Charts in Synastry and Composite

I'd like some insight from folks who are more experienced in looking at charts. The two charts below are mine and a fellow I'm interested in. This fellow and I have an almost freakishly high level of mutual understanding at a number of levels -- something I see reflected in both the composite charts and the synastry between our charts. There are other things that ... give me pause (not in a 'worried for my safety' way at all mind). Yet I also recognize that no relationships are perfect and few composite charts or charts in synastry are devoid of fricative aspects. (Nor would that be good, even, since I see fricatives as being essential for growth.)

But I *also* know (via painful experience and divorce) that certain aspects are worrisome. I'm not sure I'm seeing the same worrisome aspects in this chart as in the one with my ex-, but I also don't know if I'm overlooking OTHER things that OUGHT to worry me.

And an amusing detail that gave both gave me a laugh, but also gave me pause ... my ex- and this guy share the same birthDATE (but different years). So clearly I have an astrological "type"! *chuckle* I was married to my ex- for 20 years, and in some ways, we had a very good marriage. In other ways ... not at all. We were toxic for each other. (It was, looking back, probably a relationship that should never have advanced to marriage. We'd have been terrific friends. We were, ultimately, rotten marriage partners. The latter, unfortunately, trumped and soured the former.)

So, let me first give my and the new guy's two individual charts for synastry, then the composite chart. Mine first, his second, composite third. FOLLOWING the charts, I'll note what aspects/placements raised my eyebrow, and what make me think this would be a particularly good relationship ... I'll also note that I have a slight bias towards synastry over composites, although I pay a lot of attention to both. I realize every relationship is unique and what one couple can't make work, another can ... but comment from the rest of you with experience reading other charts with similar aspects/placements is most welcome:

MINE:


HIS:


COMPOSITE:




Composite Chart:

Okay, first, that huge stellum in the 9th house is really powerful. Also, the closest aspect in the chart is a conjunction there between Sun and Venus (only .13 of a degree out!). With the previous spousal unit, we also had a (less close) Sun-Venus conjunction, but in the *6th* house and boy did that work out in the worst way! We were also missing the Mercury conjunction mixed in with the Sun-Venus ... but also missing the Uranus. 6th house suggests sacrifice and support and work. 9th house, however, suggests it's highly intellectual ... which is it ... but also suggests potentially merely platonic.

The Uranus could be bad or neutral (or good). I know Uranus can indicate a high level of instability (although in the composite chart, I see possible counterbalances to that), but it can *also* merely indicate an atypical relationship in some way. This one would be ... there's an age-gap, but it's with the woman, not man, who's older. Of course, we're both approaching or over 40, so after a point, age gaps matter less, but it is still "atypical." Likewise, other details make it an atypical relationship, and so I'm *inclined* to read Uranus as indicating "atypicality" rather than "instability" but I also recognize that might be just wishful thinking. (That is, I'm duly -- Saturnian-cautious.)

In composites, I ALWAYS look at Neptune, since that's deception (intentional or not so) and in both personal experience AND looking at other charts, I've found it indicative of Big Issues. With the ex-, we had some *horrid* Neptune stuff ... more hard aspects than soft, AND a 7th house placement ... and again, that played out pretty straightforwardly negative for us. Idealized and unrealistic.

In the composite above, there are no hard Neptune aspects, and Neptune is in the 11th house, which brings it's own deceptions, but I don't see the same potentially explosive deceptions as I saw in the composite with the ex-.

Among the more troubling aspects to me are the Moon-Saturn conjunction in the 4th, which can indicate either coldness and sense of duty, or (conversely) serenity and stability ... although I note Moon isn't OTHERWISE aspected, and that's not necessarily good. Sure enough, in our relating, we do tend to relate at the head, although some of the emotional walls have been coming down of late ... and we both do prize emotional stability. So I'm aware of the potential problems, but not sure how much to make of it. The orb here is much wider than that Sun-Venus conjunction (or even the Sun-Venus-Mercury stellum).

Last, there's a Mars-Pluto square in the composite that troubles me. It could be explosive, I know, but it's also a wider ob, and this is an energy I've never actually *felt* negatively in the relationship so far. I've *never* felt threatened by him, nor are we overtly competitive in a hostile way ... less so than I was with the ex-, actually. I felt alarmed by the ex- in a way I've not felt with the new guy. Actually, one of the attractions of me to him is the fact he's magnetic (Pluto here, + his natal chart Scorp rising which attracts my super-powerful natal Mercury-Pluto conjunction in the 7th house ... I LIKE Plutonian energy). And he doesn't *seem* to be particularly threatened by my own force of personality (Mars). Men often are -- not in a physical way, but an intellectual way. They back off; he doesn't back off. But the energy is (so far) always positive, not negative. So the aspect troubles me more because it's there, than because I've actually felt it. I wonder if it COULD raise an ugly head.

But as far at the composite chart is concerned, I'm *most* concerned by what I see that indicates 1) this is more inclined to be platonic, and 2) there may be difficulty in emotional sharing. The "relationship" is currently a friendship that has developed into *possible* potential for more ... ergo the concern that it's meant to be platonic and trying to take it to another level would destroy it. (By the same token, however, we BOTH need strong friendship in our relationships.)

Synastry:

THAT brings me to the synastry chart. As I said above, I've always been a little more given to synastry, but not as an either-or. The synastry chart seems slightly more positive. (And I should say, if NOTHING else, I see us as having a deep and transformative friendship, so when I say "more positive" I mean purely in a "how would this work as a ROMANTIC relationship as opposed to a really good friendship?")

In the synastry chart, the most obvious is that we share sun and moon signs, but do not share the "traditional" asc/desc pairing. Instead we have something similar to what I had with the ex- ... with him (the ex-) his MC was my ascendant. And sure enough, he "followed" me/my career in terms of where we moved (and that wasn't necessarily so positive, in the long run).

With the new guy, his *IC* is my rising, suggesting a certain feeling of "home" with me ... and sure enough, about 75% of our time is spent at my house, not his, and I do represent some "stability" for him. That strikes me as a better placement for a pairing relationship, while the one above wold have been better for a business or other professional partnership. Add to that, our (I and the new guy's) moons are conjunct in Aries. We feel *comfortable* to each other at an emotional level, familiar, but it's a fire placement so there's a little punch there.

Other positive (relationship) aspects ... a double sextile, my sun to his Venus, and his sun to my Venus. His Mercury and mine are also sextile. Last, his Venus is trine my Mars which suggests isn't not just Platonic, and both our Marses square each other (which might be sometimes a negative, but given the overload of "sugar" in the synastry might, in this case, be HELPFUL spice).

