Predicting your own death.

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fifteen

Well-known member
JUPITERASC said:
That's great news fifteen! :smile:
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Thanks Jupiter!

I think this is the message for me: since I have Chiron next to my IC in my natal chart, RosieOne told me to look into Chiron -which I did- and now I am thinking that the wounds of the wounded healer Chiron will never heal, thus exiting my struggles will not solve anything it only makes it worse. Instead I should focus on helping others.

That is where I stand right now. :smile:
 
CapAquaPis

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
According to my natal chart, Saturn (in Virgo) in near eclipse with Lilith (in Virgo) and Pluto (in Libra) are 25 degrees apart with the IC in 3 degrees 10 (in Libra). The significent symbolism of two fatal planets with an IC caught in between in addition the middle of the astrological zodiac (Virgo/Libra) is something for me to worry about. I don't think of death, then I held a more fatalist aspect of life...as I felt my goals in life will never be completed. :sad:
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
CapAquaPis said:
According to my natal chart, Saturn (in Virgo) in near eclipse with Lilith (in Virgo) and Pluto (in Libra) are 25 degrees apart with the IC in 3 degrees 10 (in Libra). The significent symbolism of two fatal planets with an IC caught in between in addition the middle of the astrological zodiac (Virgo/Libra) is something for me to worry about
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Not necessarily JMO what if your time of birth is not accurate and the IC is elsewhere after all?
CapAquaPis said:
I don't think of death, then I held a more fatalist aspect of life...as I felt my goals in life will never be completed. :sad:
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Clearly we cannot complete our goals AFTER death CapAquaPis so I agree it is a good idea to complete them asap :smile:

Death is brought to our attention every time we notice a funeral taking place and is mentioned frequently by the media e.g. famous people who died that day in the past.

Astrologers in particular, retain an interest in the charts of celebrities who died in some cases centuries ago.

Death is a not unusual occurrence

.... in fact worldwide, with each passing minute of clock time, approximately one hundred people have died - that's approximately 153,781 deaths per day...

So JMO, it may not be easy, however it IS important to be ready for death - as ready as possible.

And one of the ways that we can do that is by - despite our imperfections - living as 'good' a life as we are able to, while we have the valuable opportunity to do so
 
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fifteen

Well-known member
JUPITERASC said:

So JMO, it may not be easy, however it IS important to be ready for death - as ready as possible.

And one of the ways that we can do that is by - despite our imperfections - living as 'good' a life as we are able to, while we have the valuable opportunity to do so
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That's true. I think it can be healthy to explore death. I always had a great fear of death, but some 10 years ago I realized that I was afraid of fear itself. I started to confront my fears, and once I started to approach it, it vanished like fog... So it can be healthy for humans to explore death and suffering. In every wound there is the gift of healing.

I also think that preparation for one's death can be very important. Many people are ripped from this life unprepared and when they die, they can get confused of what just happened, some remain in denial for years or decades and cannot pass over, many remain earthbound as ghosts. Spirituality is very important, to understand what just happened to you and knowing where to go when it happens. Protection of the subtle body which is released upon death is very important. If the subtle body lingers around and doesn't know where it must go, it can be picked up by other entities or energies that are around. The energy has to go somewhere. The question to be buried or cremated is therefore a very important thing to consider. People who are buried are in risk of losing there "subtle body" to bad entities. These bad entities are collecting subtle bodies from the buried which are unprotected in the ground. This is why cemeteries are always haunted. If the body is cremated, the subtle body is protected by a sheet of fire which is one of the elements that bad entities cannot penetrate. This way the passover will be smooth and direct.
 
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JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
fifteen said:
That's true. I think it can be healthy to explore death. I always had a great fear of death, but some 10 years ago I realized that I was afraid of fear itself. I started to confront my fears, and once I started to approach it, it vanished like fog... So it can be healthy for humans to explore death and suffering. In every wound there is the gift of healing
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Ignoring death only leads to being unprepared when inevitably the time to 'shuffle off this mortal coil' arrives! :smile:

as William Shakespeare has one of his characters Hamlet say:

QUOTE:

"To be, or not to be: that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to sleep;
To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil"
fifteen said:
I also think that preparation for one's death can be very important. Many people are ripped from this life unprepared....
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War is a major cause of unexpected death...

...and the deaths of defenseless children, slaughtered by airstrikes from 'drone missiles' or one way or another during military action are particularly horrendous

In the pampered West, unexpected deaths are mostly via car accidents or accidents of some form, as well as alcohol related deaths and heart attacks from over-indulgence.
fifteen said:
...and when they die, they can get confused of what just happened, some remain in denial for years or decades and cannot pass over, many remain earthbound as ghosts. Spirituality is very important, to understand what just happened to you and knowing where to go when it happens. Protection of the subtle body which is released upon death is very important. If the subtle body lingers around and doesn't know where it must go, it can be picked with by other entities that are around. The question to be buried or cremated is a very important thing to consider. People who are buried are in risk of losing there "subtle body" to bad entities. These bad entities are collecting subtle bodies from the buried which are unprotected in the ground. This is why cemeteries are always haunted. If the body is cremated, the subtle body is protected by a sheet fire -which is one of the elements- that bad entities cannot penetrate. This way the passover will be smooth and direct.
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That's very interesting fifteen.
 
