how to interpret mother in child's natal?

well, as i am completely amateur in reading charts and very overwhelmed by all of the information i see here and elsewhere, i was wondering if some kind person could help me make sense of my son's (seemingly) burdened chart.

it seems he has some nasty squares (sun/saturn, venus/saturn, moon/venus etc.) that indicate problems with parents-especially his mother (that would be me), developing an integrated psychology and self-esteem and feeling unconditionally loved.

i would simply hate to know that we will be the cause of so much damage!!! is there any other interpretation?

i thought all charts had hard aspects, but when i compare his to that of others, i see that he really does have a lot of challenging factors, and so many of them stem from childhood "conditioning".

his fourth house is also packed full of planets, so i feel whatever happens "at home" will be inescapably significant.- i am a double pisces (scorpio decan) with very sensitive feelings and intuitions and i have always felt "in tune" with my son. it surprises me that my emotional nature will affect him negatively.

please help!!

Soluna, would it be possible for you to upload a chart please? It is so much easier for everyone to comment on, otherwise we all have to do it at home and not everyone wants to put up charts of others in this forum. Just their own. This link will help you, it is really easy. Thanks.

Sticky: Attaching Chart as a Thumbnail! ( 1 2)

Starlink

oops, sorry Starlink

here (hopefully) are the two charts

Soluna,

I took a look at your son's chart, and I think that the challenging influence of the aspects you are concerned about is rather weak. The orbs are set too wide. That Moon-Saturn conjunction is 9* and is separating, Moon's square to his Scorpio Venus and Jupiter is also questionable. The closest square is with Jupiter, but it is 6* wide and separating.

thank you so much... it looked so hard. i do admit to having to "wear the pants" and be the more authoritative one when it comes to discipline and order, so i can see how there may be some of that coloring his chart. strange as it is really not "inherent" in me to be that way, at least as far as i can tell in my chart. saturn and i don't usually get along, but i am trying to learn my lessons.

i am the stronger parental figure simply because my husband is a weaker influence when it comes to asserting rules and authority (and i was counting on his cap sun to pitch in).

that brings me to my last nagging worry: what about the sun/saturn and venus/saturn squares. are they also weak? so sorry to ask a redundant question if that's the case.

iwonder said:

Soluna,

I took a look at your son's chart, and I think that the challenging influence of the aspects you are concerned about is rather weak. The orbs are set too wide. That Moon-Saturn conjunction is 9* and is separating, Moon's square to his Scorpio Venus and Jupiter is also questionable. The closest square is with Jupiter, but it is 6* wide and separating.

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The orbs allowed for sun and moon are 10' so 9' is acceptable in my book.

Your suns are in trine easy empathy energy, your jupiters are trine also. The synastry seems ok. He does have Sun,venus square saturn. Saturn in 2nd house of values, beliefs and how you earn your money-- I have seen this develop into a 'fear of poverty' whereby to compensate they work extra hard

Venus conj jupiter, very loving expansive, sun conj venus - inner cheerfulness, love of life, sun conj mars can be rather wilful, but so can scorpio

Mercury retrograde, (I have this) give a introspective mind until it goes direct by progression. Keep their thoughts to themselves and analyse them before speaking.

Saturn opp neptune can show itself as a 'fear of the unknown' on occasion. It's only with further study and research will you understand astrology..

On Children
Kahlil Gibran
Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

http://www.katsandogz.com/onchildren.html

hmm... so might i take it that while the saturn/moon conjunction is valid, it may not be a strong an influence as if it were in a tighter orb?
i sometimes wonder if imposing my cultural upbringing and expectations (different from the culture we live in) might make him feel repressed or too rigidly controlled. here the children are much more spontaneous and have a tendency to be very indulged by parents and relatives.


as far as saturn/sun square there are moments in my" son's life when his father is physically absent for extended periods of time, (ie when we are visiting my parents in america) could this be a manifest of the aspect?

gosh there is so much to learn. thank you for your comments.

Soluna,

There are so many possible interpretations... Here is what I think: if this square is about your husband not being fully present in your son's life, then no matter what he does, this is how your son will feel.

My older son has Moon in Capricorn, 1st house, and my youngster's Moon is in Pisces, 5th house. They are only 2 years apart, and I am the same mother to them. Yet, they see me differently, no matter what I do. The older one cannot have enough of my love and attention, no matter how much he gets - it is just not enough for him. And his brother is a happy camper even if I am not there.

yes you are so right about children. no matter how much love we give them, how they receive it and translate it is largely up to them.

my son's stellium in scorpio in the 4th and 5th houses is a pretty big deal- maybe it needs a strong parental influence to direct the excess of willful energy and passionate feeling into creative outlets "or else". and i have seen the "or else"- what a bomb!

good thing i'm pretty much "at home" with scorpio. my father is a scorpio sun virgo moon (just like my son- but with the quieter and more diplomatic libra asc as opposed to my son's leo)

well, seems pluto has plenty to contribute to two very significant life roles- child and parent- there's just no way getting around it.

iwonder said:

Soluna,

There are so many possible interpretations... Here is what I think: if this square is about your husband not being fully present in your son's life, then no matter what he does, this is how your son will feel.