I should clarify, too, that in synastry, I disregard outer planets, and consider Jup/Sat. only in aspect to inner planets. I see as good (my) Sun trine (his) Jupiter (my selfhood attracts his benevolence), but as challenging (my) Sun square (his) Saturn (my selfhood possibly limiting him). Last, there's (his) moon sextile (my) Saturn that goes back not just to the Platonic theme seen in the composite, but underscores the age difference. I am the "mentor" to him. Ergo, that sextile might be less a positive than a negative, like the Mars-Mars square might (in our case) be less negative than a needed fricative to keep passion/interest flowing.

Last, when looking at chart aspect PATTERNS, he has a gigantic "house" or "plane" pattern that "points" into my 9th house, but conjunct the MC.

In the end, and while I've hardly dissected every aspect (good AND bad), the above indicates some of the things that leapt out and bit me. This looks to me like a potentially very good friendship-based love relationship ... as long as it doesn't slip over into "pure" friendship, or the age difference doesn't cause a mentor-mentee mode to take over. It seems to be missing the bigger warning signs that mine had with the ex-, even while both men share a birthdate (the ex-'s data, btw, is Oct. 12, 1962, Melbourne, FL, 10:38pm). If I'd known then what I know now about astrology, I might never have married him, but we'd been married already almost 10 years by the time I started to study astrology. A little late for second-guesses!

But this new relationship isn't too late, and so I'd like some outside input. It looks promising, but I'm just not sure how much weight to give the more negative/problematic aspects. I also read some ambiguity in his romantic/sexual attraction to me (maybe), as opposed to my more straightforward attraction to him on that level. (It's HIS Venus trine MY Mars, not the reverse ... but our Marses square.)

the composite chart shows theeis much excitment and intensity here.there seems to bequite a lot socializing/partying.the mercury/venus/sun/stellium shows the emotional/physical attraction and openess and laughter.
but uranus is opposed to jupiter,which increases the intensity but does not bode wellfor a steady relationship.this realtionship though intense may brunout and end abruptly.it is the chance you take when commiting to a uranus influence.with the pluto/venus and pluto /sun midpoints conjunct uranus,it is almost a certaintly ,this will end abruptly with no adequate reasons given.enjoy the moment .
with a saturn/moonconjunction present, you have already given your devotion and see the future together.the saturn/moon conjunction is indicative of devotion and loyalty but it is not good at discrimination.that is this conjunction will stay with a relationship whether it is good or bad.oftyen this aspect showup in chart where one person will not let go.

but with uranus opposed to jupiter, it is doubtful the devotion shown can make this relationship work longterm.

no question there is a magic,idealism and tantric sexual energy.love and learn from these inspired impulses .but,aghain,live in the moment and don't build dream castles as they will not form.

i realize you will blow this advice off because you are in the midst of the intoxicating love/lust senations and can smell only the roses.

my feeling are that this relations came together ardently and suddenly in early summer 10 and will become more passionate and intense as the month progress.there is a inderlying impulse to commitment ro marriage,but these good intentions will not come to fruition though you still have several months of intensity left.

on the negative side this relationship will probably break up just before christmas though it could sustain itself til spring before th eintensity draws you apart.

but again ,inhale the love and happiness of the moment,but live in the moment,not in the future
rahu

rahu said:

i realize you will blow this advice off because you are in the midst of the intoxicating love/lust senations and can smell only the roses.

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Actually, I'm not blowing off your comments. I'm cautious by nature, and have been through a divorce once already. That's part of why I put these charts up here, specifically to see if others saw the same concerns I did, and whether they thought I was making a mountain from a molehill given the number of good aspects ... or not. By the time I saw the composite chart of me and my ex-, we'd already been married almost 10 years, and although some stressers were already showing, I *was* inclined to blow off the danger signs, or at least hope they worked out for the best (what else could I do?). Also, we'd believed and been told we were an "ideal" couple, one that our friends expected to still be married after 50 years. Yeah ... not.

I think my composite chart with the new guy (D.) is less problematic than that with the ex- ... but having HAD the experience of seeing in a progressed chart the warning signs that sunk a marriage, I'm NOT inclined to dismiss some of the issues I see in this one, even while awareness can sometimes bring due caution and allow the pitfalls to be avoided. Maybe. (Not least because, beyond a friendship, this is not yet a *relationship*.)

As mentioned, while I see a LOT of positives in both synastry and composite (especially synastry), there are some pretty serious potential pitfalls, to my eye -- the Uranus opposition to Jupiter that you discussed, the fact both Jupiter and Pluto square Mars ... as well as (in synastry) the Sun-Saturn square, and possibly the Pluto-Sun conj. (although conj. can be iffy on whether they play well or play badly ... or start one way and turn into the other). I'm not sure the really positive aspects are positive ENOUGH to allow the hard ones to be handled constructively. I was optimistic before in my marriage and got nailed. I'm not eager for that to happen twice.

rahu said:

the composite chart shows there is much excitment and intensity here. there seems to bequite a lot socializing/partying. the mercury/venus/sun/stellium shows the emotional/physical attraction and openess and laughter. but uranus is opposed to jupiter, which increases the intensity but does not bode wellfor a steady relationship. this realtionship though intense may brunout and end abruptly. it is the chance you take when commiting to a uranus influence. with the pluto/venus and pluto /sun midpoints conjunct uranus, it is almost a certainly, this will end abruptly with no adequate reasons given. enjoy the moment.

... my feeling are that this relations came together ardently and suddenly in early summer 10 and will become more passionate and intense as the month progress. there is a underlying impulse to commitment to marriage, but these good intentions will not come to fruition though you still have several months of intensity left.

on the negative side this relationship will probably break up just before christmas though it could sustain itself til spring before the intensity draws you apart.

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Some specific background:

We met via small group get-togethers to play geeky board-games. In fact, initially I was put out that D. was invited to one, as I didn't know him and had wanted to invite a grad student of mine instead who seemed shy (and I'd wanted to get him more involved/meet other grad students). Instead, this "D." guy got invited. Fateful choice. *grin* That was over a year ago, in fact.

While I recognized him as attractive from the get go, it was FAR from anything instant in terms of mutual attraction. By the end of that first night, I'd decided he was okay after all, but that was really about it. The development of the rest took time.

Gradually, we discovered we had enough of the same things in common that we began to hang out, but definitely not as a date. We get together, talk for hours about history stuff that would bore most people to tears (we're both history professors), and our conversations on the phone that would take other people 5 or 10 minutes take an hour because they range all over the place and we think of something more to say fairly effortlessly.

Such easy conversation is NOT natural for me. I like to talk and I'm not precisely shy, but with most people, I run out of things to say or feel compelled to play the role of "conversation facilitator." I never, ever have to do that with D. Finding a place to hang up/go home/stop talking is more of a problem than finding more to talk about. Ha. The *ease* of such wide-ranging communication is rare (and precious) to me in and of itself. From things he's said, I think he feels at least somewhat the same, but I can't read his mind and that's a tough thing to ask without it being a leading question: "Yes, just how DO you feel about me ...?" *grin*

rahu said:

no question there is a magic, idealism and tantric sexual energy. love and learn from these inspired impulses. but, again, live in the moment and don't build dream castles as they will not form.

