Is my Birth Time Correct??

Lion o ness

Lion o ness

Well-known member
Is the time on my birth certificate correct??? Am I an Aries or a Pisces ASC??

I had my chart rectified, because some things on my chart just didnt fit into place...

I was born in 72, I dont think doctors were really making a point the write down the exact time.. My mom was in labor for 3 days, and I was born a month early.. I was rushed out of the room, upon delievery, to be checked.

My birth Certificate gives a time of 9:40PM.. Which gives me an 0Aries Asc.. If the doctor was off my 3 mins, it puts me at a Pisces Asc..

I read up and Pisces fit me way better than Aries.. Aries fit some what, but not as much as Pisces..
With the Birth Chart my Asc would trine Neptune (would that give me the pisces feeling)

I really want to know if my birth certificate is correct...



I am Saturn... The birth Certificate is (h3 correct?? ) So then its Mars.
There is a trine with Saturn and Mars..
The Doctor is ruler of H6 (correct?)
The doctor is the moon, which squares Mars
Neptune is in H1. does that mean confusion with me?
Is my mom also Mars? (h10)

Still not sure if this is a yes or no...
 

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dr. farr

Well-known member
See my amended post, below...


(Magic 8 Ball gives a correct no answer to the horary question: 3rd whole sign house of documents is under Aries which = Mars which = a "no" answer according to 8 Ball rules)
 
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Lion o ness

Lion o ness

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
According to Sun/Cosmic time (see Daily Sun Data) on July 5th the Sun/Cosmos was 4 minutes and 29 seconds behind civil (mamade) clock time; therefore as far as the Sun/Cosmos is concerned, your were born @ 9:36 pm on July 5th.(Pisces ascendant,
Click to expand...

I checked this chart just to see what it looks like.. I wasnt born in Los Angeles. I was born in Central time zone..

This chart has me with an Asc at 9Aqua.

Ohhh and Jupiter is at 2Cap instead of 28Sag..
 
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tikana

tikana

Well-known member
hey Leo

information is correct
mars trines saturn
saturn is strong
moon just sextiled sun which rules the doctor

treat this as "is the rumor true?"

T
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
Sorry: in my previous post I corrected to Sun/Cosmic time based on July 5th birth date (which is actually the date of the horary)

If you were born on August 8th (any year), the Sun/Cosmic time is 5 minutes and 39 seconds slower than the civil (clock) time; if, then, your birth certificate listed 9:40 pm (daylight savings time) wherever you were born at, the Sun/Cosmic time is 5 minutes and 39 seconds slower than that, which means, according to Sun/Cosmic time ("real" time, aka Local Apparent Time) you were born @ 9:34:11 pm (daylight savings time) Therefore, you would indeed have a Pisces ascendant as your natal ascendant and yes, the time on your birth certificate is wrong according to "real" (Sun/Cosmic) time.
 
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Anachiel

Well-known member
Lion o ness and tikana, I agree; this is a third house matter.

But, the Moon is void, and in the 8th, so can the report (certificate) have valid information?

Also, Mars, Lord of the 3rd has no dignity, so that doesn't seem to match a report of any substance or value.

Moon separates from the Sun, the Lord of the 7th, so the news or report is of no benefit to the querent but, rather some other person.

Mars trine Saturn only shows the querent has the report but, not neccessarily the truth of the report.

Mercury, natural ruler of reports, appears peregrine and square Jupiter, who is in the 3rd, with no reception. Seems the report is flawed again.

Mercury and Jupiter both afflict the Asc. This does not bode well of the report for the querent.

What do you think?
 
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tikana

tikana

Well-known member
hi

moon void here means nothing further will be done which validates the querent.. when you get midsign void esp in 8th house .. querent is worried for nothing, which again backs that querent's worries are false

aspect to the sun came from the doctor - it is possitive i am not seeing a negative aspect.. meaning the doctor didnt lie or mislead

mercury cannot be peregrine because there is mino reception with jupiter

mars is not peregrine it holds itself in face

T
 
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Anachiel

Well-known member
tikana, Yep, yep, you're right...Mars is barely in face by minutes! lol, very true. And, Jup and Merc recpt by term and face, bit weak methinks to save either one of them tho. Rather see two of the minor dignities to cinch it.

Lilly stated that a Moon VOC means the report is lies...?

I see everyone's point on this chart, though. Hard one to call methinks, harder to prove....but interesting, very interesting.
 
tikana

tikana

Well-known member
here is the break down according to Deluce
retyping lilly is a paaaain

1. consider advantage or disadvange of a report
ruler of 1st house or the moon or dispositor of the moon of of 1st house ruler oois on the angle or in fixed sign
more esp if at the same time the moon oer mer be in angles or in fixed signs and in good aspect to benefics or the sun

if separateing from malefic and applying to benefics it is additional evidence of credibility

now

merc or moon applying to retro or merc retro - evil rumor
if lord of 1st or the moon or disposibtor of the moon or lord of 1st applyign to evil aspect with other planet esp from fixed - evil news
lord of asce combust and the moon is far south latitite are tokens that truth shall remain secret
merc conj square oppose mars esp in moveable sign and at the same time in cadent house is always deception
 
tikana

tikana

Well-known member
see here we have merc is on the angle and fixed
applying to evil planet with a sextile
sun would be dispositor of merc it is void
along with the moon
soo see it is credible
 
Lion o ness

Lion o ness

Well-known member
Thanks everyone for your input... Much appreciated...

