Using Solar Arcs to Rectify a Natal Chart

Arian Maverick

Well-known member
Wow, a lot has happened since I last read this thread! :eek:

Unukalhai,

I went to the site you linked to, clicked on the picture next to Download Astrolog32 (v. 1) - English version, and now I am at the Astrolog32 Binaries page. There are several links here and I am unsure which one to click, since I don't want to download the "wrong" version. Do you have Astrolog32 release version 1.30, Astrolog32 test version 1.33, or Astrolog32 CLI version 1.03? I hope you don't say the last one, because I clicked on the link and received an error message that "this site is temporarily unavailable."

My head's still spinning a bit from all of these shortcut codes, but when I have more time, I'll read through your directions carefully and see if I can stumble my way through the process--sort of like this smilie, who seems to think he can fly. I'm sure I'll get it...eventually. :30:

Unfortunately, I've been procrastinating on some work I have to do, but I'll return to this thread and respond to the other posts later today. Thank you, everyone, for your advice and support!

Atria,

I'd love to give this a try! Unfortunately, I don't know if I can come up with enough dates to use because I've never been married, never had a major accident, have never undergone surgery, haven't experienced the deaths of my parents or siblings, etc. I can give you the date of my grandmother's death, the date of death of two beloved pets, the date I signed some legal documents for my family, the date I got my license, the date of my high school graduation, the first day I attended college...but I'm probably not the best example to use for demonstration, as much as I'm dying to know what sign is on my Ascendant.

Lela,

I was able to download a demo version of Solar Fire, but it is only able to calculate charts in the 1930s :(

Arian Maverick
 
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Atria

Well-known member
Hello , thank you for your interest, all the events are important, those who you mentioned are useful too, with luck, maybe we can do it, sometimes a diary or an agend is important, the symbolic directions indicates important things and common things, cotidiane things too sometimes i have a problem, a lost of water in my house and i have a bad direction of Neptune to fourth house ( home) my teacher says to us to go shopping, woman clothe, when you have good directions of venus , and they work very well. At your chart Arian and for example to rectificate you can move saturn to midheaven if i am not wrong there are 14 degrees ,so at this age what happen to your mother or to your father or at your home because saturn make an opposition to four house, thinking in the analogy of the planet has and the houses he governs, in this case the eleven and midheaveaven, the same you try with mars you move it to four , you count the degrees 15 years what happen at that age , mars is the lord of eight , and is in the third house, may be a trip , Jupiter if you move it to IC 26 years old , is the lord of the nine house or studies, or a trip to another country and so on, all the events are important, with your pets may be a square at six , four, nine. Then we make a simple mathematic sum or rest, and i show how and we make a test with the future events with the others symbolic directins,This directions permit me to avoid some things, this april y said to my son to not drive at april 18 he has the symbolic direction uranus conjunct eight , but he dont listen my advice so he drive and he practically destroyed his car but he dont get hurt, i can explain why he was safe there were another indications that helps him. I send you the best and is very grateful to see the enthusiams you put at your work like moderators, and how you help others. Thank you starlink , for say that of my english , i ll try to improve it gradually.
 

Arian Maverick

Well-known member
At your chart Arian and for example to rectificate you can move saturn to midheaven if i am not wrong there are 14 degrees ,so at this age what happen to your mother or to your father or at your home because saturn make an opposition to four house, thinking in the analogy of the planet has and the houses he governs, in this case the eleven and midheaveaven

I did the math and have about 13 1/15 degrees (13 degrees 4') between my current Midheaven and my natal Saturn. However, as starlink mentioned in a post in the thread An Accidental Astrodienst Discover:

There is a difference between birth times with fast moving Suns and slow Moving Suns, so when you have a slow moving one (between March and September, must look again to know exactly) then you you have to take 1° of "making up time" into consideration. So if an aspect is exact at 17°= 17 years of age (when natal planet is at 0°), then the real happening will be a year later in the life of the person, at 18 years.

According to the chart Astrodienst provides, my Sun was moving at a speed of 59' 5" the day I was born--slightly less than a degree.

1 degree = 1 year

(59 5/60) / 60 = 709/720

709 degrees = 720 years

Unfortunately, this fraction can't be reduced.

