell me the truth?
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44495

I'll delineate this using the Lot of Truth (ascendant+moon-mercury) and the Lot of Rectitude (ascendant+mars-mercury)

-"he" = 7th house = Pisces = Jupiter significator
-Lot of Truth falls @ 11 Aquarius
-Lot of Rectitude (seeing and doing what is right) falls @ 7 Gemini
-Lot of Truth is in cadent 6th house = - testimony
-Lot of Rectitude is in angular 10th house (+) but in same sign as disruptive SN (-) so this = net neutral testimony
-"he" (Jupiter) flows away from the Lot of Truth = - testimony
-"he" (Jupiter) flows toward the Lot of Rectitude = + testimony
-Sun (arbiter of Truth) flows toward the Lot of Truth and also toward the Lot of Rectitude = + testimonies
-Lot of Truth falls in a pitted degree of Aquarius = - testimony
-significator of Lot of Truth (Saturn) is in succedent 2nd house (neutral) but in its sign of exaltation (+) = net + testimony
-significator of Lot of Rectitude (Mercury) is in detriment (-) but in angular 4th house (+) = net neutral testimony
Click to expand...
-"he" = 7th house = Pisces = Jupiter significator
-Lot of Truth falls @ 8 Aquarius
-Lot of Rectitude (seeing and doing what is right) falls @ 5 leo
-Lot of Truth is in cadent 6th house = - testimony
-Lot of Rectitude is cadent and in 12th house (-) = - testimony
-"he" (Jupiter) flows away from the Lot of Truth = - testimony
-"he" (Jupiter) flows toward the Lot of Rectitude = + testimony
-Sun (arbiter of Truth) flows away from the Lot of Truth and toward the Lot of Rectitude = + testimony and - testimony
-Lot of Truth falls in an elevated degree of Aquarius = + testimony
-significator of Lot of Truth (Saturn) is in succedent 2nd house (neutral) but in its sign of exaltation (+) and retro = + testimony and - testimony
-significator of Lot of Rectitude (sun) is in exaltion (+) = +testimony

Indications from this result are that this is a toss-up, maybe the truth will be discovered and he will take the right thought and action (rectitude), maybe not.


every method's answer is different??
i didn't find more posts about the future (only dr. farr) when or if he will tell the truth
 
D

dr. farr

Well-known member
I'll say this: when we apply several investigative methods to a particular matter, and we obtain about an equal amount of disparate indications (different answers), it means that the Cosmic influences regarding this matter are in a state of flux, OR are being affected by extra-mundane influences, OR-for some reason which might only be discovered upon investigation of deeper charts (such as progressed or profected natal charts, or investigation into karmic potentials relative to the subject matter)-the answer to the specific horary question is being obfuscated during the current time period of the question.
 
B

burlinvermon

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
I'll say this: when we apply several investigative methods to a particular matter, and we obtain about an equal amount of disparate indications (different answers), it means that the Cosmic influences regarding this matter are in a state of flux, OR are being affected by extra-mundane influences, OR-for some reason which might only be discovered upon investigation of deeper charts (such as progressed or profected natal charts, or investigation into karmic potentials relative to the subject matter)-the answer to the specific horary question is being obfuscated during the current time period of the question.
Click to expand...
can you please look at the charts?

in my did he tell me the truth horary chart,i used two of your methods,one(using the lot of truth/falsity) had 3 positives and 0 negative and the other 2 positives and 2 negatives which i am not sure was accurate because both me(asc) and him(his co-significator) are the moon.

can you please look at my chart(did he tell me the truth) and delineate using your 2 methods? if the answer is that he did tell me the truth,my when will he tell me the truth chart is invalid.

were my calculations of the lot of truth/falsity in my did he tell me the truth accurate?
7th (in this case)+moon-mercury
7th cusp(5 capricorn)+moon(+0 aries)-mercury(0 aquarius)
275+0-300=-25+360=335=5 pisces

is it accurate?

thanks dr. farr
 
D

dr. farr

Well-known member
Your determination of the Lot (5 Pisces) is correct but I would have done the mathematics differently:

Lot of Truth and Falsity = ascendant (in this case the quesited's ascendant) + Moon - Mercury:
-quesited ascendant = 5 Capricorn = 275
-Moon = 0 Aries = 0
-Mercury = 0 Aquarius = 300
so: 275 + 0 = 275 minus 300; this is a negative number so you must add the circle of the zodiac (360) to the first number; therefore 275 + circle of the zodiac (360) = 635 minus 300 = 335 which = 5 Pisces

The Sun (arbiter of truth) flows toward 5 Pisces = +
Quesited significator, Saturn is in a pitted degree (so does not flow either one way or the other) = neutral or, perhaps, -
Significator of the Lot, Jupiter, falls in the 11th whole sign house (friends, Good Spirit, gains) and in an elevated degree of Taurus = + and also is applying to a sextile with the Lot
Lord of HIS (quesited's) 9th house (truth house), Mercury, flows toward the Lot = +

...so by this method (ie Ankara application of the Lot of Truth and Falsity) the probably answer is clearly indicated by the totality of testimonies.
Your significator, the Moon, flows away from the Lot-indicative of your doubts about his veracity.
 
