Did Aliens take flight 370

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
You and your grumpy friend decided it was speculation, not me.

Provide evidence of Alien Abduction :smile:
You know nothing about my motives.
According to ancient astrological texts, your motives are assessed by viewing the chart you used on the OP, if anyone is interested
I will not be receiving any more messages from this board. We're done. As a parting gift, here's the chart I just pulled up to see if I should close my AW account. I know it's too soon to tell, but perhaps you can see how glorious you have been. I am out of here.
As I explained earlier
I'm an Horary student
not an expert
and am simply quoting Horary rules based on common sense
 

junoisuppose

Well-known member
Hi,

I know you did not mean to offend and it is just an exercise in learning, but if you don't really believe in your heart that aliens might have taken the flight then the chart will not give you an accurate answer because at the time you asked the question you were probably thinking something else like 'Where is the plane?' or 'Are all the people on board dead?' even 'Can astrology really give me an answer?'. A horary works best for an answer that you really want to know. Also horaries work best from the first moment we have considered the question, and since it has been on the news for days you have probably been thinking about it for ages, not only at the specific time you cast this chart.

The birth data for the flight are on another thread - 'Did they land in the sea?'

P.S. Don't be disheartened by people being grumpy. Comments often sound much harsher than they were meant over the medium of the internet.
 
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junoisuppose

Well-known member
P.P.S. Regarding the chart you drew up about whether or not you should leave - yes you've got mars in the 3rd house of communication, but you've got jupiter in the 11th which says to me knowledgeable people in this group, and neptune in the 7th - you are relating to kind, if somewhat difficult to read, people, plus the significator mercury is there conjunct the 7th, although once it goes into pisces it will be in detriment I'm afraid and it will be difficult for you to express your ideas to these people.

Just my opinion on the chart, not my opinion of the forum (although perhaps slightly influenced by my experiences here).
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Meanwhile, here's an analysis of the event chart posted elsewhere
After looking at the event chart (of the final sighting) i don't see a "death pattern" forming for the subject (Saturn) using Luleys approach, eg. 8th house ruler in the 1st, 4th or 12th houses...etc. So, perhaps the passengers on the plane survived the attack.

From the chart, it appears that the pilot took the action he did to fulfill a desire or a wish (11th house ruler Mars in 10th). Perhaps he was promised a substantial pay out or freedom? But from looking at the chart, it appears more likely that unfortunately for the pilot, he may not have survived...

As to the question "why hijack this flight?" There are some interesting reports circulating on the internet about a new, superconductor type of technology patent which was to be released and owned by 4 of the passengers on the missing plane. The final and only surviving owner of the new patent would then be the company itself
.
Some basic horary advice from someone more practiced follows
Hi,

I know you did not mean to offend
and it is just an exercise in learning,
but if you don't really believe in your heart that aliens might have taken the flight
then the chart will not give you an accurate answer
because at the time you asked the question
you were probably thinking something else
like 'Where is the plane?' or 'Are all the people on board dead?' even 'Can astrology really give me an answer?'.



A horary works best for an answer that you really want to know. Also horaries work best from the first moment we have considered the question, and since it has been on the news for days you have probably been thinking about it for ages, not only at the specific time you cast this chart.


The birth data for the flight are on another thread - 'Did they land in the sea?'

P.S. Don't be disheartened by people being grumpy.

Comments often sound much harsher than they were meant over the medium of the internet.
link to Horary thread DID THEY LAND IN THE SEA? http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?p=542403#post542403 :smile:
 

Ebenia

Well-known member
Why are people on this forum SO mean to each other? Seriously! It seems like every astrologer that comes on this forum has a deep fear of being ridiculed so they are so over protective and over analytical and so OVERLY serious that is goes to the extremes and then it is NOT anymore about astrology but personal issues. I really wish that if someone makes a question on this forum, we could at least talk about it in a nice sense and provide clarity for another and not evil marks. For me, when I started to learn about astrology, it was all about INTEREST and FUN. Where did astrology become so serious that we need to make it into an extension of our egos and start being "right" and start making a huge deal of RULES and REGULATIONS? I seriously don't understand why many of you even come to this forum if your only motivation is to correct people and feel righteousness. Astrology is primarly a tool for UNDERSTANDING and we as astrologers should GUIDE (not PUSH or RIDICULE) people into further and deeper understanding.

