Am I going to die young?

Missa

Well-known member
A bit of a taboo subject in astrology, but I decided to give it a try. Since I was very young I've had a strange feeling that I haven't been given much time here, this may sound weird but I can't explain it better. I don't feel particularly sad about it anymore, as it is something I've carried inside me for so long. I know there are some indicators of death on your natal chart, even though this is a subject that is not usually discussed about (which may be a good thing). I'm curious to know am I going to die when I'm relatively young? What is "young" of course depends, but in this case before I reach old age (and natural death).

12.08.2006, 14:00 Helsinki.
Here is my natal chart if it helps.
 

fensi88

Well-known member
I got for horary chart ASC=07Sco19
Death is the matter of 8house. Both the house cusp and ruler of 8house are on last degree, 29th, and that degree shows some misfortune connected with the matter asked about. Also POF in 8 is infact point of misfortune which support previous explanation.But how to explain than Ju on ASC? I do not know, maybe someone with more experience can do that? In this chart you are signified with Ma, and Ma in horary astrology signifies person abouth 40 years (when it comes to define for example thief), maybe that is the limit which you describe as young?
Looking at your natal chart there are unfortunately indicators of possible previous death. Ruler of 11 house on cusp of 8 house(hard aspects) may indicate previous death because of accident. Also ruler of 8 in 1st house in hard aspect with Ur in 4(end of life) may indicate sudden death by your fault.
This is how I see things but I am not proffesional astrologer so maybe I am not right.
 

Summery Joy

Well-known member
I dunno. I myself consider this a taboo subject, but I looked at the chart nonetheless.

First of all, The Moon is at the very beginning of its current sign. And while the 8th cusp in at the last degree of Taurus, it is still in a fixed sign. It's ruler Venus is changing signs as well, but doesn't apply to your significator (Mars) at all. It applies, however, to Jupiter in the 1st house (a significator of yours by placement). The square between Venus and Jupiter is very wide, and Venus has to cross a boundary (sign) and Mercury (your dispositor) to get to it.

I don't see how this chart could give a yes answer to your question, but it does show that the subject is on your mind (Scorpio rising). Mars, your significator, is in Virgo. Virgo is associated with depression. Are you or have you ever been depressed (as in a psychological disturbance, not as in being down for a while)?

I must say that the last lunar aspect is a trine with Pluto Rx. This aspect is around 23 degrees away from perfection. I don't know if it could be used to determine the time you have left. While the Moon is in a cardinal sign (1 fast indicator) Pluto is in a fixed sign and a succedant house (2 moderately slow indicator) and the perfection will take place when the Moon is in a cadent house (1 very slow indicator).

I say don't worry about it. When your time comes it's just over. It doesn't matter of your 20 or 80. It won't matter at all. But if you do treat everyday as though it's your last, you will get something out of this life whether you're around for a day or forever.
 

fensi88

Well-known member
Maybe this horary chart can be interpret this way:

You are signified by Ma at 12Vi57 and Moon (in 5house??) at 1Ar37. Death is signified by Ve at 29Can32. There are no applaying aspects between significators (Ve changes sign before Moon perfect square with her) so the answer is "no".

Than that indicators in natal chart we could explain like this:

With Ar on cusp of 8 house you are preoccupy with death not because you affraid of it , but because you are ready to research that apparition. And that ruler of 8 in first tells us that you talk a lot with anothers about death.
 

pwadm

Staff member
William Lilly

Here's William Lilly's take on this issue:
(excerpt from Christian Astrology)
If the Querent is likely to live long yea or not.

Many men and women have not the time of their Nativities, or know how to procure them, either their Parents being dead, or no rememberance being left thereof; and yet for divers weighty considerations they are desirous to know by a question of Astrology, whether they shall live long or not?, whether any sicknesse is neer them? , what part of their Life is like to be most happy? together with many other such Queries people doe demand incident to this house.

Signs of Health or Long Life.
[SIGNES OF HEALTH.]