B

burlinvermon

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
Your determination of the Lot (5 Pisces) is correct but I would have done the mathematics differently:

Lot of Truth and Falsity = ascendant (in this case the quesited's ascendant) + Moon - Mercury:
-quesited ascendant = 5 Capricorn = 275
-Moon = 0 Aries = 0
-Mercury = 0 Aquarius = 300
so: 275 + 0 = 275 minus 300; this is a negative number so you must add the circle of the zodiac (360) to the first number; therefore 275 + circle of the zodiac (360) = 635 minus 300 = 335 which = 5 Pisces

The Sun (arbiter of truth) flows toward 5 Pisces = +
Quesited significator, Saturn is in a pitted degree (so does not flow either one way or the other) = neutral or, perhaps, -
Significator of the Lot, Jupiter, falls in the 11th whole sign house (friends, Good Spirit, gains) and in an elevated degree of Taurus = + and also is applying to a sextile with the Lot
Lord of HIS (quesited's) 9th house (truth house), Mercury, flows toward the Lot = +

...so by this method (ie Ankara application of the Lot of Truth and Falsity) the probably answer is clearly indicated by the totality of testimonies.
Your significator, the Moon, flows away from the Lot-indicative of your doubts about his veracity.
Click to expand...
would lotf posited in the chart's cadent 9th and in his 3rd(my 9th of truth) not be + testimony?
using the lot of rectitude (seeing and doing what is right) falls @ 28 leo which is quesited's house of secrets(8th) = - testimony
significator of the lot(sun) is in my 8th = - testimony
saturn(quesited) flows away from the lot = - testimony
Lord of quesited's 9th house (truth house) mercury flows away the lot = -

4 - testimonies ,he was being untruthful?
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is my delineation using the lot of rectitude accurate?

-me = 1st house = moon
-he = 7th house = saturn
-HIS co-significator, the Moon (following Ibn Ezra here) flows away from me (the Sun) which = - testimony
-his significator, Saturn is posited in HIS 10th house and in its exaltation in Libra = + testimony
-the lord of HIS house of honesty (his 9th house) is mercury; mercury flows toward me (the moon) and is combusted = + testimony
-however, mercury is in a pitted degree (blocked degree) which = - testimony
notice that he,saturn, are also in a pitted degree of Libra-this I think shows his doubts, and further I think you realizes his doubts about you-that's his 9th house lord, mercury, in its pitted degree, and it could be that this doubting situation might be a somewhat blocking influence in this developing relationship)
+2 testimonies -2 testimonies maybe he was being truthful?
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is my delineation using the 9th of honesty accurate?

thanks dr. farr
 
D

dr. farr

Well-known member
burlinvermon said:
would lotf posited in the chart's cadent 9th and in his 3rd(my 9th of truth) not be + testimony?
In his 3rd house (communications, his communication) yes this would be + testimony; it being in your 9th would have no bearing since the question was about his telling the truth not you telling the truth

is my delineation using the lot of rectitude accurate?
Yes it is, however the lot of rectitude has nothing to do with the question which was about whether or not he was telling the truth, not whether or not he was doing the right thing (rectitude) so the delineation of the lot of rectitude for this question is not valid


is my delineation using the 9th of honesty accurate?
Yes it is
thanks dr. Farr
Click to expand...


this will be my final post regarding this particular question please do not ask me for any additional information regarding this question or its delineation. Thank you!
 
A

Aquarius358

Well-known member
burlinvermon said:
i have an horary chart which asks:
when will he tell me the truth about his sex experiences with them(2 girls)?

mercury asc
is truth 9th in 1st?

my last horary chart did he tell me the truth?(to verify)
http://alabe.com/cgi-bin/chart/pics/2456022257898.gif
what houses or planets or lots would you use?
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Hi - Received your PM and started to look at these two charts but am a bit confused about the data for them.