If I was really good at math, I'd know exactly how the 13 1/15 degrees I mentioned before works into this equation...but I'm not, and I don't. :p

I'll take a stab at it anyway by converting 709/720 into a decimal and seeing what happens.

709/720 = 0.9847222222....

This number, multiplied by 13 1/5, equals 12.99833333... or 12 599/600. I believe this may be how old I would be when Saturn was exactly conjunct my Midheaven by solar arc progression, but again, a fraction doesn't tell us much--I want to know the age in years, months, and even days, if possible.

The 12 corresponds to twelve years, I believe; now I must attempt to figure out what fraction of a year 599/600 is. A year has 365.25 days--the .25 accounts for leap year, which adds an extra day to the calendar once every four years. I really hope I have this right so far. Take a deep breath...

599/600 = x/365.25

x=0.60875

Now I think I would multiply 0.60875 by 599 and arrive at 364.64125.

So I would have been 12 years and 364.64125 days old.

Hopefully, I'm not making too big of an assumption thinking that this would be the day before my thirteenth birthday--April 4, 2002. I'll have to think if anything happened around that time to either of my parents...

I "graduated" eighth grade in June 2003, so I believe I still would have been in seventh grade in April 2002. Nothing is ringing a bell at this time, unfortunately. My mother had an operation when I was in eighth grade, nothing too serious, but this would occur be about a year later. This doesn't make much sense, though, because I would think the time should go backwards instead of forwards; it seems much more likely that I was born before rather than after the time recorded on my birth certificate because even with a normal, uncomplicated delivery, nothing the time is usually an afterthought and may be done after the newborn is washed and measured. Can grandparents be involved in any way? I don't remember the exact year, but my "grandfather" (not my father's biological father) had a heart attack some time around late elementary school, and using the 1 degree = 1 year rule, this would move my Midheaven back about two degrees or so. Would I use the rule of derived houses to determine which house my "grandfather" would be signified by and see if this is significant in some way? My father's (fourth house) mother's (ten houses from the fourth, or the second house) partner (seventh house from the second, or eighth). But my grandmother divorced my biological grandfather, and I read somewhere that the second partner skips two or three houses--so would this perhaps correspond to the tenth or eleventh house, like you mentioned before? He also had treatment for throat cancer, but I can't remember if this was before or after.

I'd better conclude this message before my brain explodes! :eek:

Insomniac Edit: I've been trying to fall asleep for about three hours now, but all sorts of random thoughts keep flowing through my head that I feel like I've been having a conversation with myself. So before I keep myself up for another three hours, I wanted to write a reminder to myself that I may also be able to use the date I registered to the forums and the date I became moderator.

Arian Maverick
 
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unukalhai

Well-known member
Arian Maverick said:
I went to the site you linked to, clicked on the picture next to Download Astrolog32 (v. 1) - English version, and now I am at the Astrolog32 Binaries page. There are several links here and I am unsure which one to click, since I don't want to download the "wrong" version. Do you have Astrolog32 release version 1.30, Astrolog32 test version 1.33, or Astrolog32 CLI version 1.03? I hope you don't say the last one, because I clicked on the link and received an error message that "this site is temporarily unavailable."

My head's still spinning a bit from all of these shortcut codes, but when I have more time, I'll read through your directions carefully and see if I can stumble my way through the process--sort of like this smilie, who seems to think he can fly. I'm sure I'll get it...eventually. :30:

Astrolog32 v1.33 is what I've been using for a good year now, been working nicely.

Try back later, geocities limits the transfer bandwidth on their free sites, it will come back, don't worry. If you can't get at it, let me know and I'll upload a copy of it for ya :)

Pretty much all those functions are available through the menus if you choose to point n click... Although I really like the shortcut keys... I'm just a keyboard kinda dude, hehe. Quicker, and the shortcuts tend to sink in after you've used them a while. If you get used to the shortcut keys you can navigate through quite a bit of analysis in a fairly short period of time. My Mercury-Uranus conjunction demands lightning speed, lol...

Lots of good ideas from everyone!! :D
 

Sag Moon

Well-known member
I have been using Astrolog for many years now. The versions of much recent releases I found not to work well for me.