I think this is an interesting question and iit would be interesting to think about this. It is good to keep an open mind. I dont personally think it is probable that they were taken by aliens, but I am not saying that they weren't. This universe is full of mysteries and things we know nothing about and most of it is because we are so deep seated in our own viewpoints that for new ideas to arise, we need generations to die before new ideas reach consciousness.

About the chart:

Moon is in the 4th house and to me that is a house of home, roots but in this case also Earth (our larger home). I think there is nothing in the chart that would indicate aliens in this case. Note worthy: Jupiter is on the ascendant, so I think the question asker definitely has good on his/her mind.
 
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junoisuppose

Well-known member
Why are people on this forum SO mean to each other? Seriously! It seems like every astrologer that comes on this forum has a deep fear of being ridiculed so they are so over protective and over analytical and so OVERLY serious that is goes to the extremes and then it is NOT anymore about astrology but personal issues. I really wish that if someone makes a question on this forum, we could at least talk about it in a nice sense and provide clarity for another and not evil marks. For me, when I started to learn about astrology, it was all about INTEREST and FUN. Where did astrology become so serious that we need to make it into an extension of our egos and start being "right" and start making a huge deal of RULES and REGULATIONS? I seriously don't understand why many of you even come to this forum if your only motivation is to correct people and feel righteousness. Astrology is primarly a tool for UNDERSTANDING and we as astrologers should GUIDE (not PUSH or RIDICULE) people into further and deeper understanding.

While I agree with you that it is better if people are nice and polite to each other, perhaps we can use astrology to find the answer to why people are the way they are. In the chart that Pelargo put up about whether he/she should leave there is Jupiter in the 11th. Jupiter can be pompous and overbearing and use humour to teach. It might seem that people are trying to feel self-righteous, perhaps some even are, but Jupiter's motivation is to learn and to teach, it can just sometimes be a bit tactless about how it does so, not considering other people's feelings in the greater quest for knowledge and truth. Also saturn is on the 4th squaring the significator of the querent. Initially I thought "Oh that means that he/she is definitely leaving then. " Kind of what he/she said - this is the end of the thread, but perhaps also it is what you said about rules and regulations, and the querent not liking that rigidity. :unsure:
 

junoisuppose

Well-known member
I think this is an interesting question and iit would be interesting to think about this. It is good to keep an open mind. I dont personally think it is probable that they were taken by aliens, but I am not saying that they weren't. This universe is full of mysteries and things we know nothing about and most of it is because we are so deep seated in our own viewpoints that for new ideas to arise, we need generations to die before new ideas reach consciousness.

OK, this is true too.
So if we're looking at the original chart, I think, and this is just my personal opinion, the significator for the plane would be the sun, ruler of the third house of air travel (although I have seen posts by others suggesting that we should use the 9th house as this is international travel not short range travel), I think aliens would be signified by the 9th (foreign to us), and while the traditional ruler of Aquarius is saturn I use modern rulers too, so I'll use uranus, also uranus fits much better with aliens than saturn (I guess, never having personally met any). Although saturn is trine the sun, there is no aspect between he sun and uranus so no I do not think there was contact between aliens and the plane.
The sun is in the 10th in pisces. To me that says it is in a public place, in the open, and in the sea (pisces). Of course pisces could signify other things too, a country that is ruled by pisces for example, even a small island surrounded by the sea, but the most likely thing, in my opinion, is that it is in water.
As for who or what is responsible, well there is an inconjunct between the sun and mars, and saturn trine the sun in scorpio. That might give us some clues as to who or what took the plane.
But the chart is not clear or easy for me to read. I am not 100% sure which house to use for the plane, and I don't know which house aliens would be ruled by, although I like your idea of using the 4th as our home the earth.
 