The second chart is LATER than the first - so it can't be the second chart "to verify" the first, as you say. Unless you meant the date to be 27 Mar 2012, 20:07pm EDT (daylight time) and you put up the wrong chart.

Did you?

If so, that would be 7 days between your two horaries virtually about the same thing and this is not recommended and will usually confuse you.

I was wondering if what you're wanting to know in that first horary is really, Can I trust him? OR Should I continue (or start) (or end) a relationship with him?

Can you confirm this, yes or no?
Cheers.__________
 
A

Aquarius358

Well-known member
burlinvermon said:
i have an horary chart which asks:
when will he tell me the truth about his sex experiences with them(2 girls)? THIS CHART IS DATED MARCH 2012.

http://alabe.com/cgi-bin/chart/pics/2456023042125.gif
mercury asc
is truth 9th in 1st?
my last horary chart did he tell me the truth?(to verify)
THIS CHART IS DATED JANUARY 2012.
http://alabe.com/cgi-bin/chart/pics/2456023325086.gif
what houses or planets or lots would you use?
Click to expand...

I still think you have worded the 2 gifs the wrong way round - because asking the question "When ..." should be the earlier (January) chart and then the question "Did he ..." would be the 2nd, later (March) chart. Anyway ...

I've read the 20 March chart as "Did he tell me the truth about the 2 girls?" Here's what I find. Hope it helps.

Generally speaking - truth is represented by 9 ruler and, logically, it has to be in pretty good condition which it is here. It should be in a fixed sign too, which will help. Trouble is, you need to determine WHOSE truth it is you're wanting and imagine Truth as a separate entity - kind of like a document or a special communication.

You can use the Arabic Parts or Lots to help - especially the dispositor of the Lot - and in this case the "Lot of Information - whether true or false" as per Al Biruni is the same as Bonatti's Part of Rumours whether they be true or false". BOTH are taken by day or night from Mercury to Moon and projected from the Asc." - viz : ASC+Moon-Mercury.
_______

Did he tell me the truth about the 2 girls?
20 March 2012, 4:23 pm, EDT [ASC 00VI32; MC 23TA41.]

You, as 1 ruler Mercury, are combust - showing you are fearful or overwhelmed by this matter. Because you asked a question in January 2012 about WHEN he would tell you the truth, I presume that somewhere in that 3 month period January - March you confronted him and had words or an argument. (Moon separating from Mars by 3 deg).

The fact that your significator, Mercury is in the 8th House, also underscores your ‘fear or anguish of mind.’ Although you haven’t said as much, I should imagine this question concerns you greatly.
The Sun is in the 8th House too - ie Sun as ruler of the 12th of things hidden from you - is also causing you sorrow.

HE is 7 ruler, Jupiter in Taurus, in your 9th of truth. Moon is partile sextile Jupiter, and then sextiles Venus.

I would take Venus to represent ‘the truth’ in this matter because it rules HIS 9th of HIS truth (and of course your 3rd of information.) My reasoning is that this question is concerned with HIS truth or lie - not yours.

Venus is in excellent condition, in her own Sign and in her own Triplicity. She scores very highly (20 or more) and is the strongest planet in the chart by a long way. Venus - importantly - is in a Fixed Sign, further confirming truth rather than lies. Moon is aspecting Jupiter, also in Taurus, a Fixed Sign and then Venus which is another confirmation. It would seem that the Truth is very strong here.

What about its relation to HIM? RECEPTION gives us the answer. Venus receives Jupiter and Jupiter receives Venus - with mixed reception. Jupiter receives Venus by Term and Venus receives Jupiter by Sign and Triplicity. This reception confirms his truth-telling rather than otherwise.

Neither Moon nor Mercury apply to Saturn, ruler of HIS 12th of secrets and lies and also natural significator of lies. Also, Rx Saturn is separating from the ASC - NOT applying to it - suggesting that the lies are moving away from you and your life. There is no reception between Jupiter and Saturn to speak of and no aspect between them either. This lack of aspects and reception again comes down on the side of truth here, not lies.

Moon has just separated from a sextile with Pluto - suggesting that just prior to this question, something had come to light - some information or knowledge had been passed on to you. Also Moon has just prior to that separated from a debilitated Mars in the 1st House, suggesting an argument had taken place. Mars also rules HIS 3rd - of information and is not essentially dignified being Rx but does have some accidental dignity by being in the 1st House.

I realise this chart has 00VI32’ on the ASC, but because it describes the situation so very clearly - in many ways - it is reasonable to proceed with great caution which I’ve taken, I believe.