My older son has Moon in Capricorn, 1st house, and my youngster's Moon is in Pisces, 5th house. They are only 2 years apart, and I am the same mother to them. Yet, they see me differently, no matter what I do. The older one cannot have enough of my love and attention, no matter how much he gets - it is just not enough for him. And his brother is a happy camper even if I am not there.

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Gosh..well said Wonder..even its slightly you also made me feel better with this pointing " the Matter isn't what kind of mother you are,the matter is how your kid is seeing you"
well...at this point,it seems i am too tough for him...and a bit crazy

[FONT=&quot]I’ve been looking at your son’s chart. This kid is a quintessential Scorpio! The problems you will have with your son are mostly rebellion issues. This issue is mostly with your son, not with you. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Your son’s chart has 7 planets in Fixed signs and 7 planets in Water signs. Once your son has a set way of doing things, he won’t change for anyone! You will also need to watch out and gently deflect any manipulation he uses on you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]He doesn’t have any Cardinal signs in his chart which indicates he isn’t a doer. There will probably be fights between you two motivating him to do his homework and study for tests. There may also be fights during group projects at home and school. Scorpios naturally do things alone in secret and working in groups can be a problem for baby Scorpios. When I look at your chart, you have Saturn in the 4th house. You learned your parenting style from dad. I don’t recommend being a disciplinarian with this kid. Yes, you will have to set boundaries but too many rules will just make the kid rebel. Your son may be a tough rebel on the outside, but he still is a sensitive, emotional person on the inside. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Too much criticism can also be damaging to him. Moon in Virgo in the 2nd house (values) indicates that your son will criticize himself for the minutest things. As his mom, you should focus on building his self esteem. If there are any self esteem issues in your life, you will need to work on them immediately or you will subconsciously pass insecurities on to your kid. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Your son also has most of his planets on the right side of the chart. This is called a royal chart, which indicates that he’s more likely to delegate tasks to others. Don’t be surprised when he gives his chores to his younger siblings or cousins. Also, people with royal charts can’t achieve success alone. Your son must learn to work in groups in order to be successful.

Finally, the energy of your son's chart funnels into two planets: Neptune in Aquarius and Moon in Virgo. The first planet, Neptune, is located in your son's only air sign, Aquarius. The moon is located in your son's only earth sign, Virgo. These two planets are the heart of your son's horoscope.
[/FONT]

Sranda, I am curious about your signature quote. Who does it belong to? Those who were born recently with Pluto in Cap can barely talk. Those who were born last time it was there, didn't know they had it.

Sorry for hijacking the thread, but I could not resist asking.

iwonder said:

Sranda, I am curious about your signature quote. Who does it belong to? Those who were born recently with Pluto in Cap can barely talk. Those who were born last time it was there, didn't know they had it.

Sorry for hijacking the thread, but I could not resist asking.

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LOL! I have Pluto is currently TRANSITING the end of my 12th house. Pluto in Cappie conjuncts Mercury and the Ascendant, which means it's in a Don't-Mess-With-Me-Or-I'll-Send-You-To-H*** mode.

In my offline life, I'm using Pluto in Capricorn to speak up regarding the health care and jobs issues affecting the U.S. I even scared away a mugger who wanted to attack my mom. All I did was stand between her and the attacker, glared at the guy, and he just ran off. I think he was too weak to fight a 290 lb sumo-like woman.

I invented the quote myself. ^_^

Wherever the child's moon is (house) that is where the Mother was *at* at the time of birth. Most of the childhood the child will feel this way about the mother, and reflect upon it later in life.

I am not sure which chart is which? Are both of these different sons?

sranda01 said:

[FONT=&quot]I’ve been looking at your son’s chart. This kid is a quintessential Scorpio! The problems you will have with your son are mostly rebellion issues. This issue is mostly with your son, not with you. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Your son’s chart has 7 planets in Fixed signs and 7 planets in Water signs. Once your son has a set way of doing things, he won’t change for anyone! You will also need to watch out and gently deflect any manipulation he uses on you.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]He doesn’t have any Cardinal signs in his chart which indicates he isn’t a doer. There will probably be fights between you two motivating him to do his homework and study for tests. There may also be fights during group projects at home and school. Scorpios naturally do things alone in secret and working in groups can be a problem for baby Scorpios. When I look at your chart, you have Saturn in the 4th house. You learned your parenting style from dad. I don’t recommend being a disciplinarian with this kid. Yes, you will have to set boundaries but too many rules will just make the kid rebel. Your son may be a tough rebel on the outside, but he still is a sensitive, emotional person on the inside. [/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

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wow, yes he is very strong-willed and very sensitive- like you said the quintessential Scorpio- and so INTENSE!! the other thing i've noticed with him is that he already has very strong likes and dislikes (even regarding people)

it does seem that he would have little "initiating" motivation due to the lack of cardinal energy in his chart. this puzzles me because he is (at least at this age) a very big "doer"- sometimes i have to urge him to relax or take a break. seems really driven frm within- could be attributed to his squares with saturn? and yes he is absolutely his own worst critic- and regarding too many rules- well i have learned to pick my battles.