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I took this a little out of order because I want to piggy-back on the above in order to outline one of my primary uncertainties in pursuing this, aside from the very Uranus energy you pointed to or his Saturn squaring my Sun and Pluto conjunct it.

I am unsure to what degree *sexual* attraction is present on BOTH sides. I'm attracted to him, certainly. But I'm resisting it because, as noted, common sense warns caution. There was an interesting discussion of the Yod in my chart in another topic, and it's possible/likely impact on how I form relationships here. While I asked about the Yod initially, I didn't make ANY connection between it and this whole current thing with D., but the subsequent discussion made me re-evaluate it, and perhaps the current triggering of my natal Yod with "things beyond my control" (outlined below) is meant to move this forward in order to learn something from taking a chance -- even if I know it might (eventually) end badly. It's ending badly immediately that worries me.

I'm not fond of futility, and I've HAD plenty of experience with rejection. I don't need more of that lesson. I might entertain the possibility of a relatively brief, intense love affair as a way of growing past my cautious nature, but I don't need to throw monkey-wrenches into the machinery just to see that they break things. I already know they can break things. Baring my feelings is counterproductive if he's just going to say, "Sorry, not there for me," or worse, "Ew!" ... and then have a very rare friendship "get weird" as a result of Things Said That Should Have Been Left Unsaid.

It's pretty clear to me that he has never considered me as potential date material. His Scorp rising may cause him to withhold information (especially about his feelings) until he gets to know a person, but once he makes the decision to trust you, he *trusts*. And in what he DOES say, he's extremely WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get). He is one of the more straightforward people I know (and in fact, gets a tad irritated if his words are doubted). I like this about him. I see it as (among other things) the Neptune-Venus in Sagi in his first house. He's an idealist in some ways, very principled, and Sagi-blunt in his affections (he doesn't pretend to like people he doesn't like), loyal and faithful. That's the good stuff.

There's the bad side to that conjunction too, including a tendency to idealize, excuse, and not always see what's really going on in his relationships. We BOTH have stress aspects between Venus and Neptune in our natal charts that I'm very aware of as potential blind-spots. Mine's a square, his is a conjunction. I've learned already (and continue to learn) I can't idealize a lover. He's been learning that lesson too, especially in the last few years. So I've thought LONG and hard about what a nest of snakes that could be if our mutual tendency to idealize/be disappointed with reality is not addressed at the VERY beginning and communication kept open. I'm doing my darndest NOT to idealize him.

Anyway, back to the intensity thing. After some months of just being basic acquaintances/colleagues who shared similar views on teaching, a deeper friendship built very fast yes, right around late spring/early summer (began in early March, in fact), but not as a love relationship. As noted, I don't think he ever considered me as a potential partner for a variety of reasons from the age difference (I'm 9 years older), to the fact I have a higher degree and in "departmental hierarchy" I'm above him (not in a "boss" sort of way; I'm tenure-track faculty while he's part-time), to the fact I have cats (to which he's allergic), to the fact I was overweight (until somewhat recently) while he's more fitness conscious and (given previous girlfriends) likes his women thin.

So from what I've seen of his previous girlfriends, I'm not his physical type, and given what I know of him, I think he sizes up women/girls and decides at the outset "attracted or not?" then relates as "potential date" or "just friends" without reconsidering the issue. (He has a number of simple friends who are women and has a wonderful ability to treat women with respect as equals, but platonic with him really is *platonic*.) We knew each other a good 6-9 months before we quite realized how well we got on, and I was relegated to the position of "buddy" early-on. I doubt he's ever revisited that (until perhaps very recently, and I'm dubious of that). Nor did I see him as more than an acquaintance for a while. Unlike him, however, I've had past friendships take a new turn. For him, he absolutely NEEDS friendship with his girlfriends (he's said so), but rarely starts dating people who were previously "just" friends.

That brings me to the shifting axis -- and whether it is, could (or whether I even want it to!). As noted, I'm quite sure he hasn't/doesn't see me presently as a romantic potential, and in fact was reconsidering a return to dating an ex-girlfriend until this very week. The spring advanced *our* friendship rather rapidly, but at a head-level. Emotionally, he was thinking about getting reinvolved with the ex- after having been dead-set against it for a while. That owes, I think, to some transits to his natal chart (just as I'm having the heavy-hitters up there hit me in different ways right now), but the upshot is that I was NOT a romantic consideration.

This week, several things came together that led him (last I talked to him) to decide to back off on the ex-, that he really didn't want to revisit that, as well as an additional, sudden (Uranian?) problem from a different, mutual friend/acquaintance who's having her *own* marital problems. This young woman is part of the larger group of friends through whom we met, so we've all known each other a while but neither of us are particularly close to her (in fact, she often irritates him; he views her as flighty and emotional). Last year, she married a fellow who she brings to things only sometimes. Now, for several reasons, they're having problems and -- for reasons that are not clear to any of those in the group who know her, she has fixed on *D.* with a huge, obsessive crush that, quite frankly, has flipped him out. (He called me having a major meltdown after a clash with her last Monday. He was completely clueless about a lot of things, some of which I've pieced together only subsequently after talking to *other* mutual friends ... it's Crazy Time, IOW. But the situation with her mostly led him to do some hard thinking about what was really occupying him at the moment: his ex- and led him to clarify some stuff. So it was weirdly useful to him.)

In any case, this young lady is a newly minted therapist, still doing some training, so she's convinced she knows more than she knows. (I used to do hospice, and I recall how much you learn that you *don't* know that first year. Caution is the big lesson.) But unfortunately, she's using her knowledge of human psychology in very dangerous ways to attempt to manipulate -- uninvited psychoanalysis of friends, pushing issues when she's been asked to stop ... things that are ethically problematic. In short, she's an emotional wild card with the potential to do a LOT of damage and enough delusions that she thinks she's "helping" when her motivations are primarily self-interested sublimated jealousy. (Again, this isn't just my analysis of things. It's the general consensus of the larger group. D. has also picked up on her craziness, although he's unaware of the full picture since it involves him.)

In any case, she's convinced he's trying to "play" her, me. and other girls. This is not the case. (As I pointed out to a mutual friend, had Dan wanted to"play" me, he could have had me in bed back in May!) In fact, the only thing I'm confused about is whether he *could* feel sexual/physical attraction if I revealed that my own feelings have changed. I think there might could be more, but whether there *should* be is a good question in itself. I've at least entertained the possibility. I'm not so sure he has. Despite his Scorp Rising, he's a true Libra Sun and Sagi-Venus and doesn't deceive on that level that she seems to fear.