I use Verion 5.40.

I am woundering how you use the aforementioned Binasries?

And the SA program is not accrate it's a few yrs. to slow for some reason.

Any guidance would help.

Thx!
 

Atria

Well-known member
Hi Arian , you remember the exact day you graduated or the exact day your mother operation, and the day of your grand father heart attack ?, lets try that hipotesis to try to rectificate your chart , to do this method I need the day , then y can do the count is much easier than those large math operations , one year =one degree, five minutes = a month , six days= one minute ,one day = one second. I am going to search some examples to send you.
 

Atria

Well-known member
Hi Arian , you remember the exact day you graduated or the exact day your mother operation, and the day of your grand father heart attack ?, lets try that hipotesis to try to rectificate your chart , to do this method I need the day , then y can do the count is much easier than those large math operations , one year =one degree, five minutes = a month , six days= one minute ,one day = one second. I am going to search some examples to send you.
 

starlink

Well-known member
Themis, Solar Arc has to be looked at in combination with Secondary Progressions and transits. If there is an exact Solar Arc aspect in your chart but no Progressions (to natal) or strong transits (to natal) than not much will happen. SA directions should be backed up by progressions and transits.
But of course you can also only look at future trends by just using the Progressed chart and the transits of the slow planets, or doing a Solar return chart for a year look.
 

Arian Maverick

Well-known member
Hi Arian , you remember the exact day you graduated or the exact day your mother operation, and the day of your grand father heart attack ?, lets try that hipotesis to try to rectificate your chart , to do this method I need the day , then y can do the count is much easier than those large math operations , one year =one degree, five minutes = a month , six days= one minute ,one day = one second. I am going to search some examples to send you.

I graduated on June 25, 2007.

I actually attempted to get the exact date of my grandfather's heart attack as well as his cancer treatment yesterday, but unfortunately, his memory is sketchy. He said he had his heart attack in June when he was 62, ironically, right after he quit smoking; since he was born in late April 1935, it must have been in June 1997, although he guessed the year 1998. Three or four years later, "before summer" (he guessed the month of May), my grandfather had treatment for throat cancer, which lasted seventeen weeks. He originally gave me the year 2001 before changing it to 2002, but I believe this was derived from the approximated 1998 year of his heart attack, so this might have actually occurred one year earlier than his guess of 2001--2000. I'm actually leaning towards the year 2000 myself, because I think I would have remembered being in middle school when hearing of this news and visited him in the hospital, I still felt very much like a child.

He suggested that I ask my grandmother, who tends to have a better memory for dates; unfortunately, I haven't had an opportunity to see her since I asked these questions.

My mother had her operation in February 2003.

I apologize for not having more accurate dates for you; I'll do my best to ask questions of my parents and my grandmother.

Thank you for this help! :)

EDIT: I just created the solar arc chart for my mother for the approximate time of her operation, and Mars was tightly conjunct her natal Saturn, which I have conjunct her Ascendant in the birth chart I created for her; unfortunately, the time of birth is not found on either of my parents' birth certificates, so I've had to go by anecdotes, which aren't terribly reliable. My mother recalls being told she was born in the morning "before lunch" and this would likely give her a Scorpio Ascendant; the sign takes about two hours to cross the horizon in the northern hemisphere. If the Ascendant represents the physical body, and Mars represents cutting, I cannot think of a better indicator of surgery...

In my solar arc chart, Mars is located at 28 Gemini 53', which is getting near my Nadir. Unfortunately, I'd have to adjust my time of birth back almost ten minutes to get my Nadir conjunct this degree.

EDIT 2: My grandparents just visited, and although they don't believe they have the medical paperwork anymore, they're pretty sure my grandfather had the heart attack in June 1998; the cancer treatment occurred two or three years later.

Arian Maverick
 
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unukalhai

Well-known member
Sag Moon said:
I have been using Astrolog for many years now. The versions of much recent releases I found not to work well for me.

I use Verion 5.40.

I am woundering how you use the aforementioned Binasries?

And the SA program is not accrate it's a few yrs. to slow for some reason.

Any guidance would help.

Thx!