junoisuppose

Well-known member
I did not mean my post to sound pompous or self-righteous. (I have mercury in leo, jupiter conjunct moon, jupiter in the 9th trine ascendant and sextile the sun so perhaps I do come across that way?) That is just what I have heard about horaries. It is possible that the people who I heard that from were incorrect. I could have prefaced my comment with "This is what I have heard."
 

tikana

Well-known member
OF COURSE they did. just look at it Merc will trine jupiter .. merc the passengers changing signs *changing galaxies* on their way to meet the rest of the aliens. Notice that merc will go into a silent sign - all water signs are unable to speak so yepp that must be it!
they dont speak alien language,,

regards
 
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ashriia

Well-known member
Why are people on this forum SO mean to each other?

Astrology is primarly a tool for UNDERSTANDING and we as astrologers should GUIDE (not PUSH or RIDICULE) people into further and deeper understanding.

I think this is an interesting question and iit would be interesting to think about this. It is good to keep an open mind. I dont personally think it is probable that they were taken by aliens, but I am not saying that they weren't. This universe is full of mysteries and things we know nothing about and most of it is because we are so deep seated in our own viewpoints that for new ideas to arise, we need generations to die before new ideas reach consciousness.

I completely agree with you on this Ebenia.

The OP seemed to have been completely serious in asking this question. If it went against horary rules, then that should simply have been explained and stated and left at that. Unfortunately the word "aliens" brought much of the dismissive comments and personal prejudices. Had the OP replaced that word than i am sure there wouldn't have been the type of bullying this user received.

there is so much in this universe that is mysterious to us. and it's arrogant to think we are the only Life forms in the entire universe! Even
astrophysicists are funded to research the possibility of life on other planets. If they called that looking for aliens they wouldn't receive a dime. but change that to "life" and all is kosher.

I certainly empathize with the people affected by this tragedy, and find the whole thing very sad. But I have wondered myself if something "unexplainable" occured to them. And I am quite sure alot of other people have had this thought cross their minds as well.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Why are people on this forum SO mean to each other? Seriously! It seems like every astrologer that comes on this forum has a deep fear of being ridiculed so they are so over protective and over analytical and so OVERLY serious that is goes to the extremes and then it is NOT anymore about astrology but personal issues. I really wish that if someone makes a question on this forum, we could at least talk about it in a nice sense and provide clarity for another and not evil marks. For me, when I started to learn about astrology, it was all about INTEREST and FUN.

Where did astrology become so serious that we need to make it into an extension of our egos and start being "right" and start making a huge deal of RULES and REGULATIONS?
Horary is a particular branch of Astrology that has strict rules
those rules are necessary in order for Horary technique to be workable
and informing the OP of these factors is not 'being mean to each other'
but in fact being helpful

The OP is clearly unaware of Horary rules
and to suggest that rules are unnecessary because they spoil the fun
shows that the level of interest is for 'fun'
and
asking Horary questions 'for fun'
automatically invalidates those questions
:smile:

Regarding INTEREST and FUN certainly astrologers find Horary interesting and fun
however
on this occasion the question concerns a major tragedy affecting the families and friends of many hundreds of people
and as such an element of respect is required

Including respect for Horary Rules

I seriously don't understand why many of you even come to this forum if your only motivation is to correct people and feel righteousness.
Ours is a learning forum
and we all learn from each other
obviously it is necessary therefore to explain to those who do not know the Horary Rules
The precise nature of those Horary Rules

Astrology is primarly a tool for UNDERSTANDING and we as astrologers should GUIDE (not PUSH or RIDICULE) people into further and deeper understanding.
Horary astrology in particular is a tool to find definite answers to definite questions

Serious questions
Definite answers

As such, serious rules are necessarily adhered to

I think this is an interesting question and iit would be interesting to think about this. It is good to keep an open mind. I dont personally think it is probable that they were taken by aliens, but I am not saying that they weren't. This universe is full of mysteries and things we know nothing about and most of it is because we are so deep seated in our own viewpoints that for new ideas to arise, we need generations to die before new ideas reach consciousness.
Your comment simply highlights that the OP's question is not an Horary question
but instead a Hot Topic discussion question
'regarding new ideas arising to consciousness'