In fact, I'm uncomfortable with the number of things that he doesn't know at present, but some of this stuff is not mine to reveal. (I do think he'd understand, and honor, the boundaries of confidences, but he'd have to calm down first.) Anyway, I've considered the idea that I should at least come clean to him about what *I* feel, because him coming to me with his relationship issues is just a little *weird*. I've told him that I'm hardly unbiased, but he doesn't realize quite what that means and I can't explain without things getting complicated fast. But I have been upfront with him about the fact I'm not an unbiased observer.

Part of my reluctance to reveal my feelings is that apparently this young woman flat told him she had feelings for him, and that's a large part of what flipped him out. He has *serious* issues with adultery, and she's married. It all led to some extreme reactions from him, that in turn led him to call me and start the conversation with, "I need to talk to somebody who's SANE." It would hardly help this whole thing if the "sane" person turns around and says, "Oh, btw, I have feelings for you too ..."

But I'm still not comfortable with him not knowing given the sudden insanity of everything. Unfortunately, there's no opportunity to sit down privately and explain without being interrupted in the immediate future. And I really DO value the friendship, so I'm reluctant to risk it ... even as I'm increasingly aware maybe that's what the Yod is "activating" ... forcing me to move past my cautious Moon-Saturn sextile and *risk* on the Sun-Mars sextile instead.

Then I look at our charts and I'm not sure it's a good idea, as it could blow up even worse in the future. Not to mention I'm not convinced that he actually FEELS any romantic/sexual attraction in the first place. Likes me a lot, yes. Cares about me, yes. Wants to date me ... maybe not. Yet I feel like everything is just a spring that getting tightened until it's going to snap (and not in a pretty way). I keep looking at current transits in both our charts to see if I can find a good time (that's actually available to us) to perhaps sit down and talk (although how far that goes we'll have to see). But I don't know.

(That's also why I was interested in timing, as I don't know if the current craziness could be a/the Uranian event that drives a wedge, but it seems a bit early.)

The Davison Chart

Kenoshamaensa said:

...There was an interesting discussion of the Yod in my chart in another topic, and it's possible/likely impact on how I form relationships here. While I asked about the Yod initially, I didn't make ANY connection between it and this whole current thing with D., but the subsequent discussion made me re-evaluate it, and perhaps the current triggering of my natal Yod with "things beyond my control" (outlined below) is meant to move this forward in order to learn something from taking a chance -- even if I know it might (eventually) end badly.

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Davison/Relationship Charts (imo) show the astrological purpose of a relationship, K....So, (if this is about your Yod) I'd expect it appear in the Davison Chart for "You+Dan"...

[Note :- I've looked already...and it has an exact Saturn/Moon opposition; an exact Sun/Mars trine and a Leo ascendant ruled by an exhalted Aries Sun that sits in the middle of a Saturn/Venus/Sun/Mercury/Chiron stellium...and an anaretic degree North Node in Pisces/9th, urging the two of you to learn about "merging Self with others".]

EJ

Hi, EJ! Your ears must have been burning when I mentioned the yod discussion. *grin*

In any case, it struck me later how things were starting to really feel "out of (my) control" and spiraling, as yods are said to do, and I'd just been asking about the yod. I didn't put it together with *this* situation when asking (despite the 7th house sun at the apex ... a sort of "duh" hint) because I'd been thinking in different directions about other things I'd been trying to accomplish this summer that had largely fallen through.

In any case, I'm unfamiliar with the Davison chart, although I did a quick search online. My books are all for composites (e.g., Hand) and synastry. I ran the chart and sort of went, "Wow ... I have no idea what that all means, but wow!" LOL! There's a double-yod there. *grin* But there are different aspects. The Sun-Venus-Mercury conjunction is still there, but now with curbing (or stabilizing?) Saturn in the mix, and Chiron. And while in the composite, the Sun-Venus was a very close conjunction, here I'm not sure whether to even count it. What do you typically use as orbs? Traditional (so 8-10 for conjunction), or smaller orbs? Conjunction or no, it's still a big stellum so they're all resonating together up there at the MC.

It's just that I'm unfamiliar with this type of chart or how to read it. For instance, does the Venus-Moon opposition indicate ease of interpersonal relating, or difficulty doing so? Saturn and Venus are much closer here that Sun and Venus, and I doubt that's terribly good. Jupiter and Uranus are conjunct, suggesting instability still? But Mars is now trine the whole Sun-stellum up there.

I was also looking at placements of rulers for things like the 4th house Libra (Venus at the MC in the 10th), and of the 5th house romance Scorpio (Pluto from the 3rd, but Mars from the 5th, and does Davison work better with new rulers or traditional rulers like horary?)

It's a whole new thing to learn!

(Adding the chart for those who want to see it ...)

Kenoshamaensa, looking at your Davison chart made me realise we share a very similar Yod in our respective (Davison) charts. However, in my Davison, the yod has a Saturn-Sun-Vertex conjunction in (late Aries / very early Taurus - anaretic degree).

Seeing the outer planets involved makes me think that this could be generational and if this is so, does that mean our generation is learning the same relationship lesson(s)? I'm sure EJ can confirm this....

Re: Charts in Synastry, Composite and Relationship

Kenoshamaensa said:

...I'm unfamiliar with the Davison chart

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The following link might help, K... http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com/relationshipdavidson26.0.htm

...There's a double-yod there.

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The qcx orb for Venus/Neptune is too wide...Saturn/Neptune/Mid-point of (Pluto+Jupiter+Uranus) is a within-orbs Yod, though.

...The Sun-Venus-Mercury conjunction is still there, but now with curbing (or stabilizing?) Saturn in the mix, and Chiron.

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An Aries conjunction (incorprating Saturn+Chiron) in the Davison, but a Libra conjunction (incorporating Uranus+Pluto) in the composite...So, an opportunity to see the Sun/Venus/Mercury combination working in two different ways......(specifically) in your relationship with Dan.

[Note : Astro.com use the Davison to analyse non-sexual relationships between two people, and the Composite to analyse relationships between "couples"......So, on that basis, all this Davison "fire" is presumably non-sexual.]

...And while in the composite, the Sun-Venus was a very close conjunction, here I'm not sure whether to even count it. What do you typically use as orbs? Traditional (so 8-10 for conjunction), or smaller orbs? Conjunction or no, it's still a big stellum so they're all resonating together up there at the MC.

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We use the same orbs as in natal chart analysis...So, Sun/Venus counts as a conjunction for me (but others would discount it)...

And here, the "piggy-back" principle applies to make this a united stellium...[NN->Chiron->Mercury->Sun->Venus->Saturn has each step "within orb", making an unbroken linked chain of conjunctions that work together.]