Ok... Looked into the details of Astrolog, Astrolog32 and solar arc calculations.

The current version of Astrolog (16 bit, version 5.41G) and Astrolog32 (32bit) do solar arc calculations properly and have results that match Kepler, as long as you have the swiss ephemeris installed, which of course is required for accurate calculation.

the old 5.40 (and earlier) 16 bit versions of Astrolog uses a manually specified direction rate. By default this is a degree per 365.25 days, the Sun's average speed. The Sun moves at a varying rate throughout the year. Most of the time the Sun will be moving at a different speed at birth, so to get a solid result from 5.40, you have to figure out the direction rate from the Sun's daily motion, manually. Not much fun!

This is the reason your calculations are off. Using my chart, the calculations using the average daily solar motion, 365.25 days per degree, throw the solar arc hits off about 1/2 degree, equal to 6 months of arc or 2 minutes of birthtime inaccuracy, as the angles move 1 degree in 4 earth minutes. If your natal Sun is especially slow or fast, several years arc inaccuracy is possible, especially in one's later years as the incorrect motion rate throws things even further off.

This was considered a bug (rightly so) and fixed in version 5.41G, and the wording in the user interface was also updated to "solar arc directions" to indicate this. 5.41G and all Astrolog32 versions compute the proper solar daily motion and use this automatically. This was logged as fix #100 in the astrolog 5.41G release notes.

Astrolog32 5.41g Release Notes said:
* 100. Changed calculations of Solar Arc. Original Astrolog calculates
there actually directions, where all planets and house cusps positions
are moved forward to an amount equal in degrees to the number of years
that have passed between the specified date and the chart in question.
Because real (even mean or average) motion of Sun isn't 1 degree per
day, resulting Solar Arc Sun position doesn't match with secondary
progressed Sun position (but they must match).

This fix was carried forward to all versions of Astrolog32, as well.

The latest 16bit Version 5.41G can be had from:
http://astrolog.offline.ee/astrolog/changed/changed.shtml

I uploaded a copy of Astrolog32 v1.33. This archive includes the program, the ephemeris files, and the atlas files, all in one download.

http://www.Justupit.com/7125113dffbdbe770d975a1eb2f82ac9

Download the zip, open it, and drag the ast32 folder (inside the zip) to the root of your C: drive (c:\). This creates c:\ast32, and the needed sub-folders. The executable is c:\ast32\main\astrolog32.exe, simply run it. Create a shortcut on your desktop for ease of access. There is no setup to run.
 

Arian Maverick

Well-known member
I've finally got version 5.41! :D

Now I'll have to go back and reread your instructions for solar arcs and see if the process is any easier now that we're both using the same version ;)

Thanks so much!

Arian Maverick
 

Atria

Well-known member
Hi, Arian with patience you will obtain dates from your past but also from the future are very useful, when my teacher rectificate my chart i didnt remember almost anything only the date of marriage, and birth of my children, only four dates, but he with effort he arrives ,with only one date is very difficult to rectificate, only the graduation, may be a hipotesis of pluto, a trine to the ascendant or a conjunction to nine house, did you make a trip near your graduation? dont give up. The best Atria
 

Atria

Well-known member
Hi Starlink and Andonis too, if you want to try the rectification of your natal charts we can do it with the data or the events of your life you can collect , more data the rectification is easier, few more difficult, the rectification is good for many reasons ,and it allows your to use the multiple keys( symbolic directions) of Spicasc all data are welcome, Spicasc and Morin the VIllefranche teachs us that symbolic directions (multiple keys) are stronger than transits, his teacher make a surgery with good symbolic direction and bad transits, his surgery was exitous, unluckily Arian has only one event the graduation, but i hope with more time he will have more, I am going to search examples, better to begin with a heaven more auspicious than these days, we were talking of eclipses in the other thread, but to recolect data may take you some time. The better example is to experience yourself this directions day by day.
 

Sag Moon

Well-known member
Unukalhai
How do I trsansfer all my charts into the new version?

I might just be misreading somwthing you have written.