In the Question you must consider if the Sign ascending, the Lord thereof, and the Moon be free from misfortune, viz. if the Lord of the Ascendant be free from Combustion of the Sun, from the Square, Opposition or Conjunction of the Lord of the 8th, 12th, 6th or 4th House, if he be Direct, in Essentiall Dignity, Swift in Motion, or Angular, especially in the 1st house, (for in this question he is best placed therein) or 10th, or else in the 11th, or 9th House, and in a good aspect with Jupiter or Venus, or the Sun, or in the Termes of Jupiter and Venus, it’s an argument of Health and long life to the Querent, for the Lord of the Ascendant, or Ascendant it selfe unfortunate or Moon in bad houses afflicted, show mischiefe at hand; the aforesaid Significators tree, argue the contrary: for as you consider the Lord of the Ascendant, so the Ascendant is to be considered, and what aspect is cast unto it, viz. good or evil, and by what Planet or Planets, and of what house or houses they are Lords of.

[SIGNES CONTRARY, VIZ. OF SICKNESSE, DEATH, &C. MISFORTUNE.]

It’s generally received, that if the Lord of the Ascendant be under the Sunbeams, or going to Combustion, which is worse then when he is departing, or the Moon cadent and unfortunated by any of those Planets who have dominion in the 8th or 6th, and either the South Node, Saturn or Mars in the Ascendant or 7th House, peregrine or in detriments, or retrograde, or if there be in the degree ascending, or in that degree of the Signe wherein the Lord of the Ascendant is, or with the Moon, or with that Planet who afflicts any of those; I say, any Fixed Starre of violent influence or nature of the Planet afflicting, or nature of the Lord of the 8th or 6th House, then you may judge the Querent is not long lived, but neer some danger, or shall undergoe some misfortune in one kind or other, according to the quality of the Significator and Signification of that or those houses they are Lords of.

The Time When Any of These ACCIDENTS Shall Happen.

You must see if the Lord of the Ascendant be going to Combustion, or to Opposition or Conjunction of the Lord of the 8th or 4th, how many degrees he is distant from the Sun, or Lord of the 8th or 4th, and in what Signe either of them are in; if the space betwixt them be eight degrees, and in a common Signe, it denotes so many moneths; if in a fixed signe, so many yeers; if in a moveable, so many weeks: this is onely for example, and in generall; for the measure of time must be limited according to the other Significators concurring in judgment herein..
Secondly, having considered the Lord of the Ascendant, see how many degrees the Moon is also distant from any Infortune, or from the Lords of the 6th or 8th, and in what Signe or Signes, their Nature, Quality and House wherein they are posited..
Thirdly, consider if there be an Infortune in the Ascendant, how many degrees the Cusp of the house wants of that degree the unfortunate Planet is in, or if the unfortunating Planet be in the 7th, how many degrees the Ascendant wants of his true Opposition, and compute the time of Death, Sicknesses or Misfortune according to the dimension of degrees in Signes moveable, common, or fixed..
If you find the Lord of the Ascendant afflicted most of all by the Lord of the 6th, and in the 6th, or if the Lord of the Ascendant comes to Combustion in the 6th, you may judge the Querent will have very many and tedious sicknesses, which will scarce leave him till his death; and the more certain your judgment will be, if the Lord of the Ascendant, and the Lord of the 8th and the Moon be all placed in the 6th.
If you find the Lord of the Ascendant, the Signe ascending, or Moon most principally impedited or unfortunated by the Lord of the 8th, or that Planet who afflicts your Significators out of the 8th, then you may judge that the sicknesse with which he is now afflicted, or is shortly to be troubled withall, will end him, and that his death is approaching or that death is threatened..
But if you can find that the Lord of the Ascendant, or Signe of the Ascendant, or the Moon are chiefly afficted by the Lords of some other houses, you shall judge his misfortune from the nature of the house or houses whereof the Planet or Planets afflicting are Lords; and the first original thereof, or discovery, shall be signified from something, Man or Woman, &c. belonging to that house wherein you find the Planet afflicting posited, and thereby you shall judge a misfortune and not death: The Fixed Starres I mentioned, being of the nature of Mars, show sudden distempers of body, or Feavers, Murders, Quarrels &c. of the nature of Saturn, quartan Agues, Poverty, casuall hurts by fals &c..., of the nature of Mercury, they declare Consumptions,Madness, cozenage by false Evidence or Writings: of the nature of the Moon, Tumults, Commotions, Wind-chollick, danger by Water, &c, of the nature of the Sun, envy of Magistrates, hurt in the Eyes, &c. of the nature of Jupiter, oppression by domineering Priests, or by some Gentleman: of the nature of Venus, then prejudice by some Woman, the Pox, or Cards, Dice and Wantonnesse.