Lastly, Deb Houlding (Skyscript.co.uk) has written that a badly afflicted 3rd House can indicate lies. In this chart, HIS 3rd House is not badly afflicted because it contains both the benefics - Jupiter and Venus - and even though your 3rd has a Rx Saturn in it, Saturn is still exalted there in Libra.

Overall, I would judge YES to your question, Did he tell me the truth? _____
 
B

burlinvermon

Well-known member
Aquarius358 said:
I still think you have worded the 2 gifs the wrong way round - because asking the question "When ..." should be the earlier (January) chart and then the question "Did he ..." would be the 2nd, later (March) chart. Anyway ...

I've read the 20 March chart as "Did he tell me the truth about the 2 girls?" Here's what I find. Hope it helps.

Generally speaking - truth is represented by 9 ruler and, logically, it has to be in pretty good condition which it is here. It should be in a fixed sign too, which will help. Trouble is, you need to determine WHOSE truth it is you're wanting and imagine Truth as a separate entity - kind of like a document or a special communication.

You can use the Arabic Parts or Lots to help - especially the dispositor of the Lot - and in this case the "Lot of Information - whether true or false" as per Al Biruni is the same as Bonatti's Part of Rumours whether they be true or false". BOTH are taken by day or night from Mercury to Moon and projected from the Asc." - viz : ASC+Moon-Mercury.
_______

Did he tell me the truth about the 2 girls?
20 March 2012, 4:23 pm, EDT [ASC 00VI32; MC 23TA41.]

You, as 1 ruler Mercury, are combust - showing you are fearful or overwhelmed by this matter. Because you asked a question in January 2012 about WHEN he would tell you the truth, I presume that somewhere in that 3 month period January - March you confronted him and had words or an argument. (Moon separating from Mars by 3 deg).

The fact that your significator, Mercury is in the 8th House, also underscores your ‘fear or anguish of mind.’ Although you haven’t said as much, I should imagine this question concerns you greatly.
The Sun is in the 8th House too - ie Sun as ruler of the 12th of things hidden from you - is also causing you sorrow.

HE is 7 ruler, Jupiter in Taurus, in your 9th of truth. Moon is partile sextile Jupiter, and then sextiles Venus.

I would take Venus to represent ‘the truth’ in this matter because it rules HIS 9th of HIS truth (and of course your 3rd of information.) My reasoning is that this question is concerned with HIS truth or lie - not yours.

Venus is in excellent condition, in her own Sign and in her own Triplicity. She scores very highly (20 or more) and is the strongest planet in the chart by a long way. Venus - importantly - is in a Fixed Sign, further confirming truth rather than lies. Moon is aspecting Jupiter, also in Taurus, a Fixed Sign and then Venus which is another confirmation. It would seem that the Truth is very strong here.

What about its relation to HIM? RECEPTION gives us the answer. Venus receives Jupiter and Jupiter receives Venus - with mixed reception. Jupiter receives Venus by Term and Venus receives Jupiter by Sign and Triplicity. This reception confirms his truth-telling rather than otherwise.

Neither Moon nor Mercury apply to Saturn, ruler of HIS 12th of secrets and lies and also natural significator of lies. Also, Rx Saturn is separating from the ASC - NOT applying to it - suggesting that the lies are moving away from you and your life. There is no reception between Jupiter and Saturn to speak of and no aspect between them either. This lack of aspects and reception again comes down on the side of truth here, not lies.

Moon has just separated from a sextile with Pluto - suggesting that just prior to this question, something had come to light - some information or knowledge had been passed on to you. Also Moon has just prior to that separated from a debilitated Mars in the 1st House, suggesting an argument had taken place. Mars also rules HIS 3rd - of information and is not essentially dignified being Rx but does have some accidental dignity by being in the 1st House.

I realise this chart has 00VI32’ on the ASC, but because it describes the situation so very clearly - in many ways - it is reasonable to proceed with great caution which I’ve taken, I believe.

Lastly, Deb Houlding (Skyscript.co.uk) has written that a badly afflicted 3rd House can indicate lies. In this chart, HIS 3rd House is not badly afflicted because it contains both the benefics - Jupiter and Venus - and even though your 3rd has a Rx Saturn in it, Saturn is still exalted there in Libra.

Overall, I would judge YES to your question, Did he tell me the truth? _____
Click to expand...
i asked "did he.." earlier(january) chart because i wanted to know if he did tell me the truth and then i asked" when.."later (march) chart because i thought the horary chart "did he.." was a "no", he didn't tell me the truth

but you've read the 20 march chart as "did he..", would your answer still be that he will tell me the truth? when?

or is "did he.."(january) chart a "yes" ,he did tell me the truth? and "when.." is invalid?

it helps, thanks.
 