Im a little confused though..

Tikana.. you think the certificate is correct?

Im not really worried about it per say, I would like to know for sure because of Astrology. Im really curious to know if its correct or not. I did have my chart rectified twice, once with Solar Arc's and 2nd to fit me... So Im pretty much sure its Pisces, and will probably stick with it, but I wanna know what the stars say about it..

I dont think the doctor lied or falsified info.. If anything I wonder if the time was rounded off.
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
Sorry: in my previous post I corrected to Sun/Cosmic time based on July 5th birth date (which is actually the date of the horary)

If you were born on August 8th (any year), the Sun/Cosmic time is 5 minutes and 39 seconds slower than the civil (clock) time; if, then, your birth certificate listed 9:40 pm (daylight savings time) wherever you were born at, the Sun/Cosmic time is 5 minutes and 39 seconds slower than that, which means, according to Sun/Cosmic time ("real" time, aka Local Apparent Time) you were born @ 9:34:11 pm (daylight savings time) Therefore, you would indeed have a Pisces ascendant as your natal ascendant and yes, the time on your birth certificate is wrong according to "real" (Sun/Cosmic) time.
Click to expand...

Is this what you are referring to when you say Cosmic Time dr.farr? The Equation of Time? Certainly when I checked, the figures agreed with your analysis http://www.wsanford.com/~wsanford/exo/sundials/equation_of_time.html
 
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tikana

tikana

Well-known member
i do

i quoted directly from horary book


Lion o ness said:
Thanks everyone for your input... Much appreciated...

Im a little confused though..

Tikana.. you think the certificate is correct?

Im not really worried about it per say, I would like to know for sure because of Astrology. Im really curious to know if its correct or not. I did have my chart rectified twice, once with Solar Arc's and 2nd to fit me... So Im pretty much sure its Pisces, and will probably stick with it, but I wanna know what the stars say about it..

I dont think the doctor lied or falsified info.. If anything I wonder if the time was rounded off.
Click to expand...


it is all the same in the face of horary...
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
JUPITERASC said:
Is this what you are referring to when you say Cosmic Time dr.farr? The Equation of Time? Certainly when I checked, the figures agreed with your analysis http://www.wsanford.com/~wsanford/exo/sundials/equation_of_time.html
Click to expand...


Yes it is: it is the Equation of Time.

Here we have something of interest re to the horary: yes, the document IS correct (not falsified) according to civil (man-made) clock time.
However, ASTROLOGICALLY (relative to the Sun and Cosmos-to THAT time) the document (time given on the birth certificate) is incorrect.
...so what time do you take as "correct"? Certainly for astrological purposes (such as determining the ascending sign) one would take Sun/Cosmic time as "correct", rather than man-made clock time?
I think so...
 
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JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
Yes it is: it is the Equation of Time.

Here we have something of interest re to the horary: yes, the document IS correct (not falsified) according to civil (man-made) clock time.
However, ASTROLOGICALLY (relative to the Sun and Cosmos-to THAT time) the document (time given on the birth certificate) is incorrect.
...so what time do you take as "correct"? Certainly for astrological purposes (such as determining the ascending sign) one would take Sun/Cosmic time as "correct", rather than man-made clock time?
I think so...
Click to expand...

So, dr.farr are you saying that astrological programmes do not take into account the Equation of Time then? Astrological programmes are computed solely according to civil time are they?
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
Yes that is correct: I specifically checked into this with Astro.com management, and they confirmed that their progam does not take the EOT into account. To the best of my knowledge only the Solar Fire program has an option (to be manually set) correcting for Local Apparent Time (ie, the EOT) None of the freely available horoscopic chart or planetary hour internet calculators correct for the EOT...
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
Yes that is correct: I specifically checked into this with Astro.com management, and they confirmed that their progam does not take the EOT into account. To the best of my knowledge only the Solar Fire program has an option (to be manually set) correcting for Local Apparent Time (ie, the EOT) None of the freely available horoscopic chart or planetary hour internet calculators correct for the EOT...
Click to expand...

As astro.com management freely admit that their programme is based on civil time, they need to tell those who use their site! This could explain the not uncommon need to 'rectify' charts by sometimes only a few minutes
Also, clearly, planetary hours (which date from an era when observations of sunrise/sunset were naked eye based and therefore based on LAP are entirely incorrect for 364 days of the year (by as much as fifteen minutes at the maximum shown on the EOT table!) So much for computers liberating us from papyrus and feathers.
In fact, planetary hours are correct on only one day a year - June 14 when the Equation of Time is precisely 0.00
Thank you for that information dr. farr, it is most useful as well as thought provoking :smile:
 
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