...I'm unfamiliar with this type of chart or how to read it.

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A Davison is a natal chart...(of a relation rather than a person)...and is read in exactly the same way...but we interpret the indicators with a slightly different "slant", and express our conclusions in relationship terms.

...For instance, does the Venus-Moon opposition indicate ease of interpersonal relating, or difficulty doing so? Saturn and Venus are much closer here than Sun and Venus, and I doubt that's terribly good. Jupiter and Uranus are conjunct, suggesting instability still? But Mars is now trine the whole Sun-stellum up there.

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As in natal charts for an individual...the Aries Venus in 10th/Libra Moon in 4th opposition indicates a conflict between the conscious Venus desire to be seen as unfettered by relationships and the Moon's subconscious desire to be in a relationship...So in this "non-sexual"/Davison relationship chart, it's asking the two of you to consider (and resolve) your conflict about whether or not to be a Composite chart "couple".

The close conjunction of Saturn/Venus in Aries/10th indicates that both parties are mature enough to sacrifice/overcome the desire to be "unfettered".

The (anaretic degree) Jupiter teacher in Virgo combines (in 3rd house) with the Uranus risk-taker in Libra...urging the two of you to "learn by taking a risk".

Mars in Sagittarius/5th trining the Sun-centred stellium is emphasising the "pleasure of learning by being adventurous"

So, we appear to have a non-sexual Davison relationship chart, whose purpose is to urge the two people to risk the experience of being a "couple"

]...I was also looking at placements of rulers for things like the 4th house Libra (Venus at the MC in the 10th), and of the 5th house romance Scorpio (Pluto from the 3rd, but Mars from the 5th, and does Davison work better with new rulers or traditional rulers like horary?)

Click to expand...

Yes...rulerships apply to the Davison chart in the same way as in natal charts...using Modern or Traditional rulers, according to our personal preference.

...It's a whole new thing to learn!

Click to expand...

Individual chart for understanding each person : Synastry chart for understanding the personality clashes between two people : Composite chart to ascertain how they appear to outsiders, as a "couple" : Davison Relationship chart to ascertain the astrological purpose/what two people can learn from non-sexual inter-action with each other.

EJ

Generational aspects and configurations

07.Re said:

...my Davison chart yod has a Saturn-Sun-Vertex conjunction in (late Aries / very early Taurus - anaretic degree)...

...Seeing the outer planets involved (in both this and K's yod) makes me think that it could be generational and if this is so, does that mean our generation is learning the same relationship lesson(s)?

Click to expand...

[Background note : I view aspects involving outer planets as "evolutionary"...indicating social change that must take place, to ensure we (our Souls) evolve as the Source intends...and involving whole generations, to ensure they do take place (because of the sheer volume of incarnated Souls/"targets" being influenced by the planets).]

With that in mind, I agree that your generation is learning the same relationship lesson 07.Re...but in different ways and areas/houses.

Thus, most of us born in the 20th Century have a Neptune/Pluto sextile in our natal chart...but each generation has these two planets in different signs...(Scorpio/Virgo for K's and Libra/Leo for mine, for example)...So we are all learning something about relationships, but what that is depends upon the specific generation into which we were born...

And, the particular areas of life where it is being learned is detemined by the houses occupied by Neptune/Pluto in each of our charts...

Consequently, each generation is learning the same thing (within the Neptune/Pluto evolutionary cycle)...mostly unconsciously rather than consciously...but it's being taught in so many different ways (through the houses) that very few people perceive the common thread of evolution underlying the transformation of their thinking/outlook due personal experiences/events in life.

Those who are aware of their individual contribution to this evolutionary process become conscious "co-creators" with the Source....Those who are not aware of it experience life as a series of unrelated events, without any pattern and over which they have no control...

[...But, we are way off-topic now]

EJ

Re: Generational aspects and configurations

EJ, I knew you'd be so good as to help with this question. Thank you

You provided a clear explanation as to the Pluto-Neptune sextile. I would also think that for those with Pluto in Libra (as I have), this learning is especially important.

Sadly though, many people isolate themselves and hide behind computer screens instead of interacting with other human beings in the real world. Hence I'm not so sure we're on track as a generation, for learning this Pluto-Neptune lesson.

Re: Charts in Synastry, Composite and Relationship

Ohhh, I like the potential of this Davison chart. Thank you, EJ. One of my own interests has been the ties between family charts, and I've been using synastry and composite, which is no doubt why I find synastry more interesting ... but a new "toy" to learn!

And thanks for the link. I've used Bob Marks pages before.

Btw, any (newer) books y'all find particularly useful on synastry? I've got a shelf full from when I was learning, but realized I haven't much added to it in 10 years, so I bopped over to Amazon to see if there was anything new. I found an updated/revised version of Steven and Jodie Forrest's Skymates, and I've always liked his stuff, although I never actually bought the original of *this* text. And any thoughts on the Rod Suskin book? I think I'll at least pick up Davison's book on it to add to my collection.

-----------------

07. Re -- I like the generational question you asked. Working with generational aspects and how to interpret them within natal charts interests me for many of the reasons EJ outlined. What he talked about is how I've been looking at them too ... how does THIS individual express the energy found in her/his generation, and in what areas of life? Maybe that's my Merc involved IN one of those. Ha! (And I don't mind the somewhat drifting topic conversation as it winds up fitting into the whole in a tangential way ... and I'm always interested in learning.)

Anyway, for me, I've got my Mercury involved in the larger Pluto-Uranus conjunction sextile Neptune of that early '60s generation (tail-end of the baby boomers) and that swept the nation through the 60s. As a child of that, it obviously impacted my early life, and as my brother was much older than me (by nearly 18 years ... he opened the baby boom and I closed it), I was that much more "drawn in" to the generational clashes of the mid/late '60s because my brother and father were often quarreling about it.

E.g., I internalized it, and my way of try to understand it is to WRITE (and teach) about some of those themes. My fiction tends to be message driven and my teaching to a purpose, not esoteric knowledge (Hello, Virgo!). And I often use (especially in fiction, but less so in academia) intimate interpersonal relationships to explore these larger thematic issues (Hello, 7th house!). Ha.

So it actually does figure into relationships for me. I need to sit down with the Davidson chart and look at how it expresses that energy, since I feel it perhaps more than some who don't have a personal planet involved (or as closely involved as my Mercury is with Pluto). Being a generation behind me, Dan's Pluto-Neptune sextile is in early Libra and Sagi, and his Venus is conjunct Neptune, which is another personal planet involved, but with the other planet (and not as close as my Mercury to Pluto). In his case, it's his sun involved with Uranus (combust), not his Mercury.