[CAUTION.]

You must carefully avoid pronouncing Death rashly, and upon one single testimony, you must observe, though the Lord of the Ascendant be going to Combustion, whether either Jupiter or Venus cast not some Sextile or Trine to the Lord of the Ascendant, ere he come to perfect Combustion, or any other infortune, for that is an argument that either Medicine or Strength of Nature will contradict that malignant influence, or take off part of that misfortune; but when you find two or more of the rules asforesaid concurring to death, you may be more bold in your Judgement; yet concerning the absolute time of death of any party, I have found it best to be wary, and have as much as I could, refrained this manner of judgement; onely this much by the Question may be knowne, that if you find the Significators, as aforesaid, afflicted, you may judge the man or party inquiring to be no long lived man, or subject to many miseries and calamities, and this I know by many verified examples; the knowledge hereof is of excellent use for such as would purchase any Lease or Office, or thing for Life or Lives, &c. or for those who would carefully in a naturall way prevent those casualties their natures or inclinations would run them into.
 

freedomlover

Well-known member
Re: William Lilly

The thought occurred to me when I read your post and looked at your chart that possibly you died young in one or more past lives, and so you carry the memory of that. Maybe this is where the belief comes from that you will die early in this one? A good possibility, I think........
 

fensi88

Well-known member
Inspired with this Missa question I was curious to know when will I die.
Data for my question are:
17 avg 2006
8:23pm gmt+2
20e29, 44n48
According by Frawley, we look for applaying aspects between rulers of 1st house and 8 house.
Event is certain, so we know that there must be a timing in the chart somewhere. We ignore prohibitions, we push our significators as far as we need through sign after sign. There are 2 barriers we cannot allow our significators to pass:
  • conjuction with the Sun
  • station


Look at chart. Ruler of 1H in 8H! How appropiate for this type of question!
1st house ruler is Ju at 11Sco33 (good sign, Ju expands all, and North node in 1st house also good). 8 house ruler is Ma at 16Vir19.
From 16Vir19 to 11Sco33 there is 50deg and 14'. If we consider 1deg=1 year, this is less then I have now, so I must use my co-significator Moon at 15 deg 37'Ge. From Moon to Su at 24Leo42 we have 69deg 5'. That means 69 years and 1 month! Interesting, I always "feel" that I will live 70 years! So if you do not see my post on this forum after November 2022, you will know what happend!
 

Summery Joy

Well-known member
Goca, I wish you a long and fruitful life. And always remember; we make a living by what we get, we make a life by what we give -- Winston Churchill.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Of course we dont die, just pass over. However I see possible passing for you in a foreign country or connected with a foreign person. There would have to be heavy transits through the 8th and perhaps 12th also 6th house for you to pass. A lot of people feel they are going to die young. What is young, it could be 40,60,??????? I feel it wont be a violent death but perhaps in your sleep and possibly at home. It is best to just live our lives day by day as if being told when you will die, somehow you can will that to happen or bring it about. There are about 5 different times when we can exit throughout our lives and I believe we choose when to ultimately pass or it is written in our birth contract.

Claire
 

jag

Well-known member
Quoted from Simplified Horary Astrology by Ivy M. Goldstein-Jacobson

not sure if this is of any help to anyone....

“Part of death (D)= ascendant plus the 8th cusp and then minus the moon.

Will there be a death soon?

A malefic in the 8th signifies a death in the family during the year and if aspecting (D) their difference in degree gives the approximate time. IF the ruler of the 8th, 4th, 10th or 3rd is afflicted, it signifies that death is now approaching the family. Any malefic ruling the 9th and coming to the 8th cusp denotes death on the way, to arrive after some months.