TIA
 

Arian Maverick

Well-known member
Hi, Arian with patience you will obtain dates from your past but also from the future are very useful, when my teacher rectificate my chart i didnt remember almost anything only the date of marriage, and birth of my children, only four dates, but he with effort he arrives ,with only one date is very difficult to rectificate, only the graduation, may be a hipotesis of pluto, a trine to the ascendant or a conjunction to nine house, did you make a trip near your graduation? dont give up. The best Atria

Oh, I hadn't even thought of using the dates of trips!

Yes, I went to Hawaii with my parents during spring vacation, which was several months before graduation. We certainly don't take luxury trips like this every year, but my mother loves to travel and has told me that she would gladly eat tuna fish and noodles every day for a year in order to save money for such an excursion. Fortunately, we didn't have to resort to such drastic measures ;)

This trip was from April 21 to April 28; we arrived home at 7 AM on April 29th, which was another important day because my high school's wind ensemble had qualified for the state band festival back in March, and the concert was that day.

Another big trip was to London in August 2004; it was either from the 14th to the 21st or the 21st to the 28th.

Arian Maverick
 
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unukalhai

Well-known member
Sag Moon said:
How do I trsansfer all my charts into the new version?

They should open right up, the file format for saved charts did not change.

If you are using the astrolog32 archive that I created, it looks for charts, by default, in the directory C:\AST32\CHARTS, so just copy them to that folder. You can change this by going to the Settings menu, Directory Settings option, and entering a new folder for your charts. Be sure to save that setting to astrolog32.dat (the main configuration file... File, Save Current Settings) if you change it.

One change they did make in astrolog32, from the previous versions, was to use the file extension ".dat" for charts -- When you go to open charts (File, Open Main Chart, or chart 2/3/4), it will only show you .dat files. You can have it display all files by selecting "All Files (*.*)" from the "Files of Types" selection in the open dialog. The file extension is just a naming thing, the chart files maintain the same format. When you save new charts, it defaults to saving them with a ".dat" extension.

Hope that helps :)
 

Sag Moon

Well-known member
OK- I DL'd the 5.41G version and then Highlighted all my charrts and transfrered them over ,but said "NO" when they wanted me to replace them with the old Files from 5.40.

More detail in this version ,thank you,I just hope that nothing goes awry using the newer version.

I still do not understand what this v133 File is suppose to do yet?

I will re-read what you wrote to try to figure it out.

One thing I am not seeing are the aspect lines that I had used in my aspect file that I use for transit charting.The aspects are tighter orbed for some reason I have not figured out as yet.
 
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starlink

Well-known member
Hello Atria! Thank you for giving so much information about rectification. It is awfully difficult. I too have (had I think) an Ascendant at 29°42 Scorpio, but it starts already with the information. Baby book says 6.49 PM, Birthcertificate states 7PM. Lovely!! As I have loads of data and made a chart of each of them starting with the data of relocations, then wedding, divorce. I noticed that the Progressed planets to my Natal (incl. Asc. and MC) are usually very helpful as well. I had a Progr. Asc. opposing Uranus and SA Mercury exactly at 26° Taurus, opposing my new 26° Asc.when I relocated to Peru in 1972. The Solar Arc MC (rectified to 20°32')exactly trined my Sun. But SA Uranus did not touch anything!! It was at 13° Cancer.Earlier on in 1956, our family had to leave Indonesia because Sukarno threw out all the Dutch. Again, no SA Uranus,(it was at 28° Gemini, close to inconjuncting Asc) but SA Moon exactly at 26 Scorpio , conjunct Asc. and SA Mars also at 26° (Aries) exactly inconjuncted my Asc. SA PLUTO (supposed ruler Asc.) sextiled exactly my natal Uranus.
Solar Arc MC exactly trined my Mercury, that's why I thought, Bingo, I take 26° Scorpio as my Ascendant instead of 29° and I got 20°.32 on the MC. BUT THIS MEANS THAT I WAS BORN HALF AN HOUR OR 15 MINUTES EARLIER THAN MENTIONED in my babybook. Could that be possible?