Anyway, while poking around, I did find a comment about doing a Davison chart between the original Davison and each person's chart in order to determine how they each see the relationship/interact with it. I thought that interesting, but astrodeist won't do it (and my Nova program no longer runs on these new computers; I'm not even sure I've still got a copy). EJ, do you have a program that would let you? Would you mind running them and posting or messaging me the data? (Astrodeist won't save the chart from the special charts, or I can't figure out how to do it, and when I try to input the calculated lat. and long. to just run it as a natal, it tells me there's no such place, so it won't run the chart.)

EJ53 said:

Note : Astro.com use the Davison to analyse non-sexual relationships between two people, and the Composite to analyse relationships between "couples"......So, on that basis, all this Davison "fire" is presumably non-sexual.

Click to expand...

I think it definitely is for him, and was for me until earlier this spring. I'm not sure quite what changed for me. I'll examine transits around March and April. And I'm not sure if it would/can change for him. But there is a LOT of intellectual fire, as the 9th house suggests. We challenge each other's minds, but in an extremely positive way (it's why our conversations go on and on and on ...)

My simple fear/worry is just that any interest/curiosity about turning it sexual is entirely on my side of this equation and not his.

EJ53 said:

And here, the "piggy-back" principle applies to make this a united stellium. (NN->Chiron->Mercury->Sun->Venus->Saturn has each step "within orb", making an unbroken linked chain of conjunctions that work together.)

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Yes, that's how I tend to read stellums, too; wanted to make sure that principle applied.

EJ53 said:

A Davison is a natal chart...(of a relation rather than a person)...and is read in exactly the same way...but we interpret the indicators with a slightly different "slant", and express our conclusions in relationship terms.

Click to expand...

Good, that'll make it easier to learn. I'm going to run several with families (and perhaps friends) and do some practicing.

EJ53 said:

As in natal charts for an individual...the Aries Venus in 10th/Libra Moon in 4th opposition indicates a conflict between the conscious Venus desire to be seen as unfettered by relationships and the Moon's subconscious desire to be in a relationship...So in this "non-sexual"/Davison relationship chart, it's asking the two of you to consider (and resolve) your conflict about whether or not to be a Composite chart "couple".

The close conjunction of Saturn/Venus in Aries/10th indicates that both parties are mature enough to sacrifice/overcome the desire to be "unfettered".

The (anaretic degree) Jupiter teacher in Virgo combines (in 3rd house) with the Uranus risk-taker in Libra...urging the two of you to "learn by taking a risk".

Mars in Sagittarius/5th trining the Sun-centred stellium is emphasising the "pleasure of learning by being adventurous"

So, we appear to have a non-sexual Davison relationship chart, whose purpose is to urge the two people to risk the experience of being a "couple"

Click to expand...

Ha. Very interesting. And thank you. It's helpful, getting a handle on how to read this. I wish I had some idea of how he's thinking. That's part of why I want to try that trick with running the chart against his as a secondary Davison, see if it grants any insight.

Btw, I had a thought on the composite chart, if we look at it as how others see the relationship on the outside rather than how it's experienced internally (Davison and/or Synastry-emotions) ... Perhaps the presence of Uranus there (in addition to) destabilizing/insisting on freeness, also indicates that outside/others might regard the relationship as unconventional for the fact of the generational gap. This had crossed my mind anyway, as I have Uranus conjunct my descendant (albeit loosely) and I was once asked by an astrologer friend if my husband was younger than me. (The first was actually 2 years older, but only 1 year ahead in school, so we were effectively contemporaries.) We did, however, have an unusually "open" (not in a sexual sense) marriage, which was how I tended to read that. And 7th house is usually first marriage, not second, so I'm not sure how much it applies here. His Sun is conjunct Uranus.

I do notice my 9th house (second marriage) is the same as his rising sign, but the 9th house also rules advanced learning and he's a fellow professor (not that these are mutually exclusive readings, but I'm leery of reading TOO much into that placement). But my rising is not the same as his 7th house (he's never been married before). Neptune is, however, conjunct his Venus and my rising sign (Pisces) is in the first degree of his 4th house (I also find it funny that when we hang out, he tends to come over to my place, despite being allergic to my cats). That's all synastry stuff, but I find it suggestive, if far from conclusive. I think at least the placement of my rising on his 4th cusp means he finds a certain "comfort zone" with me, which would seem to be how it works out.

Re: Charts in Synastry, Composite and Relationship

Kenoshamaensa said:

One of my own interests has been the ties between family charts...

Click to expand...

As you may already know, K...this is also a major interest of R4VEN.

-

Re: Generational aspects and configurations

07.Re said:

...I would also think that for those with Pluto in Libra (as I have), this learning is especially important...

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Yes, 07.Re...I missed that one...

You have Libra Pluto + Sagittarius Neptune...Your Husband has Virgo Pluto + Scorpio Neptune...The Davison has (his) Virgo Pluto + Scorpio Neptune...

...So this relationship provides you both with an opportunity to experience two Neptune/Pluto generations, but only you with the potential to learn from that...

...That made me wonder how Neptune/Pluto might turn up in the Davison Charts between a parent and child (or those with a generational age gap)...So I checked the natals+Davison for myself and (25 years younger) son...I have Leo/Libra : He has Libra/Sagittarius : We have Virgo/Scorpio...So this relationship provides us both with experience of two generations, but the Neptune/Pluto evolutionary purpose of this specific Davison Chart is to provide each of us with an opportunity to understand the (Virgo/Scorpio) generation that falls between them (or perhaps the "evolutionary linking process" itself)...[Interesting "point for further pondering".]

EJ

Re: Charts in Synastry, Composite and Relationship

Kenoshamaensa said:

...EJ, do you have a program that would let you? Would you mind running them and posting or messaging me the data?

Click to expand...

I've PM'd the (Dan+K-D Davison) Davison Chart...Let me know if you want the (K+K-D Davison) Davison Chart as well.

...My simple fear/worry is just that any interest/curiosity about turning it sexual is entirely on my side of this equation and not his.

Click to expand...

The Davison Chart indicates that both of you should "take the risk"...but that doesn't necessarily mean (or need to be) with each other.

...if we look at it as how others see the (composite) relationship on the outside rather than how it's experienced internally (Davison and/or Synastry-emotions) ... Perhaps the presence of Uranus there (in addition to) destabilizing/insisting on freeness, also indicates that outside/others might regard the relationship as unconventional for the fact of the generational gap.

Click to expand...

Yes...or it might indicate that outsiders see the generation gap as being of concern to one (or both) of those in the relationship.

...my husband and I did have an unusually "open" marriage...His Sun is conjunct Uranus.

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I'd expect personal freedom and independence within the marriage to be particularly important to a Sun/Uranus person.

...I think at least the placement of my rising on his 4th cusp means he finds a certain "comfort zone" with me, which would seem to be how it works out.

Click to expand...