Jupiter, Venus, the Moon and Mercury denote death from natural causes and generally painless unless with Mars or Saturn. The Sun denotes death from constitutional weakness, usually beginning or ending with the heart, and if afflicted by the Moon or malefic in the prenatal 4th it is usually congenital: existing at birth.

Uranus in or conjunct the 8th shows death sudden and unexpected, and probably by accident if he is with Mars. M ars in or conjunct the 8th denotes violent death that is quickly over: an acute attack, or perhaps by murder or suicide if he is with Neptune. Neptune in or conjunct the 8th denotes death in a coma with possibility of mistaken diagnosis - or suspended animation leading to premature burial. Death comes slowly if Saturn is in or conjunct the 8th: from chronic disability, or if with Mercury by strangling or asthmatic attack; and if Neptune is also involved, the possibility of drowning.

The ruler of the 1st, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 7th or 10th the most afflicted and nearest the 8th cusp designates the one who is next to die. Note that the 1st house rules others besides the querent: his death is never shown.

Recognizing Death in any Chart

In a chart set for a question of any kind, regarding death or not, if Saturn, Mars Uranus or Neptune is in the 8th or conjunct the cusp, a death registers in the querent’s circle within 12 months. The death may take place either before or after the date of the question, and the querent hears of it at once if the Moon is in an angular house; later if succeeding, and much later if cadent. Intercepted, the news is long suppressed.

In the question on page 230, asked in May, there are two malefics in the 8th. In the preceding March and April two men in the family died. It is important for the student to note that one of the malefics rules the Ascendant BUT THE QUERENT’S DEATH IS NEVER SHOWN. The planet is Mars, conjunct the 9th: he was a brother-in-law. Saturn was also a brother -in-law. Note that the Moon’s preceding aspect was to Mercury the 8th-ruler. {Question was “will I be repaid for my doctor bill? 8:05 p.m. PDST, May 2, 1944, 118W15, 34N03 asc 19 scorp 5}

On page 232 we find the malefic Saturn in the 8th by mutual reception with Mercury-ruler-4th (where we find Saturn-ruler-8th), threatening the life of the father, because the ruler of the father-4th is in the 8th. Six months later the father died. Again, the Mon’s preceding aspect was to Mercury but this time in the 8th. {Question was “will son-in-law pay me the note?” 00:57 p.m. PST, Feb 7th, 1950, 118W15, 34N03, asc 20 gem 58}

Am I in danger here?

The ascendant plus the ruler of the 8th and then minus Saturn gives the Part of Peril (P). Capricorn on the 8th always puts (P) conjunct the Ascendant and dangerous if afflicted. If (P) is conjunct a malefic and in bad aspect to the ascendant or its ruler, the person is in danger. The moon afflicting any malefic in the 1st is a danger signal. In 12:01 Cancer on page 90, the (P) squares the sun in the 6yh, and the querent’s health was endangered by mental strain due to fear. {Question was “what is the matter with me?” 7:17 p.m. PWT, April 1, 1944, 1118W15, 34N03, asc 13 lib 43}”
 

yelena234

Well-known member
Hello to all,

About to die young, I had some great wish before my 30th year, to live full life, because I wanted to die just with 30 years.

First of all, because I became sick already with 16 years. Second maybe, because by Regression, in all my 3 Past lives, I have died with 23 years. My first suicide try in this life was with 23 years and 9 months, but I was rescued.

In Birth Chart, there is one Aspect (I don't want to write it, because of other members, who want to live, and not think about death), that shows, will the person have short life.

I am not affraid of death (Venus, ruler of 8th in 8th). I am more affraid of such a life, as I have now.
Beside that, I collect Birth Charts from famous people, who died young. Also from the people, that made suicide. Somebody told me, I have flirtation with death. Could be! This flirtation is very dangerous. Like playing Lotto, you play, and you win or you don't.

Yelena
 

Claire19

Well-known member
I think your soul has made a contract when incarnating again on the earth plane when it is likely to pass over. I too have Venus in Libra in 8th ruled by Venus. I believe in the afterlife and have no fear of "death". Venus sextile Pluto. Neptune conjunct Venus in 8th.