Horary astrology is not intended as speculation
but as a tool for gaining definitive answers
to serious questions

About the chart:

Moon is in the 4th house and to me that is a house of home, roots but in this case also Earth (our larger home). I think there is nothing in the chart that would indicate aliens in this case. Note worthy: Jupiter is on the ascendant, so I think the question asker definitely has good on his/her mind
.
That is an exceedingly brief analysis with little substance
I completely agree with you on this Ebenia.

The OP seemed to have been completely serious in asking this question. If it went against horary rules, then that should simply have been explained and stated and left at that
.
That was explained but the OP took exception
Hi,
I know you did not mean to offend and it is just an exercise in learning, but if you don't really believe in your heart that aliens might have taken the flight then the chart will not give you an accurate answer because at the time you asked the question you were probably thinking something else like 'Where is the plane?' or 'Are all the people on board dead?' even 'Can astrology really give me an answer?'. A horary works best for an answer that you really want to know.
i.e. Horary has rules
Including strictures against idle speculation
....Unfortunately the word "aliens" brought much of the dismissive comments and personal prejudices. Had the OP replaced that word than i am sure there wouldn't have been the type of bullying this user received
An accusation of bullying is a serious one
To say this person was bullied
simply because members told them that possible Alien abduction of the flight is considered as idle speculation
in the realms of Horary astrology
simply highlights your own bias


.....there is so much in this universe that is mysterious to us. and it's arrogant to think we are the only Life forms in the entire universe! Even
astrophysicists are funded to research the possibility of life on other planets. If they called that looking for aliens they wouldn't receive a dime. but change that to "life" and all is kosher.

I certainly empathize with the people affected by this tragedy, and find the whole thing very sad. But I have wondered myself if something "unexplainable" occured to them. And I am quite sure alot of other people have had this thought cross their minds as well
.
The OP posted a controversial question on the possible alien abduction of flight 370
a story making headlines currently internationally

No reputable media outlet has thus far even suggested that 'Aliens' could have been responsible for the unexplained disappearance of the flight
Clearly the idea is speculative

Interesting certainly,
but idle speculation
and therefore unsuitable for Horary practice
 

junoisuppose

Well-known member
My two cents' worth:

When I read through this thread I didn't think the OP had been bullied but I can see how he/she came to that conclusion and thought that he/she was being got at. Words can be taken in more than one way. I actually thought Zarathu's comments about aliens without green cards was laugh out loud funny, witty and very well suited to the situation.

Unfortunately once people feel they have been shamed they start throwing accusations back and then it all quickly gets out of hand from there - on both sides.

Different people will have different opinions about whether things are appropriate, and when it was pointed out to the OP that this event involved people who had lost loved ones and are still wondering where they are he/she offered to take it down but was unable to do so. It is a serious event and given that it is highly unlikely that aliens exist it is almost laughable to suggest that they were involved, however I do understand that there are a few people in this world who genuinely believe that other life forms from other planets have come to ours.

I don't really think that there are rules to horaries. There are rules in the sense that we look at this house and which planet rules this house and whether it is strong or weak and what sort of aspects it is making etc but I use modern planets so that is 'against the rules' for a start.

I wasn't trying to say that he/she wasn't following the rules. What I was trying to say was that the chart probably wouldn't give a clear answer because that is very probably not the question that he/she really had in their mind/heart at the time of asking.

But that is just my opinion, which everyone is free to disagree with.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
My two cents' worth:

When I read through this thread I didn't think the OP had been bullied but I can see how he/she came to that conclusion and thought that he/she was being got at. Words can be taken in more than one way. I actually thought Zarathu's comments about aliens without green cards was laugh out loud funny, witty and very well suited to the situation.

Unfortunately once people feel they have been shamed they start throwing accusations back and then it all quickly gets out of hand from there - on both sides.