A

Aquarius358

Well-known member
burlinvermon said:
i asked "did he.." earlier(january) chart because i wanted to know if he did tell me the truth and then i asked" when.."later (march) chart because i thought the horary chart "did he.." was a "no", he didn't tell me the truth

but you've read the 20 march chart as "did he..", would your answer still be that he will tell me the truth? when? What do you think, having read my delineation carefully?

or is "did he.."(january) chart a "yes" ,he did tell me the truth? and "when.." is invalid?

it helps, thanks.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry but you can't ask a horary question in order to verify an earlier horary. That's like asking Does Horary work? or something similar. It makes a mockery of the whole Art of Horary Astrology, I'm afraid. I'm not being harsh here - just pointing this out to you in case you weren't aware of it.

Your gif for the first chart shows a MARCH chart. Fact.

Your gif for the 2nd chart shows a JANUARY chart.

I'm sorry but I'm at a loss to understand how a January chart can be "verifying" a March chart - it's completely beyond me! It just doesn't make any sense at all.

I've had a look at the March chart because it is the latest one and because (I'm repeating myself here!) you can't ask a question to see if the answer you got in the last question is correct! We'd all go bonkers if we did that!!

You want to know if he's told you the truth or not and because this is important I've given the Truth its own signification. Venus. But, y'know, you give very little information and this makes it difficult to understand what the background is. For instance, we have no idea if HE has spoken to you about these 2 girls or not! We can only PRESUME that he has, because you asked a future tense question and a past tense question.

I'm happy to discuss/argue points I've raised in my delineation of the March chart. ________
 
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tikana

tikana

Well-known member
Hi to anyone who cares,

i think there is fundamental problem with actual clarity phrasing a question.

what is person trying to ask? will the other tell the truth? i wouldnt read them

Both charts are fatigued and vague

I would straight out ask would have been in 1st chart.
Will he tell me the truth? and go from there

There is no need for 2nd question.

I know horary requires clarity .. i know sometimes i have a problem asking that is why Lilly writes meditate before asking any questions.

u have 2 considerations against judgements in 1st chart
I would read the chart still IF it had been properly phrased.
SOOO
Early asce - question asked prematurly without thinking - DUH look at the question
Then you have Mars in 1st house - nothing but aggitation
Then you have Neptune too close to desc
what does this tell us - is he lying? or is there somethign else going on?
Then we have Mercury which rules questor
it is in REALLY bad shape
Merc is in 8th house - anxiety worry
Conj Uranus
I would straight out decline until the questor has phrased a question differently


Just 2 cents on the issue
T
 
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B

burlinvermon

Well-known member
Aquarius358 said:
I'm sorry but you can't ask a horary question in order to verify an earlier horary. That's like asking Does Horary work? or something similar. It makes a mockery of the whole Art of Horary Astrology, I'm afraid. I'm not being harsh here - just pointing this out to you in case you weren't aware of it.

Your gif for the first chart shows a MARCH chart. Fact.

Your gif for the 2nd chart shows a JANUARY chart.

I'm sorry but I'm at a loss to understand how a January chart can be "verifying" a March chart - it's completely beyond me! It just doesn't make any sense at all.

I've had a look at the March chart because it is the latest one and because (I'm repeating myself here!) you can't ask a question to see if the answer you got in the last question is correct! We'd all go bonkers if we did that!!

You want to know if he's told you the truth or not and because this is important I've given the Truth its own signification. Venus. But, y'know, you give very little information and this makes it difficult to understand what the background is. For instance, we have no idea if HE has spoken to you about these 2 girls or not! We can only PRESUME that he has, because you asked a future tense question and a past tense question.

I'm happy to discuss/argue points I've raised in my delineation of the March chart. ________
Click to expand...
misunderstandings, mercury was retro.

he has spoken to me about these 2 girls and i asked the horary question(january) after that and asked whether he told me the truth or not

then i asked" when will he tell me the truth"later (march) chart because i thought the horary chart "whether he told me the truth or not" was a "no", he didn't tell me the truth

thanks

I would straight out ask would have been in 1st chart.
Will he tell me the truth? and go from there

There is no need for 2nd question.
Click to expand...
i asked that in my 2nd question which is invalid if 1st question(january) is a "yes", he did tell me the truth.
1st chart i asked whether he told me the truth or not

thanks
 
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