Going on I find in the relocation of 1980 SA Uranus at 21° Cancer, no exact hit, unless maybe to MC, a half sextile, but he conjuncted my 9th house cusp exactly at 21°. SA Mars exactly conjuncted my natal Uranus and SA Moon exactly opposed natal Uranus (Uranus = ruler 4). Very appropriate I thought. So I take the 9th house cusp as very important when looking at relocations.
In 1985 when moving to Holland, finally a SA Uranus hit at 26°32' Cancer, trining my newly chosen Asc. at 26°13'. At the same time Progr. MC (0° Libra) opposed Progr. Moon(0°Âries)and entered a new Sign. Progr. Asc. also had just entered a new sign . SA Sun sextiled MC exactly.

When looking at engagement which was at exact date 1 year before marriage, I get more information from SA Venus and Mars exact hits to midpoints from Sun/Mercury, Moon/Mars and Moon/Uranus then to Asc. or MC:At the time of divorce (day it was proclaimed), SA Uranus exactly trined Venus and SA Pluto (Asc. ruler) exactly trined the Moon/Uranus midpoint.We had an amicable divorce, hence the trines I guess. There were no other Uranus, (Progr or SA) to Asc. or MC. Trans. Uranus was squaring Asc. at 28°. But what I did see was the Midpoint between Moon and Saturn at 25° Virgo being aspected by SA Mercury (square), SA Saturn(conj.) and SA NorthNode (sextile) all at 25° of theîr signs. Again, the midpoints activated when it comes to happenings of emotional/relational nature. Progr. Moon was at 25° Scorpio, conj. Asc. and also sextiling the Moon/Saturn midpoint. Interesting.

So even though my newly found Asc. indicates a birthtime almost half an hour earlier, could that be right?? I am now going to look at the 7 PM time (just found out last night, looking at my birthcertificate), but I have a feeling that my dad did not really know and just took an approximate time. It was a very difficult birth where mother and child both almost died (forceps) so it could be that nobody really looked at the exact time then.
 

Atria

Well-known member
Hello Starlink, to rectificate with this method i need the days of the events, if your remember the day of your moving to Holland will be wonderful moving pluto to midheaven using symbolic Ptolomeo direction one year = one degree, gives 13 years old , pluto is in the nine (trip, or another country) also has a subregence at capricorne the third house of movements, and conjunt midheaven express changes in life may that is one probable hipotesis and with the day and month i can make the count ( maths calcullation i will show you), later we have to corroborate with others events of your life with the multiple keys, the other symbolic directions, I need other events with the days month and year if is it possible, another hipotesis could be Saturn conjunct to cuspid of 9 th gives nine years the exile from indonesia, in that case we move saturn at reverse. what happen at 22 years old , saturn conjunct midheaven and mars conjunct 5 house? and at 20 years old when uranus make conjunction with the seven and make an opposition to ascendant ? always moving it one year, one grade. All the dates are welcome. the best Atria
 

starlink

Well-known member
Hello Atria, I think I have something for you, but not a specific date (I dont have passports from when I was a child anymore.I found the passports of my parents with loads of dates between 1951 and 1953. Apparently that was homeleave.(they lasted 2 years) Now, the last date, probably when we went back, by ship, was 24 Nov. 1953.(Visum issued). Another Visum for a trip to Holland was issued on the 15th of December 1947 (I was born 5th May, so I was 7 month old) and another stamp with 16th Dec. 1947.
30.12.1950 we entered Holland, Rotterdam Port and left 22 Aug. 1952.
I have no idea if you can make something of this.
What we do know is, that I was 9 years old when leaving Jakarta, so that Saturn on the 9th cusp could be right. At 22, june 27, 1969, I married. At 27 June 1968 I got engaged.
At 20 I think it was my parents leaving Europe to go to Indonesia again. I stayed in Holland.


1st of Sept. 1986 I entered Switzerland, coming from Holland where we stayed only 10 month.
June 1972 I flew to Lima, Peru, I know, because on 17 April 1972 my daughter was born and I was not allowed to travel with her before she was 2 month old because she was so small. So I guess around 15th of June.
12 December 1974, Son was born. (I flew from Holland to Spain where we were going to live when I was 7-8 month pregnant), so that is another move.
That must have been in Oct-Nov. 1974, but I really dont know the date anymore. Very difficult to remember, I should have kept a diary! Hope this can give you an idea. Thanks very much!! Star.
 
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