Different people will have different opinions about whether things are appropriate, and when it was pointed out to the OP that this event involved people who had lost loved ones and are still wondering where they are he/she offered to take it down but was unable to do so. It is a serious event and given that it is highly unlikely that aliens exist it is almost laughable to suggest that they were involved, however I do understand that there are a few people in this world who genuinely believe that other life forms from other planets have come to ours.

I don't really think that there are rules to horaries. There are rules in the sense that we look at this house and which planet rules this house and whether it is strong or weak and what sort of aspects it is making etc but I use modern planets so that is 'against the rules' for a start.

I wasn't trying to say that he/she wasn't following the rules. What I was trying to say was that the chart probably wouldn't give a clear answer because that is very probably not the question that he/she really had in their mind/heart at the time of asking.

But that is just my opinion, which everyone is free to disagree with.
Horary astrology has very definite rules :smile:

FREE HORARY ASTROLOGY TUTORIAL from well known Horary expert Deborah Houlding
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/horary_intro.html
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
& it was Ashriia who said the OP was being bullied not me.
Fair enough - the OP said they 'felt bullied' however obviously everyone reacts differently on a learning forum
Some are willing to learn
and are interested when astrological rules are mentioned
others are not

and that's individual choice :smile:
 

junoisuppose

Well-known member
Horary astrology has very definite rules :smile:

FREE HORARY ASTROLOGY TUTORIAL from well known Horary expert Deborah Houlding
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/horary_intro.html

My problem with rules, in whatever sphere of life they appear in, is that they are authoritarian and demanding - "You must do this!" With no room for alteration or additions.

At least when we have rules in countries we can change them by changing our governments (if we are lucky enough to live in a democracy).

I prefer consensus.

By the way I have sun square uranus and saturn square uranus in my chart :smile:
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
My problem with rules, in whatever sphere of life they appear in, is that they are authoritarian and demanding - "You must do this!" With no room for alteration or additions.

A few current rules
that could of course change :smile:
are as follows


Planet Earth takes 365.256363 days to orbit our Sun once.
Currently Planet Earth must do this. That's a rule.

Another rule is that while orbiting the Sun, our planet Earth travels at approximately 60,000 miles per hour.
Currently Planet Earth must do this

Another rule is that the Sun itself is traveling at approximately 40,000 miles per hour.
Currently, Sun must do this

Those are a few of the rules that govern the creation of planetary positions in astrological charts.

Rules are everywhere
:smile:
At least when we have rules in countries we can change them by changing our governments (if we are lucky enough to live in a democracy).

I prefer consensus.

By the way I have sun square uranus and saturn square uranus in my chart
:smile:
From my observation, changing governments has no effect on the rules
i.e. that one per cent of the population owns the other ninety nine percent of the population


So Sun and Saturn are possibly conjunct
or Sun and Saturn are possibly square
or Sun and Saturn are possibly opposing
or....
 

tsmall

Premium Member
Well, the OP removed himself from the thread and presumably from the forum.

Without going back and quoting people, here are some thoughts about this chart, this thread, and people's feelings.

Regarding the chart...it really wouldn't matter if someone wanted to discover if aliens abducted the plane (although it does seem as if the news outlets are beginning to have evidence that the plane was hijacked); casting a horary chart for this type of event isn't the way to go. As has already been pointed out on several of the threads here at AW about the flight, as well as on the many, many other astrology forums out there.

Let's just use a bit of logic here. Imagine that every astrologer decided at some point over the last several days to query the Universe and cast a chart about this plane. How many charts, with how many ascendants, would we end up with? Too many. That is why we use an event chart for these matters, as Zarathu has already done on another thread. I personally am not in possession of enough time (I have other charts working) or interest, but if I did I would want to look at the chart from the moment the flight took off, and possibly compare it to a chart for the moment the plane disappeared from radar.