He could see you as a "mother" rather than "wife"...not because of the age gap, but because of this 4th house comfort zone...[If so, I'd expect it to appear in the chart I PM'd to you...assuming the theory behind that use of the Davison Chart is valid.]

EJ

Got the charts, EJ, thank you muchly for taking the time to run those for me. For a wide variety of reasons (most of which have nothing to do with US), things around here are getting plain batsh*t crazy (more with the woman I mentioned above in that long post who's fixated on him). Being the organized sort (ha), I'm trying to get a handle on these charts to have a bit of a compass in navigating this mess without ruining OUR friendship (Dan's and mine). At this point, I think it's inevitable that somebody is going to get hurt. I'd just like to minimize the damage. Crazy woman has now messed with my grad student and the mama lion sitting on my 6th house cusp has risen up to roar. ;> My students are my kids.

Anyway, back to the chart(s). The "mother" thing has occurred to me before -- that he might see me so -- but I think it would be "big sister." He has an older sister, in fact, with whom he gets along really well and we resemble each other just a little. I've never met her but immediately noticed it when I saw a picture of her. When Dan and I first became friends, I assumed he'd transferred to me some of the trust he puts in her, so I think that is certainly operative, and is one reason he tends to hang out here despite his cat allergy. He just takes Claritin as soon as he comes in the door. It's become a bit of a joke.

I was out last night with friends until very late and only got up about an hour ago, ha. But I looked a little more at the Davidson chart itself, and then at the Davidson chart you sent me that recombined the original with his natal chart into a secondary Davidson.

The theory behind what I was doing is found here:
http://www.panix.com/~gsk/LovePart2.html

I can't speak to its accuracy, but I read through the example and it sounded sound enough. I already know how I feel about him (and the relationship), but I was curious about how his chart might recombine with the original Davidson, for how he might be looking at things. For that, both the synastry you sent and this second one are extremely helpful.

Looking at what I'll call the Davison2 (his natal chart + the original Davison chart between us) -- posted below -- what really grabs me (in part due to the narrow orbs that cuts out other things), is the minor grand trine with the focal point.

The chart ruler (Neptune) is in the opening (but not critical) degree of Sagittarius in the 8th house, conjunct Jupiter in Scorpio, which rules that house, again not at a critical degree quite. But if I understand rulers and deposits, Jupiter deposits Neptune in that house, yes? So if I read that correctly, idealistic/fuzzy Neptune in Sagi wants/sees/feels a higher mind intimate connection but it's meeting expansive Jupiter in Scorpio, the sight of both intensity and sex, in the house it both naturally and rules by house placement. The good side would be (again, going back to the themes that are all over these Davison charts) the possibility of an ideal "higher" love combined with sexual energy that could take it there. The bad side is that he's deluding himself about what's possible. (I'll get back to Saturn in a moment.)

One one wing of the m-g-trine sits the moon in the 11th house in constricting Capricorn, and on the other magnetic Pluto conjunct both the Vertex AND the descendant in stabilizing/pragmatic Virgo.

I'd read that as a hell of a lot of energy that's emotional, idealistic, AND sexual.

And then Saturn sits at the base of it all in the 2nd house Libra , aiming it like an arrow/making a kite of it. Saturn places restrictions, and would here, I think, indicate a whole bunch of pragmatic uncertainties on his part, holding back that minor-grand-trine energy, but as Saturn is in exaltation in Libra, it may allow the "higher" vibration of Saturn, making him useful, not just a wet blanket, plus Saturn makes (loose) trines to the moon and Pluto. Kites in charts make happy landings? (That's what I've always heard.) The ambiguity on his part seems pretty clear, but I'd read it as wanting to fly if given the chance. But I'd like to know if others would confirm that reading.

I also notice the trine/sextile of this opposition to fiery Leo Mercury in the 5th house, suggesting (maybe) that (honest/emotional?) communication is the way to resolve the opposition? Of course, keeping communication open is the key to ANY relationship, so that's a bit of a no brainer, but with a Neptune/Jupiter combo, perhaps absolutely essential. (I should also add that I consider Jupiter a little wide to really be in sextile with Mercury, but given the aspect pattern, I'd put them together.)

Re: Generational aspects and configurations

[Interesting "point for further pondering".]

Click to expand...

As long as its you doing the 'pondering'... because to be honest, it just confuses me...

Oops, did I just admit to that?!

Davison2

Kenoshamaensa said:

...when I try to input the calculated lat. and long. to just run the Davison as a natal, Astro.com tells me there's no such place, so it won't run the chart.

Click to expand...

Evansville, Indiana is close enough (37N58 087W33)...with a local time of 12.23pm.

Kenoshamaensa said:

...problems with the woman I mentioned above in that long post who's fixated on him

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Might be worth you looking privately at how she views your Davison Relationship with Dan.

...The "mother" thing has occurred to me before...that he might see me as a "big sister."

Click to expand...

In the Davison2, he sees you as a strong/high status woman within his society (Moon in Capricorn/11th)...who is comfortable with expressing her femininity and caring nature (Venus+Sun in Cancer/4th)...but with chart rulers (Jupiter+Neptune) in the 8th house of sex (and signs of sex+adventure respectively) he is not seeing you as a mother/big sister.

...I already know how I feel about him (and the relationship)

Click to expand...

So a Davison2 with your natal data provides a means of testing the theory.

...In the Davison2, what really grabs me is the minor grand trine and it's focal point of...chart ruler (Neptune) in the opening degree of Sagittarius in the 8th house, conjunct (it's sign ruler) Jupiter in Scorpio/8th (which Pluto in Virgo/7th rules by both sign and house).

Thus Jupiter deposits Neptune (but is then disposited itself by Pluto...(the planet of transformation)...in the sign of rational thinking, and house of intimate partners.

...So idealistic/fuzzy Neptune in Sagi wants/sees/feels a higher mind intimate connection but it's meeting expansive (ruler) Jupiter in Scorpio, the sign of both intensity and sex. The good side would be the possibility of an ideal "higher" love combined with sexual energy that could take it there. The bad side is that he's deluding himself about what's possible.

Click to expand...

"Confused and confusing" idealistic Neptune really wants what adventurous Jupiter needs...to tranform this relationship from platonic Davison to sexual Composite.

...I'd read constricting Capricorn moon in the 11th house trine magnetic Pluto (on Dsc and conjunct the Vertex) in stabilizing/pragmatic Virgo...as a hell of a lot of energy that's emotional, idealistic, AND sexual.

Click to expand...

Fated and transformative sexual attraction to a high-status woman.

...then Saturn in the 2nd house Libra (and making a kite of the MGT)...places restrictions/pragmatic uncertainties on his part...but (as Saturn is in exaltation in Libra) this kite might land happily. So, the ambiguity on his part seems pretty clear, but I'd read it as wanting to fly if given the chance (and I'd like to know if others would confirm that reading).