Depending on the transits of Pluto, Saturn and Mars to the 8th house, 1st house, 12th house, these can all denote "death". Even the flowing aspects such as sextile, trine and some conjunctions which mean an easy passover or one that is welcomed and accepted.

Many people die on their Saturn Returns and the Pluto square Pluto of midlife.

So many scenarios.

Claire
 
Missa,

Don't confuse your Natal chart with a Horary chart. The William Lilly passage was pertaining to a Horary Chart. I'm not a professional astrologer but your natal chart is supposed to be a blueprint of your life with many paths you can take. If there are indications of a short life it doesn't necessarily mean it will turn out that way unless you take that path. You dn't necessarily manifest everything in your birth chart.
 

yelena234

Well-known member
Hello to all,

When I look this explanation between ruler of 1st and 8th, what about us, who have the same ruler?
My ruler of both houses is Venus. That means, Venus must make square to itself, to show the time, when I am going to die.

It is true, that my mother died at 86, my aunt is now 87 years old. What about me? I don't want to have answer about that. I would like to be surprised.

I think, there is Part of death, there is Pluto, we have to look both of them, by somebody's death, not only 1st and 8th house.

My good friend died very young, 28 years old. She died, when her natal Pluto came with 28 degrees to the cusp of Scorpio (at the same time, cusp of her 8th house, she was AC Aries).

When that is so easy, then every Astrologer would know, how long is he going to live. And many of them don't want to know it. Or simple, they can't count it excatly.

Yelena
 

Claire19

Well-known member
I feel we must also look at Neptune and the 12th house for death. Also the heavy Pluto transits and the Saturn Returns can be indicative of passing over. I have 8th house planets and this indicates the nature of the death often. So I have a good idea of that. There are those who can predict death using the Almuten etc but I dont concentrate on that. I dont want to know as I am interested in living my life. I have two elderly parents who are dying and I am sure it will be soon but I dont want to know the date.

I saw the death of my younger sister as imminent and it was very painful I can tell you. It was clear in my chart and those of my family but in different ways. I believe in the afterlife and so on but the grief is still there. This happened on my 2nd Saturn Return and also lost our beloved family dog.

Lets live for life!!
Claire
 

yelena234

Well-known member
Dear Claire,

I must say, I am very sorry for you.

As you know, I have ruler of 1st and 8th in 8th (Venus in Taurus), and I am really not afraid of death. It should be natural death, but I wish, I was dead already, and I understand very good, that the people who suffer to much, they want to die.
But, I am afraid that dies, somebody close to me.

I am collecting birth charts from famous people, as also Solar Returns, when they died. What I wrote yesterday, that if you have Venus, ruler of 1st and 8th, you should be about 90 years old, to die. That is not true. Last night, I have seen Natal Chart of one famous politician in my ex country, who was also AC Libra, and the same ruler of both houses. He was killed, when he was 50 and half years. Then I looked in his Chart, and there was something with Saturn, when one planet came in conjuction with Saturn. That means, that Saturn is still some kind of the worst planet.

I really wish you, after all that, that all happiness from the world comes into your life. You deserve it!

Nice regards,
Yelena

p.s. I have Neptun in 12th.
 

yelena234

Well-known member
Claire19 said:
I feel we must also look at Neptune and the 12th house for death. Also the heavy Pluto transits and the Saturn Returns can be indicative of passing over. I have 8th house planets and this indicates the nature of the death often. So I have a good idea of that. There are those who can predict death using the Almuten etc but I dont concentrate on that. I dont want to know as I am interested in living my life. I have two elderly parents who are dying and I am sure it will be soon but I dont want to know the date.

I saw the death of my younger sister as imminent and it was very painful I can tell you. It was clear in my chart and those of my family but in different ways. I believe in the afterlife and so on but the grief is still there. This happened on my 2nd Saturn Return and also lost our beloved family dog.

Lets live for life!!
Claire

Hello Claire,

About Neptun in 12th: do you know that 12th house means our past life, AC means our life now, and 2nd house, next life?

My Neptun in 12th is real! I had to go to Regression because of steady chronic pains, and have seen my three (3) past lives. The very past life was in India, where I have died in the lake (Neptun - water).

Yelena
 
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