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fifteen

Well-known member
JUPITERASC said:
War is a major cause of unexpected death...

...and the deaths of defenseless children, slaughtered by airstrikes from 'drone missiles' or one way or another during military action are particularly horrendous

In the pampered West, unexpected deaths are mostly via car accidents or accidents of some form, as well as alcohol related deaths and heart attacks from over-indulgence.
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That's correct. That's why there are many stories of people who suffered a terrible death who are still lingering around. Many are angry, confused and try to get attention from the living. If that doesn't work, they eventually do find a way to pass over. But that isn't guaranteed. Some can be held captive by other entities or themselves in case they have unfinished business. So some need help from here to passover, and few get help from the other side. But I think it's best to know something about death, just in case.
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
fifteen said:
That's correct. That's why there are many stories of people who suffered a terrible death who are still lingering around. Many are angry, confused and try to get attention from the living. If that doesn't work, they eventually do find a way to pass over. But that isn't guaranteed. Some can be held captive by other entities or themselves in case they have unfinished business. So some need help from here to passover, and few get help from the other side. But I think it's best to know something about death, just in case.
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Good idea to be aware of these possibilities fifteen and there's an ancient text on the subject freely available in translation - "The Tibetan Book Of The Dead" - The Great Liberation On Hearing In The Intermediate State at http://www.holybooks.com/wp-content/uploads/The-Tibetan-Book-of-the-Dead.pdf :smile:
 
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fifteen

Well-known member
I once helped someone to pass over. I found my colleague who had sudden cardiac death. I found my colleague in the office next to me as I walked in. It was the first time I was confronted with death. And I have to say, it was extremely peaceful, even magical how weird that might sound. I didn't want my colleague to die alone on the floor as others alerted the emergency operators, so I sat down next to my colleague and held her right hand. I looked into the eyes of my colleague and suddenly I felt a connection. I said in my mind: it's time to go, you cannot stay here. I had not much experience with spirituality, but it came naturally on that moment. On the moment I said that it was time to leave, I instantly noticed that the body of my colleague turned into a shell. Completely empty. I knew then that my colleague was gone, and passed over. It's difficult to describe in words, but I just felt that it happened. I could even sense it externally, the moment of a presence and then the complete emptiness of a body was noticeable to me.

So when the emergency personnel arrived minutes later, I knew they could not bring her back. Which they tried of course. The strangest thing was that I was very relaxed, others were all crying, afraid and some even shouted in anger. Somehow I knew that I knew/felt/saw something they didn't, which was actually the start of my interest in spirituality and my fear of death just vanished.
 
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JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
fifteen said:
Great, I read that in my teens, but forgot most of it. Looks like I have something to re-read again. :joyful:
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'....Approximately 750 years ago, Karma Lingpa found several hidden texts on top of a mountain in Tibet when he was fifteen years old. Within those texts he found a collection of teachings entitled “The Self-Emergence Of The Peaceful And Wrathful Deities From Enlightened Awareness.” These teachings contained the texts of the now famous “Great Liberation Upon Hearing In The Bardo"....'

fifteen is definitely lucky :smile:
 
NancyS

NancyS

Well-known member
fifteen said:
I once helped someone to pass over. I found my colleague who had sudden cardiac death. I found my colleague in the office next to me as I walked in. It was the first time I was confronted with death. And I have to say, it was extremely peaceful, even magical how weird that might sound. I didn't want my colleague to die alone on the floor as others alerted the emergency operators, so I sat down next to my colleague and held her right hand. I looked into the eyes of my colleague and suddenly I felt a connection. I said in my mind: it's time to go, you cannot stay here. I had not much experience with spirituality, but it came naturally on that moment. On the moment I said that it was time to leave, I instantly noticed that the body of my colleague turned into a shell. Completely empty. I knew then that my colleague was gone, and passed over. It's difficult to describe in words, but I just felt that it happened. I could even sense it externally, the moment of a presence and then the complete emptiness of a body was noticeable to me.

So when the emergency personnel arrived minutes later, I knew they could not bring her back. Which they tried of course. The strangest thing was that I was very relaxed, others were all crying, afraid and some even shouted in anger. Somehow I knew that I knew/felt/saw something they didn't, which was actually the start of my interest in spirituality and my fear of death just vanished.
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To support your account: My best friend experienced this when her father died; she saw his soul ("a ball of light") leave his body. My mother described her mother's passing in much the same way you described your colleague's.

Nobody seems to struggle against death when it happens.
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
NancyS said:
To support your account: My best friend experienced this when her father died; she saw his soul ("a ball of light") leave his body. My mother described her mother's passing in much the same way you described your colleague's.