The OP stated a desire to learn horary, and to use this chart to do so. A mistake, for certain, but having that pointed out is not a reason to abruptly pull out of a forum in a huff after stating that believing in astrology was on par with believing in aliens and choosing to decide his/her fellowship after the responses of two members. I'm sorry, but that is the behavoir of someone who is either too sensitive to be on a forum, or someone who is looking to create trouble. Just my own opinion/experience.

Lilly himself did at least once cast a chart to determine the fate of an overdue ship. The difference between this (and any other curiousity chart) is the the querent in that case had a vested interest in the ship. So in the case of the missing plane, if a family member of one of the passengers or crew went to an astrologer to discover the fate of the flight, that chart would be valid. Otherwise. NO.

To speak to gentleness. This is an internet forum. Again in my own opinion, if you are too sensitive to participate then it is perfectly fine to chose not to do so. You (as in the generic you) are going to be exposed to opinions you don't like or agree with, to people who are not always terrific at communicating, to people who are using a language that is not native to them, to people who only have an ax to grind, to people who genuniely want to help but come from the school of tough love...here is my adivce. Grow a thicker skin, build a bridge and get over it. Astrologers come in all shapes and sizes. Some are looking for and in agreement with the kumbaya idea that every idea/opinion expressed has merit and should weigh the same; some believe that astrology needs to have structure and meaning otherwise it lacks value. Above all, astrologers are people. People have great moments and not so great moments. And as much as we would like to think we are the only ones who are allowed to have those not so great moments and yet still should expect everyone else to behave or react perfectly in accordance to the "gentleness" and teaching spirit and whatever else has been expressed here...

You are living in a glass house. Unless you yourself are perfect, it isn't kind or gentle or even terribly realistic for you to expect perfection from others.

This thread: Was posted in the horary forum, and every single post that does not pertain to horary or the chart is completely off topic and against the rules of the AW horary forum. Including mine. I understand that there are many ways to read horary charts (I don't agree with them, but then I am a traditional astrologer) but there are also rules to posting here that ought to be observed. Not that they always are. Some of those rules pertain to the forums in which we are posting, some of them pertain to the way we are to behave when posting. If the behavior breaks those rules, it is within the bounds of members to point it out. If the moderators choose, they will become involved. If you don't like the rules...well. That would be part of the problem, right?
 

Tessie

Banned
This post is written in hope that someone actually willing to answer the OP question may use their expertese to do so. I too am genuinely interesed whether the original question has been a factor in this disappearance.

For the record, just because linguistic graduates in the the media, who write for sensationalism, speculate that something is not true does not have any relation whatsoever to objective phenomena in the universe. There may be no proof that aliens exist but there is also no proof that aliens do not exist (and, no, I do not wish to get into a debate about it here). Thus casting the question as invalid on the assumption they do not exist is logically falacious.

As to horary being a method for definite questions and definite answers, this is a definite question. The OP has said they were not taking the issue for a joke. As for definite answers, there have been questions asking whether people have cast black magic spells on them and received a definite answer by those who have more definitive expertese in reading such charts.

If this is a learning, and not a debate, forum and posters are sceptical about the issue then it is a common courtesy to watch the thread and learn from those more experienced rather than turning the thread into a rediculing debate.
 

Zarathu

Account Closed
HORARY doesn't just answer any question, there are specific requirements of the question.

And the question is a kind of birth chart. Each question is a pregnant moment in time like just like your birth. You cannot be born more than once in the same body without dying in between. This is how astrology works. Its based on birth times that are singular for the person, the corporation, the event, and the question.

If the question can be asked by a multiple numbers of people, then it means that the question will have multiple birth times. We understand as professional astrologers that a time difference of as much a 10 minutes can make the diagnostic of the chart totally wrong. What about multiple birth times for the question over day and weeks? Which question is the correct one???

Think this through. Horary Questions are the same as a birth times for a human being; that's why they work.

The question has to be something very very special to the person who asks it, and it has to be a question that no one else would ask.

This is the way Horary works. Otherwise there would be multiple birth times for the same item, which is simply not allowed anywhere in astrology. Having multiple birth times for a question negates the validation of birth times for all of astrology.
 
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