Click to expand...

Exhaltation here reflects Saturn's need to be "on best behaviour", as a wrong move could affect his reputation within the local environment (Gemini/2nd/3rd)...He is concerned that acting upon the MGT might "backfire", if he is reading you incorrectly...(A Neptunian blessing of most relationships where the two people are collegues having different status levels...If high-staus woman informs colleagues that lower-status man made an "unwanted sexual approach" to her, he can pretty much kiss goodbye to any chance of future promotion...and might even lose his job.)

...I also notice the trine/sextile of this opposition to fiery Leo Mercury in the 5th house, suggesting (maybe) that (honest/emotional?) communication is the way to resolve the opposition? Of course, keeping communication open is the key to ANY relationship, so that's a bit of a no brainer, but with a Neptune/Jupiter combo, perhaps absolutely essential. (I should also add that I consider Jupiter a little wide to really be in sextile with Mercury, but given the aspect pattern, I'd put them together.)

Click to expand...

Yes...Honest communication of emotions is the way to resolve almost every relationship issue...But, (imo) the status problem makes it almost impossible for that to come from him unless he gets the "all clear" signal to do so from you first...[If he gets it wrong, he risks losing his livelihood...If you get it wrong, you risk embarrassment...which (for me) is the real "no-brainer" issue here.]

EJ

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Re: Davison2

Man, I am slow replying... The semester started yesterday/today so things are crazy.

EJ53 said:

Might be worth you looking privately at how she views your Davison Relationship with Dan.

Click to expand...

I'd love to, but I have little info on her for a chart. The best I know is her birthday is June 18th (and that only via facebook). If I can tease the rest out of her, or even a year and place if not a time, I do plan to run her chart. She is very much a Gemini. But I'd also expect to see some powerful Pluto in her chart somewhere, along with a lot of moon and/or Neptunian influence. I'm not sure how much use a Davison chart is without her birthtime, but it'd give me planetary aspects, if not reliable houses. If her moon's cusping, I probably know enough about her to make a reliable guess where it would belong by sign, but I prefer to guess as little as possible.

EJ53 said:

In the Davison2, he sees you as a strong/high status woman within his society (Moon in Capricorn/11th)...who is comfortable with expressing her femininity and caring nature (Venus+Sun in Cancer/4th)...but with chart rulers (Jupiter+Neptune) in the 8th house of sex (and signs of sex+adventure respectively) he is not seeing you as a mother/big sister.

Click to expand...

Yeah, looking at the Davison2, that's what I was thinking, that there was some powerful sexual energy there, but I wanted to see if others saw the same and it wasn't just wishful thinking on my part. Ha.

EJ53 said:

So a Davison2 with your natal data provides a means of testing the theory.

Click to expand...

It might. I've posted it below (using the data you gave me and Evansville). I'm not sure I'm seeing the sexual power, but the chart ruler(s) are in the 11th, and we did meet via friends. There's a square to the 8th house ruler, which also rules the 11th house. There's a trine (Venus-Pluto) and square (Venus-Mars) to the ruler of the 5th. And the ruler of the 5th is in the first.

EJ53 said:

Thus Jupiter deposits Neptune (but is then disposited itself by Pluto...(the planet of transformation)...in the sign of rational thinking, and house of intimate partners.

"Confused and confusing" idealistic Neptune really wants what adventurous Jupiter needs...to tranform this relationship from platonic Davison to sexual Composite.

Fated and transformative sexual attraction to a high-status woman.

Click to expand...

Ha.

EJ53 said:

Exhaltation here reflects Saturn's need to be "on best behaviour", as a wrong move could affect his reputation within the local environment (Gemini/2nd/3rd)...He is concerned that acting upon the MGT might "backfire", if he is reading you incorrectly...(A Neptunian blessing of most relationships where the two people are collegues having different status levels...If high-staus woman informs colleagues that lower-status man made an "unwanted sexual approach" to her, he can pretty much kiss goodbye to any chance of future promotion...and might even lose his job.)

Yes...Honest communication of emotions is the way to resolve almost every relationship issue...But, (imo) the status problem makes it almost impossible for that to come from him unless he gets the "all clear" signal to do so from you first...[If he gets it wrong, he risks losing his livelihood...If you get it wrong, you risk embarrassment...which (for me) is the real "no-brainer" issue here.]

Click to expand...

That's interesting, and not something I'd considered. I think by this point he can probably guess I wouldn't bring him up on charges for just asking me out. Ha. But he's had some rather strange experiences involving miscommunication with women lately, so I think he's on edge, re-evaluating boundaries and how HE'S being read. So I'm sure he's "on his best behavior" as you noted, with regard to any and all interaction with all women, I think. We have cleared the air a bit about some aspects of our friendship, but haven't touched anything beyond the simple platonic ties. So it's back to the original Davison platonic chart. So there may indeed be the potential for more, but I suspect patience is a virtue right now. (I've currently got BOTH Venus and Mars crossing my 8th house in transit, and Mercury in the 7th, so I'm conscious that I may be inclined to leap first and look later, and taking a deep breath, then counting to 3 is likely wise. After the bizarre week we both just had from largely external pressures and drama llamas, some downtime may be in order. Mercury went retrograde, and it's probably not the best time for a conversation where clarity is important. Good time for reflection, though.

-------------

Another quick question ... if I understand correctly, because composites are cast from midpoints, it's no real use looking at current transits to the *composite* chart, correct, in terms of timing and immediate future?

Transits to Composite

Kenoshamaensa said:

...because composites are cast from midpoints, it's no real use looking at current transits to the *composite* chart, correct, in terms of timing and immediate future?

Click to expand...

Transits do apply in the normal way to a Composite, as the latter is a true mid-point chart of two (non-moving) natal charts...

...However, (as you probably know) the Progressed Composite Chart is calculated by progressing the two individual's natal charts and then calculating the mid-points between them...rather than progressing the Composite Chart itself.

[Note :- Since Davison's are a "true" natal chart based on time and space, they are progressed in the normal way.]

EJ

Re: Davison2

Kenoshamaensa said:

...In the Davison2 for myself...I'm not sure I'm seeing the sexual power, but the chart ruler(s) are in the 11th, and we did meet via friends. There's a square to the 8th house ruler, which also rules the 11th house. There's a trine (Venus-Pluto) and square (Venus-Mars) to the ruler of the 5th. And the ruler of the 5th is in the first.

Click to expand...

I was drawn immediately to the Venus/Moon opposition...because of a comment by Tim Wilson on this aspect, in another thread at http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=228418&postcount=10 ...pointing out that it can indicate a conscious/subconscious "conflict of interests"...(which reminded me of the conscious/unconscious sides of your natal bathtub configuration).