Nobody seems to struggle against death when it happens.
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That's a variable, particularly regarding violent deaths e.g. murder, manslaughter, deaths during war, earthquake, tsunami, hurricane, road accidents and so on

In contrast, the deaths of older persons can seem peaceful :smile:
 
NancyS

NancyS

Well-known member
Ah... good point. I was thinking of one's final moment when I posted that, not the struggle preceding it. And the picture in my mind was indeed of an old person passing away peacefully in bed ~ you know, the way we would all like to sign out :cool:
 
J

Justine

Active member
A delightful astrologer my family knew, predicted her own death. She was serene and looking forward to what we now call 'transition' in our family.
She tidied up her life, settled everything, and then lived through whatever-it-was she had foreseen as her death. Lived another 20-odd years, serving her community well.
Transition can happen here: we may not have to drop our body to go into an utterly new stage of our life. Remember the caterpillars that go into transition (cocoon) and re-emerge as butterflies or moths. I'm sure we humans do something spiritually similar when we go into "a dark night of the soul", learn whatever it is we need to, and re-emerge ready to start a 'new' life. Of course, we CAN choose to learn nothing during the spiritual crisis; but hey, we'll face it again if we don't do the work this time ;)
Love to all on this forum.
Justine
 
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greybeard

Well-known member
Astrologers of old regularly predicted death.
They usually couched the prediction in softer terms, but they nonetheless warned their clients to exercise caution, or avoid riding a horse, or against treacherous friends, etc.
And they usually lost a good client at the time the prediction was made for.

There is no escape. If it's your time it's your time. Adios.

But what's to fear? I was dead before I came here and can't see anything frightening about being dead on departure from Paradise.
 
Z

zenith

Well-known member
greybeard said:
Astrologers of old regularly predicted death.
They usually couched the prediction in softer terms, but they nonetheless warned their clients to exercise caution, or avoid riding a horse, or against treacherous friends, etc.
And they usually lost a good client at the time the prediction was made for.

There is no escape. If it's your time it's your time. Adios.

But what's to fear? I was dead before I came here and can't see anything frightening about being dead on departure from Paradise.
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I remember you wrote about the strange up coming transits a while back. I don't have the extensive astrological knowledge as many do here on this site, and I do not know what to say at these moments. But not saying anything also feels wrong. It puts a lot of things into perspective, when looking at someone facing their own mortality with acceptance vs human beings daily frustration . I know I am not at that point yet, death has been pushed to the far end of my consciousness because there are so many things I want to do, I want to see my son grow up, and be there every time he needs me... I can go on... but it has to be the same for everyone isn't it? I can't imagine age would be a part of having enough of life, or too old to care... it's just something that can't be pushed that far away anymore. I remember when my step father passed away, he was suffering for years due to failing health, so we all knew it was coming, he signed up for hospice, and in the end he was very peaceful, ending suffering was welcomed, he was tired of the loss of dignity as terminal disease can do to human beings. It was very hard to watch, it was very hard to live through, my mom was taking care of him every step of the way, I can tell my step father at moments felt so bad for her that he looked forward to ending it all. I do not know what to say to them, I have no words, but I guess I respect mortality and respect human conditions. I don't know if I want to know when will be my end, may be I do, then I'd have time to leave something behind for people I love, help them to mourn me and accept my passing. Yes, I would like to know. I really don't know what I'm trying to say here, may be what to say does not matter, may be why we say it matters, I heard on a video I watched recently that... "because we are all in it together". If you don't mind, I would like to give you a hug. I can't imagine there is anything a hug won't make it feel just a little bit better.
 
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greybeard

Well-known member
Old George, my friend, was 85 or so. He had gotten cancer. He knew it wouldn't be long. I last saw him about a week before he died. He came walking into the little cafe where some of us gather to fix the world, talk about kids or horses, remember the good old days over a warm friendly cup of java. George had a big smile on his face.

George knew that today is all there is. So he always met today with a smile.

I'm not sorry George died. I miss telling tall tales to my good friend. But I'm sure George wasn't sad about it. He stood up like a man, knowing that today is a good day to die, and kept on smiling.

I guess George loved two things more than anything else in life. His wife, who had been gone for twenty years or so, and horses.

One day I asked George how he trained his dogs, still pups, to be so willingly obedient. His eyes sparkled as he said with the hint of a smile on his lips, "Buggy whip."

It isn't when and how you die. It's how you live today, wholly in the here and now. I don't think George had any unfinished business, which is why he could look death in the eye in peace and joy, without fear, a smile on his face.

No one, not you, not me, has any claim on tomorrow. We can't change yesterday, and we don't know what tomorrow will bring (if it comes). Given this fact, it seems to me that it would be wise to focus on Now.
 
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zenith

Well-known member
When I come here to offer comfort and in return felt guided, and coming from someone facing his own mortality. I know I'm in the presence of a higher consciousness. I do not encounter this often on my journey, not to be arrogant, but the reality of my subjective experiences is that I don't run into people who make better choices than me much, it's rare and exceptional. I love this feeling of standing in the light of compassion. Thank you Greybeard, you inspire me with your choices and purpose, and from the few life stories I've read. You have lived. Thank you for share that. There isn't much to wish for to someone who had found peace. Celebrate moments, and this is one of them, an inspiring one.
 
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